Let there be R.V.

[TQueezy]

Guys...

I want to do this in the most adult and civil manner. I want to bring up something that is really bothering me, always had, and likely always will. There are two sides to this argument, and there is no in between. It's relevant to every aspect of life, some more than others, but to us as investors, this hits home with a fury.

Argument 1:

God. And the possible revaluation of the Iraqi Dinar. Have NOTHING to do with each other.

Now, I believe in God. And I believe that he blesses believers in their life, but not with outright rewards in the form of wealth and property gained. That is done by people. They may be blessed with knowledge and insight through communion with God in order to properly attain wealth and use it to further the work of God, but God does not bring wealth into people's lives directly.

Just because someone believes in God, and believes that the RV is part of God's plan for his/her life doesn't mean that's how reality works. If that's the case, I truly believe that God wants me to win the Powerball jackpot so that I can use the money to help out my community and bring them closer to God through evangelism. But even though I truly believe that, I will NEVER win the Powerball because I believe in God and that it is his plan for me.

It even says in the bible that no man will know the of God, or something like that... I'm not entirely sure, as I don't read the bible and have it memorized. But I'm pretty sure that even the part about using the Holy Spirit to somehow get in touch with God's thoughts and what he wants for you still doesn't entitle you to labeling positive things in your life with something God did for you. How many times have you seen/heard this? Oh, praise Jesus! the surgery went well. C'mon... really? I mean, I'm sorry. That's just now how a belief in God works. It's not a game where you can say a prayer and think happy thoughts and God will make positively sure nothing goes wrong with your surgery. Same applies here for the RV. That won't work. Sorry.

Argument 2:

God is the creator and as such is in control of everything down the very nanoseconds of each of our lives and influences every little thing that happens from a microbe floating through the air to the major movements of societal values over time and major social, political, economic events. Believers can trust in God and attribute all great things that happen to God's will being done in their lives, as the beneficial things are the good things they want that they believe God wants for them.

All of the negative stuff though, they don't want any of that, so none of that stuff is part of God's plan for their lives. I know true Christians believe otherwise and I've heard them say that even the bad stuff is in God's plan, so they have to learn to love God and thank him for everything, even the bad stuff. But c'mon... are you really gonna chock that up that excuse? That's just a psychological reaction to negative events in your life, to say, well, I guess that's what God wanted for me. But no, the positive stuff is obviously what God wants for you too, even becoming rich overnight. So...

Even though I sound super cynical and bitter (which I am) and some will feel like I'm misrepresenting Christianity. Feel free to argue otherwise, provide your opinion and your perspective on it. I'm pretty sure I hit it right on the head though. And this has really been bothering me lately.

I love God. I have a great personal relationship with him. I don't practice "Christianity" though, and I don't sit there and pretend that things I want and desire with my mind and heart are things that I believe God has put in his plan for my life. Those things, whatever they are... I wouldn't know about. They would just happen. So basically everything that has occurred in my life (and in others) you could say was something God wanted to have happened for you, or basically God just wants you to have free will and live your own life. That's how I believe, the latter. There's no secret connection that allows us to see some greater plan He has for us. His plan is for us to live our lives how we WILL, and whatever happens happens.

Thanks guys.

Remember, keep this clean and civil. This is all my opinion and I want to hear yours.

[bamagirl]

TQueezy I enjoy your posts but I 100% disagree with you on this......I trust the Lord to work His will in my life and if I am financially blessed by this investment I believe it is Gods will for that to be so and I will give Him all glory for it......thats just me though....

[TQueezy]

TQueezy I enjoy your posts but I 100% disagree with you on this......I trust the Lord to work His will in my life and if I am financially blessed by this investment I believe it is Gods will for that to be so and I will give Him all glory for it......thats just me though....

Thank you bama for sharing your perspective and personal belief.

I have to wonder though, and this is not meant to be offensive (although by nature it is offensive to question someone else's beliefs using contrary nongrounded opinion), that people who think and believe like you do (my parents included, which is why I'm bitter having gone through that my whole childhood and adolescence), are trying to come to terms with a lack of contentment in their lives or their own fears over doubting things.

I don't doubt that the RV is possible. I fully think that it is very likely to happen. I'll go as far as to say I believe it will happen! But I don't think it's something God wants to be in His plan for my life. It's just something I want for myself and my family. I guess the question is then...

where do you draw the line or find the differences between those two trains of thought? As they are pretty much the same, just that mine doesn't involve God. Lol...

