It is time to....

[Rossenbos]

My above question has gone not only unanswered here but everywhere else even on the most educated pro-RV Dinar forums : If there are only $10tn US Dollars in circulation and if everyone bought Dinar and magically became 1,000x richer, then where does the other $990tn come from to give them "their" $10qdrn back?

The mistake you make in your thinking is that we do not need money in circulation. The coins and notes in circulation represent less than 4% of all the "money" out there ( digitally, mostly).

9 years ago, or so, the US/UN/IMF/Worldbank TOOK massive wealth of the planet by devaluating the Dinar to what it is now.

We are now on the verge of putting it back!

Have you ever thought about what happened in reverse when the Dinar got DV-ed?

That's when you were supposed to have gotten angry! Trillions wiped away! What was the effect of that action then?

So, let's take an example.

I now have 1.5 mio in assets.

After the RV, I plan to have 5.5 mio in assets.

Am I going to spend the extra 4 mio immediately on things? Am I going to go to the bank with a suitcase to demand notes and coins? Hell no!

I will most likely give money away ( digitally). I will take 150K out of the bank for a big holiday and a new car. And that's it.

Big deal.

Let's assume I park the remaining 5 mio in an investment account at BoA.

How does this effect you and others?

And if 80% of the RV-vets do this, ( in reality, 99% will follow a similar path, I reckon), how will this "break the bank"?

Think! Your brain is your biggest and most effective weapon, sir.

Edited July 13, 2011 by Rossenbos

[speculatorsRIDE]

Coooofffffffeeeeeeeeee. I need more coffee.

[Rossenbos]

BTW, why is this in rumors and not in opinions?

[Luigi1]

Oh boy, lopster talk. I'll explain again. Your 25k note is worth 23-25 dollars right now. You take the zeroes off of your bills which would make it 25. If you see what they plan to do (1k will equal about 1 dollar usd) you will see that you lose NOTHING in value. It is not a lop it is a re denomination. Many countries have done this in the past, Iraq could very easily be the next. Please stay grounded and don't let the emotions get the best of you. As I said before, we will all most likely make money off of this investment.

I am not here to sell you anything, I have no ulterior motives sitting here in my pajamas wide eyed on this rainy night in the pacific NW. Most importantly I am not here to PUSH dinar.

As a DOD contractor, I been through two LOPs, one in Turkey in the 80s & the other in Zaire in the 90s. Two zeros lopped off the Lyre & four zeros were lopped off the Z Note. After LOP, I cashed in the old for the new & lost or gained nothing in value. The Turks & Conganese & those not holding Dollars suffered the most. Since then, their currenceis continued to weaken to the Dollar. Another LOP may be coming. This is what happens with runaway inflation. If the USA don't get a handle on it's inflation, it may see a LOP some day.

[Ironwolf1974]

Do you actually believe all the money owed today actually exists in circulation of printed bills? 80% of all money exists as digits in a computer system.

So if there was $1 trillion dinar that suddenly became worth $4 trillion, where does the extra $3 trillion come from? Some will be printed out of thin air just like they do now, and the rest will be entered as a number electronicly. Who is going to walk into any bank and say, here, I have $1 million dinar and I want my $4 million in USD back in all cash? It don't work that way. You need to make a major purchase, here is a cashiers check! You pay with the cashiers check, they take that number in digits from your account and transfer to the account you gave the cashiers check. Simple!

It is all based on credit and debt. There is no MONEY! It's all credit and debt. The debt you mistaken for being money is just a debt instrument. It is a promise to pay the same as any check is a promise to pay the same as any note you sign to borrow credit is a promise to pay. It is all just debt! Your signature is the credit.

So how big of a number can you write? Presto! You just created that amount out of thin air in credit! The banks do the same by creating debt out of thin air. The small percentage in currency printed is just enough to pass around between everyone to use as a convenience so you can easily get what you need and give them that IOU in exchange for it. You get the items you need, they get a promise to be paid, which no one ever does actually get paid because there is no money. It's all credit and debt and in the near future they won't even be using opaper currency anymore and everything with be done electronically.

So type as big a number as you want and that is how easy they create debt out of thin air. Then they steal your credit to pay for it all.

