Parliamentary Finance: Central Bank starts during the current year measures the deletion of zeros from currency

[blueskyline]

How so?  You dont think the CBI knows how much currency it has issued?

 

Have you not seen the financial statements posted on the CBIs website from these auditing agencies?

See the above response....

Have you seen the incinerator articles ? Did you see the pictures of the incinerators ? Do you know beyond  shadow of a doubt they have not been destroying currency . Even Though they purchased these incinerators for the purpose of burning currency in the basement of their banks. No one knows for certain. 

[RVPleaseToday]

"Thoughts about articles are all we have . No one knows for absolutely sure .The CBI has released information along with others on what they say is in circulation . And they have also released information ( and released pictures) on the purchase of incinerators to burn currency. No one knows for sure"

 

If the CBI's published numbers are completely unreliable, then there is no more reason to believe an RV is coming than an RD. If you believe it is truly a toss-up, then why are lopsters so bashed?

 

A lop isn't interesting anymore. Whether they lop and gradually increase the value of the currency over time, or whether they do nothing with the currency and gradually increase the value of the currency over time, the result is the same for us who hold the currency. So it's really between a slowly increasing value and an overnight RV.

Edited April 14, 2013 by RVPleaseToday

[keepmwlknfny]

Have you seen the incinerator articles ? Did you see the pictures of the incinerators ? Do you know beyond  shadow of a doubt they have not been destroying currency . Even Though they purchased these incinerators for the purpose of burning currency in the basement of their banks. No one knows for certain. 

The CBI states that they do destroy currency that is worn and replaced. And that those bills are subtracted from the financial statements they provide to the world. So of course they destroy currency. Every country does, but its no where near the amount that they are creating each year. 

 

They also could have been talking about the incinerators because of all the talk of redenominating. They have to have a way of destroying the old notes. But there is no indication that they are just taking bills off the street to be destroyed and taken out of circulation without putting anything back in.

[TQueezy]

"Thoughts about articles are all we have . No one knows for absolutely sure .The CBI has released information along with others on what they say is in circulation . And they have also released information ( and released pictures) on the purchase of incinerators to burn currency. No one knows for sure[/size]"

 

If the CBI's published numbers are completely unreliable, then there is no more reason to believe an RV is coming than an RD. If you believe it is truly a toss-up, then why are lopsters so bashed?

 

A lop isn't interesting anymore. Whether they lop and gradually increase the value of the currency over time, or whether they do nothing with the currency and gradually increase the value of the currency over time, the result is the same for us who hold the currency. So it's really between a slowly increasing value and an overnight RV.

Not true, there's a big difference, mainly that RD/LOP divides the total worth of any amount of IQD holding by 1000. A gradual Increase by taking in higher denoms over time and release lower denoms of the same currency would not divide our "wealth" in IQD holdings, just increase their value.

[blueskyline]

Lobsters are for certain with their thoughts on this investment. I disagree with their certainty

[RVPleaseToday]

"Not true, there's a big difference, mainly that RD/LOP divides the total worth of any amount of IQD holding by 1000."

 

An RD is a neutral event.

So, blueskyline, you believe there is an equal possibility that it will lop or RV?

[gainesm]

There are two components to a significant RV for Iraq. One is that Iraq declare an RV. The second is that the rest of the world recognize it. The CBI can add value to their currency out of thin air. They cannot make dollars out of thin air to exchange those dinar for. Iraq controls only half of the equation. The question, then, isn't really if Iraq can declare the Dinar worth the same amount as the dollar, for example; the question is if the U.S. (or anyone)  would give them a dollar for each dinar.

 

We have to ask, then, how it would benefit the U.S. to do that. Anyone have a theory about that?

 

I have one - it's basic economic theory of supply and demand.  As Iraq's economy stabilizes and grows it will get to the point that their exports eclipse their imports, leading to a trade imbalance if it is not allowed to market-correct through the natural rise in the value of their currency.

 

The US will want Iraq's currency to appreciate when that happens.  No one wants to see Iraq taking any economic lessons from China.