[bamagirl]

I honestly don't know how to answer you on that TQueezy. I personally can't draw the line....I feel I have been abundantly blessed in my life, not financially but then again I have never done without so maybe I have.....I have a good faithful husband and 4 wonderful kids...I give God credit for the blessings I already have so if I have a financial gain how do I not give Him credit for that? How can a person like me draw the line when I don't want to, I love my life, there is no major discontentment even if I'm never wealthy.....I just pray that God continues His will in my life.....

[TQueezy]

I honestly don't know how to answer you on that TQueezy. I personally can't draw the line....I feel I have been abundantly blessed in my life, not financially but then again I have never done without so maybe I have.....I have a good faithful husband and 4 wonderful kids...I give God credit for the blessings I already have so if I have a financial gain how do I not give Him credit for that? How can a person like me draw the line when I don't want to, I love my life, there is no major discontentment even if I'm never wealthy.....I just pray that God continues His will in my life.....

That's good to hear! I'm glad you have found that good balance in your life of being content whether or not you get rich.

I am the same way. I would love to make a lot of money from this, but if I don't, I'm fine. I can manage.

But I guess I just don't have the same mindset for attributing it to God's will/plan for my life. I don't see how He would factor that in, if that's even something that happens in reality. For me, I just don't see it... I guess it's more of a fundamental difference in the way I believe God, or rather we, are able to interact with God in our lives.

[HughJeffin Byrd]

TQueezy - Right on...that's how I feel anyway. I was born and raised hardcore catholic...but I don't practice any religion... I don't need to follow the word of a book written by humans, nor need to worship God in a house of god, which is just a building on planet earth...just like any other house. My relationship with god is what it is...and it doesn't have any boundaries or rules necessary to praise him.

[bamagirl]

I guess we are just gonna agree to disagree.....would you be offended if I pray for you, for answers to your questions? If you would rather I didn't then I won't......

[Halo9678]

T,

If I may be so bold to enter the "fray" (j/k... this is pretty civil). I think the difference is those who know and use Free Will and those who rely soley on faith. Yes, your "arguements" are mutually exclusive but the are mutually supportive as well. Using the surgery example. One person gave full credit to God and they are correct for it was God who gave the surgeon the free will to go to school, do well, and practice effectively. Another person would say that the surgery was a success because of the surgeon. One is a macro view the other is a micro view but both are from the same line of logic, "The surgery went well". This paradigm can apply to just about any concept that one chooses to involve God, Man, a difficult situation, and a positive outcome.

<now going back to my corner before I get labelled with being a non-believer or a heretic>

Halo

[umbertino]

I do respect everybody and their creed...Just wanted to chime in to say that when I used to have questions ( as a Catholic kid / boy) about the fact that some things didn't seem to be right and also some People's actions, etc... I'd always receive ( mainly from my beloved Aunt who is / was a very very fervent religious Person) the usual answer " God gave us free Will"...And the natural consequence to that was that " All which is good is God's work and all which is bad is Devils's work through Man"......Ok.... Fine... But I always thought that was somehow a shaft answer.. Or at least I felt that way ( shafted) ...

So I resolved the matter with myself by preferring to think it all depends on and it's up to Man and mere fate.( maybe some Karma too and some Spiritualism,,,)....... Or else the rage would be too big to manage to even think that the Almightly would allow some horrible stuff to happen , etc. etc. etc....Un-attentive, ok... Distracted....Blind, maybe.. But up to what point?

Instead, thinking it's all up to Man and Fate is much more bearable to me.....Again, no offense to anybody.. Jmvho.

Edited March 25, 2012 by umbertino

[tandy]

refreshing to see folks discussing such a sensitive issue in a caring compassionate manner...hats off to all if I might add a different perspective...to believe there is no rational supreme intelligence (GOD) in this huge existence that is mega thoughts and perception beyond our comprehension is intellectual suicide.. We haven't the vocabulary or experience to begin to imagine the mysteries of logic or plans that have been formulated for future time and space. There has to be purpose but we only hope and believe (each to his or her own choosing and background) what we determine best suits our lives.

Personally, I believe that free will and choice is one of the great gifts given to humanity at the dawn of creation so whatever hell or paradise we find ourselves in can be contributed to choices we made along the paths we trod. (with exceptions of course and I am referring to our situations here)

I believe in GOD...but like a few others, I'm not sure GOD is looking in from another dimension saying.maybe next week will be a good time to bless these folks. Maybe HE is and will...my opinion is that like the RV there is a lot of speculation and mystery sometimes .in things we don't understand

It doesn't hurt to be prayerful and positive!!!. But thanks to all of you posting thoughtful and respectful posts....and Bama...you is a sweet lil dumplin..

