Non-believers, who are they?

[Tiffany23]

Non-believers are more educated, more tolerant and know more about "God".

Secularists make up 15% of global population, or about 1 billion people. Third in size behind Christians, Muslims. The minority but not for much longer!

In the past 20 years, numbers in the US have doubled to 15% and expected to grow as Church attendence significiantly decreases in the US

They are commonly opposed to discrimination. They have fewer objections to foreigners and homosexuals.

Atheist know more about the God they don’t believe in, than the believers themselves.

Barry Kosmin is a different kind of market researcher. His data focuses on consumers targeted by companies like Lifechurch.tv or World Overcomers Christian Church TM. The sociologist analyzes church-affiliated commercial entities, from souvenir shops to television channels and worship services.

But the most significant target of Kosmin's research is the consumer group most likely to shy away from such commercial products: secularists. "The non-religious, or Nones, hold the fastest-growing world view in the market," says Kosmin. "In the past 20 years, their numbers in the United States have doubled to 15 percent."

The director of the Institute for the Study of Secularism in Society and Culture at Trinity College in the US state of Connecticut, Kosmin is among the few researchers focused on the study of non-believers. This umbrella covers various groups including atheists, agnostics and humanists, as well as those who are simply indifferent to religion.

Secularists make up some 15 percent of the global population, or about 1 billion people. As a group, this puts them third in size behind Christians (2.3 billion) and Muslims (1.6 billion). Despite their large numbers, little is known about this group of people. Who are they? And if not religion, what do they believe in?

"Sometimes I feel like Christopher Columbus on an expedition to an unknown continent," says Kosmin. "For example, many believe that the US population is steadily becoming more religious -- but this is an optical illusion. Many evangelicals have simply become more aggressive and more political."

US Churches Losing Millions of Members

This heightened public profile may be contributing to the shrinking numbers of religious believers. Churches in the US are losing up to 1 million members every year. In Europe, secularization has advanced even further. The number of non-religious people, those who do not believe in God or any higher power, has reached approximately 40 percent in France and about 27 percent in Germany.

Until now, researchers examining religious populations have mostly come from faith-based backgrounds. The Vatican was a pioneer when it established the Secretariat for Non-Believers in order to "detect in the atheistic mind the hidden causes for the denial of God" in 1965.

But the numbers of secularists are growing. By now, non-believers have even infiltrated the churches: In a survey conducted by the Protestant Church in Germany, 3 percent of Protestants admitted that they did not believe in God. Church leaders may seek comfort in the idea that skepticism towards God is limited to Western Christian thought. China, South Korea and Japan, however, are commonly counted as being amongst the most secular countries.

Now secular researchers like Kosmin want to determine just how the religious and secularist minds differ -- and their initial findings are a surprise. While secularism was typically limited to the realm of educated, affluent and male-dominated urban societies, atheism is now spreading across much broader spectrums of society.

Opposition to the Death Penalty, War and Discrimination

So what do these increasing numbers of non-believers believe in, if not God? Sociologist Phil Zuckerman, who hopes to start a secular studies major at California's Pitzer College, says that secularists tend to be more ethical than religious people. On average, they are more commonly opposed to the death penalty, war and discrimination. And they also have fewer objections to foreigners, homosexuals, oral sex and hashish.

The most surprising insight revealed by the new wave of secular research so far is that atheists know more about the God they don't believe in than the believers themselves. This is the conclusion suggested by a 2010 Pew Research Center survey of US citizens. Even when the higher education levels of the unreligious were factored out, they proved to be better informed in matters of faith, followed by Jewish and Mormon believers.

But their knowledge doesn't seem to do them much good, since secularists rank among the least-liked groups of people in the US, falling behind even Muslims and homosexuals. In the states of South Carolina and Arkansas, those who deny the existence of a supreme being are not even permitted to hold public office.

The secularists' problem is that, unlike the religious believers, they do not have a strong organization backing them. There is no such thing as a "typical" non-believer and every society has its own version of secularism.

