25 Reasons Why We are Better Off Today than Four Years Ago

[tommyboy]

Good for you Tommyboy. I know the Republicans are far from perfect but the democrates are pure evil. The future of this country is at stake. Conservatives must win or we are sure to suffer beyond imagination.

I see you're a Texan. When I decided to vote against Obama, my diligent study led me to find RON PAUL. Would have voted for him even if we had more than a 2 party system. Still think he's the best. JMHO.

Edited September 6, 2012 by tommyboy

[simple]

Actually that is not correct...... However he did manage to add $6 Trillion in less than 4 years...

Add is a mistaken word... Ask yourself where does the debt come from; what administration, what policies. Obama policies 1.4trillion (2009-2011).

Edited September 6, 2012 by simple

[caz1104]

According to a poll on msn.com that posed the question "are you better off today"? YES-25% About the Same-14% Not Sure-1% NO-60%. That about sums it up

[simple]

According to a poll on msn.com that posed the question "are you better off today"? YES-25% About the Same-14% Not Sure-1% NO-60%. That about sums it up

That's too shallow of an observation. The country is better off than 2 years ago, post recession. That's reality!

[caz1104]

That's too shallow of an observation. The country is better off than 2 years ago, post recession. That's reality!

"shallow"? Thats a pretty precise question. I know by talking with my customers/clients that its actually a higher percentage in the "NO' collum. But i guess if you dont want peoples perspective just the gov rendition I can see your point. I'll take the man on the streets version,he has more credibilty-imo. I also believe the common man knows his own circumstance better than our president-imo.Peace

[simple]

"shallow"? Thats a pretty precise question. I know by talking with my customers/clients that its actually a higher percentage in the "NO' collum. But i guess if you dont want peoples perspective just the gov rendition I can see your point. I'll take the man on the streets version,he has more credibilty-imo. I also believe the common man knows his own circumstance better than our president-imo.Peace

I can appreciate that perspective but if we poll individuals we'll find a balance of responses. Some are doing fantastic comparing to 4 years ago and some stayed the same, and some hit the bubble late in the recession. Some jobs will never be back ,therefore, they must develop new skills.

Some people are answering this question relative to how the government is doing. Some answer relevant to the country's debt and unemployment today vs. pre-recession. Some comparing 2 men, Bush and Obama. That's why I say it's shallow or we're not all talking about the same thing.

My bank accounts are lower than 4 years ago but income is rising. Am I personally better off - YES. Is the country better off, that's relevant to how bad it could have been with millions of more jobs lost due to industries closings.

[caz1104]

I can appreciate that perspective but if we poll individuals we'll find a balance of responses. Some are doing fantastic comparing to 4 years ago and some stayed the same, and some hit the bubble late in the recession. Some jobs will never be back ,therefore, they must develop new skills.

Some people are answering this question relative to how the government is doing. Some answer relevant to the country's debt and unemployment today vs. pre-recession. Some comparing 2 men, Bush and Obama. That's why I say it's shallow or we're not all talking about the same thing.

My bank accounts are lower than 4 years ago but income is rising. Am I personally better off - YES. Is the country better off, that's relevant to how bad it could have been with millions of more jobs lost due to industries closings.

It was really just a simple poll that asks a simple direct question. You can skew however you want,but like I said earlier this poll reflects peoples view and that cant be argued.

[simple]

It was really just a simple poll that asks a simple direct question. You can skew however you want,but like I said earlier this poll reflects peoples view and that cant be argued.

Simple, leading but vague, that's cool.

[grand pubah]

Ok for me this speaks volumes about the fundamental differences of the parties.

GP

[simple]

Ok for me this speaks volumes about the fundamental differences of the parties.

GP

Okay, that was easy.

[caz1104]

Simple, leading but vague, that's cool.

It was'nt a loaded,leading,or vague question? Now if you're in the 25% that are doing better....................great! Buttttttttttttt according to the poll you are in the minority. And hey thats where the Democrats want to keep ya..................kazinga-lol JK-Peace

[Markinsa]

Tax cuts cause debt??? NO! Spending more than you have causes debt, where was the money spent???

