King or President...?

[parmenio]

"... the truth is, we can't wait for a dysfunctional Congress to do its job." These words were spoke by Obama recently. He then signed a series of executive orders to "create" shovel ready jobs and spend more money to fix bridges and roads. We already know this was a MASSIVE failure the first time around.

Obama also signed an EO (executive order) to reforms of the federal student loan program. His EO will be stimulus money to be used to forgive some of these student loans or modify them.

Here's the kicker for us. Executive orders apply only to the executive branch (president) of government. The president has ONLY the authority to REFUSE expenditures (stimulus money). The President (executive branch) does NOT have the authority to spend money..., only the LEGISLATURE (Congress) can do this according to our Constitution! Is Obama acting as King or President?

[Seabee]

I have never had a lot of faith for Obama as President, however at the end of the day he is the president of the United State and I willdo my best to respect his athuority (To an extent)

What he is doing now, I would term as sidestepping congress. If he does this as a scheme to put people back to work then I will support it. For Congress to conduct themselve's like little children as they have been over the past year makes me want to puke. We have too many people out of work our country including many of which are members of this site for Conress to be palying games. If Obama can put people back to work in this country using whatever means then I will support it.

After all if Congress won't put people back to work then let's put all of Congress out of work.

[parmenio]

I have never had a lot of faith for Obama as President, however at the end of the day he is the president of the United State and I willdo my best to respect his athuority (To an extent)

What he is doing now, I would term as sidestepping congress. If he does this as a scheme to put people back to work then I will support it. For Congress to conduct themselve's like little children as they have been over the past year makes me want to puke. We have too many people out of work our country including many of which are members of this site for Conress to be palying games. If Obama can put people back to work in this country using whatever means then I will support it.

After all if Congress won't put people back to work then let's put all of Congress out of work.

So you see him as KING?

[ehmjr]

I think it was Einstein that defined stupid as " Doing the same thing and expecting different results". That goes for round 2 of the stimulus. If the powers that be would free up things so the employers would know what was going to happen and make it sort of long term, jobs would come.

[Seabee]

So you see him as KING?

Did you read every line that I wrote? Nowhere did I say he was a king and you are not going to draw me into anything more on this thread.Other Presindents have used the same thing. Are you going to begrudge people getting help on Students Loans or people going back to work? Apparently you don't live in the second poorest county in upstate New York and suffer like alot of my good neighbors do.

I'll give President Obama a C- as Prez and an F as King.

[radar47]

I support any effort to get folks working. GO RV!!!!!

[Danan]

I think it was Einstein that defined stupid as " Doing the same thing and expecting different results". That goes for round 2 of the stimulus. If the powers that be would free up things so the employers would know what was going to happen and make it sort of long term, jobs would come.

Totally agree. His Stimulus package didn't work for the common man the first time, and hey how about forgiving student loans just before election time, that way he has them in his pocket. Wake up America. It isn't that he is a Democrat, it is that he thinks he is better than everyone else including ALL of voting America.

[Seabee]

I support any effort to get folks working. GO RV!!!!!

I gave you a + for that statement

[parmenio]

Did you read every line that I wrote? Nowhere did I say he was a king and you are not going to draw me into anything more on this thread.Other Presindents have used the same thing. Are you going to begrudge people getting help on Students Loans or people going back to work? Apparently you don't live in the second poorest county in upstate New York and suffer like alot of my good neighbors do.

I'll give President Obama a C- as Prez and an F as King.

Yes, I read every line you wrote..., you apparently have not read mine! Executive orders are to be used ONLY to REFUSE EXPENDITURES. The LEGISLATURE is the only branch of government that can spend money which Obama is doing through his EO's. What part did you not get, my friend?

If you support what Obama is doing then you are supporting your "King".

