Trump Treachery Or Treason?

[coorslite21]

9 minutes ago, Shabibilicious said:

 

Hmmm....who would've thought Mark 12:17 involved tax loopholes?  

 

And this old archived nugget..

https://www.thedailybeast.com/donald-trump-in-1990-adultery-is-not-a-sin

 

GO RV, then BV

And again I'll ask.....who do you support for 2020?....and why?

 

How will they make the Country better for all citizens.....who do you see as a uniter?

 

It's ways easy to second guess...(or bash)......it's much more difficult to create solutions.....

 

What's your solution?

(I've already given my accessment on the top 5......pretty weak group IMO)

 

CL

 

[MyLadiesDaddy]

19 minutes ago, Shabibilicious said:

 

Hmmm....who would've thought Mark 12:17 involved tax loopholes?  

 

And this old archived nugget..

https://www.thedailybeast.com/donald-trump-in-1990-adultery-is-not-a-sin

 

GO RV, then BV

 

Both these responses are little more than deflection. 

The Beast is NOT  a news source one should trust. And what Trump said in the audio is disgusting. The Difference between you and I here is that I make no judgment call of President Trump because I admit to having said far worse things than that in my past. You do not admit to such things, portraying yourself to be some kind of saint. I don't buy it.

 

9 minutes ago, Shabibilicious said:

 

You know, audio and video does indeed say a lot about a person's morality.......but sometimes, for millions of loyalists, it just doesn't matter.  

 

 

GO RV, then BV

 

[MyLadiesDaddy]

27 minutes ago, Shabibilicious said:

 

Hmmm....who would've thought Mark 12:17 involved tax loopholes?  

 

And this old archived nugget..

https://www.thedailybeast.com/donald-trump-in-1990-adultery-is-not-a-sin

 

GO RV, then BV

It took me a second to understand the biblical reference. Probably because your intentions here are Ludacris at best. So now you're suggesting that it is a sin to be shrewd with your money? Using the legal tax system that our government provides is not a sin. By your standards someone taking the unearned income credit for children receiving thousands of dollars, is Stealing. The left likes to call it loopholes, I call it what it is THE LAW. 

[Shabibilicious]

6 minutes ago, ladyGrace'sDaddy said:

It took me a second to understand the biblical reference. Probably because your intentions here are Ludacris at best. So now you're suggesting that it is a sin to be shrewd with your money? Using the legal tax system that our government provides is not a sin. By your standards someone taking the unearned income credit for children receiving thousands of dollars, is Stealing. The left likes to call it loopholes, I call it what it is THE LAW. 

 

Just noticing the hypocrisy on full bloom, nothing more.....and you spelled Ludacris with a capital L, like the rapper.  

 

GO RV, then BV

[caddieman]

56 minutes ago, md11fr8dawg said:

Funny, there has been a doc located that goes back to 2007 when the great patriot John F'ing McCain was running for Prez. He was accused of colluding with the Russians thru (I believe) his campaign manager. It was a set up script just like movie. So when you look at the script you can see how easy it was to just substitute Trump's name for McCain's and here we go again. Many will say well why did it not come out about McCain. Well, Bush was Prez and would not allow it to go any further. But when Obummer was Prez, it was only natural that he would allow it to proceed, to insure the HillDawg's election. You may not like Trump, but he is a Boy Scout compared to the Donkey Party.

I lost all respect for Trump for what he was doing to John McCain and his family. And don’t even start on how he treats women. The President of the US should be above all that. Trump is well below all thresholds a President of the US should be held to. He is an embarrassment to the office and that’s a fact. 

[Shabibilicious]

28 minutes ago, coorslite21 said:

And again I'll ask.....who do you support system" rel="">support for 2020?....and why?

 

How will they make the Country better for all citizens.....who do you see as a uniter?

 

It's ways easy to second guess...(or bash)......it's much more difficult to create solutions.....

 

What's your solution?