Germany Serves as Case Study

Germany serves as a sort of historical case study for sociologists, thanks to the distinct differences in religious tendencies between the formerly divided east and west. In the former East Germany, or German Democratic Republic (GDR), where atheism long ago shed its association with the educated classes and became a common value, it has evolved over three generations.

Nearly 67 percent of eastern Germans have no religious affiliation, compared to just 18 percent in the West. This trend isn't likely to change in the foreseeable future, since children who grew up with non-religious parents are almost certain to remain secular. The mother's beliefs have an especially significant impact on the children's belief systems.

When the GDR ended its period of religious repression, no process of re-Christianization occurred. "After the fall of the Berlin Wall, the withdrawal of a church presence in the east actually sped up," says Detlef Pollack, a professor in the sociology of religion at the University of Münster.

Ironically, the link between church and state contributed to secularization in the East, he says. Publicly funded theological professorships, military chaplaincies, and the presence of church representatives on broadcasting councils were common. As a result, public perception came to closely link authority with religion, which was seen as coming from the West.

Germany's case also counters the assumption that economic instability encourages people to embrace religion. In fact, the opposite seems to be true. The oil crisis of the 1970s, the difficult period of reunification and the recent financial crisis were all accompanied by waves of exoduses from the church. Many former Christians name Germany's church tax -- an automatic levy of 8 to 9 percent of a person's total income tax that is managed by local government tax offices and applied to all members of the Catholic and Protestant churches -- as a reason for leaving.

According to Pollack's estimates, eastern Germany may well be a trendsetter, but at some point, he predicts, at least 70 percent of people in the West will also live a secular life. Religion, though, will never disappear entirely, he says. "When supporters of the church fall into a minority, a so-called 'diaspora effect' often ensues, and the sense of unity between the scattered communities increases," he says.

Two Different Thinking Styles

Boston University's Catherine Caldwell-Harris is researching the differences between the secular and religious minds. "Humans have two cognitive styles," the psychologist says. "One type finds deeper meaning in everything; even bad weather can be framed as fate. The other type is neurologically predisposed to be skeptical, and they don't put much weight in beliefs and agency detection."

Caldwell-Harris is currently testing her hypothesis through simple experiments. Test subjects watch a film in which triangles move about. One group experiences the film as a humanized drama, in which the larger triangles are attacking the smaller ones. The other group describes the scene mechanically, simply stating the manner in which the geometric shapes are moving. Those who do not anthropomorphize the triangles, she suspects, are unlikely to ascribe much importance to beliefs. "There have always been two cognitive comfort zones," she says, "but skeptics used to keep quiet in order to stay out of trouble."

Only a small portion of secularists are as radical as the "strong atheists" championed by British evolutionary biologist and author Richard Dawkins. The majority are more likely to be indifferent to religion or mildly agnostic, according to Kosmin's analysis. There are also secular humanists, free thinkers and many other factions. "One problem of atheism research is that we simply can't agree on a unified terminology," notes Kosmin. "Every researcher thinks he is Linnaeus and invents his own labels."

Then he tells of a meeting of secular groups last year in Washington. They were planning a big demonstration. "But they couldn't even agree on a motto," he says. "It was like herding cats, straight out of a Monty Python sketch." In the end, the march was called off.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/spiegel/0,1518,777281,00.html

[Mustmoto]

oooh, this is gonna get good.

gave you a +, as the -'s are already a flyin'

[bamagirl]

The non-believer does not know more about my God than a true believer... I know God with my heart, until you accept Him you cannot understand what I'm saying. The Bible also foretold exactly what you just wrote, we are experiencing a falling away, an apostacy, we Christians knew there would be declining numbers of believers in the latter days. Thanks for trying to enlighten Tiff...

[divemaster5734]

Empty words from an empty heart.

[bamagirl]

BTW, I did not -neg you.

[Anti This Anti That]

2Th 2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,

2Th 2:2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

2Th 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

2Th 2:5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?

2Th 2:6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.

