Gun madness, solutions and people’s movements

[Farwould]

Why are you using such sophomoric jacked up antics to divert the direction of such an important and critical discussion? I have no idea if you are pro or con gun ownership, and fortunately there aren't many like you who try to take the focus off what is truly important in this matter. I'm not sure if it's your typical approach to employ a strategy of name calling to conceal that you are at a loss for words? If so, please allow me to be the first to suggest that this is not the caliber of interaction we need in standing together as a united people in confronting the mounting threat to our constitutional freedom and liberty.

Thank You Rayzur! here here!

I know I will not be well liked in here because I dont like guns but I am trying to give you guys a good

challenge on this gun debate thing.I forgive sportfishers comment god bless him.

Heres some more facts of the holiday against guns.

Already on the news bullets from the Yeee Haaa ers boozed up and

outside shooting there weapons up into the air like yosemite sam and they come down and kill folks.

Wonder how many came down last night?

Wonder how many folks were drunk and just for a minute layed there weapons down unattended for

kids to find while they were going to the fridge for there next celebration drink?

I wonder how many fights started last night while celebrating and guns were drawn?triggers pulled?

Alcohol and guns dont mix but how many legal owners with concealed handgun permits carried them

into bars and drank with there guns loaded.Loaded people with loaded guns tisk tisk!

Its tibbit goodies like this that will get them gone even faster these days.

Every single day someone is on the news that has been killed by a gun.

Just think how many of you would shoot to kill verses how many would shoot to wound?

verses how many would not shoot at all?freeze up lock up and get shot while not pulling the trigger?

I got hundreds of good reasons not to own a gun.

I have lived more than 50 years and never owned a gun or even want one.

This is a debate I am not trying to take your guns just providing good stuff to think on why you should keep them.

You can bet our government thinks just like this and these reasons for taking your guns

so lets start to get responsible for your actions with guns or it will be you who pushes the gov over the edge

and makes that descision to take your guns for not being responsible enough to own one.

Now why should I own a gun?your turn folks!

God Bless you all.

I am going to get shredded and negged I'm sure and I just want a debate is all.

Notice I didnt call anyone any names so be nice to me please.

holds up white flag of truce!And am I the only one in this forum that doesnt like guns?figures.

[BobCoss]

Farwould,

The fact that you hate guns & choose not to have them is fine. It is the fact that you have the choice to follow your own feelings on this matter that is so vitally important. I have had friends come to my home before with weapons to fire at midnight on New Years Eve, You are right, that is just plain stupid & I told him no. Fireworks are intended for that purpose.

Two things that might change your opinion on guns. Have someone you know & trust teach you about them so that you understand them, how they work etc and actually shoot a small gun say like a 22 rifle and see how much fun target shooting can be. Might change your mind a little bit.

The other one is and I hope you never experience this one, but it is to be in a life and death situation where you need a gun and don't have one. I have been there twice and once I had one and once I didn't. I know which one I liked better.

[jonjon]

"gun-free zones," a 1999 study by John Lott and William Landes found that many mass shootings occur in places where mass killers know they will meet no resistance.

"With just one single exception, the attack on Congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords in 2011, every public shooting since at least 1950 in the U.S. in which more than three people have been killed has taken place where citizens are not allowed to carry guns," Lott said.

[Snotrocket]

Thank You Rayzur! here here!

I know I will not be well liked in here because I dont like guns but I am trying to give you guys a good

challenge on this gun debate thing.I forgive sportfishers comment god bless him.

Heres some more facts of the holiday against guns.

Already on the news bullets from the Yeee Haaa ers boozed up and

outside shooting there weapons up into the air like yosemite sam and they come down and kill folks.

Wonder how many came down last night?

Wonder how many folks were drunk and just for a minute layed there weapons down unattended for

kids to find while they were going to the fridge for there next celebration drink?

I wonder how many fights started last night while celebrating and guns were drawn?triggers pulled?

Alcohol and guns dont mix but how many legal owners with concealed handgun permits carried them

into bars and drank with there guns loaded.Loaded people with loaded guns tisk tisk!

Its tibbit goodies like this that will get them gone even faster these days.

Every single day someone is on the news that has been killed by a gun.

Just think how many of you would shoot to kill verses how many would shoot to wound?

verses how many would not shoot at all?freeze up lock up and get shot while not pulling the trigger?

I got hundreds of good reasons not to own a gun.

I have lived more than 50 years and never owned a gun or even want one.

This is a debate I am not trying to take your guns just providing good stuff to think on why you should keep them.

You can bet our government thinks just like this and these reasons for taking your guns

so lets start to get responsible for your actions with guns or it will be you who pushes the gov over the edge

and makes that descision to take your guns for not being responsible enough to own one.

Now why should I own a gun?your turn folks!

God Bless you all.

I am going to get shredded and negged I'm sure and I just want a debate is all.

Notice I didnt call anyone any names so be nice to me please.

holds up white flag of truce!And am I the only one in this forum that doesnt like guns?figures.

Hey Power Generation... why the username change? I've missed your lefty rants

good to see you back, PG

[dog53]

Hey Power Generation... why the username change? I've missed your lefty rants

good to see you back, PG

hahahahaha now why didnt I see that. Your good snot. real good. Yep I should have known there couldnt be more then one that messed up. hahaha kinda like OKIE. There can be only one.

[Snotrocket]

hahahahaha now why didnt I see that. Your good snot. real good. Yep I should have known there couldnt be more then one that messed up. hahaha kinda like OKIE. There can be only one.

[Rayzur]

!

I know I will not be well liked in here because I dont like guns but I am trying to give you guys a good

challenge on this gun debate thing.

Heres some more facts of the holiday against guns.

