THE $50,000 DOLLAR BAG OF GROCERIES......

[dinarck]

dinarck, you are the rd crusader. lol

Sonny I dont want it any more than you. Unforunately that doesnt mean that it isnt a reality.

Hopefully you will put the "must RV" thinking to the side just long enough to give your thoughts on what we may expect if in fact they do RD. You have to admit. It looks like they will.

Edited March 26, 2012 by dinarck

[sonny1]

Sonny I dont want it any more than you. Unforunately that doesnt mean that it isnt a reality.

Hopefully you will put the "must RV" thinking to the side just long enough to give your thoughts on what we may expect if in fact they do RD. You have to admit. It looks like they will.

here is what i will admit, iraq has never told the truth about anything, and never showed actions on anything they do say........fact

i will admit, and you rd'ers will never admit it, but they would of rd'd when inflation was sky high, but they chose to bring inflation down, there actions are those of a country that is about to raise there value of there currency. lopping is neutral, there is no value gained, and unlike you guys seem not to realize but rd'ing doesnt increase purchasing power, and will not get there private sector up and running. i also know that countries dont just say.....hey we will forgive your billions and billions of debt, for free.....never happened.... i also know that the u.s treasury, imf, w-b have been over in iraq helping them with there monetary policy, and they all have best interests for the countries that iraq owes money too. i also know that iraq can afford a .10 rv, not $12.48 like those idiots say. i dont like all the b.s either, okie and tk are complete fools, and everyone who states stupidity is a fool, i have been wrong as well, so i am not innocent, but i agree that these other guys are complete idiots. i will say that it could go either way, but you rd'ers do try to out think yourselves........fact

[dinarck]

Wow sonny. Usually countries RD after hyperinflation is brought under control. It is a tool to erase the effects of PAST hyperinflation. If they attempted a RD during hyperinflation it wouldnt work.

A RD puts the dinar on par with the dollar with the same purchasing power that the dollar has. What more purchasing power do they need? Maybe if 1 dinar bought a camel then everyone in Iraq would be happy? The purchasing power argument is easily disspelled by the fact that I just gave. What good is purchasing power to an Iraqi who doesnt have dinar because he doesnt have a job that pays well anyway?

[sonny1]

Wow sonny. Usually countries RD after hyperinflation is brought under control. It is a tool to erase the effects of PAST hyperinflation. If they attempted a RD during hyperinflation it wouldnt work.

A RD puts the dinar on par with the dollar with the same purchasing power that the dollar has. What more purchasing power do they need? Maybe if 1 dinar bought a camel then everyone in Iraq would be happy? The purchasing power argument is easily disspelled by the fact that I just gave. What good is purchasing power to an Iraqi who doesnt have dinar because he doesnt have a job that pays well anyway?

so your saying that rd'ing isnt neutral, sorry, but your wrong. if it stays neutral, even, no rise, even-steven, how does that increase purchasing power.....it doesnt...

for your inflation issue, look at mexico......

[RVPleaseToday]

If they RD as they say they will, one Dinar buys the same thing that 1166 did the day before. Sounds like an increase in purchasing power to me.

[dinarck]

so your saying that rd'ing isnt neutral, sorry, but your wrong. if it stays neutral, even, no rise, even-steven, how does that increase purchasing power.....it doesnt...

for your inflation issue, look at mexico......

So you are saying a currency revaluation is going to take the place of good paying jobs? That is what they really need.

The new dinar will be on par with the dollar with the same purchasing power. How is that hard to comprehend?

[sonny1]

So you are saying a currency revaluation is going to take the place of good paying jobs? That is what they really need.

The new dinar will be on par with the dollar with the same purchasing power. How is that hard to comprehend?

wow, i am now done debating you today, you obviously dont know what neutral means, your computer should have a dictionary on it use it.

Mexico

In spite of the Oil Crisis of the late 1970s (Mexico is a producer and exporter), and due to excessive social spending, Mexico defaulted on its external debt in 1982. As a result, the country suffered a severe case of capital flight and several years of hyperinflation and peso devaluation. On 1 January 1993, Mexico created a new currency, the nuevo peso ("new peso", or MXN), which chopped 3 zeros off the old peso, an inflation rate of 10,000% over the several years of the crisis. (One new peso was equal to 1000 of the obsolete MXP pesos).

here is the piece about the mexico lop......if you notice its because of inflation......danmmmm %10,000 thats when a country most likely rd's...

here is the link to it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperinflation#Mexico

[dinarck]

wow, i am now done debating you today, you obviously dont know what neutral means, your computer should have a dictionary on it use it.

Mexico

In spite of the Oil Crisis of the late 1970s (Mexico is a producer and exporter), and due to excessive social spending, Mexico defaulted on its external debt in 1982. As a result, the country suffered a severe case of capital flight and several years of hyperinflation and peso devaluation. On 1 January 1993, Mexico created a new currency, the nuevo peso ("new peso", or MXN), which chopped 3 zeros off the old peso, an inflation rate of 10,000% over the several years of the crisis. (One new peso was equal to 1000 of the obsolete MXP pesos).

here is the piece about the mexico lop......if you notice its because of inflation......danmmmm %10,000 thats when a country most likely rd's...

here is the link to it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperinflation#Mexico

Sonny I think maybe we should end our debate here. You are incapable of seeing how their purchasing power would improve with a RD. You think thay they have to RV by 100,000% so Irawis will have good purchasing power which is a joke.