[rjboots1]

Obama talks about democracy, but acts as a socialist dictator. What he's doing with these executive orders is wrong. He doesn't seem to get the fact that what he calls the "dysfunctional" Congress was ELECTED BY THE AMERICAN PEOPLE. I don't care if he thinks they are dysfunctional or not. The US electorate is transitioning from liberal back to more fiscally conservatvie. We're right in the middle of that transition. The fact that it's not allowing him to do what he wants should be his problem, not ours. So instead, he's bypassing the Constitution and the Congress, to re-cycle his failed spending policies to try and stimulate a failing economic recovery. The fundamental problem here is simple. Governments don't create jobs, BUSINESSES DO! Sure, governments can hire people, but they become part of the problem, not the solution, because they are not productive, sustainable jobs, and they become part of the spending problem and the tax burden that keeps businesses from being able to fund and create productive, sustainable jobs that ultimately grow the economy. Socialism doesn't work. It's been tried for centuries, and it ALWAYS fails. Keynesian economics doesn't work. It's been tried for a century and it ALWAYS fails. We need to shrink the government, shrink the spending budget, shrink the tax burden and regulation on businesses, and give the capitalistic system that made this nation the greatest empire in the history of the planet a chance to work again!!! And if we, as a people, are stupid enough to re-elect this man, then we deserve the economic collapse that will be forthcoming.

Edited October 31, 2011 by rjboots1

[Francie26]

I have sat and stared at this empty post for a while, trying to think of how to say what I feel needs to be said. I have no desire or intention of angering or insulting someone. But I do want to state my own view of this matter. The first congress under Obama was right there will all his schemes and plans to knock them out for him, and to do everything he asked. To that end, he wanted to get the health insurance, and he wanted more and more money to be spent every day. The money that went for his schemes to do the first stimulus, which didn't work (he even said so when he laughed because they had learned tthat there really weren't any shovel ready jobs), so he followed it by spending more trillions of our money on the auto bailout and taking over the auto industry, plus the Cash for Clunkers program that accomplished nothing and still spent a huge amount of money. By this time, I felt a little desperate because all that money was going, and we were getting nothing for it. More and more people were out of work, and there was less and less money to help the growing numbers of umemployed. But he followed that with another stimulus program, again accomplishing nothing. Well, i take that back, His wasteful spending and more demands for further tax dollars from business caused desperation in the business sector that lead to even more jobs being lost and so much money spent that it will cost our grandchildren years of their working life to pay it off, and that's only if Obama doesn't spend another dime.

Meantime, more and more businesses were having to close their doors and unemployment continued to rise. He has not let up,just keeps spending and spending. If we did that at our homes, we would be out on the streets by now. The American people were so upset that they voted in a much more conservative congress, but that didn't stop Obama's spending. And meantime he appointed at least 35, and I think more, czars who are in charge of huge amounts of taxpayer money and aren't accountable to congress or the American people. Obama has done so many end-runs around congress and he just told us that he plans to do more. That's what all this is about. And this is not how our forefathers set up our government., but how they set it up worked for 200-300 years, until Obama figured out how to scam the system. And he has almost brought this great country to her knees. It will take generations to undo all the damage he has done to our government and to our grandchildren, if in fact, it can even be undone.

Of course all of us want to help our poor, those good people who simply need a hand up, but we have to do it without breaking the backbone of our country. I am not against helping people who genuinely need it, because when my turn comes, they would step up and help me. That's just who we Americans are. But Obama isn't doing that. He promises a lot, but he actually does very little. Where are all the jobs he promised? And if they are out there, why aren't some of your neighbors working again? I would love to see a much more conservative president who would refrain from spending money needlessly so there would be more to actually put to good use for those who genuinely need it. I would like to see a president who actually helps those who need it, and not just promises us pretty speeches and then gives his help to unions and to his buddies in the "greasy palm" system of paybacks.

If you are offended, I am sorry about that, but I have given this much thought, and these are my considered views based upon the facts, not just my wishes, but the honest to goodness facts. We are never going to have what you want from this president. I think he would do it, but he can't seem to figure out how to do it (which no one could) while continuing to waste all our tax money and continuing this high spending without getting anything for it.

