Obamacare!!!!!!!!!

[carlablum]

Got this in my e-mail and it made me sick to my stomach!!!

 

This is just the beginning...a friend of ours was already just denied surgery for her back because of Obamacare!  Her treatment was covered in past years. Believe this or not, just get ready to either pay up or suffer and die!  Keep after your Congressmen!  This is not a party problem, it's a system problem.

Hold on folks… the fun is just startin!!!! 
  
  
  
  
  
PLEASE PASS THIS OUTRAGE TO EVERY ONE ON YOUR LIST!!! 
THIS should be read by everyone, especally important to those over 75. If you are younger, then it applies to your parents. 
  
Your hospital Medicare admittance has just changed under Obama Care. You must be admitted by your primary Physician in order for Medicare to pay for it! If you are admitted by an emergency room doctor it is treated as outpatient care where hospital costs are not covered. This is only the tip of the iceberg for Obama Care. Just wait to see what happens in 2013 & 2014! 
At age 72, today, I went to the Dr. for my monthly B12 shot that I have been getting for a number of years. The nurse came and got me, got out the needle filled and ready to go then looked at the computer and got very quiet and asked if I was prepared to pay for it. I said no that my insurance takes care of it. 
She said, that Medicare had turned it down and went to talk to my Dr. about it. 15 minutes later she came back and said, she was sorry but they had tried every-thing they could but Medicare is beginning to turn many things down for seniors because of the projected Obama Care coming in. She was brushing at tears and said, "Some day they too will get old", I am so very sorry!! 
Please for the sake of many good people, please... pass this on. We all need to be informed.

                           YOU ARE NOT GOING TO LIKE THIS...

At age 76 when you most need it, you are not eligible for cancer treatment
page 272 
What Nancy Pelosi didn't want us to know until after the healthcare bill was passed. Remember she said, "We have to pass the Bill so that we can see what's in it." Well, here it is.

                           Obama Care Highlighted by Page Number

                           THE CARE BILL HB 3200

JUDGE KITHIL IS THE 2ND OFFICIAL WHO HAS OUTLINED THESE PARTS OF THE CARE BILL.

Judge Kithil of Marble Falls, TX - highlighted the most egregious pages of HB3200

        Please read this....... especially the reference to pages 58 & 59 


JUDGE KITHIL wrote: 
Page 50/section 152: 
The bill will provide insurance to all non-U.S. residents, even if they are here illegally. 

Page 58 and 59: 
The government will have real-time access to an individual's bank account and will have the authority to make electronic fund transfers from those accounts. 

Page 65/section 164: 
The plan will be subsidized (by the government) for all union members, union retirees and for community organizations (such as the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now - ACORN).Page 203/line 14-15: 
The tax imposed under this section will not be treated as a tax. (How could anybody in their right mind come up with that?)

Page 241 and 253: 
Doctors will all be paid the same regardless of specialty, and the government will set all doctors' fees.

Page 272. section 1145: 
Cancer hospital will ration care according to the patient's age.
Page 317 and 321: 
The government will impose a prohibition on hospital expansion; however, communities may petition for an exception.

Page 425, line 4-12: 
The government mandates advance-care planning consultations. Those on Social Security will be required to attend an "end-of-life planning" seminar every five years. (Death counseling..)
Page 429, line 13-25: 
The government will specify which doctors can write an end-of-life order.


     HAD ENOUGH???? Judge Kithil then goes on to identify:

"Finally, it is specifically stated that this bill will not apply to members of Congress.Honorable David Kithil of Marble Falls, Texas


All of the above should give you the ammo you need to oppose Obamacare. 
 

 

[dontlop]

The plan will be subsidized (by the government) for all union members, union retirees and for community organizations (such as the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now - ACORN).