-

[sandstorm]

Please define recession. Can you seriously tell us what's expected during a 1 year 6 month recession; the list of large business failures were the worst in American history? Who could have done any better?

Anyone other than obama. obama and his economic geniuses, added to the stimulus policies, bailouts, all the kickbacks in obamacare.

this is an organized meltdown. they knew their policies and they worked. we now have a crisis. Obama created the crisis, for reason to retransform the system...its aapart of his revolution

[grand pubah]

On another note, in the community and networks of associations I have, people are struggling looking for work, unemployed, underemployed, or behind on bills. Many of the small and large businesses have already or are continuing to close almost weekly. A local farm supply store placed a sign out in front of the store that it was hiring. There were over 300 applications for a small handful of low paying jobs.

Now while I do not blame all this on the Pres. I believe that a healthy economy is a streamlined and efficiently run one. With all the bailouts that happened it prevented many of the businesses and banks from having to tighten their belt, become more efficient and competitive, and cutting out waste. Much of the money was used for bonuses to executives, or just extended the companies capital for a temporary period of time in hopes the economy would pick up before they ran out of money again.

Of course there would have been more layoffs without the bailouts but what would have emerged was stronger, more efficient, profit producing companies in the long run able to compete better in the world market.

This may be an oversimplified view in some respects but you get the idea.

The problem with the car companies is that they are not efficiently run businesses. The unions have run amuck, employees and CEO's receive ungodly compensations, craftsmanship and quality of products are substandard and benefits are outrageous.

I mean how in the world can you stay competitive when you have to pay union employees 3 months of paid vacation a year each? (just one example)

Or the productive workers are blackballed by the union because they are too productive and make everyone else's laziness look bad. You are labeled a "speedballer" and blackballed.

The problem is that too few of our elected politicians are willing to make the tough choices because they know it could cost them re-election in the short term because things would initially get worse before they got better.

If you refused to take the needed medicine when you are sick just because it tastes bad then you are short sighted and will end up long term in much worse shape than you are now.

A simple illustration of what it is going take to get our economy and nation back on track. Cutbacks must be made, sacrifices must occur, spending has to be severely cut.

Spending our way through recession only will deepen the problem in the long run and place us in worse shape through excessive debt and prevent us from making the adjustments to out of control spending that must be made.

I never really understood some of this until I became a business man and had to learn to control overhead, efficiently streamline labor costs, work longer hours to cut back labor costs, take salary cuts, trim expenses, ect... to make ends meet in tough times.

You don't borrow your way to health. You must become more efficient.

GP

[simple]

Tax cuts cause debt??? NO! Spending more than you have causes debt, where was the money spent???

-

read the chart.

Anyone other than obama. obama and his economic geniuses, added to the stimulus policies, bailouts, all the kickbacks in obamacare.

this is an organized meltdown. they knew their policies and they worked. we now have a crisis. Obama created the crisis, for reason to retransform the system...its aapart of his revolution

read the chart.

[Roadrunner]

The only ones who seem to know anything about these 4 million jobs Obama created are his staff and his spin doctors. Here is a more realistic account. http://voices.washingtonpost.com/economy-watch/2009/05/actual_us_unemployment_158.html

Actual U.S. Unemployment: 15.8%

This morning's news that U.S. unemployment has hit 13.7 million, pushing the rate to 8.9 percent, tells only half the story of this recession.

The total number of Americans who are not working full-time but ought to be is actually about 22 million, or 15.8 percent, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics.

Who are those other 8.3 million Americans? Call them the unofficially unemployed.

As The Ticker points out each time the Bureau releases the monthly unemployment figure, it does not include many out-of-work Americans.

There are many reasons for this.

The bureau, which is under the Labor Department, cannot use unemployment compensation records to count the out-of-work, because they are not reliable or up-to-date enough. The bureau also cannot count every out-of-work person.

Instead, as The Ticker reported here in December: "In the case of the monthly jobs report, the Labor Department contacts 60,000 households to determine the unemployment picture for the entire workforce, which consists of about 154 million Americans."