[parmenio]

Obama talks about democracy, but acts as a socialist dictator. What he's doing with these executive orders is wrong. He doesn't seem to get the fact that what he calls the "dysfunctional" Congress was ELECTED BY THE AMERICAN PEOPLE. I don't care if he thinks they are dysfunctional or not. The US electorate is transitioning from liberal back to more fiscally conservatvie. We're right in the middle of that transition. The fact that it's not allowing him to do what he wants should be his problem, not ours. So instead, he's bypassing the Constitution and the Congress, to re-cycle his failed spending policies to try and stimulate a failing economic recovery. The fundamental problem here is simple. Governments don't create jobs, BUSINESSES DO! Sure, governments can hire people, but they become part of the problem, not the solution, because they are not productive, sustainable jobs, and they become part of the spending problem and the tax burden that keeps businesses from being able to fund and create productive, sustainable jobs that ultimately grow the economy. Socialism doesn't work. It's been tried for centuries, and it ALWAYS fails. Keynesian economics doesn't work. It's been tried for a century and it ALWAYS fails. We need to shrink the government, shrink the spending budget, shrink the tax burden and regulation on businesses, and give the capitalistic system that made this nation the greatest empire in the history of the planet a chance to work again!!! And if we, as a people, are stupid enough to re-elect this man, then we deserve the economic collapse that will be forthcoming.

Well said rj...!!!

[George Hayduke]

I have never had a lot of faith for Obama as President, however at the end of the day he is the president of the United State and I willdo my best to respect his athuority (To an extent)

What he is doing now, I would term as sidestepping congress. If he does this as a scheme to put people back to work then I will support it. For Congress to conduct themselve's like little children as they have been over the past year makes me want to puke. We have too many people out of work our country including many of which are members of this site for Conress to be palying games. If Obama can put people back to work in this country using whatever means then I will support it.

After all if Congress won't put people back to work then let's put all of Congress out of work.

In the US of A, people are out of work because there are no jobs.

There are no jobs because there is no profitability.

There is no profitability because of taxation and over regulation.

In other previously impoverished countries there are jobs and profitability because of lower taxation and reasonable regulation PLUS incentives for US businesses to relocate from the US of A.

It is neither Prince Obama’s nor the Congress responsibility to put people back to work. Their responsibility is to the Constitution and it’s directives to provide US citizens an opportunity for prosperity. Prior administrations are equally responsible for restructuring the business climate to induce businesses to relocate to marginally unstable countries in order to counter balance growing discontent that could, or already has begun to manifest an insurgency with an ideology that is antithesis of Global Governance.

Is this a good geopolitical strategy that minimizes use of force and loss of life while advancing the standard of living for others? Yes it is. However at what cost; lower standard of living in the US? Passing EO’s and redirecting tax dollars to build bridges and fix pot holes is not going to put ‘America back on track’ but, emphasizing opportunity for Americans first by providing incentives (not bailouts or loans) for businesses to relocate back to the US will.

If Congress and this administration as well as subsequent administrations do not recognize the cross road coming into view in front of them, they will soon find out about the strength and indignation of a US insurgency standing on the principles and authority of the Constitution.

As Calvin Coolidge said,” The man who builds a factory builds a temple that the man who works there worships there, and to each is due, not scorn and blame, but reverence and praise."

It is time to start building factories in the Good ‘ol US of A by holding Congress and Prince Obama accountable!

GO RV!

[recman]

I am sick of people not telling the truth about or let me say to thick to understand what Congress is trying to do? Stop the spending!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! If you make 100,000.00 a year you cannot spend 125,000.00. That is why we are in the mess we are in. That is simple enough, Maybe

[mojack]

If HIS actions DIRECTLY supports the average citizens then I will support HIS actions. Create jobs and reduce some hardships - I vote YES!

I would be inclined to believe HIS executive actions are legal. If the powers weren't there the EO would not be set in motion.