Read more: http://dinarvets.com/forums/index.php?/topic/142182-obamacare/#ixzz2LqbKgvt8

 

 

i guess we will just have to find out how we all start our own community organizations

i heard they will have a preventive maintnance program .. that covers everthing as far as maintaining our health .. so we should just overwhelm the system and bankrupt it .. it should cover , food , shelter transportation , ..........so i will ask for a prescription for food .. the good stuff too .they dont want me dying of starvation ...................i will ask for nice warm clothes .. they dont want me getting sick ....... if they want  me to pay .. they must provide me with a job .. and if i have a job they need to supply me with  transportation .. i hope they dont want me to stress myself out and work hard either ,, thats bad for my health ..man every time i get hungry ill be seeing a doctor  for a food coupon.. nice ,, ill just live in the doctors office ... and i want a specialist for every  check up i can possibly think of .. i want cat scans .. mri .. blood work .. and i want it every month .. or if something happens to me and they missed it .. i will sue the crap out of them  .. or ill sue for discrimination ...

we should all get the same specialists the president gets .. or its discrimination ..and he can get in line like everyone else .. and explain to his kids if they get sick that he signed these laws into law .. the bums will live in the emergency room .. heck we can alll become bums .. why work if our health is being taken care of  for free if we dont work .

this makes me sick . what are they going to do next .. force us to work  .. at what ever job they say we must work at .. just like a marxist dictator ..

hey 50 million people voted against it .. so if all 50 million dont pay .. what are they going to do round us all up and put us in jail ?.

 

 they already said  they cant round up just 12 million illegals . so they are making it legal for illegall immigrants  to immigrate here .

 

so i guess they dont have the ability to round up 50 million people if they cant round up 12 million people

Edited February 24, 2013 by dontlop

[sxsess]

Socialism, liberalism, communism = Liberals  have a co-dependency mindset with government. They expect government to support them because of their warped entitlement mindset. Pathetic

Edited February 24, 2013 by Markinsa
removed other members names | Please read Forum Rules

[Flatbush Zombies]

This is false and exaggerated. This has been circulating for months now. I'll post the original version followed by this Version which came after. It's been proven false and fact checked. Google is your friend people. Stop believing nonsense. If you cant source or cite it or back up with facts don't spread it. Cheers.

Everyone should read this and pay close attention.

An Indianapolis doctor's letter to Sen. Bayh about the Bill (Note: Dr. Stephen E. Frazer, MD practices as an anesthesiologist in Indianapolis, IN) Here is a letter I sent to Senator Bayh. Feel free to copy it and send it around to all other representatives. — Stephen Fraser

Senator Bayh,

As a practicing physician I have major concerns with the health care bill before Congress. I actually have read the bill and am shocked by the brazenness of the government's proposed involvement in the patient-physician relationship. The very idea that the government will dictate and ration patient care is dangerous and certainly not helpful in designing a health care system that works for all. Every physician I work with agrees that we need to fix our health care system, but the proposed bills currently making their way through congress will be a disaster if passed.

I ask you respectfully and as a patriotic American to look at the following troubling lines that I have read in the bill. You cannot possibly believe that these proposals are in the best interests of the country and our fellow citizens.

Page 22 of the HC Bill: Mandates that the Govt will audit books of all employers that self-insure!!

Page 30 Sec 123 of HC bill: THERE WILL BE A GOVT COMMITTEE that decides what treatments/benefits you get.

Page 29 lines 4-16 in the HC bill: YOUR HEALTH CARE IS RATIONED!!!

Page 42 of HC Bill: The Health Choices Commissioner will choose your HC benefits for you. You have no choice!

Page 50 Section 152 in HC bill: HC will be provided to ALL non-US citizens, illegal or otherwise.

Page 58 HC Bill: Govt will have real-time access to individuals' finances & a 'National ID Health card' will be issued!

Page 59 HC Bill lines 21-24: Govt will have direct access to your bank accounts for elective funds transfer.

Page 65 Sec 164: Is a payoff subsidized plan for retirees and their families in unions & community organizations: (ACORN).

Page 84 Sec 203 HC bill: Govt mandates ALL benefit packages for private HC plans in the 'Exchange.'

Page 85 Line 7 HC Bill: Specifications of Benefit Levels for Plans — The Govt will ration your health care!

Page 91 Lines 4-7 HC Bill: Govt mandates linguistic appropriate services. (Translation: illegal aliens.)

Page 95 HC Bill Lines 8-18: The Govt will use groups (i.e. ACORN & Americorps to sign up individuals for Govt HC plan.

Page 85 Line 7 HC Bill: Specifications of Benefit Levels for Plans. (AARP members - your health care WILL be rationed!)

