Deleting the Zeros

[Markinsa]

Flatbush, I read the article, I know what they are saying, in the paragraph previous to the one you quoted, Hashemi was quoted as saying "removing the zeros", in the following paragraph when they talk about these countries they are talking about "deleting the zeros".  Why does the translator pick the two different words?  Hashemi talks about these countries not increasing in value, but he talks about wanting Iraq's currency increasing in value.  We are just going to have to agree to disagree, you read it your way, and I'll read it mine.  If it goes my way, we'll all be happy, if it goes your way, we can blame you for the crappy outcome.

 

Boomer,  Those other countries didn't forgive the country in question a freighter load of debt.  Why do you think Kuwait, the Paris Club, and other countries are forgiving debt Iraq owes?  They aren't stupid, they know what the plans are, and they stand more to forgive Iraq the debt now, and then let the currency appreciate and they'll win out big time.

 

I wont' post anymore in this thread, except for Mod Purposes.

 

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[boomer113189]

if iraq RDs . there currency will be worth more later on an gain value

[boomer113189]

Flatbush, I read the article, I know what they are saying, in the paragraph previous to the one you quoted, Hashemi was quoted as saying "removing the zeros", in the following paragraph when they talk about these countries they are talking about "deleting the zeros".  Why does the translator pick the two different words?  Hashemi talks about these countries not increasing in value, but he talks about wanting Iraq's currency increasing in value.  We are just going to have to agree to disagree, you read it your way, and I'll read it mine.  If it goes my way, we'll all be happy, if it goes your way, we can blame you for the crappy outcome.

 

Boomer,  Those other countries didn't forgive the country in question a freighter load of debt.  Why do you think Kuwait, the Paris Club, and other countries are forgiving debt Iraq owes?  They aren't stupid, they know what the plans are, and they stand more to forgive Iraq the debt now, and then let the currency appreciate and they'll win out big time.

 

I wont' post anymore in this thread, except for Mod Purposes.

 

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http://goo.gl/gl7zV here proof that the paris club forgave another place of its debts NOT JUST IRAQ.   iraq was forgivin i think 40 billion. and Nigeria 18 billion so that statement you made was false

[Francie26]

Show me the facts, and please don't refer me to any of the news articles that are coming out.  I want to see the CBI's plans that documents what they will do when they issue the new notes.  If you don't have that, you don't have facts, you have speculation.  So go back in your corner and shut up.

 

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Well, Markinsa, this is extraordinarily rude of you to tell someone else to "go back to your corner and shut up." I can't believe you said it.  You may not like what he said, but unless it's outside the rules here, he has the right to say it. And I don't believe he has to stay in a corner at your command, either.  Your comments are outrageous.

[Markinsa]

lol @ own opinions . This is Fact just got to look it up for youselfs

 

 

Well, Markinsa, this is extraordinarily rude of you to tell someone else to "go back to your corner and shut up." I can't believe you said it.  You may not like what he said, but unless it's outside the rules here, he has the right to say it. And I don't believe he has to stay in a corner at your command, either.  Your comments are outrageous.

 

Francie, you didn't read the whole post.  Please don't pick out a single phrase and forget the rest.  He was laughing, telling me that the opinions they were proposing were supported by fact.  I simply told him to shut up until he had facts.  Which he "finally" was able to produce about a statement I made concerning the Paris Club forgiving debts to other Nations, not on what I told him to shut up about.

 

And I might add he didn't follow my instructions, so it didn't really matter what I told him.  So Francie26, you're being upset over what I said, is mute. You've had problems with other things I have posted in the past, so perhaps it might suit you to put me on ignore if you don't like what I post.

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[Darin]

No, you're not getting it.  It is written in "The Law", if they want to do otherwise, they will have to change the law.  I can guarantee you, if they tried to do that here in the United States, there would be a lawsuit, so what makes Iraq any different from the U.S.?

 

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I believe that any new currency would require a different ISO and name call out (I.e., NID). What essentially would happen is 3 currencies would exist within Iraq. The highly demand dollar, the new & improved dinar w/o zeros, and the old IQD. Talk about confusion, right? But, my point would be that a 25,000 IQD would be equal to a 25 NID. It would be an entirely separate currency. Therefor, the unit for unit law would not apply because it isn't of the same (ISO/IQD).

I know what we want, Iraq has to have NEW lower denomination (ld) notes and coins in order for the currency to appreciate in value, otherwise no one will be able to buy chewing gum and sodas with the large notes.  Iraq could have RD'd and LOPPED a long time ago if they just wanted to introduce new ld notes.  Mexico is constantly revaluing their currency.  But Iraq is different, they want the value of their currency to increase, and lopping and rd'ing won't do that.  There are Financial Institutions and Countries all over the World that are holding onto Iraq Currency and if Iraq LOPS, those countries are going to be upset along with the IMF and World Bank.