2Th 2:7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

2Th 2:8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

2Th 2:9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,

2Th 2:10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

2Th 2:11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

2Th 2:12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

[ems]

The non-believer does not know more about my God than a true believer... I know God with my heart, until you accept Him you cannot understand what I'm saying. The Bible also foretold exactly what you just wrote, we are experiencing a falling away, an apostacy, we Christians knew there would be declining numbers of believers in the latter days. Thanks for trying to enlighten Tiff...

Well put! It's time we flood Heaven with prayers on her behalf.

BTW, I didn't either! (-)

[smee2]

Great article. Numbers don't lie ... but sometimes people do. A lot of numbers are somewhat askew, as my own research for a thesis some time ago showed, in that a lot of non-believers will claim to be believers for "appearances sake" ... not wanting to incur the wrath of the believers who are friends, co-workers, relatives ...

As the article says, the perception is that religious affiliation is growing, when it is just the opposite. In part this misperception is a result of the "appearances sake" movement but in part it is because those who do have a real religious affiliation, and a real committment to their faith, are also real proselytizers, adamant not only that they are right, but that they have the right, the God-given right no less, to convert others to their own beliefs.

Now, before anyone starts removing me from their "friends" list or "negging" me or thinking I am a Godless heathen, let me assure you that is not so. I spent the first third or so of my life as a very devout Catholic, going so far as believing I had a religious calling and spending over two years in a convent first as a postulant and then as a novice. I never got to the final vows because there were too many questions the church could not answer for me and I was advised to take time in the "world" to find answers and if I chose to return I was welcome. Needless to say I did not return.

I did, however, find that I had, in my soul, some very strong and painfully beautiful beliefs, things I could not explain or rationalize, just as some Christians cannot rationalize or explain their beliefs other than to refer to biblical passages. I found my own faith and live it. So please don't consider me a bad person, I am just a believer in something I cannot explain and feel no great need to do so.

In any event, I enjoyed this article very much. I thank you for posting it Tiff ... you keep coming up with thought provoking and interesting stuff and I always enjoy reading your postings. This is, however, going to bring out those who recite bible passages to substantiate and condone their very existence. It could turn very hostile, though I realize that is not their intent ... it is just that the really political, and the really religious, tend to be really adamant that their viewpoint is the ONLY right one. Personally, I prefer tolerance, real tolerance, not just the words.

Thanks again ...

smee2

[bamagirl]

Smee that was very respectful, thanks for that. I have tolerance for people of other faiths and political views even though I am an extremely conservative Christian. I don't judge others for their way of life or think badly of others just for thinking different from me. BUT one of the things I can't tolerate is someone that is condesending and looks down on others and that is how the OP comes across to me.

[divemaster5734]

Smee that was very respectful, thanks for that. I have tolerance for people of other faiths and political views even though I am an extremely conservative Christian. I don't judge others for their way of life or think badly of others just for thinking different from me. BUT one of the things I can't tolerate is someone that is condesending and looks down on others and that is how the OP comes across to me.

Exactly.

Like in Seattle they were so eager to buy the hybrids people were paying up to $10,000 ABOVE dealer sticker just to have one sooner than their neighbors.

Pretty soon, you could see "Eat My Smug" bumper stickers on them.

And in case you happened to have somewhere to go or something to do other than "see" the wonderful environmentalists in their very cool cars, they made sure to drive at least 5 under the limit, unless it was freeway, then they never exceeded 45 MPH, so that everyone behind them could know they were oh so cool.

I completely respect anther's right to do whatever they want, but don't come off as some pompous self-righteous jerk.

They can save the condescending arrogance, they will need every ounce of that one day.

Edited November 7, 2011 by divemaster5734

[Markinsa]

adamant not only that they are right, but that they have the right, the God-given right no less, to convert others to their own beliefs.

my life as a very devout Catholic

It is probably better you didn't convert to their beliefs because the Holy Spirit is the one that does the converting. Anyone that takes credit for saving someone's soul is incorrect, God calls those to him that are his, humans are just messengers.

I've found in my life and my Christian Experience, that the Catholic Church leaves alot of questions unanswered for its members. In my Church, we have believers that have come from the Catholic Church and say the Catholic Church never told them this or that, and that makes a big difference. From my experience the Catholic Church concentrates too much on Ritual and Works, leaving out the "Saved by Faith," truth the Bible Teaches. I may not know the answers to the questions you had, but I would be willing to help you find the answers.