Page 102 Lines 12-18 HC Bill: Medicaid eligible individuals will be automatically enrolled in Medicaid. (No choice.)

Page 12 4 lines 24-25 HC: No company can sue GOVT on price fixing. No "judicial review" against Govt monopoly.

Page 127 Lines 1-16 HC Bill: Doctors/ American Medical Association - The Govt will tell YOU what salary you can make.

Page 145 Line 15-17: An Employer MUST auto-enroll employees into public option plan. (NO choice!)

Page 126 Lines 22-25: Employers MUST pay for HC for part-time employees AND their families. (Employees shouldn't get excited about this as employers will be forced to reduce its work force, benefits, and wages/salaries to cover such a huge expense.)

Page 149 Lines 16-24: ANY Employer with payroll 401k & above who does not provide public option will pay 8% tax on all payroll! (See the last comment in parenthesis.)

Page 150 Lines 9-13: A business with payroll between $251K & $401K who doesn't provide public option will pay 2-6% tax on all payroll.

Page 167 Lines 18-23: ANY individual who doesn't have acceptable HC according to Govt will be taxed 2.5% of income.

Page 170 Lines 1-3 HC Bill: Any NONRESIDENT Alien is exempt from individual taxes. (Americans will pay.)

Page 195 HC Bill: Officers & employees of the GOVT HC Admin.. will have access to ALL Americans' finances and personal records.

Page 203 Line 14-15 HC: "The tax imposed under this section shall not be treated as tax." (Yes, it really says that!)

Page 239 Line 14-24 HC Bill: Govt will reduce physician services for Medicaid Seniors. (Low-income and the poor are affected.)

Page 241 Line 6-8 HC Bill: Doctors: It doesn't matter what specialty you have trained yourself in — you will all be paid the same! (Just TRY to tell me that's not Socialism!)

Page 253 Line 10-18: The Govt sets the value of a doctor's time, profession, judgment, etc. (Literally— the value of humans.)

Page 265 Sec 1131: The Govt mandates and controls productivity for "private" HC industries.

Page 268 Sec 1141: The federal Govt regulates the rental and purchase of power driven wheelchairs.

Page 272 SEC. 1145: TREATMENT OF CERTAIN CANCER HOSPITALS - Cancer patients - welcome to rationing!

Page 280 Sec 1151: The Govt will penalize hospitals for whatever the Govt deems preventable (i.e... re-admissions).

Page 298 Lines 9-11: Doctors: If you treat a patient during initial admission that results in a re-admission — the Govt will penalize you.

Page 317 L 13-20: PROHIBITION on ownership/investment. (The Govt tells doctors what and how much they can own!)

Page 317-318 lines 21-25, 1-3: PROHIBITION on expansion. (The Govt is mandating that hospitals cannot expand.)

Page 321 2-13: Hospitals have the opportunity to apply for exception BUT community input is required. (Can you say ACORN?)

Page 335 L 16-25 Pg 336-339: The Govt mandates establishment of outcome-based measures. (HC the way they want — rationing.)

Page 341 Lines 3-9: The Govt has authority to disqualify Medicare Advance Plans, HMOs, etc. (Forcing people into the Govt plan)

Page 354 Sec 1177: The Govt will RESTRICT enrollment of 'special needs people!' Unbelievable!

Page 379 Sec 1191: The Govt creates more bureaucracy via a "Tele-Health Advisory Committee." (Can you say HC by phone?)

Page 425 Lines 4-12: The Govt mandates "Advance-Care Planning Consult." (Think senior citizens end-of-life patients.)

Page 425 Lines 17-19: The Govt will instruct and consult regarding living wills, durable powers of attorney, etc. (And it's mandatory!)

Page 425 Lines 22-25, 426 Lines 1-3: The Govt provides an "approved" list of end-of-life resources; — guiding you in death. (Also called 'assisted suicide.')

Page 427 Lines 15-24: The Govt mandates a program for orders on "end-of-life." (The Govt has a say in how your life ends!)

Page 429 Lines 1-9: An "advanced-care planning consultant" will be used frequently as a patient's health deteriorates.

Page 429 Lines 10-12: An "advanced care consultation" may include an ORDER for end-of-life plans. (AN ORDER TO DIE FROM THE GOVERNMENT?!?)

