More PROOF not rumor of EXCHANGE RATE w/link

[FrankieV]

im sorry but your math is WAY OFF...open up your calc on yer computer and type 25,000 * 1.20 = 30,000

Yeah but you said 1.2 dinar = 1 USD. That means the dinar is worth less than the USD. 1 dinar = .86 USD. That means you divide 25,000 by 1.2, not multiply. If you want to multiply you multiple by .86, not 1.2.

20,833, not 30,000.

Do you have a link to the report at the Universities website?

Edited September 4, 2011 by FrankieV

[Mazzz27]

.....must have......lithium!!!

Edited September 4, 2011 by Mazzz27

[Marilyn53]

Wow, this parade really got rained on. Lots of good opinions here though. Guess we will just have to accept whatever does happen. Even the lopsters don't really want a LOP. I just thought that they had to come out within 50 cents of Kuwait's....has that gone away too? Personally, I don't think any news article is going to come out and say "oh, by the way, our currency is going to worth 1000 xs more than it is right now." Would you do that? Anyway, LOP or not...nothing we can really do now but ride the ride we are on. We have at least met some wonderful friends on our journey and gained weight from watching this unravel everyday....so all is not lost. Hmmmm, dang, I wanted this to be like microsoft, but I am always a day late and dollar short. I will wait until the fat lady sings....we still have a chance until then. JMO

[xyzzy]

and when your country has grown economically, you must re-value your currency appropriately to reflect that value

And as Iraq's GDP grows so too will the value of its money supply both by higher exchange rates and increases in the volume of currency. But it isn't gown NOW.

...same thing with stocks....when a gold mining CO finds and mines a new claim, the stock price re-evaluates based on new assets....

But a couple big differences. A company stock is not set by declaration but by the market. When Gold mining company finds a new supply, the stock typically does go up based on the expectation of higher revenues and profits in the future. The stock market prices in future value. But currencies do not. Currencies are all about NOW, especially for currencies that peg and are not allowed to float. Further no commerce is occurring with the stock, but the currency is intimately linked to the economy.

. and in iraqs cause they are not REDENOMINATING they are simply issuing lower denoms because their currency can now buy significantly more

So you think, and hope! If they RV to $1 I think there would be huge problems:

1) There will be a huge immediate drain on foreign reserves as with 24T or 30T or 60T (pick your number) out in the world, I'd guess that at least 1T dinars will come in for exchange and there is no way they have the foreign reserves to cover that.

2) The gap between rich and poor in Iraq is magnified by 1000x. Anyone living paycheck to paycheck is screwed and everyone that has savings is sitting very pretty. In a country already very fractionalized with plenty of opportunists ready to rally the disenfranchised, this is a recipe for disaster.

3) You as a hard working Iraqi have saved up 250,000 IQD to buy a used $200 USD motor scooter. Now that 250,000 IQD can buy you a $50,000 USD BMW and have 80% of it left over. But when you get to the dealer the 3 cars he had sold out 1 minute after opening for 5x their sticker price and there is a line around the block signing up for more at those same inflated prices. But salaries have to be lowered by the RV amount. If you were making 2,000 IQD per hour before now you will only be making 2 IQD/hr. LIkewise with good from in Iraq. So the wealthy get wealthier but the wager earners are priced out of everything. They will demand higher wages, and up and up we go.

4) Even if they can mangage the inital exchange how do they do so on-gonigly? BMW will be happy to supply more cars, but they don't want dinars they want euros, where is the CBI going to get them? And if the CBI can't support this exchange reate (1:1 with the dollar) then foreign companies will not sell their goods based on it.

you lopsters can fool some people some of the time, and even those same some people all of the time, but you can't fool all people all of the time

can't fool me

I'm not trying to fool anyone, what would be my motive? I've got dinars, I'd love them to be worth a fortune, but I don't see how its possible.

[HopefulTxn]

An RD is a neautral event! Thats why it makes absolutely no sense! You really gotta look at the whole picture. Iraq claims almost everyday as of late that they intend to be the economic super power of the ME. A LOP will not make that happen.