Already on the news bullets from the Yeee Haaa ers boozed up and

outside shooting there weapons up into the air like yosemite sam and they come down and kill folks.

Wonder how many came down last night?

Wonder how many folks were drunk and just for a minute layed there weapons down unattended for

kids to find while they were going to the fridge for there next celebration drink?

I wonder how many fights started last night while celebrating and guns were drawn?triggers pulled?

Alcohol and guns dont mix but how many legal owners with concealed handgun permits carried them

into bars and drank with there guns loaded.Loaded people with loaded guns tisk tisk!

Its tibbit goodies like this that will get them gone even faster these days.

Every single day someone is on the news that has been killed by a gun.

Just think how many of you would shoot to kill verses how many would shoot to wound?

verses how many would not shoot at all?freeze up lock up and get shot while not pulling the trigger?

I got hundreds of good reasons not to own a gun.

I have lived more than 50 years and never owned a gun or even want one.

This is a debate I am not trying to take your guns just providing good stuff to think on why you should keep them.

You can bet our government thinks just like this and these reasons for taking your guns

so lets start to get responsible for your actions with guns or it will be you who pushes the gov over the edge

and makes that descision to take your guns for not being responsible enough to own one.

Now why should I own a gun?your turn folks!

FarWould.... is that really you PG? If so... good to see you... And either way

Its always good to have thoughtful counter opinions respectfully given. It gives people a chance to see how others are thinking, and what the bottom line issue is or is not. Often times, I think its a matter of misunderstanding what the issue really is... And you're probably right that many in the government might think the way you do, and I respectfully have a real problem with that level and kind of thinking... So allow me to return the favor in giving you some things to think about....

Human directed violence with guns is NOT a problem with guns. It is a problem with video games that induct our kids at a young age, with developing brains, who are being hard wired to win by human directed violence with guns. The more prevalent and violent the games, the more we wire our kids to imitate. Autistic Spectrum Disorders are increasing to the rate of 1:100, compounding the isolation experienced by these youngsters, is playing violent games hard wiring their neurophysiology to win by using violence to kill people.

That notwithstanding.... FarWould, this is an attack on our constitution. For that, you have to stand with the rest of us in protecting the sanctity of that document as the foundation to who we are as a country. If you are PG, you swore an oath to protect our constitution, and this country against all enemies foreign and domestic. Once a soldier, always a soldier, unless you never were in the first place, and I don't think that is true of you. This is not about you or I liking or wanting to own a firearm, this about the constitutional right to bear arms, and that distinguishes this country from most of the rest in the world. There is a reason we are great as a nation and this is a foundational piece of that. And if this truly is an agenda like that published in the post by JonJon, then all the more reason to stand together in protecting the liberties and freedoms of the constitution.

FarWould, lots of things bring about violent death. Car accidents, yet we don't ban them, alcohol use around dangerous machines, yet we don't ban alcohol or the machines, I think at present accidents it the number one killer of people uhmm like under the age of 35 or something, yet we don't ban snow mobiles, skis, stairs, nail guns, ladders, vending machines or the thousands of other things that kill people. AND, and this is very important, none of those aforementioned things are a stated right guaranteed by our Constitution... the right to bear arms is... FarWould, you may not see a reason to own a gun, but don't deprive me of that right,.... as one day mine might be the one protecting your tail...

Once you as people have been manipulated into messing with the foundational rights of our constitution... what stops that infringement from going further... I would guess the 1st amendment would be the next target..... And oh, most interesting that the first amendment targeted (2nd), is the one that would most likely ensure all the rest remain intact as granted by our forefathers. I personally don't like the KKK yet, I will protect their right to assemble as granted in the constitution. I personally don't agree much with the Nazi movement in this country, but I will stand with others in protecting their right to speak and march in parades and whatever else civil action they take. I am personally against religious groups that play and pay heavy into politics, however I will stand in protecting that right as it is a right granted by our constitution.

And even all that notwithstanding, research and experience shows us that an attempt to restrict something such as this, simply does not work. We did a little experiment in this country years back in the attempt to ban alcohol as the root of all evil. The use of alcohol didn't cease in any sense of the word, and in fact made more than a few families extremely rich, providing it to those who wanted to continue drinking. We have spent millions in the attempt to ban something as simple as marijuana, again as an evil.. and there are more people smoking it today than there were 5 years ago.... and its made more than a few families extremely rich providing it... Same with drugs like cocaine or heroin... its all over the place ... and has made more than a few cartels extremely rich... not to mention at one time was so lucrative, it funded a lot of cia work... AND none of those banned things were a guaranteed right granted us by the constitution... yet people continues ownership and use. Why would anyone attack a constitutional right and think it will somehow work???

FarWould if you treasure being a citizen of the US of America, then you need to stand with the rest of us on the principles granted by our constitution. Doing anything less, supports our country being diminished and deteriorating into something far less than the magnificent land of the free it is today. It is that simple. We are not talking about a permissive convenience, or owning one more thing like all the other things we own..... We are talking about the foundation of this country, and your allegiance to protecting that. Don't for one second let anyone run squirrels through your brain and try to convince you it is anything other than that, plain and simple.

So my counter reply? Why would you breach the foundation of the constitution in attacking this cornerstone amendment, and deprive me of my right to bear arms? Especially when that is not the source of the problem with violence directed toward humans with guns.... Your turn...

[Farwould]

To start with I want to thank you folks for being civil in this debate.

I typed in this power genration person into the search bar to see who he was and got no response.

I am not this person.

Bob Coss thank you for your response.

in a life or death situation I still would'nt need a gun I am prepared to die for our lord or to take one

as you would say for anyone else so that they could live.its called faith.If I was a robber and I knew

that you had a gun yep you probably would get shot first then took what I wanted plus your gun.

if that same robber knew I didnt have a gun and was willing to cooperate and give him what he wanted

my chances of living would be greater than the folks that had a gun on them.Some still would shoot me because

I would be a witness in his case if he were to be caught and brought to justice.