Page 429 Lines 13-25: The GOVT will specify which doctors can write an end-of-life order. (I wouldn't want to stand before God after getting paid for THAT job!)

Page 430 Lines 11-15: The Govt will decide what level of treatment you will have at end-of-life! (Again — no choice!)

Page 469: Community-Based Home Medical Services = Non-Profit Organizations. (Hello? ACORN Medical Services here!?!)

Page 489 Sec 1308: The Govt will cover marriage and family therapy. (Which means Govt will insert itself into your marriage even.)

Page 494-498: Govt will cover Mental Health Services including defining, creating, and rationing those services.

Senator, I guarantee that I personally will do everything possible to inform patients and my fellow physicians about the dangers of the proposed bills you and your colleagues are debating.

Furthermore, if you vote for a bill that enforces socialized medicine on the country and destroys the doctor-patient relationship, I will do everything in my power to make sure you lose your job in the next election.

Respectfully,

Stephen E. Fraser, MD

I have reviewed selected sections of the bill and find it unbelievable that our Congress, led by Speaker Nancy Pelosi, could come up with a bill loaded with so many wrong-headed elements. We do need to reform the health insurance system in America in order to make coverage affordable and available to everyone. But, how many of us believe our federal government can manage a new program any better than the bankrupt Medicare program or the underfunded Social Security program? Both Republicans and Democrats are equally responsible for the financial mess of those two programs.

I am opposed to HB 3200 for a number of reasons. To start with, it is estimated that a federal bureaucracy of more than 150,000 new employees will be required to administer HB3200.

That is an unacceptable expansion of a government that is already too intrusive in our lives. If we are going to hire 150,000 new employees, let's put them to work protecting our borders, fighting the massive drug problem and putting more law enforcement/firefighters out there."

Other problems I have with this bill include:

Page 50/section 152: The bill will provide insurance to all non-U.S. residents, even if they are here illegally.

Page 58 and 59: The government will have real-time access to an individual's bank account and will have the authority to make electronic fund transfers from those accounts.

Page 65/section 164: The plan will be subsidized (by the government) for all union members, union retirees and for community organizations (such as the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now - ACORN).

Page 203/line 14-15: The tax imposed under this section will not be treated as a tax. (How could anybody in their right mind come up with that?)

Page 241 and 253: Doctors will all be paid the same regardless of specialty, and the government will set all doctors' fees.

Page 272. section 1145: Cancer hospital will ration care according to the patient's age.

Page 317 and 321: The government will impose a prohibition on hospital expansion; however, communities may petition for an exception.

Page 425, line 4-12: The government mandates advance-care planning consultations. Those on Social Security will be required to attend an "end-of-life planning" seminar every five years.

Page 429, line 13-25: The government will specify which doctors can write an end-of-life order."

Finally, it is specifically stated this bill will not apply to members of Congress.

Members of Congress are already exempt from the Social Security system and have a well-funded private plan that covers their retirement needs. If they were on our Social Security plan, I believe they would find a very quick "fix" to make the plan financially sound for the future."

Honorable David Kithil Marble Falls, Texas.

PLEASE PASS THIS OUTRAGE TO EVERYONE ON YOUR LIST!!! THIS should be read by everyone, especially important to those over 75.......If you are younger, then it applies to your parents.

Your hospital Medicare admittance has just change under Obama Care. You must be admitted by your primary Physician in order for Medicare to pay for it! If you are admitted by an emergency room doctor it is treated as outpatient care where hospital costs are not covered. This is only the tip of the iceberg for Obama Care. Just wait to see what happens in 2013 & 2014!

Age 76 Today, I went to the Dr. for my monthly B12 shot that I have been getting for a number of years. The nurse came and got me, got out the needle filled and ready to go then looked at the computer and got very quiet and asked if I was prepared to pay for it. I said no that my insurance takes care of it.

She said, that Medicare had turned it down and went to talk to my Dr. about it. 15 minutes later she came back and said, she was sorry but they had tried everything they could but Medicare is beginning to turn many things away for seniors because of the projected Obama Care coming in. She was brushing at tears and said, "Someday they too will get old", I am so very sorry!!

Please for the sake of many good people. . . ..be informed please . YOU ARE NOT GOING TO LIKE THIS...