Its really beyond me at this point how the loppers dont see what the whole picture is about and how a lop will not accomplish what their intentions are. The dinar is just one piece of the puzzle but because we greedy americans focus on nothing but money nothing else matters. Ive looked at both sides of this and there is no doubt that Iraq talks of and RD often howerver they do also speak of revaluing. You have to read these articles for what they say and what they dont say. You have to think outside the box.

Why would a country continue to talk about reserves in such a positive manor and how they want to restructure their currency and revalue their currency and have the strongest currency in the ME if they intended to pull off a neutral event with their currency. They wouldnt! It makes absolutely no sense.

For those of you who want to continue to reference Turkey....ok I havent read up or waisted a lot of time researching Turkey as I think its completely irrelevant BUT it would appear Turkey was definitely not happy with their economy and currency when they RD'd. Iraq has it all going on....they have foreign countries from all over the world to go in there to work the are restructuring the ENTIRE country after decades of crap!!! FACT.....Iraq desires to be the top performing country in the ME!!! you can NOT accomplish that with an RD then RV!

They will RV then RD their currency....their just not gonna tell you that! Altough they did a pretty good job of describing what theur exact intentions are in another news article posted today on here! Go RV!!!

The point is that AQUA DUDE presented an article that compared what they are planning on doing to Brazil, Romania and Turkey - then wanted to state that certain articles are not to believed because they are from sources that lie. Well, if the article he puts up is a lie, then why put it up??? That makes absolutely NO SENSE whatsoever.

not to mention Turkey's inflation rate was up high right before they redenominated to lower notes.......iraqs inflation is not high like Turkeys was AT ALL!!!

Great points I forgot to add in this aspect which basically eliminates the possibility of a lop....you can't take three zeros of the paper currency and be a superpower.....taking zeros off the currency reduces the value of the paper currecy(soemthing iraq said that won't happen) and reduces the amount of acutal currency iraq has which reduces their total value, currency is like a countrys stock...they are not reducing stock...in matter of fact there are articles with state they are creating HIGHER denominations than those that already exsist....so ya...lets create a currency that says 100,000 and remove three zeros off it to make it 100....thats so stupid...they would just make a 100 bill......

your logic is fuzzy(lopsters)...stop drinking florinated water!

Take a look at your history a bit more, because when Turkey did their redenomination they too were under 10%. Are you really that dim that you don't research what you post and claim is something that it's not before hand?

We all hope for the straight up RV, but for YOU to post something that makes comparisons to Brazil, Romania and Turkey and Iraq comparing themselves to those instances. YOU were the one that put that article up, and now that those lines have been pointed out to you it seems you want to discredit the article - which YOU were originally trying to use to support your stance. You cannot have it both ways.

Unfortunately you have tried to show how it cannot or will not happen, and more often than not have used articles stating RD, in one way or another, as an attempt to support your position. That actually shows that you have no clue as to what you are even reading, IMO.

[Mazzz27]

3) You as a hard working Iraqi have saved up 250,000 IQD to buy a used $200 USD motor scooter. Now that 250,000 IQD can buy you a $50,000 USD BMW and have 80% of it left over. But when you get to the dealer the 3 cars he had sold out 1 minute after opening for 5x their sticker price and there is a line around the block signing up for more at those same inflated prices. But salaries have to be lowered by the RV amount. If you were making 2,000 IQD per hour before now you will only be making 2 IQD/hr. LIkewise with good from in Iraq. So the wealthy get wealthier but the wager earners are priced out of everything. They will demand higher wages, and up and up we go.

Read more:

isnt that how it is in the U.S.? the rich get richer and the poor gets....well you know the saying...

and you expect this to be a smooth transition? the oil and GAS that they have will back it up.

[OregonHopeful]

It's amazing to me how so many lopsters can take things out of context. They only focus on the zeros. What about the comments from CBI that says they want to strengthen the dinar, they want to make Iraq the strongest economy in the middle east, how they want to help their people and build their infrastructure. They want to go global and join the WTO?

Quit focusing on the zeros people, read the rest of it, look at the long term plans, look at the political plans. Do you think this current parlicment and government of Iraq could get reelected if they lop? NO WAY.