Rayzur thank you for your response.

That worthless piece of paper called the constitution is just that worthless.Laws were made for the poor not for the rich.

rich folks,movie stars,politicians,etc.they dont have to comply to any laws of the constitution they have that good

ole lobby money and kick back money to just pay off any crimes against the people.to start freedom of speech

yeah right! So I could go to the whitehouse with a picket sign that said Get the Fudge out obama you suk what would happen

to me thats right you guessed it I would get arrested for freedom of speech.If I stood at the whitehouse yelling out

all of the 10 commandments and held a picket sign I would get arrested.No.2 right to bear arms which would mean for you to

carry arms on your person for protection,hunting or just to carry them no reason needed.It sure is funny how come only

certain folks apply for automatic weapons permits get to have them instead of anyone can own them?Its a arm right?

The rich can own them and the poor get cap guns.Politicians wrote the constitution in favor of the rich not for the common

man or woman.Politicians threw out the ten commandments on capital hill not the WE THE PEOPLE.

Its time to level the playing field folks if you cant own guns they cant either fair is fair.You guys have waited to long

to make your stand for guns.The wicked outweigh the good anyone can see this.Our justice system only works for the rich.

Its a shame heavyduty had to post to warn folks of religeous content in his post because of the wicked who WOULD bash him for it.

You have to know they will pass the law banning assault weapons.Its gonna happen folks.So when you folks resist that

law who are you going to shoot to overturn this law?The folks that have no guns or the ones with guns that will be pointing

them at you to take your guns?My guess the military will come for you.If you hide them and they find them is it worth

many years in jail if your poor?You can bet the rich will have guns and if there caught they can pay the judges a fine

and then turn right back around and buy another one and from whom will they get another one?I apologize rayzur but the

constitution is not a good defense to use for the justification of guns.If a gun was the constitution it would be the most crooked gun

and would never shoot straight.The police are trying to level the playing field because once you run out of ammo they can grab you

but not if you are carrying clips of high capacity.try loading a revolver fast they can get to you.its for the good of man to get rid

of assault rifles.Now I do disagree with the price you paid for one they should give you cash for what you paid for it in return.

There are alot of reasons to not owning a gun verses the reasons to keep one.

I am not a lefty! I am a republican,I own a business with multiple employees.If obama keeps things the way they are

I wont be in business for long.Your turn rayzur and thank you.

[dog53]

FarWould.... is that really you PG? If so... good to see you... And either way

Its always good to have thoughtful counter opinions respectfully given. It gives people a chance to see how others are thinking, and what the bottom line issue is or is not. Often times, I think its a matter of misunderstanding what the issue really is... And you're probably right that many in the government might think the way you do, and I respectfully have a real problem with that level and kind of thinking... So allow me to return the favor in giving you some things to think about....

Human directed violence with guns is NOT a problem with guns. It is a problem with video games that induct our kids at a young age, with developing brains, who are being hard wired to win by human directed violence with guns. The more prevalent and violent the games, the more we wire our kids to imitate. Autistic Spectrum Disorders are increasing to the rate of 1:100, compounding the isolation experienced by these youngsters, is playing violent games hard wiring their neurophysiology to win by using violence to kill people.

That notwithstanding.... FarWould, this is an attack on our constitution. For that, you have to stand with the rest of us in protecting the sanctity of that document as the foundation to who we are as a country. If you are PG, you swore an oath to protect our constitution, and this country against all enemies foreign and domestic. Once a soldier, always a soldier, unless you never were in the first place, and I don't think that is true of you. This is not about you or I liking or wanting to own a firearm, this about the constitutional right to bear arms, and that distinguishes this country from most of the rest in the world. There is a reason we are great as a nation and this is a foundational piece of that. And if this truly is an agenda like that published in the post by JonJon, then all the more reason to stand together in protecting the liberties and freedoms of the constitution.

FarWould, lots of things bring about violent death. Car accidents, yet we don't ban them, alcohol use around dangerous machines, yet we don't ban alcohol or the machines, I think at present accidents it the number one killer of people uhmm like under the age of 35 or something, yet we don't ban snow mobiles, skis, stairs, nail guns, ladders, vending machines or the thousands of other things that kill people. AND, and this is very important, none of those aforementioned things are a stated right guaranteed by our Constitution... the right to bear arms is... FarWould, you may not see a reason to own a gun, but don't deprive me of that right,.... as one day mine might be the one protecting your tail...

Once you as people have been manipulated into messing with the foundational rights of our constitution... what stops that infringement from going further... I would guess the 1st amendment would be the next target..... And oh, most interesting that the first amendment targeted (2nd), is the one that would most likely ensure all the rest remain intact as granted by our forefathers. I personally don't like the KKK yet, I will protect their right to assemble as granted in the constitution. I personally don't agree much with the Nazi movement in this country, but I will stand with others in protecting their right to speak and march in parades and whatever else civil action they take. I am personally against religious groups that play and pay heavy into politics, however I will stand in protecting that right as it is a right granted by our constitution.

And even all that notwithstanding, research and experience shows us that an attempt to restrict something such as this, simply does not work. We did a little experiment in this country years back in the attempt to ban alcohol as the root of all evil. The use of alcohol didn't cease in any sense of the word, and in fact made more than a few families extremely rich, providing it to those who wanted to continue drinking. We have spent millions in the attempt to ban something as simple as marijuana, again as an evil.. and there are more people smoking it today than there were 5 years ago.... and its made more than a few families extremely rich providing it... Same with drugs like cocaine or heroin... its all over the place ... and has made more than a few cartels extremely rich... not to mention at one time was so lucrative, it funded a lot of cia work... AND none of those banned things were a guaranteed right granted us by the constitution... yet people continues ownership and use. Why would anyone attack a constitutional right and think it will somehow work???