[RVPleaseToday]

gainesm, I don't disagree with you. In fact, I think that is exactly what will happen with Iraq. But it has nothing to do with the question I asked about a 1000x overnight RV.

[TQueezy]

"Not true, there's a big difference, mainly that RD/LOP divides the total worth of any amount of IQD holding by 1000."[/size]

An RD is a neutral event.[/size]

So, blueskyline, you believe there is an equal possibility that it will lop or RV?

Sure neutral from a standpoint of not making money as opposed to making money... But since I bought dinar to exchange at a higher value at a later point in time, neutral is not something beneficial and should be looked at as wholly different than a gradual appreciation. There's a no-LOP gradual increase that is acceptable, then the post-LOP appreciation that is much less preferable as it means reducing initial potential gain divided by 1000. Edited April 14, 2013 by TQueezy

[keepmwlknfny]

I dont think anyone wants it to lop....thats silly and ignorant to think that.

 

So labeling one as such is also silly and ignorant. There are people who understand what the CBI is telling the world, and then you have people who twist what the CBI is saying into meaning everything we want to hear. Unfortunately those who understand what the CBI is saying are deemed as negative and called lopsters  Why is being realistic such a horrible thing?  Being realistic doesnt mean they dont want a RV. Everyone wants this to turn out in our favor. Some just realize that this is a bigger longshot then what we were all made to believe in the beginning.....

[RVPleaseToday]

"There's a no-LOP gradual increase that is acceptable, the the post-LOP appreciation that is much less preferable as it means reducing initial potential gain divided by 1000."

 

A gradual increase after loping is the same as a gradual increase if they do nothing with their currency. We start with currency that has the same value and it increases over time. I don't understand what you are saying.

[gainesm]

gainesm, I don't disagree with you. In fact, I think that is exactly what will happen with Iraq. But it has nothing to do with the question I asked about a 1000x overnight RV.

There's a reason for that - the question I was answering was the one I quoted, which asked nothing about a 1000x overnight RV.

 

As for a 1,000x overnight RV...more and more I find less reason to think a RV is the out-of-the-gate option for them once they stabilize.  While I still do believe it could happen in the right circumstances, I think they have been taking very intentional measured steps toward something more gradual - which is certainly the safer choice.  

[blueskyline]

The CBI states that they do destroy currency that is worn and replaced. And that those bills are subtracted from the financial statements they provide to the world. So of course they destroy currency. Every country does, but its no where near the amount that they are creating each year. 

 

They also could have been talking about the incinerators because of all the talk of redenominating. They have to have a way of destroying the old notes. But there is no indication that they are just taking bills off the street to be destroyed and taken out of circulation without putting anything back in.

The CBI states they do destroy currency that is worn and replaced ( yet people are left to use currency that is torn , tattered and glued together ?) Could be talking about incinerators because of redonomination ( thats not for certain ) Theres no indication either way of what CBI may be destroying . And. Putting back into circulation ?( torn ,tattered and glued together currency ?)

[RVPleaseToday]

Yeah, I think the gradual increase is less fraught with potential trouble for them than an overnight increase. Certainly agree with that.

[TQueezy]

I dont think anyone wants it to lop....thats silly and ignorant to think that.

 

So labeling one as such is also silly and ignorant. There are people who understand what the CBI is telling the world, and then you have people who twist what the CBI is saying into meaning everything we want to hear. Unfortunately those who understand what the CBI is saying are deemed as negative and called lopsters  Why is being realistic such a horrible thing?  Being realistic doesnt mean they dont want a RV. Everyone wants this to turn out in our favor. Some just realize that this is a bigger longshot then what we were all made to believe in the beginning.....

Let me ask you an honest question...

Do you really think that you know 100% what the CBI and all these other Iraqis are saying is what they're saying and that it's not you twisting it to be what you think they're trying to mean?

You accuse everyone else of twisting it to be what they think the CBI is saying and that you're the one reading them correctly, but what if we're all just interpreting, including you? Why do YOU state you're just repeating what the CBI is saying? I think you're reading it his you want to, just like you accuse those of us that find positive and hopeful info from articles, or by the apparent shading of data and info that you fail to think is something they are capable of doing.