[pattyangel]

[quote name='TQueezy' date='25 March 2012 - 04:42 PM' timestamp='1332715321' post='910440']

But I don't think it's something God wants to be in His plan for my life. It's just something I want for myself and my family. I guess the question is then...

where do you draw the line or find the differences between those two trains of thought? As they are pretty much the same, just that mine doesn't involve God. Lol...

Why is it so important for you to draw the line or find a difference? Are you struggling with who to give credit where credit is due? I would think your relationship with God will guide you in finding your answer to your concern. You have to want to find your answer. Don't let your heart be heavy with this.

Prayers to you to help you with this concern.

[zantac]

I believe in God & I also believe God does bring you wealth.

God walks this earth in many forms of life…what you believe God to look like or be is your opinion.

I am blessed by God with a wealth of happiness……First I met my wife then God blessed use with my first child & again with my second.

Wealth cant buy you happiness….certainly cant buy you health.

Wealth can also be the undoing of many people & I can certainly point you in the direction of a good friend that had wealth…….not much happiness & ironically bad health due to the 24/7 party life that ruined his life.

Now he’s broke………….Happy (divorced) & rebuilding his life from scratch, sadly the health will not be something he will be able to overcome.

Be careful at times what you wish for

[HughJeffin Byrd]

sadly the health will not be something he will be able to overcome.

I hope you end up being wrong about that... there will be many new technologies that have been suppressed for decades coming out in the health sector. Look into alternative medicine, especially dealing with our vibrational frequencies... it holds the key to our health.

[msmortgagewiz]

I honestly don't know how to answer you on that TQueezy. I personally can't draw the line....I feel I have been abundantly blessed in my life, not financially but then again I have never done without so maybe I have.....I have a good faithful husband and 4 wonderful kids...I give God credit for the blessings I already have so if I have a financial gain how do I not give Him credit for that? How can a person like me draw the line when I don't want to, I love my life, there is no major discontentment even if I'm never wealthy.....I just pray that God continues His will in my life.....

That was a great post bama, I think I somewhat mirror those expressions. I too have a faithful husband of 22 years, who stepped in to help me raise two small children that were not even his, and stayed for the long haul. Four grandchildren later, we live a simple life, have never had all that we needed, but in the same token, life has been good to us. I just like you, give credit to God for that, and although I don't get to church as often as I should, I know how to be a loving servant of just doing the right thing 100% of the time. For me, I don't look at the when I'm wealthy part any differently than I look at the when I get my paycheck part, Lord knows I take care of so many of the families expenses (I speak of my mother, and the children left in my mother and fathers care by my derelict sister). For me I already know my destiny and my purpose, and it's spiritually charged and always has been. In my fantasy world, only like minded people who's intentions were to do right by this windfall were brought together through various vehicles to all ban together and make this world a better place for those less fortunate than ourselves. For me I will continue to be thankful to God for what I do have, whether wealth makes it's way into my life or not.

[HughJeffin Byrd]

Interesting post from one of the alternative news sites I visit:

Greetings and Salutations;

What I'm about to introduce to you, explains why you have no concerns about any of the bad guys being able to steal your money. The 'matrix' has been engaged on planet earth. The new system is transparent and the matrix targets any one trying to do what they have no business doing, with money. As an example some folks tried to run off with a bunch of gold, as soon as the transaction began, it was targeted and the culpable folks were immediately arrested. It reminds me of a sentient computer. It's intelligence is faster than humans' and can't be 'negotiated' with. If your wrong, you're wrong and even you know it. It is responsible for these massive arrests and resignations across this planet. Free will does not cover you stealing, go ahead with the attempt but you'll never get away with it. The bad guys reading this will realize why many of their last attempts have failed miserably. There is no black ops operation that is not seen or a determination made about it. You could say, this is how the divine is interacting on the planet Now rather than some time in the future. The clouds have already parted and only they who really listen to that 'quiet voice' know it, because they need fireworks to get it. It's not about what people believe, what Is....IS. I suggest watching the matrix series again.