FarWould if you treasure being a citizen of the US of America, then you need to stand with the rest of us on the principles granted by our constitution. Doing anything less, supports our country being diminished and deteriorating into something far less than the magnificent land of the free it is today. It is that simple. We are not talking about a permissive convenience, or owning one more thing like all the other things we own..... We are talking about the foundation of this country, and your allegiance to protecting that. Don't for one second let anyone run squirrels through your brain and try to convince you it is anything other than that, plain and simple.

So my counter reply? Why would you breach the foundation of the constitution in attacking this cornerstone amendment, and deprive me of my right to bear arms? Especially when that is not the source of the problem with violence directed toward humans with guns.... Your turn...

Yeah lots a luck with that razor. You would have better luck talking to a stump. hahahaha

Just read his response

[dog53]

To start with I want to thank you folks for being civil in this debate.

I typed in this power genration person into the search bar to see who he was and got no response.

I am not this person.

Bob Coss thank you for your response.

in a life or death situation I still would'nt need a gun I am prepared to die for our lord or to take one

as you would say for anyone else so that they could live.its called faith.If I was a robber and I knew

that you had a gun yep you probably would get shot first then took what I wanted plus your gun.

if that same robber knew I didnt have a gun and was willing to cooperate and give him what he wanted

my chances of living would be greater than the folks that had a gun on them.Some still would shoot me because

I would be a witness in his case if he were to be caught and brought to justice.

Rayzur thank you for your response.

That worthless piece of paper called the constitution is just that worthless.Laws were made for the poor not for the rich.

rich folks,movie stars,politicians,etc.they dont have to comply to any laws of the constitution they have that good

ole lobby money and kick back money to just pay off any crimes against the people.to start freedom of speech

yeah right! So I could go to the whitehouse with a picket sign that said Get the Fudge out obama you suk what would happen

to me thats right you guessed it I would get arrested for freedom of speech.If I stood at the whitehouse yelling out

all of the 10 commandments and held a picket sign I would get arrested.No.2 right to bear arms which would mean for you to

carry arms on your person for protection,hunting or just to carry them no reason needed.It sure is funny how come only

certain folks apply for automatic weapons permits get to have them instead of anyone can own them?Its a arm right?

The rich can own them and the poor get cap guns.Politicians wrote the constitution in favor of the rich not for the common

man or woman.Politicians threw out the ten commandments on capital hill not the WE THE PEOPLE.

Its time to level the playing field folks if you cant own guns they cant either fair is fair.You guys have waited to long

to make your stand for guns.The wicked outweigh the good anyone can see this.Our justice system only works for the rich.

Its a shame heavyduty had to post to warn folks of religeous content in his post because of the wicked who WOULD bash him for it.

You have to know they will pass the law banning assault weapons.Its gonna happen folks.So when you folks resist that

law who are you going to shoot to overturn this law?The folks that have no guns or the ones with guns that will be pointing

them at you to take your guns?My guess the military will come for you.If you hide them and they find them is it worth

many years in jail if your poor?You can bet the rich will have guns and if there caught they can pay the judges a fine

and then turn right back around and buy another one and from whom will they get another one?I apologize rayzur but the

constitution is not a good defense to use for the justification of guns.If a gun was the constitution it would be the most crooked gun

and would never shoot straight.The police are trying to level the playing field because once you run out of ammo they can grab you

but not if you are carrying clips of high capacity.try loading a revolver fast they can get to you.its for the good of man to get rid

of assault rifles.Now I do disagree with the price you paid for one they should give you cash for what you paid for it in return.

There are alot of reasons to not owning a gun verses the reasons to keep one.

I am not a lefty! I am a republican,I own a business with multiple employees.If obama keeps things the way they are

I wont be in business for long.Your turn rayzur and thank you.

On-line dementia test.

http://www.mybraintest.org/online-memory-screening-tests/

[bamagirl]

Hey Power Generation... why the username change? I've missed your lefty rants ;)/>

good to see you back, PG

Ah hah... Jules gets a cookie!!!

[Farwould]

On-line dementia test.

http://www.mybraintest.org/online-memory-screening-tests/

Hey dog that was a good test but I passed it.That was funny too.

your friend Stumpy.

[Farwould]

Replying to Gun Madness yup folks are going to be mad when they try to come fer yer guns.

Solutions?Arm everyone and let each one of you to decide who's life to take or creatures life to take

to justify your conscience of feeling safe and secure for owning a gun.Having a weapon for hunting for food

for your family to survive on.To overthrow the government in case of tyranny or special groups like gangs.

Prior to ownership of a weapon:

Mandatory training on safe weapon operations and muzzle awareness training.

Full physciatric evaluation for each person who wants to own a weapon.(guess that leaves me out)>stump

For each weapon purchased a lock should come with them.

If your going to carry a weapon it should'nt be concealed so that law obiding citizens and police forces

can see them for safety purposes.meaning if your legal you dont have anything to hide.carry them

just as the police do in flap holsters with a snap on your sides.

Set stiff penalties for folks that dont want to comply with gun ownership laws

remove all reloading equipment and manufacture bullets with bar coding capabilities installed in bullets

for easy identification of that bullet so responsibilty of that bullet can be traced to ownership.

For every bullet sold you as owners will be responsible for each and every round used.

Televised execution for folks who takes another persons life without proof they were in danger of there life

being taken.robbery,murder etc.This would give the crimminals something to think about before they shoot someone.

All executions to be followed out right after there do justice in court instead of sitting in jails for years at taxpayers

expense wanting appeals trying to justify why they did it.

