Taxes

[Quietlearner]

Good Morning,

I have been studying the US Tax codes for the past week. Wow, what a confusing mess. I have zeroed in on what seems to be call the Collectables tax. This I believe is 28% as oppossed to well over 40% capital gains. I am heavily invested in the dinar. Well over 140,000,000.00. I single. Kids are grown up. I have no shelter other than my LLC which at this point Im not sure if I should be putting the Dinar in it. Help please.

[Upgradable]

Whoo! Good question! I'm going to move this to the Tax Discussion forum. There are some folks who hang out there who are equiped to answer.

[Jamie in Bama]

You will likely need expert tax advice. With that much, you will also be on the IRS Audit short list, may as well be prepared.

Assuming a significant revalue rate you would also create a large estate tax problem, that is if you would prefer that your family gets the most benefit in the event of your death.

I don't know if you have time to get it set up, but you could benefit from some estate tax planning immediately. Might save heirs millions of $.

[DaveJen]

While I no longer practice as a CPA, I can offer a couple of things for you. First refer to Pub 525 Section 31. It deals specifically with currency transaction. It states that transaction involving less than $200 are exempt and that transactions greater than $200 are subject to capital gains. See the amount of dinar you have, one would have to assume that you have been involved for more than a year so clearly your gains would fall under the long term provisions which would place you in a 15% bracket.

Beyond that there is confusion over the short term provision. I have interuppted Pub 525 Section 31 (and this has been verified by discussions with the IRS and 4 different tax lawyers) that if you are not in the practice of currency exchange (which most are not) then all currency exchange greater than $200 will only be subject to long term cap gains thus 15%. However, this is up to interuptation and each individual should seek out legal counsel on this subject.

There is one rumer going around about a 15% add on tax. This is clearly false and misunderstood. The 15% would be for backup withholding and not an additional tax. This provision of the law kicks in when a person receives a lump sum payment in events such as gambling, lottery, prize show winnings etc. The bank or currency exchange is to collect by law a 15% payment against what will be the total tax bill. Then at the time of filing the return the tax already paid is treated as a payment against the total due. This is NOT an additional tax and there is absolutely nothing in congress at this point that would suggest that they intend on leveling an addtional tax. The IRS cannot levy an additional tax without the passage of a tax bill by congress and approval by the President.

Hope this helps some, most importantly seek the advice an attorney who specializes in tax. This would not be an estate planning attorney.

Don't ding me for spelling. I did this quickly

[docwayne]

Good Morning,

I have been studying the US Tax codes for the past week. Wow, what a confusing mess. I have zeroed in on what seems to be call the Collectables tax. This I believe is 28% as oppossed to well over 40% capital gains. I am heavily invested in the dinar. Well over 140,000,000.00. I single. Kids are grown up. I have no shelter other than my LLC which at this point Im not sure if I should be putting the Dinar in it. Help please.

Good Morning Quiet Learner,

I found it much more rewarding to learn about Adam's plans, OSI and OGIT, than studying tax codes which are as you called them a confusing mess.

docwayne

[Quietlearner]

Thank you all for the information. 15% is much more like it. I have infact had a solid estate plan and trust put in effect last year. My real property and such is in trust, however, the Dinar is liquid and I need to be clear on what I am doing with it. I have read OSI information as well as most of the information on this site. Just a little apprehensive when making a move of this magnitude.

Thank you all again.

Quiet Learner

[usndiver]

ExecConsultant has covered this subject extensively. The gains on this investment fall under Section 988 of the Internal Revenue Code, and will be taxed as ordinary income. You will need a competent attorney/CPA that is familiar with this type of investment.

[Adam Montana]

ExecConsultant has covered this subject extensively. The gains on this investment fall under Section 988 of the Internal Revenue Code, and will be taxed as ordinary income. You will need a competent attorney/CPA that is familiar with this type of investment.