The problem with this methodology is that it does not include millions of Americans who are not working full-time who ought to be. Those, in the bureau's words, who are "marginally attached to the labor force."

Those numbered an additional 2.1 million Americans in the first quarter of this year, the bureau said. Alarmingly, that number was up 35 percent from the first quarter of 2008.

Of this number, the bureau categorized 717,000 as "discouraged" workers, or those that have simply given up looking for work for any number of reasons. That number was up 70 percent from the first quarter of 2008.

"Discouraged" workers include a disproportionate number of young people, blacks, Hispanics and men, the bureau said.

On top of all of this, add an additional 3.6 million unemployed Americans who say they want a job but have not looked for work in the past 12 months.

The remaining 2.6 million or so officially unemployed Americans include part-time workers who would prefer to have full-time jobs, those who have not looked for work because of illness or transportation reasons and those who believe they have other impediments.

But even though these workers don't count toward the official monthly unemployment number, they are nevertheless a true weight on the economy.

They don't pay payroll tax, or as much of it as they would; they don't contribute to Social Security or other government entitlement entitlements and they don't spend as much.

The 15.8 percent figure is the highest since the bureau began keeping these figures in 1994. Excluding the current recession, the highest previous rate came in January 1994, when it hit 11.8 percent.

The number was 8.7 percent in December 2007, when the current recession began. That means the number of the unofficially unemployed has shot up 7.1 percentage points since then.

By comparison, the official unemployment rate has risen 3.9 percentage points since December 2007. This suggests that a greater percentage of people are becoming disenfranchised from the workforce than are getting laid off.

By the way, in February, the White House predicted unemployment would top out at 8.1 percent this year, a figure that was blown through the following month.

It has made no call on how high the unofficial unemployment rate will go.

[sandstorm]

read the chart.

read the chart.

Your kidding right. its from whitehouse.gov....the obama administration. Of course they blame bush.

Obama hit 5 trillion in three and a half years, and called bush UNPATRIOTIC for 4 trillion in 8 years.

this election isnt even about politics. its common sense...obama has failed.....whats really sad is people dont see it.

Edited September 6, 2012 by sandstorm

[simple]

Your kidding right. its from whitehouse.gov....the obama administration. Of course they blame bush.

Obama hit 5 trillion in three and a half years, and called bush UNPATRIOTIC for 4 trillion in 8 years.

this election isnt even about politics. its common sense...obama has failed.....whats really sad is people dont see it.

Top chart isn't from White House. Simply tells you where money is spent. Dig a little further if you're curious or just take the word of the politicians and biased media.

[sxsess]

I see you're a Texan. When I decided to vote against Obama, my diligent study led me to find RON PAUL. Would have voted for him even if we had more than a 2 party system. Still think he's the best. JMHO.

Yes if he would have been the nominee I would have voted for him too. This is all about destroying obummer and the left.

[simple]

The only ones who seem to know anything about these 4 million jobs Obama created are his staff and his spin doctors. Here is a more realistic account. http://voices.washingtonpost.com/economy-watch/2009/05/actual_us_unemployment_158.html

THE WORD IS UNDEREMPLOYED that now figures into unemployment depending on who you ask; not having enough paid work or not doing work that makes full use of their skills and abilities. Said it before, some jobs are not coming back. People must adapt to the times.

Check the CBO when you have time.

[grand pubah]

THE WORD IS UNDEREMPLOYED that now figures into unemployment depending on who you ask; not having enough paid work or not doing work that makes full use of their skills and abilities. Said it before, some jobs are not coming back. People must adapt to the times.

Check the CBO when you have time.

Simple, I do agree with you on that point that some jobs are not coming back and people must adapt. Well spoken.

Underemployed from what I see mostly in my world is referring to people who are skilled laborers in the building industry (master carpenters, licensed plumbers, professional electricians, ect..) who cannot find work and are trying to look for lawns to mow, or people who are college grads that are working part time in fast food restaurants or waiting tables for tips type of thing.