And after each crime commited a polygraph would be given to the shooter or in case of accidental shooting

and could be used in court.Even God said send them to me which means for crimes of murder execute them and

send them to me for final judgement.

These are just a few ways I can see you guys owning a weapon and even I would be satisfied if these things

were done before ownership of any weapon meaning guns,rifles.

As long as you were legal you would not have to worry about going across state lines with your weapons

pass laws to make this so.See there are ways to own a gun and as responsible adults could see this just could work out

for your ownership of a gun.I guess I should be ashamed of myself for wanting everyone to live and be safe.

And peoples movements I just had one.I cant believe I just wrote this for you guys and gals I hate guns.

But I have to be fair and unjust even if it is for a gun.Is this fair Rayzur?

God Bless You All.

[Rayzur]

Rayzur thank you for your response.

That worthless piece of paper called the constitution is just that worthless.Laws were made for the poor not for the rich.

With all respect due, the fact you see the Constitution to be a worthless piece of paper, suggests you might not have a good handle as to what is stands for and what is at stake here.

The constitution does not establish "laws" as you put it. Nor does it serve as some kind of penal code elaborating which laws when broken have a specified legal consequence...

Perhaps it might be helpful to discuss what (very basically) what the Constitution does and does not do.

The founding fathers established the Constitution to do just two things:

• Establish a federal government for the United States of America
• Delegate to the federal government certain, limited (and enumerated) powers.

1. The federal government created by the states, via the Constitution, exists to serve the states. Until the states delegated some powers to the new federal government, those powers belonged to the states.

The ARTICLES and their subsequent Sections specify the establishment of the government, discussing its structure, composition and relationship between the bodies of the structure and between the structure and the states it represents.

The Amendments

The first ten amendments to the Constitution were all adopted at the same time and are collectively known as the

Bill of Rights.

The

1st Amendment protects the people's right to practice religion, to speak freely, to assemble (meet), to address (petition) the government, and of the press to publish.

The

2nd Amendment protects the right to own guns. There is debate whether this is a right that protects the state, or a right that protects individuals.

The

3rd Amendment guarantees that the army cannot force homeowners to give them room and board.

The

4th Amendment protects the people from the government improperly taking property, papers, or people, without a valid warrant based on probable cause (good reason).

The

5th Amendment protects people from being held for committing a crime unless they are properly indicted, that they may not be tried twice for the same crime, that you need not be forced to testify against yourself, and from property being taken without just compensation. It also contains due process guarantees.

The

6th Amendment guarantees a speedy trial, an impartial jury, that the accused can confront witnesses against them, and that the accused must be allowed to have a lawyer.

The

7th Amendment guarantees a jury trial in federal civil court cases. This type of case is normally no longer heard in federal court.

The

8th Amendment guarantees that punishments will be fair, and not cruel, and that extraordinarily large fines will not be set.

The

9th Amendment is simply a statement that other rights aside from those listed may exist, and just because they are not listed doesn't mean they can be violated.

The

10th Amendment is the subject of some debate, but essentially it states that any power not granted to the federal government belongs to the states or to the people. See the Federalism Topic Page for more information.

The Constitution does not give you rights,... these rights are presumed to be God given..... however the Constitution protects those rights, with the expectation that the federal government, which was created to serve the states, will not infringe upon those rights given by God to all men and women of this country, the United States of America.

Rich folks,movie stars,politicians,etc.they dont have to comply to any laws of the constitution they have that good

ole lobby money and kick back money to just pay off any crimes against the people

The Constitution has nothing to do with who can or can't afford a better defense in the event you break the law. Rich people can probably hire better attorneys, but that has nothing to do with the God given rights protected by the Constitution.

to start freedom of speech yeah right! So I could go to the whitehouse with a picket sign that said Get the Fudge out obama you suk what would happen to me? Thats right you guessed it I would get arrested for freedom of speech.

You as an individual will not be arrested for infringing upon the Constitutionally protected God given right to free speech. I'm not even sure how you are wiring that together... The federal or state would be held liable for infringing on your right to free speech. To be clear, there is no law specified in the Constitution in the first place (as such per se) and you will not ever be arrested for exercising the rights protected by the Constitution.

If I stood at the whitehouse yelling out all of the 10 commandments and held a picket sign I would get arrested.

Perhaps because you were standing in front of the White House and if you were disruptive to the point of being perceived as a threat to National Security, they may haul you off to the psych ward. If you however stood in front of my house yelling the 10 commandments with a picket, and you were peaceably assembling like they do all over this country... you have the right to free speech.... People picket all kinds of places and shout all kinds of things... and they do it for days on end... The White House will always be the subject of scrutinized security in terms of what is taking place around it.

No.2 right to bear arms which would mean for you to carry arms on your person for protection,hunting or just to carry them no reason needed.

Constitution protects the God given right to own guns. It doesn't specify whether or not you walk around with them on your hip or slung over your back, in the rack in the truck or otherwise. That is a State's right to determine and it is not the place of the Federal government serving the states to make that call for the state.

It sure is funny how come only certain folks apply for automatic weapons permits get to have them instead of anyone can own them?Its a arm right?

No idea which people you mean, but the granting of any kind of permit, if there is even a need for a permit, is determined by the State. This is a State's right to determine, and the laws between states can be and are quite different. In some states there is no requirement for a permit, and anyone can own as many as they want, without any kind of permit. Other states have determined this doesn't work for them and they require permits. This is a State;s issue and not a Constitutional issue.

The rich can own them and the poor get cap guns.Politicians wrote the constitution in favor of the rich not for the common

man or woman.

Again the Constitution has nothing to do with enforceable laws written for the individual, and instead specifies limited and enumerated powers of the Federal Government. It has nothing to do with rich or poor people. And in any case, you get to choose what you want to do with your money and if buying and owning a gun is your choice, then the constitution protects that right of ownership.