I agree with you, ExecConsult has done an excellent job covering this topic, and has presented a solid argument that shows it will be taxed as income - but even he says there is no way to 100% guarantee it will be ordinary income.

Just an FYI to all, if you have anything close to 1,000,000 being taxed at ordinary income you are looking at over 40% taxes in 90% of the country. That means you instantly forfeit 400,000 of your gains as an individual...

.... and that's not even considering a potential "windfall tax"!

To the original poster - I see you are VIP. Take a look at this thread, it will give you some incredible insight:

[On_Reserve]

Good Morning,

I have been studying the US Tax codes for the past week. Wow, what a confusing mess. I have zeroed in on what seems to be call the Collectables tax. This I believe is 28% as oppossed to well over 40% capital gains. I am heavily invested in the dinar. Well over 140,000,000.00. I single. Kids are grown up. I have no shelter other than my LLC which at this point Im not sure if I should be putting the Dinar in it. Help please.

If there is any way that you can get a portion of your IQD holdings into a Roth IRA, you would be well served to do it. Sounds like you are over 50, so you can put up to $6K per year into a Roth. You can then bypass the 5-year rule using Rule 72T allowing you to take tax free income from your Roth IRA immediately, if you like.

Look into it. See: 72t (dot) net.

TS

I believe in the RV; I don't believe in the cult.

[Bigboy0854]

Please read my thread 1099B

[avalancheinvestments]

So much information to absorbe. Hope I have the correct forum, I cannot find any input from Mark on the corp in the Seychelles, Belize account and the Nevada corp. Could someone direct me?

This is quite the learning experience, thanks to all...

[easyrider]

So much information to absorbe. Hope I have the correct forum, I cannot find any input from Mark on the corp in the Seychelles, Belize account and the Nevada corp. Could someone direct me?

This is quite the learning experience, thanks to all...

I am hearing we will all be taxed at 15% no matter how long you have held it and as oridnary income plus state tax.

[paulasus]

This is an idea I read here on Dinarvet: how about cashing in just enough Dinar for a plane ticket to Belize, Switzerland or somewhere else, then cash in the rest of your Dinar in that country? When you file your US taxes, you can declare your foreign accounts, but the IRS can't touch them until you actually use the money in the US...

[ExecConsult]

This is an idea I read here on Dinarvet: how about cashing in just enough Dinar for a plane ticket to Belize, Switzerland or somewhere else, then cash in the rest of your Dinar in that country? When you file your US taxes, you can declare your foreign accounts, but the IRS can't touch them until you actually use the money in the US...

I have not dug into international tax structures as much as I would like. However, this is not my understanding of how it works. You would not only have to declare your accounts, you would also have to declare your foreign income and the US taxes its citizens on all income earned worldwide. They simply give allowances for taxes you may have paid in the foreign jurisdiction in which the income was earned. Since you didn't pay the tax to anyone else, it is due to the US.

Best of Blessings,

Mark

[ExecConsult]

While I no longer practice as a CPA, I can offer a couple of things for you. First refer to Pub 525 Section 31. It deals specifically with currency transaction. It states that transaction involving less than $200 are exempt and that transactions greater than $200 are subject to capital gains. See the amount of dinar you have, one would have to assume that you have been involved for more than a year so clearly your gains would fall under the long term provisions which would place you in a 15% bracket.

Beyond that there is confusion over the short term provision. I have interuppted Pub 525 Section 31 (and this has been verified by discussions with the IRS and 4 different tax lawyers) that if you are not in the practice of currency exchange (which most are not) then all currency exchange greater than $200 will only be subject to long term cap gains thus 15%. However, this is up to interuptation and each individual should seek out legal counsel on this subject.

Hope this helps some, most importantly seek the advice an attorney who specializes in tax. This would not be an estate planning attorney.