So you see, the RV can be as much as they want by a simple adjustment in numbers. It is just a number and nothing else. Your credit is unlimited so they can create unlimited debt.

This post times 1000.

Sure they could RD on us, ok whatever time goes on, we all are still alive. And yay I may make 2 to 3x what I put in.

But a RV COULD happen, Im not saying it will or will not and no dates. But it easily could.

[Crow]

Uuuuuuuuuuugggggghhh please go away!!!!! Yet another telling me what to do!!! In honor of your post, I'm gonna buy another 100k today... Thanks for the encouragement!!!

[E A Poe]

It makes you sad? Really? It upsets you that people that you don't know and never will, make a decision to invest and end up overspending? Really? How noble.

It makes me sad that people die in wars.

It makes me sad that people die from incurable diseases.

It makes me sad that people are starving around the world.

Those types of things make me sad. The fact that some people make unwise decisions to invest by spending money they can't afford to spend doesn't make me sad. You see in a free society people are free to make their own decisions. Part of making one's own decision is excepting responsibility for the consequences of those decisions.

Oh Oh! Perhaps I got up on the wrong side of the bed. Better break off here and get a cup of coffee.

I was intending to write something similar....but you did it oh so much better. Now I shall go seeking coffee...

[thatoneguy]

Hang in there kiddos, THIS IS A LONG TERM INVESTMENT! Maybe tomorrow, maybe 5years from now. The potential is too big for this to be a scam, pump, whatever. But, if it feels good, do it. Sell away, buy away, doowhatchalike. IMHO if the GOI can keep playing nice, and understand the political side of things, possibilities are endless. Oil, tourism, trade. Simple.

[canavanelectric]

...any idea what is going on here ?...RI = $3.22 / one IQD...and now they are a sovereign nation, only democratic nation in the ME, going global, with the most abundant supply of natural resources on the planet (Shared )...is it a good investment ? think about it !

[eastcreek]

I'll not speak to the rest of your post now, but let's consider your first question. If the amount of USD in circulation is 10Trillion, does that tell you that the total worth of the U.S. is 10 Trillion USD ? No. There is a correlation between the two numbers , but what the $10Trillion most directly tells you is the amount of USD needed to carry on daily business. Other consideerations of course, but suffice it to say that the $10Trillion is not the total worth of the U.S.

Now, that's my view, but I'm not an economist. If someone on here is an economist, and I'm way off base, please let us all know. Maybe Scooter can chime in ...??? CALLING for SCOOTER !!

P.S. Thanks for that question, makes one think.

Edited July 14, 2011 by Bumper64

[scottntex]

Good morning ppl.. Hows the coffee? I see the early birds are bright eyes and frisky. This was a good post after all. ..lots of good points partytime,

speculatersride, kostaske this is the reason I get up early...LOL

[Polecat85]

You have not been well received, but this is in part because so many people on here have such tough financial situations and anyone not reaffirming they will be rich will be attacked. Those that bought some dinar as just a speculative investment, understand your points are well reasoned.

[DinarDreamer82]

Last I checked, this is an open forum and this is the "Rumor" section. Nothing here has been proved, or it would be in the "News" section. If you are a serious investor, you should be willing to consider all possible scenarios. If you're just looking to get rich quickly, keep mailing in those Publisher Clearing House entry forms. Thanks for the post...we all need a balanced view of what could happen.

[umbertino]

Quote

P.S. I will most likely be banned. After all Adam Montana does not like people messing with his revalue (VIP). I'll be back!

End Quote

I bet you'll be proven wrong.

Quote

Some will kick and scream that they once thought they would be millionaires overnight,

End Quote

Sorry but that's the usual "overnight" drivel talk.... Maybe not Millionaires ( or maybe it 'll happen....nobody knows)... Having waited for 7 plus years on this one myself I wouldn't exactly deem it as "getting rich (Millionaire or not) overnight".... Besides, I mean.... what would be wrong in getting rich overnight? Not a federal charge yet

Edited July 13, 2011 by umbertino

[umbertino]

Quote

Oh boy, lopster talk. I'll explain again. Your 25k note is worth 23-25 dollars right now. You take the zeroes off of your bills which would make it 25. If you see what they plan to do (1k will equal about 1 dollar usd) you will see that you lose NOTHING in value.