 

An ideal time to have done their so-called desired R/D would have been to do it once they introduced the new currency that they have now.

Its not like all those saddam dinars had 000s.

 

But, weirdly enough - 35 trillion or so becoming 35 billion does seem to be a low amount for a total value in USD of their hard currency.

 

Again, Iraq wants to rd but is waiting for stability. Again your own article you posted yesterday states this! Did you not read you own article? Here's a quote from it:

Agreed politicians and economists Iraqis that the process of deleting three zeros from the Iraqi currency current risk because of conditions of the country and the lack of security and stability and the spread of corruption, where Iraq is seeking to reform the system of currency management and ease of use and reducing the number of banknotes of four billion to one billion and 800 million paper, from by deleting three zeros and the issuance of a coin . .

This is something you don't rush....yes Iraq could have done it long ago but they would have end up hurting themselves because they don't have stability.

No countries are going to be upset markinsa. Also there's no proof countries are hoarding dinar in anticipation of an RV. That's guru lies and forum facts with no substance. If a country does have dinar they will get EQUIVALENT amount back. No one is getting screwed you just won't get rich but you'll get your money back. It's so simple. C'mon already

 

If Iraq truly "wanted" to R/D, don't you think it would have been done by now? They've been singing that song & dance since 2006, and possibly even before that. There is opposition in parliament. Not all parties agree. The reason(s) behind it are unknown. I think most other countries that did R/D did NOT take this long, IIRC, so this is an interesting adventure to follow.

Markinsa, if and when Iraq does go thru with a RD, which we don't want, you can't say we didn't warn you or that we were wrong. If they do RD we better hope they honor bills outside Iraq. They have done it before by not honoring bills outside of country so let's hope they don't do this but make no mistake about it....what we have explained to you is what will happen IF Iraq RD's. Key word here is IF

 

They honored bills outside of Iraq... Just the exception was that they closed down the borders from outsiders due to fear of terrorism. You do have to keep in mind that there was quite a bit of daily attacks during this time period when they did that exchange. The times now are different. Back than, the process was quick and put the old dinar on a sudden quick expiration. It was also argued that a lot of counterfeits were around, when in reality the banks didn't encounter too much.

 

Which is another interesting thought. If many notes were likely prevented to be exchanged as neighboring countries held the currency as it lost its entire value, citizens of Iraq likely to scared to go to banks to exchange during a high time of violence, and the finding(s) of a low percentage of counterfeits, why still represent the inflation of the old notes?

 

Think of it this way - If Iraq did the same process today, only honoring bills held within Iraq, I believe it would be argued that the value of each dinar could rise significantly as many dinars may reside outside of Iraq (This greatly reduces their liabilities as dinars outside the country would not be a liability). The same likely happened to many notes when they did their last process of exchange.

 

if iraq RDs . there currency will be worth more later on an gain value

 

Not necessarily... I know after Turkey did their R/D, it did rise in value in the short-term, but also started to fall in value like about 1-2 years after their re-denomination to below what it was introduced at IIRC. Without quickly looking, I don't know where it stands today, but the value did drop. A R/D will not mean guaranteed rise in value (it just simply may help it rise in value over time).

 

[zul]

This is from your own article you posted yesterday markinsa:

He cited countries that have applied this process such as Sudan, which delete zeros from its currency in 2007, and Turkey, which deleted six zeros from its currency in 2005, and omitted Zimbabwe in Africa ten zeros from its currency in 2008, and Bolivia deleted three zeros from its currency in 2008, and deleted all from Romania Iran and three zeros from its currency in 2005 and 2011, but did not improve the value of the currency in these countries significantly and inflation index remained conservative on the rise . .

All these countries did what Iraq has said it wants to do...hopefully they don't. But all these countries deleted zeros off both exchange rate and currency and got back equivalent amounts of the new

 

if they lop, it is just  a neutral value event..? So why are they even talking about "how the other countries did not improve the value of their currency SIGNIFICANTLY..? 

 

 

 

"Agreed politicians and economists Iraqis that the process of deleting three zeros from the Iraqi currency current risk because of conditions of the country and the lack of security and stability and the spread of corruption, where Iraq is seeking to reform the system of currency management and ease of use and reducing the number of banknotes of four billion to one billion and 800 million paper, from by deleting three zeros and the issuance of a coin . ." 

 

And lopping does not reduce the number of banknotes...

[sandyf]

No, you're not getting it.  It is written in "The Law", if they want to do otherwise, they will have to change the law.  I can guarantee you, if they tried to do that here in the United States, there would be a lawsuit, so what makes Iraq any different from the U.S.?

 

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The 'Law' you refer to is in regard to the redemption of an existing currency, and would not apply in the case of a redenomination. All exchange procedures would be detailed in the Technical Guidelines.