[DinarMillionaire]

U.S. Presidents have issued executive orders since 1789. Although there is no Constitutional provision or statute that explicitly permits executive orders, there is a vague grant of "executive power" given in Article II, Section 1, Clause 1 of the Constitution, and furthered by the declaration "take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed" made in Article II, Section 3, Clause 4. At the minimum, most Executive Orders use these Constitutional reasonings as the authorization allowing for their issuance to be justified as part of the President's sworn duties,[2] the intent being to help direct officers of the US Executive carry out their delegated duties as well as the normal operations of the Federal Government - the consequence of failing to comply possibly being the removal from office.[3]

No where in this does it say a President has the right to circumvent Congress, make laws or spend money, because he doesn't like that Congress won't do what he wants. There are three branches of government and Obama is just one. He is not a king, nor a dictator, at least not yet.

[parmenio]

If HIS actions DIRECTLY supports the average citizens then I will support HIS actions. Create jobs and reduce some hardships - I vote YES!

I would be inclined to believe HIS executive actions are legal. If the powers weren't there the EO would not be set in motion.

Then what you are saying is you support a king!

[divemaster5734]

"... the truth is, we can't wait for a dysfunctional Congress to do its job." These words were spoke by Obama recently. He then signed a series of executive orders to "create" shovel ready jobs and spend more money to fix bridges and roads. We already know this was a MASSIVE failure the first time around.

Obama also signed an EO (executive order) to reforms of the federal student loan program. His EO will be stimulus money to be used to forgive some of these student loans or modify them.

Here's the kicker for us. Executive orders apply only to the executive branch (president) of government. The president has ONLY the authority to REFUSE expenditures (stimulus money). The President (executive branch) does NOT have the authority to spend money..., only the LEGISLATURE (Congress) can do this according to our Constitution! Is Obama acting as King or President?

The EO authority was started by Lincoln during the civil war.

Since the southern states no longer had reps in congress, Lincoln gave himself authority to make EO for appropriations only.

He needed money to fund the union army.

I posted something else about bo, and after one person complained it was locked.

I wonder how so many people act like if they just ignore the facts the facts will go away and they can then continue in their denial.

I put a Ron Paul sticker on my truck, and now get cut off almost daily by someone that will sometimes "throw a bird" as well.

What are all these people saying?

That they will go along with the vote as long as bo wins?

Are we being threatened for not drinking the koolaid?

Edited October 31, 2011 by divemaster5734

[Linda]

nothing he does is a surprise....

[mojack]

Then what you are saying is you support a king!

Frankly my friend I'm saying you're an instigator; an agitator of peace and progression. I'd like to see someone implement a plan to DIRECTLY influence jobs for people - dire need!

Sitting on thumbs won't help the country.

Executive orders have often been used for civil rights enforcement. Harry Truman issued an executive order in 1948 ending racial segregation in the armed forces. John Kennedy issued an executive order banning racial discrimination in newly constructed public housing and another banning pay discrimination against women by federal contractors. He issued orders prohibiting racial discrimination in federally funded libraries, hospitals, and other public facilities. Richard Nixon required government contractors to institute affirmative action hiring programs for women and members of minority groups.

Many, many more EOs have been used for significant changes in the structure of America. WERE THEY KINGS - GET A GRIP P!

That dog don't hunt with clear minded folks.

http://www.answers.com/topic/executive-order-1

You're playing instigator parmenio; not a roll to be proud of.

+1 for history and passion for the country at the least! Please don't hammer me

Edited October 31, 2011 by mojack

[Danan]

Frankly my friend I'm saying you're an instigator; an agitator of peace and progression. I'd like to see someone implement a plan to DIRECTLY influence jobs for people - dire need!

Sitting on thumbs won't help the country.

Executive orders have often been used for civil rights enforcement. Harry Truman issued an executive order in 1948 ending racial segregation in the armed forces. John Kennedy issued an executive order banning racial discrimination in newly constructed public housing and another banning pay discrimination against women by federal contractors. He issued orders prohibiting racial discrimination in federally funded libraries, hospitals, and other public facilities. Richard Nixon required government contractors to institute affirmative action hiring programs for women and members of minority groups.

Many, many more EOs have been used for significant changes in the structure of America. WERE THEY KINGS - GET A GRIP P!