-

[Anti This Anti That]

Great article. Numbers don't lie ... but sometimes people do. A lot of numbers are somewhat askew, as my own research for a thesis some time ago showed, in that a lot of non-believers will claim to be believers for "appearances sake" ... not wanting to incur the wrath of the believers who are friends, co-workers, relatives ...

As the article says, the perception is that religious affiliation is growing, when it is just the opposite. In part this misperception is a result of the "appearances sake" movement but in part it is because those who do have a real religious affiliation, and a real committment to their faith, are also real proselytizers, adamant not only that they are right, but that they have the right, the God-given right no less, to convert others to their own beliefs.

Now, before anyone starts removing me from their "friends" list or "negging" me or thinking I am a Godless heathen, let me assure you that is not so. I spent the first third or so of my life as a very devout Catholic, going so far as believing I had a religious calling and spending over two years in a convent first as a postulant and then as a novice. I never got to the final vows because there were too many questions the church could not answer for me and I was advised to take time in the "world" to find answers and if I chose to return I was welcome. Needless to say I did not return.

I did, however, find that I had, in my soul, some very strong and painfully beautiful beliefs, things I could not explain or rationalize, just as some Christians cannot rationalize or explain their beliefs other than to refer to biblical passages. I found my own faith and live it. So please don't consider me a bad person, I am just a believer in something I cannot explain and feel no great need to do so.

In any event, I enjoyed this article very much. I thank you for posting it Tiff ... you keep coming up with thought provoking and interesting stuff and I always enjoy reading your postings. This is, however, going to bring out those who recite bible passages to substantiate and condone their very existence. It could turn very hostile, though I realize that is not their intent ... it is just that the really political, and the really religious, tend to be really adamant that their viewpoint is the ONLY right one. Personally, I prefer tolerance, real tolerance, not just the words.

Thanks again ...

smee2

Psa 36:1 The transgression of the wicked saith within my heart, that there is no fear of God before his eyes.

Psa 36:2 For he flattereth himself in his own eyes, until his iniquity be found to be hateful.

Psa 36:3 The words of his mouth are iniquity and deceit: he hath left off to be wise, and to do good.

Psa 36:4 He deviseth mischief upon his bed; he setteth himself in a way that is not good; he abhorreth not evil.

Isa 5:20 Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

[Nelg]

Tiffiny23, I believe your post will stir up a “hive” of discussion. Some of it will not be kind toward you. I really don’t understand the motive behind your placing the article in these forums. You know that you are going to be hit pretty hard with the negative side. Nevertheless you have started the post and should be ready to bear the consequences.

I think the researcher is correct in most of what he states about the world of secularism. In fact, I think he is being generous to “church goers.” To use an oxymoron, there are more “Christian atheist” than he generalizes. Most have been bitten with “churchanity” and attend as a way to meet people or serve the community or even make business contacts. To them, “faith” is more a self-determination than a trust in God. Defining secularism is a description of many in the houses of worship: “it is the notion that morality should be based solely on regard for the well-being of mankind in this present life.” And to this definition many churchgoers would subscribe without hesitation. Why? Because many have no idea what faith means. Most secularists and atheists know the church only under a stereotype. They see it as “big business in vestments.” Televangelism scandals. Unethical fund-raising. Hypocrisy. These things are happening. They see it as an isolated and irrelevant factor in the real world, or as a divided rivalry, or unintelligent boobs who believe anything and study nothing! And, in much of the church world, that is exactly what it is! But these are not rational argument against the Christian faith; nonetheless they disallow faith for many or drive them into the posture of unbelief.

A world that is so confused as this one will not find its way through life. It has lost its way and needs the positive direction offered by the Lord, Jesus the Christ.

Many people have rejected Christianity or a belief in any Supreme Being because they cannot conceive of anything greater than themselves.

