50 Dinar Notes?

[The Eagle]

I've been puzzled at the presence of the 25,000 Dinar notes and 50 Dinar notes in circulation at the same time. I asked myself "what is the real value of a 50 Dinar note to the average Iraqi?" The answer is nothing! If a 25K note is worth only $21.25, what can you buy for 4 cents? Absolutely nothing. Recently we all read that each qualifying Iraqi citizen (about 6 million of them) will receive 15,000 IQD on their Smart Cards soon (last week actually - if you believe the false posts). In fact, this must and will happen soon. But what is 15,000 (actually 5,000 per month) worth to the Iraqi citizen? A whopping $12.75 - that's $4.25 per month. Without a RV the "food stamp" Smart Card program does not make sense. If the machines are being loaded with "low denominations" it makes sense that this will be or become the common denominations Iraq plans for its internal commerce.

Stepping back from all the BS we are all reading I could only see one viable outcome. There MUST be an RV and soon. What about RATE? The number that makes sense to me is based on the VALUE of the government gift of 5,000 Dinars each month to their citizenry. Making a wild guess at the maximum value of their 5,000 Dinars compared to someone in the US on food stamps and financial subsistence, I think the number is about $1,500 per month. That works out to an RV of 30 cents to the Dinar, a 350 X increase in the current value - pretty darn good from any investors view point.

The good part of this outcome is there will certainly be rapid growth in the value of the Dinar through a constant revaluation against the dollar. As the triple denominations are are collected and retired, leaving only the lower denomination currency in play (just like what happened in the US) the value is likely to increase to the level of the Kuwaiti Dinar - likely higher. Remember, Iraq is sitting on 1/4 of the worlds future oil.

My last conclusion is WHEN this will happen. Frankly, it's likely to happen when we least expect it. All indications point to SOON. But, this is Iraq and no one can predict M and company.

GO RV

[fox]

Well thought out idea. Thank you for the encouraging thought.

[Nothing-Ventured]

Well thought out idea. Thank you for the encouraging thought.

DITTO...!

[Darren Johnson]

Joining the site today. Very encouraged from what I am reading. Helps me to be patient and keeps things in perspective.

Go Dinars

[leola]

THAT`S AS GOOD AS IT GETS OUT OF THE GATE,,,,I CONCUR,,,,WELL DONE

[Mrose001]

Logic evades me so help. If the smallest demoination is a 50 Dinar Coin (not in circulation), and the RV is $3.26 that would make that coin worth over $75.00. How do you shop with $75.00 and no way to get change? Certainly Iraq will not be so wealthy they can afford to pay $75.00 for a loaf of bread. Without smaller currency ready it does not seam logical does it? At an RV of $.10 that coin would be worth $.50 which is a little more logical at least until smaller currency and coin is in place. Anyone have any real concrete information on smaller denomination in print?

[YukonJohn]

Well thought out Eagle, thanks for sharing. One could extrapolate on your thinking further...mainly where these people want to be in their quest for a democratic society. What is the governing body going to do to alleviate thier suffering and how soon? Couldn't agree more that it has to RV soon and be HEALTHY.

[noob57]

Logic evades me so help. If the smallest demoination is a 50 Dinar Coin (not in circulation), and the RV is $3.26 that would make that coin worth over $75.00. How do you shop with $75.00 and no way to get change? Certainly Iraq will not be so wealthy they can afford to pay $75.00 for a loaf of bread. Without smaller currency ready it does not seam logical does it? At an RV of $.10 that coin would be worth $.50 which is a little more logical at least until smaller currency and coin is in place. Anyone have any real concrete information on smaller denomination in print?

It is not a coin.... it is paper money. You may be thinking of the 25Dinar Coin and 100Dinar Coin.

CBI Site MONEY

Edited March 29, 2011 by noob57

[FAB]

Hey, just joined the site a few minutes ago.

I've been an onlooker for awhile and was booted off of PD for making a joke to one of the mods. (not much sense of humor in that arena).

I have been invested for quite awhile, and try to take a realistic view at this long term investment.