End Quote

Maybe... Maybe not... Strictly for sake of discussion.... It could go the way you describe it or it could go that they decide to equal 1 IQD to 1 USD or 1 EUR ( or any other Currency) WITHOUT CASTRATING THE 3 ZEROS in which case your 25K DInar note becomes 25kUSD or 25k EUR.....Or the exchange rate could be also different than 1:1 but still without removing the zeros.....

Again ... Maybe or maybe not... To act like one has the undisputed truth and outright confidence one way or the other about this is just gullible and a li'l bit savvy-arrogant.....We have to be humble and admit that anything can come out of this..

Then of course we can discuss on the most probable outcomes... Probable.. Not 100% sure...

I'm personally open to anything and I do not exclude anything .....I think that's a healthy mental approach......Good Luck to us

Edited July 13, 2011 by umbertino

[HappySteel]

Our own government has too much invested in the dinar for this not to rv or ri.... fact case closed

Show me proof that our government even has any dinar and then I will believe you. There are two scenarios that jsut amaze me. Yours and the one that says Obama is stopping the RV. BS!!!

[NBTEX]

If you have to trick people to read your post, maybe you shouldn't post them. Your title it's here it's time to......thanks for wasting my time. Oh and by the way send me your Dinar and when it RVs I will send you 3 times what you paid for it, oh what the heck I'm a nice guy I will even send you 4 times what you paid for it....

[TFK]

Hi All, Don't bash him. That is what he believes and it is his opinion. No one exactly knows how and when they are going to RV. There are so many theories and speculations. Only the time will tell us who is wright and who is wrong. I wish every one a happy ending. Cheers

Why do so many people say others are bashing when they say "if you don't believe then sell". Thats not bashing. It's an opinion too!!

I'll second the person above. If you don't believe, sell your dinar and leave the forums. Don't try to convince us all that this investment is a joke or a scam because you've now come to believe that. We're not interested!

I didn't even read your whole rant. I've seen it all before and the only reason I'm responding is because of all the negativity you bring here. Just another opinion and if you disagree without being rude, then I wouldn't consider it bashing.

Bashing is when you are rude and disrespectful. I see none of that in most responses that ask him to sell and leave.

[motox565]

Thanks theadicts for your opinion! I think it's important for all of the newer dinar investor to see the possibilities that exist pertaining to multiple eventual outcomes.We should be able to hear all respectfully presented opinions without sensoring or such.

It seems "lop talk" has become a taboo throughout many of the dinar forums and has been isolated to it's respective less desirable location. lol ... I still believe in a reasonable RV but that doesn't go without the knowledge of the other less attractive possibilties. Though we may not agree, I appreciate your post. ...... and just maybe we are on the fringe of this thing revealing it's true direction.

[Mntnman]

Thanks theadicts for your opinion! I think it's important for all of the newer dinar investor to see the possibilities that exist pertaining to multiple eventual outcomes.We should be able to hear all respectfully presented opinions without censoring or such.

It seems "lop talk" has become a taboo throughout many of the dinar forums and has been isolated to it's respective less desirable location. lol ... I still believe in a reasonable RV but that doesn't go without the knowledge of the other less attractive possibilities. Though we may not agree, I appreciate your post. ...... and just maybe we are on the fringe of this thing revealing it's true direction.

Well said, MotoX!

+1

[motox565]

Well said, MotoX!

+1

Thanks brotha!

[Carrello]

Why? I still have a shot at making 1, 2, or even 3 times the amount I spent initially on this investment.

Yeah, but what is $30 bucks in the scheme of things....

[Francie26]

It makes you sad? Really? It upsets you that people that you don't know and never will, make a decision to invest and end up overspending? Really? How noble.

It makes me sad that people die in wars.

It makes me sad that people die from incurable diseases.

It makes me sad that people are starving around the world.

Those types of things make me sad. The fact that some people make unwise decisions to invest by spending money they can't afford to spend doesn't make me sad. You see in a free society people are free to make their own decisions. Part of making one's own decision is excepting responsibility for the consequences of those decisions.