Faith in God is an intellectual and existential matter. People’s hearts ultimately yield not to abstract argument but to the personal touches of love and kindness expressed by adherents of faith in God. An hour or two of scholarly discussion does little to elicit faith when one’s heart is broken, or their stomach is empty, or their marriage is falling apart. A long period of service by the spiritual body of Christ may be necessary.

But any social program is not a substitute for preaching and defending the gospel of Christ. Yet until people wearing the name of Christ become a living demonstration of His Presence in the world, facts and rational discussions about Christianity will be for nothing.

Ultimately you and everyone who come to faith in God will need to study the Bible or Scripture. It is the Bible, properly understood, that brings about our knowledge of faith. That faith is not in a human being, or religious group, or set of traditional doctrines, but it is faith in God.

[Markinsa]

Ultimately you and everyone who come to faith in God will need to study the Bible or Scripture. It is the Bible, properly understood, that brings about our knowledge of faith. That faith is not in a human being, or religious group, or set of traditional doctrines, but it is faith in God.

Red, Bold, Underline, & Italics for that!

[ems]

... God calls those to him that are his, humans are just messengers.

I may not know the answers to the questions you had, but I would be willing to help you find the answers.

Well stated, Mark. God does it all! He draws us to Him. He paid for our sins. He saved us despite who we are or what we've done.

I like how you've offered to help Smee2; just think how much God loves how you've offered to help her.

Well done brother.

[AoK]

"To sustain the belief that there is no God, atheism has to demonstrate infinite knowledge, which is tantamount to saying, "I have infinite knowledge that there is no being in existence with infinite knowledge" --Ravi Zacharias

“No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws them," Jn.6:44

"The fool has said in his heart,“There is no God.” Ps.14:1

“But what about you?” he asked. “Who do you say I am?” Mt.16:15

Edited November 7, 2011 by AoK

[Anti This Anti That]

http://www.drdino.com/category/type/video/creation-seminars/

[precious1]

I have recorded this insight from Dr. Peter Kreeft, professor at Boston College:

Intellectuals resist faith longer because they can: where ordinary people are helpless before the light, intellectuals are clever enough to spin webs of darkness around their minds and hide in them.

I've added a link which tried to explain is there a God. As for myself, I believe without explainations. www.everystudent.com/features/isthere.html

Edited November 7, 2011 by Markinsa
Repaired Link for Click On

[DinarBot]

Exactly.

Like in Seattle they were so eager to buy the hybrids people were paying up to $10,000 ABOVE dealer sticker just to have one sooner than their neighbors.

Pretty soon, you could see "Eat My Smug" bumper stickers on them.

And in case you happened to have somewhere to go or something to do other than "see" the wonderful environmentalists in their very cool cars, they made sure to drive at least 5 under the limit, unless it was freeway, then they never exceeded 45 MPH, so that everyone behind them could know they were oh so cool.

I completely respect anther's right to do whatever they want, but don't come off as some pompous self-righteous jerk.

They can save the condescending arrogance, they will need every ounce of that one day.

WWJD. What Would Jesus Drive.

[David68]

While everybody is entitled to their view we (the born again Christians) believe their is only one way to get to heaven. That is through the Lord Jesus Christ. While Heaven is there for everyone, and all have been given the invitation, not all will accept. Heaven is, 1st of all Gods home, then ours by invitation. When I invite people to my house I expect them to respect it and any views I may have (even if they don't agree with them). For instance, I do not allow foul language in my house, I don't allow smoking (even from my children), I don't allow people to be abused etc etc.

I am sure you get the gist of it.

Now if God invites you to his home to live asksskes you to come through his Son, Jesus, then you have to come through his Son. (I am only stating Gods word on this). Now, you can accept that or not, the decision is yours and yours alone and all Christians must accept this. Likewise, you also must accept this and decide to accept it or not. If you reject this way then you only have yourself to blame, don't you agEveryoneveyone has a choice and their choice has to be respected.

I have chose Gods way. You can choose you own!

The bible says there will be a falling away in the last days so we (Christiansalarmedt aloarmed by this but look for the blessed hope and appearing of our Lord and Saviour. The way the world is going it can't be soon enoopiniony oppinion, but God is not slack concerning his prlong sufferinggsuffering not willing that any should perish.