(I've already given my accessment on the top 5......pretty weak group IMO)

 

CL

 

 

We've talked about his before...and at that time I gave you my choices.  Seeing as Tulsi has been relegated to the scrap heap of "also ran"....My first choice now becomes Yang (like his levelness, doesn't seem to have highs or lows personally....business background doesn't hurt, as long as he doesn't use to the office for personal profit)....Probably Mayor Pete next (war veteran, accepted his missteps in South Bend and made amends with the citizenry there...level attitude, as well)....then the rest are simply typical Democratic fluff.  That said, none of them are Donald Trump, so that's a bonus going in.  All believe taking care of God's green earth is important, as do I.....All or most believe in healthcare for all, as do I.....I believe money shouldn't outweigh life saving, and I would think any anti-abortion person would understand this....All believe our world allies are important, as do I.....And as I said earlier, none of them is Donald Trump.  Whereas millions of people voted for Trump simply because he wasn't Clinton, that's how I feel about him, his narcissism, racism, morality, lying....the list is long and ever evolving.  There it is....have at it folks.  

 

GO RV, then BV

[Shabibilicious]

41 minutes ago, ladyGrace'sDaddy said:

 

Both these responses are little more than deflection. 

The Beast is NOT  a news source one should trust. And what Trump said in the audio is disgusting. The Difference between you and I here is that I make no judgment call of President Trump because I admit to having said far worse things than that in my past. You do not admit to such things, portraying yourself to be some kind of saint. I don't buy it.

 

 

 

I've been sinning my whole life, as human beings do.....and have done many things I'm not proud of.  I do my best,  but I'm certainly no saint and like Trump, in my opinion, I'm not qualified to be POTUS either.

 

GO RV, then BV  

[caddieman]

14 minutes ago, Shabibilicious said:

 

We've talked about his before...and at that time I gave you my choices.  Seeing as Tulsi has been relegated to the scrap heap of "also ran"....My first choice now becomes Yang (like his levelness, doesn't seem to have highs or lows personally....business background doesn't hurt, as long as he doesn't use to the office for personal profit)....Probably Mayor Pete next (war veteran, accepted his missteps in South Bend and made amends with the citizenry there...level attitude, as well)....then the rest are simply typical Democratic fluff.  That said, none of them are Donald Trump, so that's a bonus going in.  All believe taking care of God's green earth is important, as do I.....All or most believe in healthcare for all, as do I.....I believe money shouldn't outweigh life saving, and I would think any anti-abortion person would understand this....All believe our world allies are important, as do I.....And as I said earlier, none of them is Donald Trump.  Whereas millions of people voted for Trump simply because he wasn't Clinton, that's how I feel about him, his narcissism, racism, morality, lying....the list is long and ever evolving.  There it is....have at it folks.  

 

GO RV, then BV

Best post you ever posted Shabs 🍺

[nstoolman1]

5 minutes ago, Shabibilicious said:

 

I've been sinning my whole life, as human beings do.....and have done many things I'm not proud of.  I do my best,  but I'm certainly no saint and like Trump, in my opinion, I'm not qualified to be POTUS either.

 

GO RV, then BV  

 

Fortunately the Constitution does not mention sin as a disqualifier. 

 

Section 1 Article Two  of the United States Constitution sets forth the eligibility requirements for serving as president of the United States:

No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United State

 

So if you meet the mentioned requirements you could be President.

It is up to the electorate to decide who they want. I will let God judge DJT on his indiscretions and I will judge him on his job in 2020. 

[Pitcher]

No different than people who blindly followed Obama.  

 

Politics has become like a sport.  You pick your guy and you become blind to anything negative. You’re from Ohio????  I’ll bet you follow Ohio State.  Great tradition, great school.  When they had some controversy a few years ago I’ll bet you didn’t care, let’s win the next game.  I’m no different when it comes to my alma mater, the University of Texas.

 

Once you pick your candidate then you back him/her until the end of their term. I voted for Obama in 08.  The ACA and that budget slight of hand made me understand he wasn’t for me.  Trump’s term isn’t over yet but at present I’m not sure I will vote for him again.  I try to be open minded but the Dems are going extreme left and I’m not into their stance on Border Security, New Green Deal, and the RC hoax didn’t help sway me to their side.  If Warren is the candidate I can’t support a Socialist agenda, no matter how much I dislike some of Trumps antics.   

[md11fr8dawg]

54 minutes ago, caddieman said:

I lost all respect for Trump for what he was doing to John McCain and his family. And don’t even start on how he treats women. The President of the US should be above all that. Trump is well below all thresholds a President of the US should be held to. He is an embarrassment to the office and that’s a fact. 