RDs have been failures and they have been sucessful. They have been done in hyperinflation and they have been done after hyperinflation. So what.

[sonny1]

wow, you admitted defeat, i can go about my day now...........

[DinarWhiz]

I just don't understand why anyone with a lopster attitude would waste all their time trying to convince RVers that the RV will not happen. These Lopsters have soooo many hours invested in telling us that the investment they are in with us is not going to prosper. Man Its soooo annoying !!!!!

[keepmwlknfny]

I just don't understand why anyone with a lopster attitude would waste all their time trying to convince RVers that the RV will not happen. These Lopsters have soooo many hours invested in telling us that the investment they are in with us is not going to prosper. Man Its soooo annoying !!!!!

They want a RV just as much as anyone else but instead of just believing blindly, some actually want to see how in reality everything could or can work....

And if you look at the numbers side of things, it just doesnt add up!!

[dinarck]

wow, you admitted defeat, i can go about my day now...........

Yep. I admit defeat from you since you have an article showing Mexico had a redenomination because of inflation. Haha.. Why do you thonk RDs are done sonny? To devalue the currency and screw all the currency speculators? Lol. I admit. You are right and I am wrong. Soon they will RV 1000 times the value overnight so Iraqis can have good purchasing power.

[BigFrankD]

wow, i am now done debating you today, you obviously dont know what neutral means, your computer should have a dictionary on it use it.

Mexico

In spite of the Oil Crisis of the late 1970s (Mexico is a producer and exporter), and due to excessive social spending, Mexico defaulted on its external debt in 1982. As a result, the country suffered a severe case of capital flight and several years of hyperinflation and peso devaluation. On 1 January 1993, Mexico created a new currency, the nuevo peso ("new peso", or MXN), which chopped 3 zeros off the old peso, an inflation rate of 10,000% over the several years of the crisis. (One new peso was equal to 1000 of the obsolete MXP pesos).

here is the piece about the mexico lop......if you notice its because of inflation......danmmmm %10,000 thats when a country most likely rd's...

here is the link to it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperinflation#Mexico

10,000% is about the TOTAL amount of inflation Mexico underwent. In 1993, when they RDd, inflation was between 8 and 11% or so, and had been under control for several years. Sound familiar?

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/mexico/inflation-cpi

[umbertino]

I just don't understand why anyone with a lopster attitude would waste all their time trying to convince RVers that the RV will not happen. These Lopsters have soooo many hours invested in telling us that the investment they are in with us is not going to prosper. Man Its soooo annoying !!!!!

So why coming to a section with the name of "LOP Talk" then? I mean , if its so annoying... Please keep in mind ( maybe you're unaware of it) that Legolas and Dinarck are FORCED to stay here in that they're allowed to ONLY post here and nowhere else around this Forum......

So for one to come here (LOP Talk section) and state that it's annoying....Doesn't make much sense....

[jmw]

i am for surely selling now. thanks jmw your the smartest, most bestest, rd'er of them all

Thank you!

[jmw]

Legolas and Dinarck...if there are any specific articles or posts that you would like to address...just let me know and I will copy them over to the LOP section so you can...

[Laid Back]

RV, RD, RD + RV...I will ride this until the end....Thank you to Legolas, Dinarck, unbertino, jmw, Keep, for showing us the other side of this investment.

Keep it real

[dinarck]

Legolas and Dinarck...if there are any specific articles or posts that you would like to address...just let me know and I will copy them over to the LOP section so you can...

Thanks buddy.

[Legolas]

They want a RV just as much as anyone else but instead of just believing blindly, some actually want to see how in reality everything could or can work....

And if you look at the numbers side of things, it just doesnt add up!!

Hey Keep. Welcome to the Lopster Penitentiary. I tried to help you out in your battle up in the opinions section by using up my allocation of +'s, but they won't let you get a sentence out up there without giving you a negative. I ran out before I could do you much good. I think I might have been outnumbered about 3,000:1 by the delusional zombies who blast you with negs without providing justification for their positions. I think a + paintball gun with an extended mag might help.

Legolas and Dinarck...if there are any specific articles or posts that you would like to address...just let me know and I will copy them over to the LOP section so you can...

Thanks JMW. The one you posted here today is one of the best articulated articles I've seen. It was brief and to the point, but definitely left no room for doubt. Anyone who can't understand the intent depicted in that one needs to get the prescription checked on their rose colored glasses. Of course we all know that those hundreds of articles are written with the sole intention of deterring speculators, and to make the dealers feel guilty as they sell their billions of Dinars at a 40% markup.

[umbertino]

RV, RD, RD + RV...I will ride this until the end....Thank you to Legolas, Dinarck, unbertino, jmw, Keep, for showing us the other side of this investment.