These people need their currancy at least where it was before. That is what they are comparing things to. What if it happened to us. Wouldn't we want our same purchasing power back?

If the political parties expect to keep their positions, they need to recover the economy back to what the people had before, or else Sadam looks better.

IMHO it will RV higher than $1.00. They just can't come out and say it.

We were advised there would be a lot of smoke and mirrors right before the RV. We were also told there would be a lot of "public education". I believe that is what we

are seeing now. They are covering their Ass*s. They can say they were telling the people what would happen. If they didn't "understand" and gather dinars, it would be their own fault.

With the relations with Iraq and Kuwait, it must really burn them to have Kuwait with a much higher exchange rate per US dollar than Iraq. They can import goods and exchange goods easier and with less in-country currency.

The only thing that makes any sense, is to RV AT LEAST $1.00 but IMHO, I think it may go higher. According to the IMF the REAL value is $2.92.

It's kind of like an IPO in the US stock exchange. The analysts value it at one price, then as soon as it goes global, it goes to its "perceived" value.

That's my $.02 worth. But I'm really really tired of the lopsters with such a closed mind and only one focus, the zeros. Read between the lines people. They can't come right out and tell everyone in actual words. So, the zeros aren't to be taken literally either.............. Get a grip!

[xyzzy]

isnt that how it is in the U.S.? the rich get richer and the poor gets....well you know the saying...

Indeed and in the last 10 years it has gotten much worse in the US .

and you expect this to be a smooth transition? the oil and GAS that they have will back it up.

No, I expect Iraq will have many hurdles along the way but, a huge RV is one they can avoid. Further the total oil and gas in the ground will indeed be a major ingredient for their growth. But, future potential does not set the currency now. The total oil in the ground in Iraq is estimate to be about 15T USD worth, so over the 30 years or more it will take to extract it, that isn't really a huge amount (200B USD per year).

[Redwizard]

Wow this thread has made me excited, depressed and wore out all at the same time

[FrankieV]

1) There will be a huge immediate drain on foreign reserves as with 24T or 30T or 60T (pick your number) out in the world, I'd guess that at least 1T dinars will come in for exchange and there is no way they have the foreign reserves to cover that.

2) The gap between rich and poor in Iraq is magnified by 1000x. Anyone living paycheck to paycheck is screwed and everyone that has savings is sitting very pretty. In a country already very fractionalized with plenty of opportunists ready to rally the disenfranchised, this is a recipe for disaster.

3) You as a hard working Iraqi have saved up 250,000 IQD to buy a used $200 USD motor scooter. Now that 250,000 IQD can buy you a $50,000 USD BMW and have 80% of it left over. But when you get to the dealer the 3 cars he had sold out 1 minute after opening for 5x their sticker price and there is a line around the block signing up for more at those same inflated prices. But salaries have to be lowered by the RV amount. If you were making 2,000 IQD per hour before now you will only be making 2 IQD/hr. LIkewise with good from in Iraq. So the wealthy get wealthier but the wager earners are priced out of everything. They will demand higher wages, and up and up we go.

4) Even if they can mangage the inital exchange how do they do so on-gonigly? BMW will be happy to supply more cars, but they don't want dinars they want euros, where is the CBI going to get them? And if the CBI can't support this exchange reate (1:1 with the dollar) then foreign companies will not sell their goods based on it.

Good points. Most people spend very little (i.e. zero) time considering the actual mechanics and consequences of a huge RV. People say over and over that the Iraqis need this, but the truth is that it screws all of them except for the rich ones.

Wow, this parade really got rained on. Lots of good opinions here though. Guess we will just have to accept whatever does happen. Even the lopsters don't really want a LOP. I just thought that they had to come out within 50 cents of Kuwait's....has that gone away too? Personally, I don't think any news article is going to come out and say "oh, by the way, our currency is going to worth 1000 xs more than it is right now." Would you do that? Anyway, LOP or not...nothing we can really do now but ride the ride we are on. We have at least met some wonderful friends on our journey and gained weight from watching this unravel everyday....so all is not lost. Hmmmm, dang, I wanted this to be like microsoft, but I am always a day late and dollar short. I will wait until the fat lady sings....we still have a chance until then. JMO

Saudis currency is nowhere near being within 50 cents of Kuwaits, why does Iraqs have to be?