Oh Oh! Perhaps I got up on the wrong side of the bed. Better break off here and get a cup of coffee.

"Excepting responsibilty" meanings omitting it, while "accepting responsibility" means assuming it. Thus, "excepting" is very nearly the opposite of "accepting." I don't normally correct spelling errors on here, in fact, never have, but that one caught my attention simply because of the quirky difference in the two meanings. This could easily confuse a reader, while the writer feels he/she has communicated clearly. And I don't think a cup of coffee with fix this, no more than your comments "fixed" the person to whom they were snidely (perhaps sadly) directed.

[FishmanTx]

Well, just to give an idea about having Dinars in the bank, here's a hypothetical (so DON'T nit-pick the numbers!) of the main 3 monetary change scenarios....

Habib has 10k IQD in the bank and the exchange rate is 1:1.

10k IQD @ 1:1 = 10k USD

Due to inflation, devaluation, and war the exchange rate falls to 1000:1 and Habib now has 10k IQD worth 10 USD.

10k IQD @ 1000:1 = 10 USD

His brand new Govt steps up and exclaims "we must restore value to the Dinar for the People of Iraq!" and proceeds with a plan to "remove three zeroes" and change the exchange rate to 1:1. Now, due to the fact that no one really knows what " removing the zeroes" REALLY entails, here are three POSSIBLE scenarios.

Scenario 1: The LOP (across-the-board removal of zeroes)

Three zeroes are removed from all physical currency, all bank accounts, and the exchange rate.

Habib now has:

10 IQD @ 1:1 = 10 USD

For Habib, NO VALUE GAINED, 9990 REMAINS LOST, but the everyday "Mohammed" loses nothing and this will represent a lateral move for all holding hard currency or accounts begun POST-war.

And we don't get the Big Enchilada.

Scenario 2: Removal of three zeros from notes *hard currency only* i.e. 10k=10 swap (anything else is a LOP; see scenario #1)

As this does NOT include the bank accounts, Habib now has:

10k IQD @ 1:1 = 10k USD

Value is recovered in bank accounts, but hard currency holders gain nothing.

10k IQD @ 1:1 = 10 USD

Now, for pre-war account holders, this recovers their lost value, but even though a lot of Iraqi's will have been

sitting on a stash of hard currency since the change, they are the only ones who MAY lose. But the everyday "Mohammed" loses nothing and this will represent a lateral move for those hold currency outside the banks. Again, we don't get the Big Enchilada.

Scenario 3: The Straight RV

three zeroes removed from the rate and "three zero notes" are removed from circulation by attrition

Habib now has:

10k IQD @ 1:1 = 10k USD

Value is recovered in accounts and hard currency. Everyone gains from the change and the Big Enchilada is served up

on a golden platter.

All scenarios MUST INVOLVE AN RV. The rate change will be a modified float with a narrow trade range so that the CBI can better control it and will be followed by a redenomination as indicated by the CBI reps statements that an RD will occur after the removal of the zeroes, i.e new currency issued and ALL the old removed from circulation

Conclusion:

IMO, I think scenarios 1 and 2 are more likely from the perspective that the GOI doesn't want to have to shell out the large amounts that a straight RV would entail. But then again they would still be broke with only $27B to rebuild the country with and THAT ain't enough.

Scenario 1 would be the easiest to implement, but does not add lost value back to those who lost it.

Scenario 2 would be the best and most fair versus a LOP to those with pre-war bank holdings. I find it POSSIBLE but IMPROBABLE in the sense that the information (propaganda?) coming out from the CBI and MoF seems to indicate otherwise.

Scenario 3 would actually be the best overall for the purposes of paying off their debt as well as rebuilding the infrastructure and bringing the people up out of poverty. The value of 27T IQD equaling 27B USD now becomes equivalent to 27T USD. Now THAT'S buying power. They could pay off all their debt, cash out all the investors, rebuild their country and have some left over.

Fish

Edited July 13, 2011 by FishmanTx

[aliciadogz]

Easy said and done, get out.It my choice, your choice and everyone choice.I'm tried of people like you telling me how to spend my money.If I want to vest in Dinars its my business,If it a bad vest its my business,if its a great vest its my business ,stay out of my business!!!