Although this list is commonly attributed as originating with a letter sent to Senator Evan Bayh of Indiana by Dr. Stephen E. Fraser, an Indianapolis anesthesiologist, or as a letter sent to the River Cities Tribune by David Kithil, a former county judge in Marble Falls, Texas, it is actually the work of Peter Fleckenstein, who issued the list as a series of Tweets and posted it to his blog in July 2009.

The bill referenced in this list, America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 (H.R. 3200), was never passed by Congress. A completely different bill, the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act (H.R. 3590), became the basis for what is now known as "Obamacare." Many of the entries in the list are therefore irrelevant and outdated, as they address aspects of health care reform legislation that were never enacted by Congress (particularly the "public option" for a government insurance plan).

Virtually every statement included in this list is exaggerated, misleading, inaccurate, or outright erroneous. Detailed line-by-line debunkings of this list can be found here and here.

http://www.factcheck.org/2009/08/twenty-six-lies-about-hr-3200/

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2009/jul/30/e-mail-analysis-health-bill-needs-check-/

Edited February 24, 2013 by Flatbush Zombies

[dontlop]

flash zombies i cant believe you would even post that .. the first sentence says its false.. heres you first two sentences of your message ..

This is false and exaggerated. This has been circulating for months now.
 

[Flatbush Zombies]

flash zombies i cant believe you would even post that .. the first sentence says its false.. heres you first two sentences of your message ..

This is false and exaggerated. This has been circulating for months now.

 

What are you even talking about. The first paragraph is my response to the original post that carablum posted and the rest is the original email followed by the revised one then followed by the conclusion with links. What's your comprehension level?

[dontlop]

What are you even talking about. The first paragraph is my response to the original post that carablum posted and the rest is the original email followed by the revised one then followed by the conclusion with links. What's your comprehension level?

 

 

i  can read what you posted and i immediatly stopped reading your post after the first two sentences

Edited February 24, 2013 by Markinsa
Changed font size and color from red to brown

[Flatbush Zombies]

What's your point?????

[dontlop]

my point is liberals are proven to be liars ,,ask clinton .. (he doesnt lie any more ask him)

[Flatbush Zombies]

That's not the point here dontlop. You sound so ignorant sometimes. The point is that this email about obamacare is FALSE. end of discussion.


And Clinton lied about sex so I guess he speaks for all liberals. What about Bush and WMD's....how did that turn out? What's worse, lying about sex or lying about war to profit. Get educated because you're embarrassing yourself

Edited February 24, 2013 by Markinsa
Added warning

[dontlop]

 

That's not the point here dontlop. You sound so ignorant sometimes. The point is that this email about obamacare is FALSE. end of discussion.


And Clinton lied about sex so I guess he speaks for all liberals. What about Bush and WMD's....how did that turn out? What's worse, lying about sex or lying about war to profit. Get educated because you're embarrassing yourself

the best i can do for ya chief .. is refer you to this link >>>>  http://dinarvets.com/forums/index.php?/topic/141948-is-obama-a-pathological-liar/

[Markinsa]

Please speak to the issue, not the person.

 

-

[carlablum]

Thank you Flash Zombies, I'll send the real one back to my friend that sent me the e-mail

[Flatbush Zombies]

Thank you Flash Zombies, I'll send the real one back to my friend that sent me the e-mail

Thanks for being mature and accepting the facts. Much respect for you. Let's keep this discussion to the topic posted. I will only respond to the topic at hand.

Dontlop I'm done responding to you. This time I mean it. Seriously just some help for you and to look out for you I would suggest you fully read everything in context before you respond to anyone. It's becoming a common theme between you and other members. Cheers

[dontlop]

That's not the point here dontlop. You sound so ignorant sometimes. The point is that this email about obamacare is FALSE. end of discussion.