I hope it happens soon, but I'm not going to hold my breath.

As far as Eagle's post, It is well thought out and makes sense to me...and I could only add that as far as the cards go, if they we're to RV at a higher rate, they can always change the # of dinar on the card.

Because I doubt if they RV @3 bucks, they'll keep the cards @ 5,0000 dinars...more like 500 dinar or so...

anyhow, I hope there's room for 1 more dinar junkie...

[Mrose001]

I stand corrected thank you. Still at 25 Dinar (Coin) that would be over $75.00 at a RV of 3.26 would it not? A 1 Dinar coin with a RV of over $3.00 would still be costly to daily business. Even if they use their debt cards it seems that smaller denominations have to be in place for it to happen. So again the question anyone have any concret factual news on smaller denominations in print or planned?

[BB-Wolfe]

Logic evades me so help. If the smallest demoination is a 50 Dinar Coin (not in circulation), and the RV is $3.26 that would make that coin worth over $75.00. How do you shop with $75.00 and no way to get change? Certainly Iraq will not be so wealthy they can afford to pay $75.00 for a loaf of bread. Without smaller currency ready it does not seam logical does it? At an RV of $.10 that coin would be worth $.50 which is a little more logical at least until smaller currency and coin is in place. Anyone have any real concrete information on smaller denomination in print?

Actually the 'smallest domination is a' twenty-five dinar coin...

you're right it's not in circulation

( I've collected one each of all the dominations including the coins )

it's very tiny...

penny sized and thus impractical if you later need even smaller denominations.

It's only good use is for collectors (who knows someday it might be worth something??)

[Roadrunner]

Eagle, good post. It looks like you've put a lot of thought into this. I believe the rate will have to be considerably higher than .30, but nonetheless I enjoyed reading your view.

[BB-Wolfe]

Logic evades me so help. If the smallest demoination is a 50 Dinar Coin (not in circulation), and the RV is $3.26 that would make that coin worth over $75.00. How do you shop with $75.00 and no way to get change? Certainly Iraq will not be so wealthy they can afford to pay $75.00 for a loaf of bread. Without smaller currency ready it does not seam logical does it? At an RV of $.10 that coin would be worth $.50 which is a little more logical at least until smaller currency and coin is in place. Anyone have any real concrete information on smaller denomination in print?

Actually the 'smallest domination is a' twenty-five dinar coin...

you're right it's not in circulation

( I've collected one each of all the dominations including the coins )

it's very tiny...

penny sized and thus impractical if you later need even smaller denominations.

It's only good use is for collectors (who knows someday it might be worth something??)

[elmstreet61]

great, thank you.... I'll just let my Avatar convey my feeling....so look left. Sheesh...it's a bright glarey one isn't it. put your sunglasses on. haha.

Good job, tah!

[blue horseshoe]

Dear Eagle -

Well thought and good post. Welcome to the site. I like the logic you use. It makes sense. We can argue the numbers, but it still makes sense. For the post, I give you a +1. In my personal opinion, for what that is worth, I do think the RV will come in higher because I do not think the will make Kuwait mistake. I think the Dinar can not afford to jump all over the place before settling down. I am not arguing with your logic, but I think the RV needs to be higher for several reasons. How much higher I will not dare to reason.

[cocklebur]

Excellent post, and I hope you are on the money. My only observation is, we have pennies, nickles dimes, quarters, and fifty cent pieces. We all have to have change correct? So a 25dinar coin times .00084 = .O21 cents. Thats my (sorry for the cliche), two cents worth on the matter.

[coldwarvet]

Great post, Eagle. Thanks!

[MovieMaker]

thanks for sharing, and welcome to the site FAB.