Because of this, the aims of the St germain trust will see their manifesto fulfilled and be unstoppable. "We are shifting the wealth of the world and the bad guys will not sniff any of this money". No one gives a hoot about politics. What is 'right' is taking place, and there's more power with it than against it. The dragons simply enhanced the operation. No sense in wasting your time, determining who's guilty of what and sitting on your 'judgement' of things, the shock to the reality will be quite consequential, no one is getting away with anything untoward. Cease burning up useless energy...it 's All being handled. If it's unconstitutional it will go up in vapors, you will be told so you never let this happen again to your country. The supreme court is not outside of this action, I suspect a few of them will be retiring early. The charge will be treason. The valkyries have joined the fat lady and they are singing in high c over c. So I suggest you men watch your attacks on women, they aren't pleased and you may be joining them singing in a high voice.

I see, folks have been joining in the dialogue on the dinar sites, trying to quell the hysteria, but few listen to them. There are 195 countries going thru a currency revaluation so it's world wide not just limited to the dinar. It All goes more or less at once, it Has to happen because there's new banking system engaging so, stop tripping. When you see the rvs show up in the treasury and forex, Then you'll know what that rate is, no amount of speculation and 'my source said' is going to change that, and the bankers don't even know the day. Some can tell you what's on the back screen but they don't know when it goes public. They don't run anything in the new system, they've all become employees on the new plantation. They just better make sure their own business is straight, inside of the matrix.

Oh, yea, the matrix is also creating Peace on the planet so, the neanderthals that still need to blow something up, will have a bit of a problem trying to perpetuate that concept of (living?) The drug companies are also on the list for going away for dispensing poisons to the people. There's one company that knows of a natural cure for cancer but can't synthesize it so, it remains growing where it does. Things like this, are before us to make this a better world. We are getting money alright, but there is some stewardship involved also. Clean this mess up. Some believe god gave us the earth to do as we like, well with thoughts like that, why would you be given more. You crapped all over the place and didn't even clean it up, like some 3 yr old so, I should give you something else so, someone can come in and clean that mess up, too? The problem around here is thinking who put us here is too far away to pay attention and we act in a vacuum, like little kids in the back yard of a big house. What'd daddy used to say? Don't make me have to come down there!

" It's the end of the world, as we know it' The money is in the wheel house, now.

Thanks for the heavy duty 'equipment' to get this long ordeal to it's logical conclusion. Sit down some where while the dust settles, you deserve it for your service for being here at such a juncture in human time.

Love and Kisses,

"Poofness"

[TQueezy]

I guess we are just gonna agree to disagree.....would you be offended if I pray for you, for answers to your questions? If you would rather I didn't then I won't......

Go ahead. My parents have been doing that for me my whole life, pretty much. Not saying it doesn't work, not saying anything negative... I just don't believe it the way my parents do, and what seems like how you believe it. But that's fine.

[thesjeske]

Wealth just makes you more of who you already are.

[JimH]

Apparently, you do not read the Bible very much. There is a great wealth of knowledge between the front and back cover, but it’s like a gold mine; you have to dig and study to reach the mother lode. If you do not, you can’t just spout out a few unfinished verses and expect that to be the grand sum of what you know about GOD. As I drive around my neighborhood I see signs that say “Pray for our Nation” Great thought. It is found in 2 Chronicles 7:14 If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land. They put a set of praying hands on the sign and quote the last phrase of the scripture and completely ignore the part that says “turn from their wicked ways” You can’t have it both ways. GOD does answer prayers and he will bless us. One of his greatest promises is found in the Old Testament; Malachi 3:10 Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the LORD of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it. The RV, if it happens, will be a Godsend. However, if you do not do righteous things with it, you might as well not even participate in it. I refer you to the New Testament; Luke 12:46 ….. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more. My friend, DO NOT sell GOD short. He is in complete control. This is HIS earth. We are but mere visitors passing through. If we do well, we will be rewarded. As Christ said in John 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments. And of course, the most skipped over and misunderstood scripture of all: James 2:17-20 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works. Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead? Be careful what you write in the book of life for your good works appear there and by that you will be judged!!! I challenge you, my brothers and sisters in Christ, dig into the scriptures and see the blessings that are in store for those “good and faithful servants”! by the way……GO RV!!!!

[Laid Back]

GOD gave you the time, space, cause, material, idea, skill, chance and fortune. Why should you feel as if you are the doer?