That dog don't hunt with clear minded folks.

http://www.answers.com/topic/executive-order-1

You're playing instigator parmenio; not a roll to be proud of.

+1 for history and passion for the country at the least! Please don't hammer me

n

I;m sorry tht you see many of us as instigators, but NO President should be able to override the other two parts. That is why our constitution was designed and carried out as it was, so we would not have ONE voice deciding what is best for the country. He has not listened to the voters since he was elected, he says and does what he wants to do when he wants it done. This is a KING, not a PRESIDENT of a democracy. I don't care what he says his reasons are.

[roxyredhead]

I have sat and stared at this empty post for a while, trying to think of how to say what I feel needs to be said. I have no desire or intention of angering or insulting someone. But I do want to state my own view of this matter. The first congress under Obama was right there will all his schemes and plans to knock them out for him, and to do everything he asked. To that end, he wanted to get the health insurance, and he wanted more and more money to be spent every day. The money that went for his schemes to do the first stimulus, which didn't work (he even said so when he laughed because they had learned tthat there really weren't any shovel ready jobs), so he followed it by spending more trillions of our money on the auto bailout and taking over the auto industry, plus the Cash for Clunkers program that accomplished nothing and still spent a huge amount of money. By this time, I felt a little desperate because all that money was going, and we were getting nothing for it. More and more people were out of work, and there was less and less money to help the growing numbers of umemployed. But he followed that with another stimulus program, again accomplishing nothing. Well, i take that back, His wasteful spending and more demands for further tax dollars from business caused desperation in the business sector that lead to even more jobs being lost and so much money spent that it will cost our grandchildren years of their working life to pay it off, and that's only if Obama doesn't spend another dime.

Meantime, more and more businesses were having to close their doors and unemployment continued to rise. He has not let up,just keeps spending and spending. If we did that at our homes, we would be out on the streets by now. The American people were so upset that they voted in a much more conservative congress, but that didn't stop Obama's spending. And meantime he appointed at least 35, and I think more, czars who are in charge of huge amounts of taxpayer money and aren't accountable to congress or the American people. Obama has done so many end-runs around congress and he just told us that he plans to do more. That's what all this is about. And this is not how our forefathers set up our government., but how they set it up worked for 200-300 years, until Obama figured out how to scam the system. And he has almost brought this great country to her knees. It will take generations to undo all the damage he has done to our government and to our grandchildren, if in fact, it can even be undone.

Of course all of us want to help our poor, those good people who simply need a hand up, but we have to do it without breaking the backbone of our country. I am not against helping people who genuinely need it, because when my turn comes, they would step up and help me. That's just who we Americans are. But Obama isn't doing that. He promises a lot, but he actually does very little. Where are all the jobs he promised? And if they are out there, why aren't some of your neighbors working again? I would love to see a much more conservative president who would refrain from spending money needlessly so there would be more to actually put to good use for those who genuinely need it. I would like to see a president who actually helps those who need it, and not just promises us pretty speeches and then gives his help to unions and to his buddies in the "greasy palm" system of paybacks.

If you are offended, I am sorry about that, but I have given this much thought, and these are my considered views based upon the facts, not just my wishes, but the honest to goodness facts. We are never going to have what you want from this president. I think he would do it, but he can't seem to figure out how to do it (which no one could) while continuing to waste all our tax money and continuing this high spending without getting anything for it.

I must tell you publicly how much I enjoy reading your comments! You are quite an impressive Lady!

Thank You!!!!!!!!

[parmenio]

Frankly my friend I'm saying you're an instigator; an agitator of peace and progression. I'd like to see someone implement a plan to DIRECTLY influence jobs for people - dire need!

Sitting on thumbs won't help the country.

Executive orders have often been used for civil rights enforcement. Harry Truman issued an executive order in 1948 ending racial segregation in the armed forces. John Kennedy issued an executive order banning racial discrimination in newly constructed public housing and another banning pay discrimination against women by federal contractors. He issued orders prohibiting racial discrimination in federally funded libraries, hospitals, and other public facilities. Richard Nixon required government contractors to institute affirmative action hiring programs for women and members of minority groups.