[Mazzz27]

Indeed and in the last 10 years it has gotten much worse in the US .

No, I expect Iraq will have many hurdles along the way but, a huge RV is one they can avoid. Further the total oil and gas in the ground will indeed be a major ingredient for their growth. But, future potential does not set the currency now. The total oil in the ground in Iraq is estimate to be about 15T USD worth, so over the 30 years or more it will take to extract it, that isn't really a huge amount (200B USD per year).

well i have come to the conclusion there is something hidden here that theyre not telling us....

Edited September 4, 2011 by Mazzz27

[countryroads]

The show is not really over when the RV is announced. Iraq will have to live with it's decision as to it's rate. The same rate that effects us will also effect all the other countries of the world. If they feel that Iraq RVed too low they aren't going to just sit still and take it. They will do what they can to get it changed. Post RV Iraq will not be calling all the shots, they still have to live with the rest uf the world.

[xyzzy]

It's amazing to me how so many lopsters can take things out of context. They only focus on the zeros. What about the comments from CBI that says they want to strengthen the dinar, they want to make Iraq the strongest economy in the middle east, how they want to help their people and build their infrastructure. They want to go global and join the WTO?

All that IS possible with an RD and a small RV. A dinar that exchanges at 1:1 with the dollar with 20B in circulation IS much stronger then one that trade at 1000:1 with 20T in circulation.

Quit focusing on the zeros people, read the rest of it, look at the long term plans, look at the political plans. Do you think this current parlicment and government of Iraq could get reelected if they lop? NO WAY.

These people need their currency at least where it was before.

It can not happen as long as there is 1000x the number of dinars in circulation as there were before when the rate was high. They will get the rate back to its previous level when they get the size of their money supply back to what it was before. That is an RD. Plus throw in some good growth in GDP, that is the small RV.

The only thing that makes any sense, is to RV AT LEAST $1.00 but IMHO, I think it may go higher. According to the IMF the REAL value is $2.92.

I think you are mistaken. Over on the thread entitled something like IMF says dinar undervalued by 400%, the IMF article says the real value should be 292 dinars per dollar, not $2.92 USD per dinar.

It's kind of like an IPO in the US stock exchange. The analysts value it at one price, then as soon as it goes global, it goes to its "perceived" value.

That's my $.02 worth. But I'm really really tired of the lopsters with such a closed mind and only one focus, the zeros. Read between the lines people. They can't come right out and tell everyone in actual words. So, the zeros aren't to be taken literally either.............. Get a grip!

Maybe, maybe its you who have the closed mind. Further this is NOT like an IPO. The value of a currency is what can be supported NOW, especially for currencies that peg. Stocks, especially IPOs are about a possible future value. And stocks have no underlying economy that they must stay in sync with. The company/stock analogy is really not a very good one.

well i have come to the conclusion there is something hidden here that theyre not telling us....

Getting good information on this subject is certainly not an easy task. But the basic economic stats reported by the CBI I think have to be pretty truthful or they will never be allowed full WTO etc membership.

[Carrello]

So you're upset with me for posting what I think while you post what you think. Ok, thanks for sharing. (oh and its "we could NOT care less..." ).

I have to point out that you stated a rate of 1000:1, 1,000 dinar to one dollar, indicating that 25,000 dinar would be worth something like $25.00. That is correct if that was the actual rate when it takes place.

But the article stated a differtent rate: 1:1. One dinar to one dollar. That means if you have 25,000 dinar, when converted (minus fees) it will be worth $25,000.

Per the particle: "It is estimated that raising the three zeros will lead to the exchange rate of one dollar per dinar..."

[idplzr]

AquaDude....I plus oned you in my heart...out of +1's for the day. You and many others are doing a great job!!

Abby, I gave him one of mine for you. Got your back...