[HisHands]

Apparently, you do not read the Bible very much. There is a great wealth of knowledge between the front and back cover, but it’s like a gold mine; you have to dig and study to reach the mother lode. If you do not, you can’t just spout out a few unfinished verses and expect that to be the grand sum of what you know about GOD. As I drive around my neighborhood I see signs that say “Pray for our Nation” Great thought. It is found in 2 Chronicles 7:14 If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land. They put a set of praying hands on the sign and quote the last phrase of the scripture and completely ignore the part that says “turn from their wicked ways” You can’t have it both ways. GOD does answer prayers and he will bless us. One of his greatest promises is found in the Old Testament; Malachi 3:10 Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the LORD of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it. The RV, if it happens, will be a Godsend. However, if you do not do righteous things with it, you might as well not even participate in it. I refer you to the New Testament; Luke 12:46 ….. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more. My friend, DO NOT sell GOD short. He is in complete control. This is HIS earth. We are but mere visitors passing through. If we do well, we will be rewarded. As Christ said in John 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments. And of course, the most skipped over and misunderstood scripture of all: James 2:17-20 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works. Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead? Be careful what you write in the book of life for your good works appear there and by that you will be judged!!! I challenge you, my brothers and sisters in Christ, dig into the scriptures and see the blessings that are in store for those “good and faithful servants”! by the way……GO RV!!!!

Welcome to DV and a great post. I could not have said it better. God Bless!

[WallyWeaver]

God. And the possible revaluation of the Iraqi Dinar. Have NOTHING to do with each other.

This is a difficult argument to make. How can you be sure that it is not God's will to raise up Iraq at this time, or at least allow it to be raised up, to accomplish His will? And what if, as a part of that process, the IQD Rv's, in order to accomplish God's will. Consider the words of Benjamin Franklin:"God governs in the affairs of men!" If God exists and has the attributes of omniscience, omnipresence, and omnipotence how could it be that He has NOTHING to do with the currency of Iraq?

I am not arguing that it is God's will to revalue the currency of Iraq, here. But I will argue that it is impossible for you to know that it is NOT God's will.

Now, I believe in God. And I believe that he blesses believers in their life, but not with outright rewards in the form of wealth and property gained. That is done by people. They may be blessed with knowledge and insight through communion with God in order to properly attain wealth and use it to further the work of God, but God does not bring wealth into people's lives directly.

This is also a difficult argument to make. Consider this passage found in Deut. 28:1-13-

"Now it shall come to pass, if you diligently obey the voice of the LORD your God, to observe carefully all His commandments which I command you today, that the LORD your God will set you high above all nations of the earth."And all these blessings shall come upon you and overtake you, because you obey the voice of the LORD your God: "Blessed [shall] you [be] in the city, and blessed [shall] you [be] in the country.

"Blessed [shall be] the fruit of your body, the produce of your ground and the increase of your herds, the increase of your cattle and the offspring of your flocks.

"Blessed [shall be] your basket and your kneading bowl."Blessed [shall] you [be] when you come in, and blessed [shall] you [be] when you go out. "The LORD will cause your enemies who rise against you to be defeated before your face; they shall come out against you one way and flee before you seven ways. "The LORD will command the blessing on you in your storehouses and in all to which you set your hand, and He will bless you in the land which the LORD your God is giving you.

"The LORD will establish you as a holy people to Himself, just as He has sworn to you, if you keep the commandments of the LORD your God and walk in His ways. "Then all peoples of the earth shall see that you are called by the name of the LORD, and they shall be afraid of you.

"And the LORD will grant you plenty of goods, in the fruit of your body, in the increase of your livestock, and in the produce of your ground, in the land of which the LORD swore to your fathers to give you. "The LORD will open to you His good treasure, the heavens, to give the rain to your land in its season, and to bless all the work of your hand. You shall lend to many nations, but you shall not borrow. "And the LORD will make you the head and not the tail; you shall be above only, and not be beneath, if you heed the commandments of the LORD your God, which I command you today, and are careful to observe [them].

In this passage it is clearly God who blesses with "riches" of many types (property, commodities, preferential weather, etc.)

Just because someone believes in God, and believes that the RV is part of God's plan for his/her life doesn't mean that's how reality works. If that's the case, I truly believe that God wants me to win the Powerball jackpot so that I can use the money to help out my community and bring them closer to God through evangelism. But even though I truly believe that, I will NEVER win the Powerball because I believe in God and that it is his plan for me.

"Now this is the confidence that we have in Him, that if we ask anything according to His will, He hears us.

And if we know that He hears us, whatever we ask, we know that we have the petitions that we have asked of Him. "

1 John 5:14-15

It even says in the bible that no man will know the of God, or something like that... I'm not entirely sure, as I don't read the bible and have it memorized.