And Clinton lied about sex so I guess he speaks for all liberals. What about Bush and WMD's....how did that turn out? What's worse, lying about sex or lying about war to profit. Get educated because you're embarrassing yourself

i dont think  saying that you have intelligence reports  that state iraq has wmds is a lie .. especially when he handed those intelligence reports over to congress for authentication.. and the resolution to those reports is  written in joint resolution 114 ..its what congress wrote back to the president .. its not what the president wrote to congress .. you should read that document sometime ..> joint resolution 114  <<< >>>> http://usgovinfo.about.com/library/weekly/bliraqreshouse.htm

 

now i dont believe i ever heard george bush say he was spying on iraq and presented his own intelligence that iraq had wmds

 

 after une united nations security council unanamously passed  un resolution 1441 ..and  bush had full athurity to invade iraq form his congress and the united nations after 12 years of sanctions . he still  wanted more .. so  he went to george tennant .. clintons cia director .. and he asked him .. ";are you sure saddam has wmds ".. and tennant replied ..";its a slam dunk "..why would he return to tennant after he had  approval ? if he just lied and made it up to invade iraq.

 

The United Nations Security Council, in Resolution 1441 (November 8, 2002), unanimously deplored Iraq's lack of compliance with Resolution 687 (1991) on inspection, disarmament and renunciation of terrorism in Iraq, and went on to make several decisions under Chapter VII of the U.N. Charter. Resolution 687, like Resolution 1441, was adopted under Chapter VII. Chapter VII gives the Council the authority to determine the existence of a threat to the peace, breach of the peace or act of aggression, and to take action accordingly. >>>   http://www.asil.org/insigh92.cfm

 

 

who told bush about the mobile chemical weapon labs .. didnt he get fired and turn against the republican party lately

 

i do not concider bush a liar at all

 

  try this  who was calling for a change in the iraqi govt.in 1998  by signing the iraqi liberation act of 1998

 

by the way i was just joking around with your post above ..

[SgtFuryUSCZ]

***///

 

No American is going to fully understand the negative ramifications of obummerLack-o'Care

until the money actually begins coming out of THEIR pockets for it. And it will... oh, will it ever!

 

It was an epic fail by the administration and an even bigger epic fail by the SCOTUS.

[KiaKaha]

I suppose I'm naive but so long as o doesn't find a way to stay in office past this term, and *IF* the voters can get their heads out, won't the gubment be in the right hands again and can't ocare be overturned in 4 years. I mean, we only have to suck it up for 4 years, no? Or should I trade in my rose-colored glasses for a stronger, clearer rx?

 

KK

 

MADD for Heather

[respectron]

I dont trust google. Gov's control it. In response to using google to search for specifics on O'care, not trusting the info as it could be washed, rinsed and dryed by the the Gov's so you see only what they want you too see.

 

 

http://youtu.be/aFGyQRAXldI

Edited February 24, 2013 by respectron

[dog53]

We payed in all those years of hard work to pay for medicare. Now all of a sudden we are the villains because we expect what we payed for.

Medicaid is seldom even discussed by the elite bastards that run things just medicare.

All you disbelievers just wait you will be old soon enough

Then you will see that the govt has no regard for what you payed in.

They want the old to die quickly so they do not have to pay the SS.

Obama care is NOT a step up in your health care

It is a step down.

It costs more for meds

It costs more for co-pays

It costs more for treatment

Higher deductibles

It takes longer for meds to be approved

It takes longer for treatment

There is not one good thing about obama care

I run a struggling business

I pay for my wife's heath care

She suffers from rheumatoid arthritis

My business can not afford both of us health care

So I go without. I simply cant afford it.

I get sick I tough my way through it

I get a toothache I pull it myself

Now i'm told that I will be fined if I don't get health insurance

I'm not paying for something that I know I cant afford.

Yet they say this is not unconstitutional

They gonna throw me in jail.

Obamacare is not a good thing

You can belive that or not

I know cause im living it.

Edited February 24, 2013 by dog53

[divemaster5734]

Not every doctor opposed this bill.

 

One of my customers, an emergency room physician, is salivating in anticipation.

 

His ER group of doctors that has a contract with the hospital they work at are expecting the ER activity to increase at least 100%.

 

They are guarenteed a minimum fee per person treated.

 

He is expecting his yearly base to rise expoentially.

 

I was appalled by his obvious selfishness and hypocrisy.

 

Thankfully I have my VA, but that's not going to help my kids.

 

I honestly don't know what to do to help them.

[reveldog]

after this goes into effect   you will need  to pay into it   for several months  before it becomes active ,

 

you are not covered  til then