Many, many more EOs have been used for significant changes in the structure of America. WERE THEY KINGS - GET A GRIP P!

That dog don't hunt with clear minded folks.

http://www.answers.com/topic/executive-order-1

You're playing instigator parmenio; not a roll to be proud of.

If it's the truth you don't like to hear then it's your problem, not mine! Meanwhile, last I checked I am still protected under the First Ammendment ..., until a king tries to take it away!

+1 for history and passion for the country at the least! Please don't hammer me

Mojack..., seems if you don't like to hear the truth, that's your problem not mine!! Calling me an instigator shows the rest of us how emotional you can get without presenting your case to the rest of us. Truely ELEMETARY! This is "Off Topic" and we can bring up any subject as long as we stay within the rules.

By the way last time I checked we still have our First Ammendment right to freedom of speech..., unless your king wants to take that away too!

[mojack]

Mojack..., seems if you don't like to hear the truth, that's your problem not mine!! Calling me an instigator shows the rest of us how emotional you can get without presenting your case to the rest of us. Truely ELEMETARY! This is "Off Topic" and we can bring up any subject as long as we stay within the rules.

By the way last time I checked we still have our First Ammendment right to freedom of speech..., unless your king wants to take that away too!

Man you're just not reading properly... Using the term King is ridiculous. I'm certainly not emotional but practical... It really is elementary, read your history of how EO's have been used. Were they considered KINGS? Of course not! Read your history of American presidents and question them all. LOL - The CASE was made with my comments and link to some historical facts; read American history on how EOs have been used then submit a practical statement.

Simple - Reading is fundamental. http://www.answers.com/topic/executive-order-1

Your comments are just to instigate a few people in your base. Not angry bud - if you post something you have to be prepared for challenges without thinking someone is angry at you; this is not your forum alone - My God! ciao

n

I;m sorry tht you see many of us as instigators, but NO President should be able to override the other two parts. That is why our constitution was designed and carried out as it was, so we would not have ONE voice deciding what is best for the country. He has not listened to the voters since he was elected, he says and does what he wants to do when he wants it done. This is a KING, not a PRESIDENT of a democracy. I don't care what he says his reasons are.

Danan although I can use the term instigator to several folks I haven't! Executive Orders are constitutional but it doesn't mean they will pass the federal courts!

I repeat, Executive Orders are in the designed constitution... Read up on it please... The first executive order, issued by George Washington on June 8, 1789.

Read more: http://www.answers.com/topic/executive-order-1#ixzz1cPi9sago

[littlefeet]

Thx for thraed topic parmenio

"... the truth is, we can't wait for a dysfunctional Congress to do its job." These words were spoke by Obama recently. He then signed a series of executive orders to "create" shovel ready jobs and spend more money to fix bridges and roads. We already know this was a MASSIVE failure the first time around.

This isn't gonna fix nothing! The bite in the rear was hen POTUS laughed about it after it failed. You think he would have learned his lesson the first time when the only thing that happened was more debt. But this is what the liberals want; more dependency on the gov't.

Obama also signed an EO (executive order) to reforms of the federal student loan program. His EO will be stimulus money to be used to forgive some of these student loans or modify them.

All the OWS students types are cheering this, because all they hear is 'free loan'. When actually the Gov't will forgive your student loan after twenty years instead of the twenty-five years it was before, just pay a little throughout these years and it will go away in twenty short years. Pretty sweet deal !!

Here's the kicker for us. Executive orders apply only to the executive branch (president) of government. The president has ONLY the authority to REFUSE expenditures (stimulus money). The President (executive branch) does NOT have the authority to spend money..., only the LEGISLATURE (Congress) can do this according to our Constitution! Is Obama acting as King or President?

He is just bloviating to get the vote in 2012 !!!!! The masses are too delirious to know the difference.

King......

Edited November 1, 2011 by littlefeet