Caddieman, you seem to forget the Rapest Clinton, far worst than anything Trump has done. Maybe you did not support Clinton, I don't know. And the joke of Obummer. Do we REALY know anything about this imposter? Where was he really born? Where did he really go to college? Does he really have a law degree from Harvard? Who bankrolled this incompetent fool? Many other questions that the left like to sweep under the rug. I have no problem with you or anyone else hammering Trump for some of the things he says or does that you do not like, but don't act he is the first or only one to do such things. Especially when the left's track record is so corrupt, dishonest and dismissal.

[umbertino]

Quote

And what Trump said in the audio is disgusting

End Quote

 

Hello LGD....Thanks for acknowledging that ....You are one of the very very few ( among Trump supporters here) who did. It's appreciated

 

 

 

Quote

You do not admit to such things, portraying yourself to be some kind of saint. I don't buy it.

End Quote

 

Sorry but no (imvho)...Shabbs never pretended to be any Saint...His "unforgivable" guilt is to be an anti-Trump and he gets pushed around by many here just because of that

 

...If he instead happened to be a Trump fan....He'd have red carpet and VIP treatment all the way here...Just like some do right on this forum who are treated as Royalties.....Fact

Edited September 23, 2019 by umbertino

[Shabibilicious]

43 minutes ago, nstoolman1 said:

 

Fortunately the Constitution does not mention sin as a disqualifier. 

 

Section 1 Article Two  of the United States Constitution sets forth the eligibility requirements for serving as president of the United States:

No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United State

 

So if you meet the mentioned requirements you could be President.

It is up to the electorate to decide who they want. I will let God judge DJT on his indiscretions and I will judge him on his job in 2020. 

 

Pretty sure a smart man such as yourself knew my point going in....but in the outside chance I'm wrong about that, here goes.  Just because a person qualifies legally to be POTUS.....doesn't mean he or she should be POTUS.

 

GO RV, then BV

[Shabibilicious]

29 minutes ago, Pitcher said:

No different than people who blindly followed Obama.  

 

Politics has become like a sport.  You pick your guy and you become blind to anything negative. You’re from Ohio????  I’ll bet you follow Ohio State.  Great tradition, great school.  When they had some controversy a few years ago I’ll bet you didn’t care, let’s win the next game.  I’m no different when it comes to my alma mater, the University of Texas.

 

Once you pick your candidate then you back him/her until the end of their term. I voted for Obama in 08.  The ACA and that budget slight of hand made me understand he wasn’t for me.  Trump’s term isn’t over yet but at present I’m not sure I will vote for him again.  I try to be open minded but the Dems are going extreme left and I’m not into their stance on Border Security, New Green Deal, and the RC hoax didn’t help sway me to their side.  If Warren is the candidate I can’t support system" rel="">support a Socialist agenda, no matter how much I dislike some of Trumps antics.   

 

I presume you're talking to me....if so all I can say is OUCH!!!  I am indeed from Ohio....but I'm a Michigan Wolverine, through and through....I despise tOSU and it's horrible fans...the Steeler fans of the college football in my view.  Awful sad sacks they are.  And though it's not a good time to be a Wolverine football fan as the greatest sports rivalry on planet earth has been very lopsided the last 20 years....I wouldn't change my allegiance for anything.  Delusional Buckeye fans think history started in the 1950's.    In a political format, let me put it this way....of course Rep. Jim Jordan was an assistant wrestling coach at tOSU.   

 

GO RV, then BV

[Pitcher]

Sorry in my assumption Shabbs.   That was terrible on my part. I have a number of family who went to Michigan and they all despise OSU.   That is almost as bad as all my kids going to Texas A&M and I’m a Longhorn. Twice a year for 8 years I had to send thousands of dollars to our biggest opponent.  College rivalries much like politics can get heated.  

 

13 minutes ago, Shabibilicious said:

of course Rep. Jim Jordan was an assistant wrestling coach at tOSU.   

 

 

Thats funny.

[Shabibilicious]

1 minute ago, Pitcher said:

Sorry in my assumption Shabbs.   That was terrible on my part. I have a number of family who went to Michigan and they all despise OSU.   That is almost as bad as all my kids going to Texas A&M and I’m a Longhorn. Twice a year for 8 years I had to send thousands of dollars to our biggest opponent.  College rivalries much like politics can get heated.  