 

The Technical Guidelines Issued by Zambia are the most recent reference. It should be noted that Zambia made no arrangement for exchange outside the country.

[keepmwlknfny]

if they lop, it is just  a neutral value event..? So why are they even talking about "how the other countries did not improve the value of their currency SIGNIFICANTLY..? 

 

 

 

"Agreed politicians and economists Iraqis that the process of deleting three zeros from the Iraqi currency current risk because of conditions of the country and the lack of security and stability and the spread of corruption, where Iraq is seeking to reform the system of currency management and ease of use and reducing the number of banknotes of four billion to one billion and 800 million paper, from by deleting three zeros and the issuance of a coin . ." 

 

And lopping does not reduce the number of banknotes...

Are you really serious? Your flip flopping now just for the hell of it? Or do you forget what you say that easily? Earlier you stated that what YOU have been trying to say all along is that deleting the zeros is reducing the money supply, number of notes and that it is a lop, and NOW your saying lopping doesnt reduce the number of notes? Sheesh.......your like a napkin in the wind lol

[RVPleaseToday]

I'm afraid that with the lack of stability in the GOI, it wouldn't really matter what Iraq declared their currency to be worth. The rest of the world would not recognize a significant increase in the Dinar's value.

 

Fiat currencies depend upon everyone agreeing on the value. A small, unstable country teetering on the edge of dictatorship does not inspire confidence in their currency.

I'm really not sure much of the world cares what Iraq's currency is worth or may become worth. Only those who  bought dinar for little of nothing stand to profit from an RV. An RV of Iraqi dinar does not benefit anyone else.

As for countries holding large amounts of dinar, that is pure speculation. There is no evidence that any do; and, in fact, the U.S. specifically says they do not. So you have to drop into the land of conspiracy theory to assert that they do.

[Francie26]

Well, Markinsa, this is extraordinarily rude of you to tell someone else to "go back to your corner and shut up." I can't believe you said it.  You may not like what he said, but unless it's outside the rules here, he has the right to say it. And I don't believe he has to stay in a corner at your command, either.  Your comments are outrageous.

For what it is worth, I agree with Markinsa's side of the discussion here. It was just his "go back to your corner and shut up comment" to which I responded.  And also for what it is worth, it was obvious that boomer . . .  was snickering and sniffling his replies to Markinsa because he had no real thought to contribute. Such people often resort to the fall-back position of laughing and snickering foolishly because they know they are unable to bring anything worthwhile to the discussion.

[zul]

Are you really serious? Your flip flopping now just for the hell of it? Or do you forget what you say that easily? Earlier you stated that what YOU have been trying to say all along is that deleting the zeros is reducing the money supply, number of notes and that it is a lop, and NOW your saying lopping doesnt reduce the number of notes? Sheesh.......your like a napkin in the wind lol

 

Keep,

I said deleting 3 zeros is reducing the number of banknotes (Read: reducing the number of banknotes of four billion to one billion and 800 million paper, from by deleting three zeros and the issuance of a coin . ."  and thus reducing money supplies.  FYI, LOP does not reduce the number of banknotes....

How do 3 zeros delete banknotes..? By removing 3 zeros notes from circulation.

We have been thru this million of times....sheeesh.

[hame55]

I know what we want, Iraq has to have NEW lower denomination (ld) notes and coins in order for the currency to appreciate in value, otherwise no one will be able to buy chewing gum and sodas with the large notes.  Iraq could have RD'd and LOPPED a long time ago if they just wanted to introduce new ld notes.  Mexico is constantly revaluing their currency.  But Iraq is different, they want the value of their currency to increase, and lopping and rd'ing won't do that.  There are Financial Institutions and Countries all over the World that are holding onto Iraq Currency and if Iraq LOPS, those countries are going to be upset along with the IMF and World Bank.

Markinsa, you and I don't agree on social topics, but we sure do on this! It makes sense they would have LOP'ed a long time ago if that were their intention. Why wait all this time to simply take off the zeros from the notes? No public education needed, no buildup of economy needed, no auctions needed, no Chap 7, no WTO, no increased security, no worries about money laundering (who will profit?) and no oversight from IMF and World Bank. 

 

Just simply doing an RD is easy for Iraq. They would have eased their dinar handling problems a long time ago by a simple RD. They are waiting and readying for something else. 

[sandstorm]

Markinsa, you and I don't agree on social topics, but we sure do on this! It makes sense they would have LOP'ed a long time ago if that were their intention. Why wait all this time to simply take off the zeros from the notes? No public education needed, no buildup of economy needed, no auctions needed, no Chap 7, no WTO, no increased security, no worries about money laundering (who will profit?) and no oversight from IMF and World Bank.

Just simply doing an RD is easy for Iraq. They would have eased their dinar handling problems a long time ago by a simple RD. They are waiting and readying for something else.