[justin88]

I've been puzzled at the presence of the 25,000 Dinar notes and 50 Dinar notes in circulation at the same time. I asked myself "what is the real value of a 50 Dinar note to the average Iraqi?" The answer is nothing! If a 25K note is worth only $21.25, what can you buy for 4 cents? Absolutely nothing. Recently we all read that each qualifying Iraqi citizen (about 6 million of them) will receive 15,000 IQD on their Smart Cards soon (last week actually - if you believe the false posts). In fact, this must and will happen soon. But what is 15,000 (actually 5,000 per month) worth to the Iraqi citizen? A whopping $12.75 - that's $4.25 per month. Without a RV the "food stamp" Smart Card program does not make sense. If the machines are being loaded with "low denominations" it makes sense that this will be or become the common denominations Iraq plans for its internal commerce.

Stepping back from all the BS we are all reading I could only see one viable outcome. There MUST be an RV and soon. What about RATE? The number that makes sense to me is based on the VALUE of the government gift of 5,000 Dinars each month to their citizenry. Making a wild guess at the maximum value of their 5,000 Dinars compared to someone in the US on food stamps and financial subsistence, I think the number is about $1,500 per month. That works out to an RV of 30 cents to the Dinar, a 350 X increase in the current value - pretty darn good from any investors view point.

The good part of this outcome is there will certainly be rapid growth in the value of the Dinar through a constant revaluation against the dollar. As the triple denominations are are collected and retired, leaving only the lower denomination currency in play (just like what happened in the US) the value is likely to increase to the level of the Kuwaiti Dinar - likely higher. Remember, Iraq is sitting on 1/4 of the worlds future oil.

My last conclusion is WHEN this will happen. Frankly, it's likely to happen when we least expect it. All indications point to SOON. But, this is Iraq and no one can predict M and company.

GO RV

Ok well though out but you are leaving out a few things that we do know for FACT the the US army delievered more different notes then what is currently out in the public so lets head south for a moment and do a little history lesson and comparison!!!!

To date five series of the Kuwaiti dinar banknote have been printed. The first series was issued following the pronouncement of the Kuwaiti Currency Law in 1960 which established the Kuwaiti Currency Board. This series was in circulation from 1 April 1961 to 1 February 1982 and consisted of denominations of ¼, ½, 1, 5 and 10 dinars.

After the creation of the Central Bank of Kuwait as a replacement to the Kuwaiti Currency Board, new ¼, ½ and 10 dinar notes were issued from 17 November 1970, followed by the new 1 and 5 dinar notes of the second series on 20 April 1971. This second series was likewise withdrawn on 1 February 1982.

The third series was issued on 20 February 1980, after the accession to the throne of Emir Jaber al-Ahmad al-Jaber al-Sabah, at that time in denominations of ¼, ½, 1, 5 and 10 dinar. A 20 dinar banknote was introduced on 9 February 1986. As a result of the state of emergency after Iraq's invasion of Kuwait, this series was ruled invalid with effect from 30 September 1991. Significant quantities of these notes were stolen by Iraqi forces and some have appeared on the international numismatic market. The "Standard Catalog of World Paper Money" (A. Pick, Krause Publications) lists notes with the following serial number prefix denominators as being among those stolen:

After the liberation, a fourth series was issued on 24 March 1991 with the aims of replacing the previous withdrawn series as quickly as possible and guaranteeing the country's swift economic recovery. This fourth series was legal tender until 16 February 1995. Denominations were ¼, ½, 1, 5, 10 and 20 dinar.

The fifth series of Kuwaiti banknotes has been in use since 3 April 1994 and include high-tech security measures which have now become standard for banknotes. Denominations were as in the fourth series.

From March 18, 1975 to January 4, 2003 the dinar was pegged to a weighted currency basket. From January 5, 2003 until May 20, 2007, the pegging was switched to 1 U.S. dollar = 0.29963 dinar with margins of ±3.5%.. The central rate translates to approximately 1 dinar = 3.33745 dollars.

From June 16, 2007, the Kuwaiti dinar was re-pegged to a basket of currencies, and is now worth about US$3.45

I know i have seen that term re-pegged to a basket of currencies somewhere before o yea our present time worthless Iraqi dinar

Now that some Key points are presented here is my opinion They dinar has Smaller denominations that we are still waiting to see just like Kuwait did at that point in time when the Dinar is globally traded and adjusted to its true value im not making predictions on what it will be sorry Then at that time will you start seeing 1/4 1/2 up to 20 dinar notes and coins become present and used .