 

 

Ooh....yeah that had to hurt.  At least your kids got a quality education, even if it is an Aggie one.   We're such Michigan fans, that when the time comes God willing, our son wants to name his first child either Maizie Blue or Mason Blue, depending on her or his gender.  

 

GO RV, then BV

[Pitcher]

Texas A&M is a great University.  When I was going to college A&M was a farmer and military college. No girls!!! 

2 of my kids are doing well and the 3rd one is getting better.  He was a lot like me. He came back from the war in Iraq and has had his struggles with alcohol, drugs and PTSD.  I think we are finally over the hump but he will have those struggles his entire life.  

 

Awesome on the names.  That is loyalty and a great fan.

[Shabibilicious]

3 minutes ago, Pitcher said:

Texas A&M is a great University.  When I was going to college A&M was a farmer and military college. No girls!!! 

2 of my kids are doing well and the 3rd one is getting better.  He was a lot like me. He came back from the war in Iraq and has had his struggles with alcohol, drugs and PTSD.  I think we are finally over the hump but he will have those struggles his entire life.  

 

Awesome on the names.  That is loyalty and a great fan.

 

My respect and prayers to your son.....as well as my thanks for his service and sacrifice.  

 

GO RV, then BV

[coorslite21]

2 hours ago, Shabibilicious said:

 

We've talked about his before...and at that time I gave you my choices.  Seeing as Tulsi has been relegated to the scrap heap of "also ran"....My first choice now becomes Yang (like his levelness, doesn't seem to have highs or lows personally....business background doesn't hurt, as long as he doesn't use to the office for personal profit)....Probably Mayor Pete next (war veteran, accepted his missteps in South Bend and made amends with the citizenry there...level attitude, as well)....then the rest are simply typical Democratic fluff.  That said, none of them are Donald Trump, so that's a bonus going in.  All believe taking care of God's green earth is important, as do I.....All or most believe in healthcare for all, as do I.....I believe money shouldn't outweigh life saving, and I would think any anti-abortion person would understand this....All believe our world allies are important, as do I.....And as I said earlier, none of them is Donald Trump.  Whereas millions of people voted for Trump simply because he wasn't Clinton, that's how I feel about him, his narcissism, racism, morality, lying....the list is long and ever evolving.  There it is....have at it folks.  

 

GO RV, then BV

 

So a Yang Gang guy......good deal.....he's a smart guy.....and should already have 47% of the vote from those already on some form of assistance....what's his plan....$1000 free a month for everyone over 19 with a HS education or better....(seems Romney had some thoughts about that years ago)....

 

Gabbard on the "scrap heap"....perhaps not yet.....top 5 finish in Iowa or NH gets her back on to the debate stage......and I doubt the dishonest corrupt DNC could prevent it.......and she does pretty well in that venue......perhaps you should get involved in her campaign....donate some time to the phone bank......calling people in Iowa and NH for just an hour a day really can make a difference......Yang has the same set up....

 

Perhaps another businessman in the White House would be a good thing......but I seriously doubt the DNC would allow it.....and if Yang was elected.....I imagine the establishment left wouldn't treat him any better than the Right has treated "outsider" Trump.....

 

Unrelated.....The Wisconsin ash kicking of Michigan last Saturday.......in my younger days I spend some time at Camp Randall......in those days 2-9 was a normal season.....yet every game was a sell out.....always the best party around!

 

So no worries......things could be much worse for Michigan football.........

 

And perhaps no matter what 2020 brings us as a future President......I hope we won't be referring to pre 2020 as the "good old days!"

 

CL

[Shabibilicious]

Trump's Hold on Military Aid Blindsided Top Ukrainian Officials

The New York Times•September 23, 2019

 

Trump's Hold on Military Aid Blindsided Top Ukrainian Officials

KYIV, Ukraine — Senior Ukrainian officials said they were blindsided over the summer when they heard the United States would withhold security assistance to the country.

“It was a total surprise,” said Pavlo A. Klimkin, who was Ukraine’s foreign minister in August when he learned of the Trump administration’s suspension of military aid by reading a news article.