Politicians threw out the ten commandments on capital hill not the WE THE PEOPLE.

I believe it was the Bible that first advocated the separation of church and state, long before the Constitution was written, However the Constitution protects the God given right to worship God as you see fit.

Its time to level the playing field folks if you cant own guns they cant either fair is fair.

Not everyone owns a Jag and a house on the ocean beach, but I'm telling you right now brother, I am not giving up either one just to level some day'um playing field cause someone else don't own one. Fair is indeed fair and I personally don't care what anyone else has, that's up to them as individuals.

You guys have waited to long to make your stand for guns.

I don't know about anyone else, I am making a stand to uphold the God given rights to protect the constitution.

The wicked outweigh the good anyone can see this.Our justice system only works for the rich.

Which has nothing to do with standing up in defense of the Constitution, other than to say, the Constitution protects all people from infringement on God given rights. This is not the same as saying the Constitution says everyone should be equally defended in a court of law for breaking a law. If you don't break em, you won't have to worry about how to pay for defense.

Its a shame heavyduty had to post to warn folks of religeous content in his post because of the wicked who WOULD bash him for it.

You have to know they will pass the law banning assault weapons.

So what you are telling me, is that the legislators don't have and never had any interest in actually solving the problem of human directed violence with a gun, and this has all been about simply taking away the Constitutionally protected God given right to own them? If legislators really wanted to solve the problem of human directed violence with a gun, they would ban the manufacture of video games children win by using of human directed violence with a gun, and which children play for hours on end, day in and out all over this country.

its gonna happen folks.So when you folks resist that law who are you going to shoot to overturn this law?

I see no one advocating the shooting of others in order to overturn what you believe will be law.

The folks that have no guns or the ones with guns that will be pointing them at you to take your guns? ???

My guess the military will come for you.

Apparently you have not been staying abreast of these type conversations among military and vets.

If you hide them and they find them is it worth many years in jail if your poor? You can bet the rich will have guns and if there caught they can pay the judges a fine

Uhmmm you have been watching too many wise guy movies, the rich will hire exceptional criminal defense attorneys who will have a more likely probability of getting a not guilty verdict.

and then turn right back around and buy another one and from whom will they get another one?

Well ya might have a good point there. If guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns, so unless the rich person has some credible contacts with the criminal element, not sure how they will get another one.

I apologize rayzur but the constitution is not a good defense to use for the justification of guns.

I am not using the Constitution to defend a justification for guns. I am defending the God given right protected by the Constitution to own guns, along with the 9 other Constitutional Bill of Rights, protecting God given freedoms and liberties.

If a gun was the constitution it would be the most crooked gun and would never shoot straight.

the right to bear arms is in the Constitution. So not sure about where you "if" fits in here.

The police are trying to level the playing field

The police and sheriff departments are not the ones advocating this. It is the federal legislators who are jumping on this band wagon of ineffective hysteria.

because once you run out of ammo they can grab you

but not if you are carrying clips of high capacity.try loading a revolver fast they can get to you

Apparently you have never had to qualify with a revolver, while being timed.... you use speed loaders

.its for the good of man to get rid of assault rifles.

The oath is to protect the constitution and country against ALL enemies, foreign AND domestic. Protecting yourself against a government who breaches the intentions of its creation by depriving citizens of their God given rights, demands the ability to retain arms on par with that of the government.

Now I do disagree with the price you paid for one they should give you cash for what you paid for it in return.

There are alot of reasons to not owning a gun verses the reasons to keep one.

With all respect due, I do not in here see one credible reason given for destroying the God given right to own a gun if that is your choice to do so. I honestly don't see one reason in here given as to why gun ownership should be illegal. Understood that some people would rather not own any type of gun and that is their choice. I don't see any compelling argument against another person retaining that right.

I am not a lefty! I am a republican,

And as many of us have stated, this is a Constitutional argument, not a debate of political affiliation. The lines are not nearly as clearly drawn as some would hope to have you believe. And you do a nice job of affirming that this is not about liberals versus conservatives in the political sense, and its best not to attack on those lines thereby alienating those with whom you will stand in taking a stand.

I own a business with multiple employees.If obama keeps things the way they are I wont be in business for long.Your turn rayzur and thank you.

Hope things will turn around and be more positive for you very soon. It is difficult for so many, and it important we keep a clear head and focused mind in discerning that which challenges us in the days to come.

Thanks for the reply FarWould..... Your Serve

[Farwould]

God given rights?I must have missed that chapter.

James 2:10-11For whoever shall keep the whole law and yet stumble in one point he is guilty of all.

For he who said do not commit adultery also said do not murder,Now if you do not

commit adultery but you DO murder,you have become a transgressor of the law.

God gave us commandments and one of those was thou shall not kill.

James 2:6 But you have dishonered the poor man.Do not the rich oppress you and

drag you into the courts?

Shows its easy for the rich man to defeat the poor because of money not the law.

Man will judge you on his laws but god will judge him on gods laws which are his commandments.

I wonder who will win?

I THOUGHT a burglar was going to harm me and my family so I killed him because I am scared of my own flesh

of little faith.God would have punished him for there crimes against you but you punished him instead.

Job let the soldiers kill his family and all of his livestock and did nothing to stop them.

He was rewarded everything back 10 fold because of his faith in god.not faith in the flesh.

when they come for your guns what shall you do?

say it was your god given right to kill them because they wanted your guns or any other possesions?

I know alot of men and women died to bring us that constitution I am not heartless.

I would love to see how we the people will stop our own government from taking away your rights.