I am not the type of attorney Dave suggested you seek out. I am an estate planning attorney. However, I have been steeped in this for quite a while now. Allow me to share some of my observations:

First - Pub. 525 is often quoted. You must realize that the publication is not authoritative. However it is a direct quote (almost) from Section 988 of the Internal Revenue Code which is authoritative. What pub 525 quotes is a small exception to the general rule. The general rule is that gains from foreign exchange are to be treated as (and reported as) interest income which is ordinary income 35% (not capital gains). The exception is made for "personal transactions" which anticipate things such as travel to other countries.

The question then becomes, since this is an investment, can the exception still apply to us? It is clear to me from a study of the underlying regulations that the intent is to capture all business and investment activities as ordinary income and only allow non-business/non-investment activities to make use of the exception for "Personal Transactions." However, just because that is the intent of the IRS does not mean that is the final word on how the law should be interpreted. You have to decide if you are ready and willing to support a different assertion under the law and fight the IRS if they disagree with you.

You have three basic options to discuss with your tax counsel:

1) See if the IRS gives guidance in their annual bulletins. I did submit a request to be added to the Guidance Priority List for this year but that is not guaruntee that the guidance will come. (The text of that submission to the IRS can be found here: )

2) Determine what you think is appropriate under the law and ask for a Private Letter Ruling from the IRS sanctioning your proposed actions. This will cost some and take some time, but if the IRS gives their blessing you are home free.

3) Determine what you think is appropriate under the law and file your taxes that way. You will of course need to discuss with counsel the risks you take and what preparations to make in case the IRS disagrees with you. (preparations to pay up or fight)

Hope that helps.

Best of Blessings,

Mark

[cajunrescuemedic]

You're gonna need to get the services of a tax professional to help you with your taxes. They know all the loop holes and how much you'll need to pay in taxes. Good luck....GO RV !!!

[ExecConsult]

So much information to absorbe. Hope I have the correct forum, I cannot find any input from Mark on the corp in the Seychelles, Belize account and the Nevada corp. Could someone direct me?

This is quite the learning experience, thanks to all...

This is a plan set up for the VIP/ OSI group in corroboration with a VIP contact. I will not make open comment on this structure because once you get into it there are many possible variables based on your own circumstances. Sorry . . . .

I will say that if YOU personally own stock in a corporation (whether it be in the US or the Seychelles) and you get sued. That stock can be taken without having to appeal to any foreign government. They just take the stock which you own in the US and then they own the company in the Seychelles. Therefore, if you are planning on doing and off shore structure with an IBC, you should seriously consider having the stock in the company owned by another asset protection trust (i.e. foreign trust or domestic LLC).

Further - I understand that Beliz has no agreements with the US to report accounts. However, this is NOT a good reason for banking there in my opinion. It is a bad practice to start thinking about "hiding" money as opposed to protecting it.

There are many positive off shore asset protection and tax mitigation structures. I don't know enough about all the things that the VIP group and/or Frank Buck are doing to make direct comment on the structures available there.

I hope this has been helpful.

Best of Blessings,

Mark

Best of Blessings,

Mark

[wpsmit]

Thought I might get a good answer to what the tax ramifications on the rv money will be, but....after reading the thread, it still seems to be as clear as mud. In my humble opinion, we will not know the exact rates until post rv when the UST rules on it.

[ExecConsult]

Thought I might get a good answer to what the tax ramifications on the rv money will be, but....after reading the thread, it still seems to be as clear as mud. In my humble opinion, we will not know the exact rates until post rv when the UST rules on it.

It's even worse than that - the UST will not rule on anything. The IRS will determine what they believe to be correct. If you disagree with them, the Federal Tax Courts are where you fight them. It is possible to appeal past the tax court but it is not often done.

The UST doesn't have any say in it.

Best of Blessings,

Mark

[patb1]

ALL GOOD POINTS HAVE BEEN MADE Icertainly bow to the professionals.

i would be careful stating how much dinar you have on a public forum.

these discussions should be discussed in VIP only

Just my Humble Opinion,