Truth is that we are in recession and it is going to last longer than people think it will. Actually I fully expect it to get much worse before it gets better.

GP

[simple]

Simple, I do agree with you on that point that some jobs are not coming back and people must adapt. Well spoken.

Underemployed from what I see mostly in my world is referring to people who are skilled laborers in the building industry (master carpenters, licensed plumbers, professional electricians, ect..) who cannot find work and are trying to look for lawns to mow, or people who are college grads that are working part time in fast food restaurants or waiting tables for tips type of thing.

Truth is that we are in recession and it is going to last longer than people think it will. Actually I fully expect it to get much worse before it gets better.

GP

Agree...

BTW: the recession was defined from Dec 2007 – June 2009, 1 year and 6 months. It's obviously improving. Even Romney stated: January 20, 2012 Mitt Romney on Laura Ingraham's radio program: "Of course it's getting better. The economy always gets better after the recession. There's always a recovery. There's never been a time anywhere in the world where an economy has never recovered. They just want to argue it wasn't due to Obama's policies. It will always be a polarizing conflict.

[grand pubah]

I understand your point simple. however the direction things are going in the world economy, with the imminent failure of nations in the Euro, and the position the dollar is starting to lose as the world reserve currency, unlimited money printing policies of so many countries to cover their debts, all will ultimately lead to catastrophic economic outcomes. Hyper inflation, devaluation of the currency, and the disappearance of the middle class.

While these measures may temporarily postpone the inevitable, they will ultimately make it worse when it does happen.

Financial collapse of the fiat money system is inevitable with the current irresponsible fiscal policies of the politicians in power at this time.

I'm not drinking the koolaide

GP just telling it like it is

[simple]

I understand your point simple. however the direction things are going in the world economy, with the imminent failure of nations in the Euro, and the position the dollar is starting to lose as the world reserve currency, unlimited money printing policies of so many countries to cover their debts, all will ultimately lead to catastrophic economic outcomes. Hyper inflation, devaluation of the currency, and the disappearance of the middle class.

While these measures may temporarily postpone the inevitable, they will ultimately make it worse when it does happen.

Financial collapse of the fiat money system is inevitable with the current irresponsible fiscal policies of the politicians in power at this time.

I'm not drinking the koolaide

GP just telling it like it is

Well now you're shifting to world and devaluation of currency discussions. I'm not sure if you're trying to indict the president or not. The candidates are not speaking on those subjects. But you must know Obama is more informed in these areas. It would be knew to any other president.

[grand pubah]

Well now you're shifting to world and devaluation of currency discussions. I'm not sure if you're trying to indict the president or not. The candidates are not speaking on those subjects. But you must know Obama is more informed in these areas. It would be knew to any other president.

the last post was an explanation about why I expect things to get worse before they get better. You obviously feel we are in a recovery. I respect your opinion but believe any minor and temporary fluctuation in the figures are just that. Minor and temporary. This was not intended to be an indictment of our president.

I see manipulation of the price of precious metals, and the govt purchase of its own treasury bonds, and the endless printing of the money supply as a last ditch effort to stave off the inevitable results of careless and irresponsible fiscal policies for many years.

I do not blame this all on President Obama but he is a willing participant in continuing these type policies. As most politicians he is doing what is best for the short term polls and to get himself re-elected just like most politicians. Certainly this is not a result of his actions alone and I do not believe that.

I will say in due respect sir, that it is my opinion that the President does not have a solid understanding of fiscal responsibility and how these things work. Or that he has any idea of how to make this country back to its greatness from where it is now. Of course he is not the cause of the condition of our country now but he is not the answer either.

There are many things I do not like about Romney but I do like the fact that he does have some history of taking failing businesses and events (the Olympics and the state he governed) and turning them around to where they were not operating at a deficit and became profitable.

Will he have the wherewithal to make the tough decisions required? If he is elected only time will tell. It will definitely take someone who is more concerned about our country than their political popularity. That is one reason I like Chris Christy. He will make tough decisions and call it like it is regardless of whether it is popular or not. Of course he is not without flaw and his record shows that as well.

GP