Please respect our view and we will respect yours.

Have a good day and if the Lord tarries, GO RV.

[DinarBot]

Exactly.

Like in Seattle they were so eager to buy the hybrids people were paying up to $10,000 ABOVE dealer sticker just to have one sooner than their neighbors.

Pretty soon, you could see "Eat My Smug" bumper stickers on them.

And in case you happened to have somewhere to go or something to do other than "see" the wonderful environmentalists in their very cool cars, they made sure to drive at least 5 under the limit, unless it was freeway, then they never exceeded 45 MPH, so that everyone behind them could know they were oh so cool.

I completely respect anther's right to do whatever they want, but don't come off as some pompous self-righteous jerk.

They can save the condescending arrogance, they will need every ounce of that one day.

DinarBot Archive: WWJD

One theory is that Jesus would drive around in an old Plymouth because “the Bible says God drove Adam and Eve out of the Garden of Eden in a Fury.”

But in Psalm 83, the Almighty clearly owns a Pontiac and a Geo. The passage urges the

Lord to “pursue your enemies with your Tempest and terrify them with your Storm.”

Perhaps God favors Dodge pickup trucks, because Moses' followers are warned not to go up a mountain “until the Ram's horn sounds a long blast.”

Some scholars insist that Jesus drove a Honda but didn't like to talk about it. As proof, they cite a verse in St. John's

gospel where Christ tells the crowd, “For I did not speak of my own Accord.”

Meanwhile, Moses rode an old British motorcycle, as evidenced by a Bible passage

declaring, “the roar of Moses' Triumph is heard in the hills.”

Joshua drove a Triumph sports car with a hole in its muffler: “Joshua's Triumph was

heard throughout the land.” And, following the Master's lead, the Apostles car-pooled in a Honda: “The Apostles were in one Accord"

Edited November 7, 2011 by DinarBot

[Believer1967]

The non-believer does not know more about my God than a true believer... I know God with my heart, until you accept Him you cannot understand what I'm saying. The Bible also foretold exactly what you just wrote, we are experiencing a falling away, an apostacy, we Christians knew there would be declining numbers of believers in the latter days. Thanks for trying to enlighten Tiff...

Very True Bama Girl. My bible clearly states that non believers just DO NOT understand God's word. "Broad is the gate to distruction, and narrow is the way to Eternal Life".

Of course, it's been that way for thousands of years. Look what Jesus delt with.

EVERY KNEE WILL BOW AND EVERY TONGUE WILL CONFESS THAT JESUS CHRIST IS LORD!!!!!! I can't recall any of my front line m,ilitary buddys ever hearing a friend being shot at, crying out "Oh Satan please save me" Nope, it's always a final cry to our GREAT GOD ALMIGHTY!!!!!!

[smee2]

Smee that was very respectful, thanks for that. I have tolerance for people of other faiths and political views even though I am an extremely conservative Christian. I don't judge others for their way of life or think badly of others just for thinking different from me. BUT one of the things I can't tolerate is someone that is condesending and looks down on others and that is how the OP comes across to me.

Condesending ... the exact word. I really find it difficult to tolerate, and I suppose I do not, those on both sides of the discussion, the believers, and the non believers, who, in their determination to try to make someone see how they believe, adopt a condesending attitude. It really turns me off. As it does with any other teachers, or those with a little power and a great need to exercise it, or even the woman in the clothing store who takes one look as I walk in and instantly feels superior to me ... condesending. Great word. We do agree on that one Bamagirl ... thanks for the response to my comment. Very respectful and not at all condesending ...

smee2

[Lorre]

Good Morning.....