[RVPleaseToday]

TQeezy, the numbers posted on the CBI website are unambiguous. They are numbers. The only question really is are they lying or not. It's not a matter of interpretation.

If the numbers are completely bogus, then we have no basis to favor an RV over an RD, or vice-versa.

[blueskyline]

"Not true, there's a big difference, mainly that RD/LOP divides the total worth of any amount of IQD holding by 1000."

 

An RD is a neutral event.

So, blueskyline, you believe there is an equal possibility that it will lop or RV?

Yes . But like most everyone here . I would love to see an RV

Yes . But like most everyone here . I would love to see an RV

float , gradual increase, rv ....

[TQueezy]

"There's a no-LOP gradual increase that is acceptable, the the post-LOP appreciation that is much less preferable as it means reducing initial potential gain divided by 1000."[/size]

 

A gradual increase after loping is the same as a gradual increase if they do nothing with their currency. We start with currency that has the same value and it increases over time. I don't understand what you are saying.

100,000 IQD at 1000:1 increasing gradually to 1:1 gives me 100,000iqd/usd

100,000 IQD lopped is worth 100iqd at 1:1, gradually increasing to 3:1 would give me $300. That may be value neutral from when I bought the IQD, but I lost 1000times what I could have gained without a lop. That simple. They are completely different.

[gainesm]

Let me ask you an honest question...

Do you really think that you know 100% what the CBI and all these other Iraqis are saying is what they're saying and that it's not you twisting it to be what you think they're trying to mean?

You accuse everyone else of twisting it to be what they think the CBI is saying and that you're the one reading them correctly, but what if we're all just interpreting, including you? Why do YOU state you're just repeating what the CBI is saying? I think you're reading it his you want to, just like you accuse those of us that find positive and hopeful info from articles, or by the apparent shading of data and info that you fail to think is something they are capable of doing.

I think you raise a very valid point - every single one of us is interpreting.  Some people jump right to "this is a positive indicator for RV" while others see something entirely different.

 

The reality is that whatever it looks like to us is irrelevant until and unless the CBI makes a move.  I try very hard to remain cautious in my conclusions - the more I want something to be true for a RV, the more likely I am to try to find something that will present it in a different light.  That is not because I do not want it to be true, it is because I want to make sure I am not overreaching in my conclusions.  

[RVPleaseToday]

I see. So you start off with 100,000 IQD worth 86 dollars and 100 IQD worth 86 dollars and both increase in value 1000x. How did you gain anything.

[TQueezy]

Because no LOP IQD will be exchanges at face value, not at supposed new IQD value. 100,000 exchanging at 1:1 isn't going to be worth 100dollars. How do you not see that?

I see. So you start off with 100,000 IQD worth 86 dollars and 100 IQD worth 86 dollars and both increase in value 1000x. How did you gain anything.

Also, after a lop, they chop the exchange rate too, from 1000:1 to 1:1 (in this scenario), so there would be no 1000x increase after a lop. Maybe a 3x increase. Otherwise your lopped 100,000 will be worth 100dollars still and to have it be worth 100,000usd, you'd have to make the 1:1 exchange rate go to 1000usd:1iqd, which would never happen.

Edited April 14, 2013 by TQueezy

[RVPleaseToday]

But you are describing an RV, not a lop. 

Edited April 14, 2013 by RVPleaseToday

[TQueezy]

But you are describing an RV, not a lop. 

No. The exchange rate stays the same after a lop. That's why it is a neutral event.

On this, air, you are entirely absolutely 100% incorrect. A lop/rd requires changing the currency notes AND the exchange rate. Otherwise you change the notes and not the exchange rate, people are Carrying low denomination bills worth fractions of a dollar? Makes no sense.

[RVPleaseToday]

Your 100,000 dinar without a lop would be worth 1166 (or $86). The 100 dinar, after a lop, would be worth 86 dollars.

[TQueezy]

Your 100,000 dinar without a lop would be worth 1166 (or $86). The 100 dinar, after a lop, would be worth 86 dollars.

Yeah, because the new exchange rate would be 1:1. C'mon man.