The blocking of military aid to Ukraine is now at the center of questions about whether President Donald Trump manipulated foreign policy to pressure the Ukrainian government to take action that would hurt Joe Biden, the former vice president and a top rival in the campaign for the presidency.

Trump acknowledged Sunday that he used a July 25 phone call with the new Ukrainian president, Volodymyr Zelenskiy, to accuse Biden of corruption.

Biden oversaw U.S. policy toward Ukraine in the Obama administration when his son served on the board of a Ukrainian natural gas company. Allies of Trump have pointed to a conflict of interest, and asked Ukraine to investigate Biden’s request in 2016 that Ukraine’s president at the time, Petro O. Poroshenko, dismiss a prosecutor who had investigated the gas company.

By the time of that July 25 call, the administration had already suspended the aid, a decision reached in early July, according to a former U.S. official.

But the news would not reach the Ukranian officials until much later, and then through nonofficial channels. For years, Ukranian officials had coordinated with the Pentagon, the State Department and members of Congress on military aid.

Klimkin said he received no formal notice through U.S. diplomatic channels of the halt in aid, although he noted the suspension came as the ministry was transitioning to a new administration. He left the ministry on Aug. 29.

U.S. military assistance for Ukraine had flowed unobstructed into the country since 2014, the year Russia annexed Crimea and fomented a war in two eastern provinces. The aid had always arrived in carefully choreographed shipments planned months in advance.

If the United States harbored concerns about any misuse of the aid by Ukraine, the senior officials said they had never heard about them.

Klimkin said U.S. officials had always provided the aid along with encouragement to overhaul the army and military industries to root out corruption.

But Klimkin said that aid was not conditional on those issues, and that he had heard no expressions of concern on those fronts from the United States in 2019.

“I never heard a discussion about meeting these conditions,” he said. “I’m not aware of any indication that something could have gone wrong.”

After a bipartisan outcry in Congress, the White House agreed to restore the aid in mid-September.

If the decision to suspend the aid was tied to a request by Trump for a politically motivated investigation, that “represents a fundamental challenge and problem for Ukraine,” Klimkin said, possibly threatening what had been bipartisan support in Congress for military assistance to the country.

“At the end of the day, the only ones who will be happy about that are the people sitting in the Kremlin,” he said.

In an interview on Ukrainian television on Saturday, Ukraine’s current foreign minister, Vadym V. Prystaiko, said Trump had not pressured Zelenskiy in the telephone call.

“There was talk, conversations are different, leaders have the right to discuss any problems that exist,” he said. “This conversation was long, friendly, and it touched on a lot of questions, including those requiring serious answers.”

Another official who learned of the hold on aid like a bolt from the blue was Oleh Shevchuk, who was deputy minister of defense in charge of logistics and oversaw the aid shipments until this month. He also said he learned of it through media reports.

Everything had been arriving smoothly, he said. Even as the news of the suspension came out, he said, Ukraine was receiving containers of medical supplies in Odessa, a Black Sea port. The Ukrainian military was expecting 33 Humvees equipped as ambulances, water purifying equipment and so-called containerized housing units, or mobile homes for soldiers. The Ukrainian military still expects these items, he said.

In fact, the hold came and went so quickly he noticed no change in the shipments and U.S. officials never informed him of any planned delays, Shevchuk said. “We got more this year than last year,” he said.

The United States has provided about $1.5 billion worth of military aid to Ukraine since 2014, almost entirely as equipment, often drawn from U.S. Army surpluses, rather than money transfers to the Ukrainian budget.

It includes items much sought-after on the battlefront, like body armor, night-vision goggles and armored ambulances. But the aid has not been decisive in the now 5-year-old war. Some aid, including ready-to-eat meals and at least one sophisticated counter-battery radar, has been captured and gleefully put on display by the Russian-backed separatists.

As a major component of the aid, about 300 U.S. soldiers serve as trainers at a military base in western Ukraine, far from the fighting in the east.

Oksana Syroid, a former deputy speaker of the Ukrainian Parliament, said in an interview that no American concerns about military aid crossed her desk this year before the hold was announced.

“It’s a very slippery road, a very dangerous approach, to make external relations a hostage to internal politics,” she said of a possible tie of the aid to corruption accusations against Biden. “It’s like asking a neighbor to take sides in an argument with your spouse.”