In my opinion, this sentence explains your entire post. You have come to a conclusion and decided to state your case having little to no knowledge of your subject matter.

But I'm pretty sure that even the part about using the Holy Spirit to somehow get in touch with God's thoughts and what he wants for you still doesn't entitle you to labeling positive things in your life with something God did for you. How many times have you seen/heard this? Oh, praise Jesus! the surgery went well. C'mon... really? I mean, I'm sorry. That's just now how a belief in God works. It's not a game where you can say a prayer and think happy thoughts and God will make positively sure nothing goes wrong with your surgery. Same applies here for the RV. That won't work. Sorry.

"giving thanks always for ALL things to God the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ,"

Eph. 5:20

Argument 2:

God is the creator and as such is in control of everything down the very nanoseconds of each of our lives and influences every little thing that happens from a microbe floating through the air to the major movements of societal values over time and major social, political, economic events. Believers can trust in God and attribute all great things that happen to God's will being done in their lives, as the beneficial things are the good things they want that they believe God wants for them.

"Are they ministers of Christ?--I speak as a fool--I [am] more: in labors more abundant, in stripes above measure, in prisons more frequently, in deaths often.From the Jews five times I received forty [stripes] minus one.

Three times I was beaten with rods; once I was stoned; three times I was shipwrecked; a night and a day I have been in the deep;

[in] journeys often, [in] perils of waters, [in] perils of robbers, [in] perils of [my own] countrymen, [in] perils of the Gentiles, [in] perils in the city, [in] perils in the wilderness, [in] perils in the sea, [in] perils among false brethren;

in weariness and toil, in sleeplessness often, in hunger and thirst, in fastings often, in cold and nakedness--

besides the other things, what comes upon me daily: my deep concern for all the churches

Who is weak, and I am not weak? Who is made to stumble, and I do not burn [with indignation]?

If I must boast, I will boast in the things which concern my infirmity.

The God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who is blessed forever, knows that I am not lying. "

2 Cor. 11:23-31

Consider this passage directd towards Cyrus, king of Persia, found in Is. 45:1-13:

"Thus says the LORD to His anointed, To Cyrus, whose right hand I have held--To subdue nations before him And loose the armor of kings, To open before him the double doors, So that the gates will not be shut:

'I will go before you And make the crooked places straight; I will break in pieces the gates of bronze And cut the bars of iron.

I will give you the treasures of darkness And hidden riches of secret places, That you may know that I, the LORD, Who call [you] by your name, [Am] the God of Israel.

For Jacob My servant's sake, And Israel My elect, I have even called you by your name; I have named you, though you have not known Me.

I [am] the LORD, and [there is] no other; [There is] no God besides Me. I will gird you, though you have not known Me, That they may know from the rising of the sun to its setting That [there is] none besides Me. I [am] the LORD, and [there is] no other;

I form the light and create darkness, I make peace and create calamity; I, the LORD, do all these [things].'

"Rain down, you heavens, from above, And let the skies pour down righteousness; Let the earth open, let them bring forth salvation, And let righteousness spring up together. I, the LORD, have created it.

Woe to him who strives with his Maker! [Let] the potsherd [strive] with the potsherds of the earth! Shall the clay say to him who forms it, 'What are you making?' Or shall your handiwork [say], 'He has no hands'?

Woe to him who says to [his] father, 'What are you begetting?' Or to the woman, 'What have you brought forth?' "

Thus says the LORD, The Holy One of Israel, and his Maker: "Ask Me of things to come concerning My sons; And concerning the work of My hands, you command Me.

I have made the earth, And created man on it. I--My hands--stretched out the heavens, And all their host I have commanded.

I have raised him up in righteousness, And I will direct all his ways; He shall build My city And let My exiles go free, Not for price nor reward," Says the LORD of hosts.

[pattyangel]

WalleyWeaver, thank you for sharing your undisputed truth.

[eaglefan]

TQueezy - Right on...that's how I feel anyway. I was born and raised hardcore catholic...but I don't practice any religion... I don't need to follow the word of a book written by humans, nor need to worship God in a house of god, which is just a building on planet earth...just like any other house. My relationship with god is what it is...and it doesn't have any boundaries or rules necessary to praise him.

[Way2WyrD]

Interesting post from one of the alternative news sites I visit:

May i ask the name of that site please?

[rothsdad]

Maybe God has planned to hold off on the RV this long to make everybody do a little soul searching. Make everybody realize what really matters. And as my Dad has said when my brothers and sisters got allowance "don't spend it all on gum and candy".