[glo]

Hey! who's been giving me all those (-)s for displaying unrestrained happiness?

hey ! you got + 14 !!!! and one +1 is mine !

[Carrello]

Though they will not lop this means lop.

I had to read this twice. You crack me up!

[Bumper64]

When is lobster season this year?

This thread is full of lobsters.

BTW: there is a LOP- section for the lobsters to play with each other so not to destroy every article on this forum.

[HopefulTxn]

When is lobster season this year?

This thread is full of lobsters.

BTW: there is a LOP- section for the lobsters to play with each other so not to destroy every article on this forum.

The originating article of the thread was what made reference to the process in comparison to Brazil, Romania and Turkey. If you wish to relegate this thread to the 'lop' section, then that is up to you and the other staff of the site. But considering that more articles make statements to that extent than not, you might end up moving quite a few threads.

[Bumper64]

The originating article of the thread was what made reference to the process in comparison to Brazil, Romania and Turkey. If you wish to relegate this thread to the 'lop' section, then that is up to you and the other staff of the site. But considering that more articles make statements to that extent than not, you might end up moving quite a few threads.

I agree with you on that point! What make makes me crazy is when you have a person that makes say 20 post and they say the same thing over and over and over!

Some people might as well just do a copy and paste of one of their post because that is what they will say for the next 10+ post so that they can drive their point into the ground trying to show that they are right and anyone that doesnt agree with them Are wrong!

Just gets old after a while!

Lobsters don't know 100% how this is going to go down just like the rest of us don't know.

[cisole]

Lobsters don't know 100% how this is going to go down just like the rest of us don't know.

[burn_the_village]

What a tired argument...There will be no lop.

To anyone with a fear of an RD ie LOP....

A lop would end any further interest in the dinar and it would require the central bank of iraq to be prepared to cash all of us speculators out. Do not believe what they say, there are a lot of foreign investors in this. Iraq has been selling their money off for years to build their reserves and make no mistake they know where the money goes. They are not stupid. We are tied to the hip and they will not LOP or billions of dollars would leave Iraq with nothing else to replace it. I can say this because their actions of not lopping up to this point says they are very afraid of all of us that are invested.

Turkey and brazil never had this many foreigners holding dinar. what can a lopster say about that? or about the article that states the ISX will not be affected. Turkey and every other country that's RD (lop) has had to adjust stock shares. That is a fact. Now if they are lie-ing about that, what would that do for the future of the ISX? After a brutal lop where they chopped up their stock shares after they said they wouldn't, what would the foreign investor who's money they desperately need, what would the foreigin investor do? Move on to another market....

What kind of future will Iraq have doing this?

Think about the years this thing has been around, all the dinar dealers, all the people talking day in and day out, and the fact that their M2 has done nothing but increase. With us holding, Iraq can not afford a LOP. We would cash out and decimate their currency. That kind of result runs contrary to the mission statement of the central bank of iraq. They need us and at the same time they hate us. Perfect.

Now unless they change their monetary policy, they can not RV either. As far as I can tell their monetary policy is full reserve banking which means they back their currency 100% and that defines Islamic banking. They can only allow it to appreciate and IF that's the route they will take then we have to wait for the economy to develop and it will be about nation building first as a currency represents a nation not define it. Also you better be prepared to be even more patient. Don't be shocked if it doesn't come out at a dollar. Don't be shocked if it doesn't revalue by a 1000% which is what it would take to make it to .86. Do you understand what that revalue you expect is? ITS HISTORIC.....UNPRECEDENTED.....Don't expect that. Currencies just don't do that overnight....or even in a short amount of time...

I would be elated to have an RV of a dollar but am I expecting that to happen? Absolutely not.

Long term...

[Texas1]

I barely recognized Keep without the ballcap....

[keepmwlknfny]

Stupid lopsters!!! LOL

[kosman]

I will be really happy at 10 cents to the dinar. At .20 cents I will quit work and do something I like to do. One dollar is beyond my wildest dreams. I have been trying, but I cannot even really imagine what I would do with a rate of 3.68 or above..... I have some thoughts about it though