Keep it real

LB...You're very kind but I contributed nothing to this.. I just leave it to the Experts from whom I'm learning a lot every day... It's all Legolas, Dinarck, jmw, dvforumuser ( and a few others... sorry If I don't remember all of you guys) ....

Of course thanks also to the ones ( sonny1 etc.) who give the possibility to this debate to proceed with stimulating reasonings, reflections, etc.

We're lucky to have People like these on our Forum. They state things that make sense ( even if some of us don't like the sound of it)

Having said that.... Good Luck to us......

Edited March 26, 2012 by umbertino

[Darin]

Wow sonny. Usually countries RD after hyperinflation is brought under control. It is a tool to erase the effects of PAST hyperinflation. If they attempted a RD during hyperinflation it wouldnt work.

A RD puts the dinar on par with the dollar with the same purchasing power that the dollar has. What more purchasing power do they need? Maybe if 1 dinar bought a camel then everyone in Iraq would be happy? The purchasing power argument is easily disspelled by the fact that I just gave. What good is purchasing power to an Iraqi who doesnt have dinar because he doesnt have a job that pays well anyway?

The raising of purchasing power is only an illusion. Yes, their IQD now purchases more, but for any Iraqi holding currency with 000s, they now technically have less. Its a value-neutral event.

I don't see what is gained through that.

Without the 000s the following can be seen as an advantage

-- They can add, subtract, divide, and multiply with ease because of less 000s to work with

------ This leads to easier accounting

------ This leads to ease of trade of currencies

Where is the incentive for the average Iraqi to exchange for lower denominations from a re-denominated currency if it does not benefit them?

If a 25,000 note still buys the $21 value afterwards while the newly re-denominated note of 25 still buys $21 worth of values of goods/services, where is the incentive to attempt to exchange?

I highly doubt people will rush to exchange their USD for IQD upon this event... Which basically means that demand wont really go up either

Its an illusion, and if anything may become a hassle for the average Iraqi having to deal with an additional currency within their economy.

I would bet that those using USD as a first-choice will remain using USD as a first-choice. (mostly due to its ease of being converted)

Those that feel that their wealth is lost may convert to use of USD (which may equally be met by those that use USD who feel that the IQD has more purchasing power - so basically a wash)

I'm not arguing they have to R/V, but more so arguing that the idea of a R/D is not going to fix their world either (mostly in the short-term)

I would argue that their best route of action is to slowly appreciate the value against foreign currencies while introducing lower denominations upon necessity to appease the market. (i.e., if the value double introduce a 25 IQD to basically replace what a 50 used to purchase)

This puts wealth back to the people in a slow process and as the economy begins to boom, the value will appreciate even faster as the CBI can support it.

Basically by reversing the inflation that occurred in previous years in the same time-frame that it happened. Which I think is a feasible option, but will just take time.

[jmw]

I would argue that their best route of action is to slowly appreciate the value against foreign currencies while introducing lower denominations upon necessity to appease the market. (i.e., if the value double introduce a 25 IQD to basically replace what a 50 used to purchase)

This puts wealth back to the people in a slow process and as the economy begins to boom, the value will appreciate even faster as the CBI can support it.

Basically by reversing the inflation that occurred in previous years in the same time-frame that it happened. Which I think is a feasible option, but will just take time.

they can do this with a new currency as well....growing the value slowly is what will happen if they continue to prosper...it doesn't matter if it is the current currency or the one they will be coming out with shortly.

[WorkerBee]

LB...You're very kind but I contributed nothing to this.. I just leave it to the Experts from whom I'm learning a lot every day... It's all Legolas, Dinarck, jmw, dvforumuser ( and a few others... sorry If I don't remember all of you guys) ....

Of course thanks also to the ones ( sonny1 etc.) who give the possibility to this debate to proceed with stimulating reasonings, reflections, etc.

We're lucky to have People like these on our Forum. They state things that make sense ( even if some of us don't like the sound of it)

Having said that.... Good Luck to us......

Ditto for me as well. I understand the postings but I don't have the mental capacity (yet,..... or most likely probably never) to debate the issue intelligently. I would like to add Markinsa to the list of thosewho are brave enough to venture in and argue their point.

I think you guys are selling yourselves short if you think you aren't getting the "other possibility" message through. Traffic is increasing! Thanks again, and thanks for responding to my questions.

[Laid Back]

LB...You're very kind but I contributed nothing to this.. I just leave it to the Experts from whom I'm learning a lot every day... It's all Legolas, Dinarck, jmw, dvforumuser ( and a few others... sorry If I don't remember all of you guys) ....

Of course thanks also to the ones ( sonny1 etc.) who give the possibility to this debate to proceed with stimulating reasonings, reflections, etc.

We're lucky to have People like these on our Forum. They state things that make sense ( even if some of us don't like the sound of it)

Having said that.... Good Luck to us......

Totally agreed.

Good luck to us

[WorkerBee]

Totally agreed.

Good luck to us

I used to think you had some kind of "top secret" intel that you weren't sharing and that's why you were so calm about the RV happening. If I saw you had made a post, I was there, waiting for you to spill the beans. Nope, just another chillax post...... it really pissed me off because I knew you knew something. ! ps....I'm a type A personality, AAAAGGHHH!