 

https://news.yahoo.com/trumps-hold-military-aid-blindsided-120507975.html

 

GO RV, then BV

[Pitcher]

Thank you.  It’s tough to watch a son go through that.  My oldest son also served but he coped with his time better.  

 

I hate war, but if your country goes and you took the vow then you grit your teeth and do the job.  That’s why I have so much respect for all who serve whether it’s the military, police, or firefighters.  And my respect to you for your service sir.  BTW, firefighting is a very dangerous occupation.  My cousin was a fire chief in Houston and volunteered to go to NYC after 911.  He died of lung cancer years later, they believe from the asbestos in the air.  The man was a rock, never smoked, drank, or did all the dumb stuff to his body that most do.  Terribly sad sad deal.  

[cranman]

I find it funny that morality,  lying and narcissism are qualities that anyone thinks anyone running for president doesn't have.  You have to have those undesirable quality,  amongst others, to even begin to think about running. No matter what party they represent. Could  you imagine going on stage saying you honestly don't know what will get accomplished because no one works together.  Not lying about your life saying you had sex before marriage or you did drink before being 21. You get laughed of the stage for being a *****, drunkard and for breaking  the law.  Lol.  You have to be a liar, cheat and and immoral so you can get your ass in to the oval office.  Anything short of that and the voters will think your not worth the vote. Prove me wrong. Haha 

[coorslite21]

Here you go Shabs.......this is how the "grass roots" works....you'll find something similar for anyone you choose to support.....

 

PresidentTulsiGabbard.org

 

 

 

Phone Banking

 

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Most people feel uncomfortable making phone calls to people that they do not know. However, we have found a method of phone banking that focuses on spreading the Spirit of Aloha by striving to make a heart-felt connection to the person on the other end of the phone call. 

Our goal is to make a human-to-human connection over the phone in order to identify how we can best assist every grassroots supporter to DO WHAT THEY FEEL MOST COMFORTABLE DOING in support of the Tulsi2020 campaign.

Please contact James Roguski at 310-619-3055 if you are interested in participating in our unique phone banking program.

    

Many people are uncomfortable making calls to people and/or receiving calls from people that they do not know and do not show up in their phone contact list. I know many people who will NEVER answer the phone if the caller's name does not pop up on their phone because they are not yet in their phone's contact list. What is the answer?...

FOR PEOPLE THAT YOU KNOW AND HAVE TEXTED BEFORE (with permission)...

Send a text message FIRST before you attempt to make a voice call !!!

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Please text me to let me know that you received this text, or let me know if I should stop reaching out to you. Give me a call anytime if you have any questions about Tulsi.

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[umbertino]

Quote

I believe money shouldn't outweigh life saving

End Quote

 

Thanks Shabbs ....I think and believe you're one of the few Americans on this Forum who understands and realizes this very fact.....For which I do commend you.....Which instead in Countries much less rich than the US it's a given which is taken for granted

 

Richest Country in the world and they have still this problem....It's somehow amazing....

 

Like Marcellus  states in Shakespeare's "Hamlet"..."Something is rotten in the state of Denmark"

[Shabibilicious]

13 minutes ago, Pitcher said:

Thank you.  It’s tough to watch a son go through that.  My oldest son also served but he coped with his time better.  

 

I hate war, but if your country goes and you took the vow then you grit your teeth and do the job.  That’s why I have so much respect for all who serve whether it’s the military, police, or firefighters.  And my respect to you for your service sir.  BTW, firefighting is a very dangerous occupation.  My cousin was a fire chief in Houston and volunteered to go to NYC after 911.  He died of lung cancer years later, they believe from the asbestos in the air.  The man was a rock, never smoked, drank, or did all the dumb stuff to his body that most do.  Terribly sad sad deal.  

 

Hard to find a family in this country that hasn't been touched by war in Iraq or Afghanistan over the last 2 decades....and my condolences for the loss of you cousin, he sounded like a wonderful man.  I'm very thankful that congress continues the yearly approval of funds for 9/11 survivors and families....I just wish it wasn't always used as a political talking piece by both sides....the families and ailing first responders

deserve better.

 

GO RV, then BV

Edited September 23, 2019 by Shabibilicious