A war for your rights to keep your guns.Is it worth so many deaths just to keep a gun?innocent folks will die as well

that dont even own a gun.Our own government will stop at nothing to get what they want because of the PTB

who control the money.These powers are scared of being killed because they know they are going to piss us off

for profit and then who shall we seek for revenge?God Bless all those who died for our country.

And God Bless all those who are about to die for this country.

[Rayzur]

God given rights?I must have missed that chapter.

Its in the same chapter you apparently missed regarding the origin and purpose of the USA Constitution....

The first 10 Amendments (referred to as the Bill of Rights) were those rights assumed by the framers of the Constitution to be rights granted by God, or God given rights afforded all men (and women). The Constitution itself does not give those rights. It protects those rights as given by God.

Its that same Constitution that protects your right to believe in and worship your God as you choose. That piece of paper you initially called worthless protects you from a government coming in and saying you can not believe what you just stated your belief to be.

Farwould with all respect due, your arguments seem to move all over the page. You also use extreme examples as a paper tiger to dispute or take down. No one is talking about the right to kill other people. If someone is in your house while you are in your house, (its not called burglary, its called robbery).. And if you want to take the extreme road and kill someone who is stealing your stuff... that is an individual choice and has nothing to do with the Constitution. Personally I would only shoot to defend the lives of myself or others... but again that is a personal choice.

And using your extreme example, to further that point, I have always said, its not so much that I fear someone coming in an immediately shooting us all dead.... its all the brutalizing stuff they do between breaking in and slowly killing one's family in front of you, that I could not nor will not tolerate. And no I don't want to ever experience the death of my family by an intruder.... but my point is, its all the sadistic torture, rape, and insane power needs playing out in front of me toward my family that I could not withstand. I would never ever be able to forgive myself for not doing everything in my power to protect those I love and myself from this cruelty.

Farwould, you are likely a better man than I, as I could not forgive myself for allowing that. I have no desire to live the life of Job, and thank God that God has not asked me to. I would probably fail miserably. If that is your calling and you can live with the consequences of your actions in the event your family is tortured and brutalized in front of you before they die, and you nonetheless can forgive yourself and the other for committing such horrendous acts, then then you are a better man than I in your ability to live without guilt in forgiving yourself and the other.

Again, please don't misunderstand or distort what is stated to be a God given right as protected by the Constitution in the eyes of the framers. Nothing is ever stated about the right to kill and its not mentioned anywhere in the Constitution. You also seem to believe there will be a war in this country over the right to bear arms, and if that is your belief, then it can only mean that the government has declared war on the states and its citizens. Do you really believe the government will declare war against the American people? And in doing so, I guess you would have to ask the government how many lives are worth taking in order to breach or distort the protected rights that serve as the very foundation defining this country. FarWould, many of us have taken the oath to defend this country against all enemies foreign and domestic. Many of us have fought in wars to protect the basic foundation and rights defining this country. I'm not sure at what point you would break your word, but many that is not an option.

Meantime, why do you keep focusing upon guns? That is not the source of the problem of human directed violence. The problem is video games in which we hardwire kids brains to connect winning with human directed violence in killing as many humans as possible to win or increase our winning score. Can you tell me why is this so hard for people to understand... its the video games... and why they ignore the obvious only to return to talking about the symptom of guns, and not the source being these games?

Dog... forgive me.. I can't stop myself

[dog53]

Its in the same chapter you apparently missed regarding the origin and purpose of the USA Constitution....

The first 10 Amendments (referred to as the Bill of Rights) were those rights assumed by the framers of the Constitution to be rights granted by God, or God given rights afforded all men (and women). The Constitution itself does not give those rights. It protects those rights as given by God.

Its that same Constitution that protects your right to believe in and worship your God as you choose. That piece of paper you initially called worthless protects you from a government coming in and saying you can not believe what you just stated your belief to be.

Farwould with all respect due, your arguments seem to move all over the page. You also use extreme examples as a paper tiger to dispute or take down. No one is talking about the right to kill other people. If someone is in your house while you are in your house, (its not called burglary, its called robbery).. And if you want to take the extreme road and kill someone who is stealing your stuff... that is an individual choice and has nothing to do with the Constitution. Personally I would only shoot to defend the lives of myself or others... but again that is a personal choice.

And using your extreme example, to further that point, I have always said, its not so much that I fear someone coming in an immediately shooting us all dead.... its all the brutalizing stuff they do between breaking in and slowly killing one's family in front of you, that I could not nor will not tolerate. And no I don't want to ever experience the death of my family by an intruder.... but my point is, its all the sadistic torture, rape, and insane power needs playing out in front of me toward my family that I could not withstand. I would never ever be able to forgive myself for not doing everything in my power to protect those I love and myself from this cruelty.

Farwould, you are likely a better man than I, as I could not forgive myself for allowing that. I have no desire to live the life of Job, and thank God that God has not asked me to. I would probably fail miserably. If that is your calling and you can live with the consequences of your actions in the event your family is tortured and brutalized in front of you before they die, and you nonetheless can forgive yourself and the other for committing such horrendous acts, then then you are a better man than I in your ability to live without guilt in forgiving yourself and the other.

Again, please don't misunderstand or distort what is stated to be a God given right as protected by the Constitution in the eyes of the framers. Nothing is ever stated about the right to kill and its not mentioned anywhere in the Constitution. You also seem to believe there will be a war in this country over the right to bear arms, and if that is your belief, then it can only mean that the government has declared war on the states and its citizens. Do you really believe the government will declare war against the American people? And in doing so, I guess you would have to ask the government how many lives are worth taking in order to breach or distort the protected rights that serve as the very foundation defining this country. FarWould, many of us have taken the oath to defend this country against all enemies foreign and domestic. Many of us have fought in wars to protect the basic foundation and rights defining this country. I'm not sure at what point you would break your word, but many that is not an option.