Also let me point out to everyone NOT at any time did Kuwait ever cancel or LOP their currency even when they openly knew Significant quantities of these notes were stolen by Iraqi forces and some have appeared on the international numismatic market.

[yusofsabri]

Very nice post. Fundamental thought. Thanks.

[jmilkey]

This is actually a fairly funny post, its the:

"Welfare Theory"

So let me get this straight, most people on this thread think that this is a well thought out thread because you are comparing welfare rates between Iraq and the US?

wow.

I will grant you that certainly you can throw about some of these numbers for reference but when it comes down to what the country of Iraq is going to do with the revalue, they can very easily change the amount that they give out in welfare and one little ditty you forgot to include in your analysis is the HCL, which is additional money paid to the citizens by the government as a % of oil sales just for being an Iraqi citizen (more welfare).

So based on just a few simple things, I think your calculations are likely not even close.

Next.

[FAB]

thanks for sharing, and welcome to the site FAB.

...thanks, movie maker...

[Merlin]

Well, as rumor is as rumor does, the small Dinar Bills where printed up long ago and are now located in banks and will be put in ATMs as soon as someone over there pulls the trigger! So, when the RV happens there will be plenty of 1's, 5's, 10's, and 20's. etc. to hand out and be used as normal money and at the same time all the pricing in stores and everything in the country is adjusted to the new price index or purchasing power at what I believe will be around 3.50 US to 1 Dinar or just a little bit higher then Kuwait is now. I don't believe it will be any less then Kuwait for many obvious reasons.

The other reason that I and we all should hope that the RV comes in at 3.50 or higher is that when the RV happens we will most likely only have 30 Days Tops to Exchange our 25k Bank notes so they can be taken out of circulation because Iraq does not want any Double Dipping i.e.: Dinar RV's for 0.10 cents, people with 25K notes cash in and turn right around and Buy as much Dinar as possible in the new smaller denomination! And wait for the Dinar to go up to 3.00 to 5.00 US Dollars to 1 Dinar! And then Make the BIG Cash in again. There are a lot of rich people like in the stock markets that are just waiting for the Dinar to start moving and then they will try to buy it all up and wait for it to go higher!

The only bad thing for us would be that it RV's at 0.10 cents and they give use a very limited time to cash in and by that block us or hold us at the 0.10 cents until it is too late to cash in and buy more! I mean it's still a very Big win for us as if you bought your Dinar for 1,000.00 per million, you would get 100,000.00 thousand back per Million and that's still OK in my book! But not near what we where hoping for back in 05 when my self and my group got into this investment!

So, I / We should all keep ours hopes up and wait for the BIG RV promised of 3.50 to 4.25 US dollars to 1 Iraq Dinar!

I have been counting on this since 05 so I can wait a little longer to get it! That's what you call a world changing event is that over night every million Dinar we have suddenly becomes worth about 4,000,000.00 US Dollars!!!! I will still be Very happy with the 0.10 cents but as long as we are just dreaming in here anyway lets dream BIG !!!!

And they have the resources to do this if you look at the reserves they have to back it up! The Big Oil (We all know about that!) But don’t forget about all the natural gas reserves they have, one of the worlds largest! And one more thing…

At last count in 07 they had over 860 Tones of Gold! And was climbing more as they keep finding hidden stores of gold all over Iraq! So Yes! They can afford to change the world and I’m banking on them doing it!

Take Care, Have Fun, And I'll see you on the Beach!!! GO GO GO RV!!!!!!

[spy]

The only variable is weather or not we can trust the rumors about the smart cards, their value and any numbers that have ever been floated out...

[Ateam]

Why does there need to be an RV SOON!!!??? Just because those folks are living on nothing?? They have had nothing for a long time, just because the smart cards were to be loaded with limited funds means nothing.

Why does there need to be an RV SOON!!!??? Just because those folks are living on nothing?? They have had nothing for a long time, just because the smart cards were to be loaded with limited funds means nothing.