Honestly.....iraq has told you every time they postponed and why. theyve told the truth.....nothings happened. why are you wrapping every scenario in iraq to have effect on a currencys exchange rate? Are we in a world where everything is rv related. 100's of rd articles in the past years....and every one of those means rv too? I dont even know where to hold a logical debate here. so many ignore the stats financials, believe common laws are all rv laws.....people believe a rv is a rd. i dont even know how to conversate...given so many believe such wild opposites.

Deleting the zeroes is a rd(lop). We may want something else to happen or them do apply it differently....but deleting zeroeshas always

Edited February 25, 2013 by sandstorm

[RVPleaseToday]

Yep. In this article they said that they are delaying the removal of the three zeros because of political instability in the country. They gave a reason.

[sandstorm]

Im off the rd subject. that topic is too distorted and its not worth the agony of discussion. please revert to individual research.....google is your friend.

Edited February 25, 2013 by sandstorm

[staunch]

It amazes me when it's said " they have told you or they are telling you they are going to RD" but if they came out and bold faced said they are going to RV, the same people would say " do you think they are really going to tell you that? "

[keepmwlknfny]

Keep,I said deleting 3 zeros is reducing the number of banknotes (Read: reducing the number of banknotes of four billion to one billion and 800 million paper, from by deleting three zeros and the issuance of a coin . ."  and thus reducing money supplies.  FYI, LOP does not reduce the number of banknotes....How do 3 zeros delete banknotes..? By removing 3 zeros notes from circulation.We have been thru this million of times....sheeesh.

If they are introducing.coin as you highlighted, there are gonna be.coins replacing some of the notes therefore you will not end up with the same amount of banknotes......

Again, earlier in this thread you agreed with what i said that its a RD and now your backtracking saying its not.....it cant be.both.....in either case if you look at the article posted by markinsa, it again related what the CBIs plan is to other countries that lopped.....do you ignore those parts of th e articles?

[zul]

If they are introducing.coin as you highlighted, there are gonna be.coins replacing some of the notes therefore you will not end up with the same amount of banknotes......

Again, earlier in this thread you agreed with what i said that its a RD and now your backtracking saying its not.....it cant be.both.....in either case if you look at the article posted by markinsa, it again related what the CBIs plan is to other countries that lopped.....do you ignore those parts of th e articles?

 

Me backtracking..? 

 

This is what i said ~ from Markisa's post....

 

 

 

Yesterday, 10:37 AM

keepmwlknfny, on 24 Feb 2013 - 23:00, said:

Its reducing the number of bank notes AND the money supply at the same time......put all these articles together collectively over the years and its NOT what we want....

 

This educational campaign has explained over the years the process......2 years (abouts) to exchange....(will still be redeemable for 10 at CBI), the exchange ratio will be 1000 to 1 (old for new) Money supply will go from trillions to billions.....end result will leave the dinar on par with the USD.....(or pretty close)  No room for profit if this goes down.....

 

Exactly what most of us have been saying Keep. Deleting 3 zeros is removing (reducing) the number of banknotes and thus reducing the money supplies at the same time. <===  very consistent with what i'm saying here, on this thread.

 

 

[zul]

Keep, it could be miscommunication on my part.....

but we are always on the diff side of the fence......

[keepmwlknfny]

Keep, it could be miscommunication on my part.....

but we are always on the diff side of the fence......

LOL.....we are on the same side.....we both want it to.RV.....the only thing we differ on is that you seem to think that deleting the zeros isnt a lop and i cant for the life of me understand why when the CBI has made it pretty clear what it is between the 1000 to 1 exchange ratio, cutting the money supply fom trillions to billions, and referencing following the same path as many other countriesbthat have lopped like Turkey, Romania, Zimbabwe and so on.....

[Goldiegirl]

2.5 yrs since I've been reading this on this site and still nobody has come to a conclusion. It just goes round and round like a...

 

[gatoraces]

that's only because no one really knows;  they just hope.

[Markinsa]

Like I said, show me the CBI's Plan to restructure their currency, otherwise, its just speculation on everyone's part.  Or as Sgt Friday would say, Just the Facts Mam, Just the Facts!

 

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[JCTEXAN]

Let,s say you have a $200k mortgage. You make $100k per year in salary. You have $100k in the bank in cash. The U.S. decides to RD and now you technically still owe $200k on your house. You now only have $100.00 new USD in your bank account. I would also assume that your employer would now only pay you $100.00 per year. How would that work based on your mortgage contract? Additionally, if the U.S. owes China, for example only, $1,000,000 today, does that mean that the U.S. would then only owe the Chinese $1,000? I know I would not be too pleased with that, and would not think the Chinese would be either. Anyone have any thoughts how this would work? There are contracts out there which would need to be taken into consideration. Above scenario is based on dropping three zero's from USD.