I felt the need to make a post. For the most part I try to stay out of many conversations due to the Newbie status. However, I am not a Newbie when it comes to this topic. I am 4th generation ministry. I came from a long line of Faith ministers, evangelists, missionaries, etc.... I find it very interesting the comments made of this thread. I have met people from every walk of faith imaginable and have found this to be true. We are all lovers of GOD. It is my firm belief that it does not matter what religion you came from. There are many devout Catholics and I commend them. As well as all the other so called "religions" in this country. That is where God has them at this point in their lives and who are we to judge any faith. These people are awesome people who dedicate themselves to others and the Lord with whole-hardheartedness. I truly believe that Satan devised these "religions" to cause DIVISION. If people would look past the flags that they supposedly carry over their heads, and unite instead of divide, we could actually get something accomplished and be the "Bride" we are called to be. There needs to be less people in the church!!!! What are we doing there anyway??? Checking out "who wore what "this week???? Seriously!! We need to get out of our comfort zone and start doing something other than making each other feel good!!! Get off the stinking pew and do something that matters!!! Missionaries to other countries are awesome, but WE Need them here too!! Look at our homeless rate, hunger, etc.... With all the scripture that has been floating out there, it all boils down to this... They know us by our joy and "LOVE"!!!

I love the homosexual! I love the agnostic!! I love the Atheist! I love the Muslim!! ETC......

Why????

Because GOD DOES TOO!!! That does not mean I agree with their lifestyle. It means- in our love, we show them something different. Curiosity of "who we truly are". Why are we so happy? Why do we love so much? What makes us the way we are????

The Holy Spirit draws them.... It is our job to be a flood of His reflection. To show them another way through our daily walk. Not to bring condemnation. He takes care of that.

The Bible says, To him that knows to do good, and doesn't do it, to him it is a sin. If they don't know..... ????? Then who are we to judge anyone??? God isn't judging until they know better.... should we???

In our walk with the Lord we are all on different levels.... We need to respect those levels, and trust that GOD knows what he's doing!!!

LOVE!!!!! and UNITE!!!! Be World-Changers!!!

Sincerely-

P.s. GO RV!!! lol

[DinarBot]

Good Morning.....

I felt the need to make a post. For the most part I try to stay out of many conversations due to the Newbie status. However, I am not a Newbie when it comes to this topic. I am 4th generation ministry. I came from a long line of Faith ministers, evangelists, missionaries, etc.... I find it very interesting the comments made of this thread. I have met people from every walk of faith imaginable and have found this to be true. We are all lovers of GOD. It is my firm belief that it does not matter what religion you came from. There are many devout Catholics and I commend them. As well as all the other so called "religions" in this country. That is where God has them at this point in their lives and who are we to judge any faith. These people are awesome people who dedicate themselves to others and the Lord with whole-hardheartedness. I truly believe that Satan devised these "religions" to cause DIVISION. If people would look past the flags that they supposedly carry over their heads, and unite instead of divide, we could actually get something accomplished and be the "Bride" we are called to be. There needs to be less people in the church!!!! What are we doing there anyway??? Checking out "who wore what "this week???? Seriously!! We need to get out of our comfort zone and start doing something other than making each other feel good!!! Get off the stinking pew and do something that matters!!! Missionaries to other countries are awesome, but WE Need them here too!! Look at our homeless rate, hunger, etc.... With all the scripture that has been floating out there, it all boils down to this... They know us by our joy and "LOVE"!!!

I love the homosexual! I love the agnostic!! I love the Atheist! I love the Muslim!! ETC......

Why????

Because GOD DOES TOO!!! That does not mean I agree with their lifestyle. It means- in our love, we show them something different. Curiosity of "who we truly are". Why are we so happy? Why do we love so much? What makes us the way we are????

The Holy Spirit draws them.... It is our job to be a flood of His reflection. To show them another way through our daily walk. Not to bring condemnation. He takes care of that.

The Bible says, To him that knows to do good, and doesn't do it, to him it is a sin. If they don't know..... ????? Then who are we to judge anyone??? God isn't judging until they know better.... should we???

In our walk with the Lord we are all on different levels.... We need to respect those levels, and trust that GOD knows what he's doing!!!

LOVE!!!!! and UNITE!!!! Be World-Changers!!!

Sincerely-

P.s. GO RV!!! lol

DinarBot Loves Human known as "Lorre". Can you Love A DinarBot.