Meantime, why do you keep focusing upon guns? That is not the source of the problem of human directed violence. The problem is video games in which we hardwire kids brains to connect winning with human directed violence in killing as many humans as possible to win or increase our winning score. Can you tell me why is this so hard for people to understand... its the video games... and why they ignore the obvious only to return to talking about the symptom of guns, and not the source being these games?

Dog... forgive me.. I can't stop myself

I love your tenacity in the face of hopelessness . Give it hell girl

[Muleslayer]

Televised execution

Read more:

Wow you just took us back to the roman times with television added.

Edited January 3, 2013 by Muleslayer

[Farwould]

Meantime, why do you keep focusing upon guns? That is not the source of the problem of human directed violence. The problem is video games in which we hardwire kids brains to connect winning with human directed violence in killing as many humans as possible to win or increase our winning score. Can you tell me why is this so hard for people to understand... its the video games... and why they ignore the obvious only to return to talking about the symptom of guns, and not the source being these games?

It is the topic of this post.

I have written a differant prospective in each post I made one of guns a gun owners view.

A piece written in anger.which was disected by you.

A post of the bible and its views on any crime.and a piece of solutions about owning a gun.Your post about video games

is a good one and is a solution towards fixing a problem with gun violence.No one else has even posted any solutions only funnies

about myself.There is no such thing as quote (god given rights) show the verse in the bible and I apologize.

I am trying to be nice and civil and not bash anyone or neg anyone.Here goes another try:

I want you to gold plate your bill of rights,Buy a gold frame for it.Put it up on your golden altar in front of your throne,

and use the bible as your footstool.Put a gun in one hand and the bible in the other and look into a mirror.Is there

any conviction at this point?Man wrote the bill of rights not god.But man wants to do the things he wants, tie god with those wants

and then justify those wants using god.When you see god hand him that bill of rights and tell him thank you for

these rights that god has given you.Tell him his words just wernt enough(bible) That man tied his words to another piece of paper

that best fit your lifestyle.God puts stumbling blocks in front of you to test your faith in him.rape,murder,theft,etc.And all you had to do

was smile and forgive them of these crimes and you passed.The wicked dont get stumbling blocks because satan has already got

there souls.Its up to God to punish folks that dont obey his commandments not us but we do anyway why?lack of faith is why.

I guess you would let a video game raise your kids instead of you?You are supposed to be setting a good example for your kids

and teach them right from wrong up to a certain age until they are considered adults and are held accountable by there free will

that god gave us.Muleslayer when they execute a person they let the victims watch it live in person.Why do they not let

everyone watch it?Because the wicked have there ways to hide all bad things.Our government would wrather get that money

to house all crimminals instead of punishing them with the law which should be gods law.They live better than us these days

in jail.

You might as well gold plate the gun as well most would die before they gave up that gun or shoot holes through the bible.

I will never be perfect I will always sin but I am trying to do as he says and its hard.I am scared to death of his judgement

for my sins against him and worry I wont be good enough to make it into heaven but I havent given up on trying to please

him.You are a worthy advesary rayzur and respect you for it.If folks cant control there actions with guns and it takes a person to

operate that gun not on its own then what would you do to control all these deaths commited by the gun.When the government

comes to your door and says we are here to take your guns what would you say or do to them?When you dont surrender them

as most of you would not and would shoot at them?starting of a war to keep your guns or surrender them and comply to

mans laws which would change this bill of rights.Were running out of room on this planet for bullets to safely travel upon a

missed shot with thousands born each day.Just more targets?I am sure alot of you are well trained but the wicked are to

and can see why you want a gun for protection if your faith is not up to parr.Where does the line get drawn.safety verses evil.

who shall control this line god or government?or We the people?This was supposed to be a debate but have laughed at me

and thats ok I forgive the ones who did.But I cant be forgiven by most because I want guns gone.And this makes me a bad guy

in your eyes.Heaven forbid I want everyone to live and enjoy life.The more I write the deeper the hole I dig for myself for trying

to just live.Go ahead and shoot me and put me out of my misery I am a horrible guy whacked in the head a stump as some

would say but I am never going to shoot another human being for any reason and this makes me a threat to your way of life.

I have'nt slept a wink for 2 days now because of this post and I think god is using me to spread his message. I didnt even want

to reply anymore because you all will only justify a gun no matter what I say or what god has said.So why try anymore.

I lose and you folks win.I have given up.When one of your family gets shot by a gun then we shall see what was so

important about a gun,being able to live with a gun and be lifes judges or just living without them.And I dont mean to be so

vain I dont want any of you or yours to be shot and killed.Life is better than death and he who uses a gun has a choice

of these things I write about.You cant control a death its part of life so what good is that gun when you would still be

taking anothers life trying to protect your life and the ones around you.Did god say kill to protect your life?It does in

your bill of rights that man wrote.Which is the better person man or God.Look at how much blood has been spilled to

write and protect this bill of rights according to man but wants to do what he wants according to his or her own desires and use god

to create the rights that man has wrote.The bible should have been enough for man to live by but no man wants more.

Man writes statues and within those statues writes more creating loopholes for the wicked.There are no loopholes in the bible

for the wicked.Gods commandments speak for themselves but man will challenge him.There will be no scpiture in this post

because I am judging man and will be punished for it.God Bless You all except me.God died for our sins so that we may live

But you would not die for him to keep his commandments but would die to protect your rights that man has written.

When phycos use guns to kill for there just gains you would use yours for your just gains.

watch the wicked neg me to death.And then laugh at me for only trying to preserve life as we used to know it.

Bash me for my views instead of coming up with better solutions to live by and thus protecting your rights as you say

for owning a gun.I am done I LOSE!

[dog53]

I gave you a plus farwould.

Now get some sleep