ENOUGH LOP TALK1

[dinarck]

Again showing your true colors and its no wonder you are confined here misery needs company and it seems you have it and to jackster no it was a general statement that has been made by people that believe we are all wasting time here yet they still are on these forums waiting for an indefinite RD which wil do absolutely nothing for their people but hey its all my opinion. So Dinarick ( Mr. rich) how will this all play out?

Easy? Since when do governments do anything for the people? You have mistakenly been led to believe that a ”RV” is what the people need. Again. Show me one. If they are so wonderful for the people then where are they? What about the people of Iran? South Korea? Any country with a hyperinflated currency? They dont exsist because they are economic fantasy. A fact that you refuse to come to terms with. Redenominations are what is done to hyperinflated currencies and any country that has ever done one could careless what the people think because massive overnight RVs are impossible. Do you really think Iraqis are sitting and waiting for the dinar to suddenly become worth 1000 times more? Hahaha... Even they would laugh at such a redicilous notion.

A huge overnight RV would do nothing for the Iraqi people other than inflate their currency even worse than it is now. That is why Iraq is planning to redenominate. They know better than any that ”RVs” are fairy tales that only unknowing internet ”investors” believe in.

[caz1104]

Mr Rich-Caz here. Long time no talk-lol. Dude u should be happy we venture down to the basement,the more that visit and comment bumps your thoughts/opinions/agendas to the top of the forum list. Thus the more opportunities to influence/educate/brainwash others. Your welcome

[DaveD]

Latest delete 3 zero article.

http://www.rudaw.net/english/news/iraq/4770.html

ERBIL, Kurdistan Region- Kurdish members of Iraqi Parliament’s Finance Committee have denied that there is currently any proposed law regarding the removal of zeros on the Iraqi banknote.

Ahmad Faizulla, an MP from the Kurdistan alliance in Iraqi parliament and member of the finance committee, dismissed claims that their committee has prepared and drafted a law to alter the currency.

“The finance committee cannot make such a decision,” he said. “We can only suggest projects. The drafted projects will be presented to parliament for discussions for voting. This is something that must go through legal channels.”

Heitham Jiburry, a member of the finance committee, announced last week that eliminating zeros on Iraqi banknotes will be implemented early next year. “It is expected that the process of printing new currency will start next August,” he said.

Jiburry also remarked, “The process of replacing the old currency to the new one will continue throughout next year. The old currency will completely be gone in the first 6 months of 2014.”

In April, the chief of staff of Iraqi Council of Ministries suspended the process indefinitely.

Fazil Nabi, Iraq’s deputy finance minister, previously told Rudaw that eliminating zeros on Iraq’s currency will not increase the value of Iraqi dinars.

However, Jiburry said, the process will make the Iraqi dinar more stable and reduce demands for foreign currency among people.

Nabi told Rudaw, “Implementing this process is related to the central bank. I always believed that this wouldn’t work at least at this stage.”

Economists believe Iraq is not ready to eliminate zeros on its currency, and that for the process to be successful security, political and economic stability is needed.

But Shorsh Haji, an Iraqi MP from the Change Movement (Gorran) maintained that there is indeed a proposal to modify the currency.

“Such an idea to eliminate zeros on Iraqi currency does exist,” Haji said. “The process of withdrawing all the old bills and replacing them with new ones needs a special budget, which was not designated from the 2012 budget. It is believed that this budget will be designated in 2013.”

Regarding possible economic benefits of a currency change, Haji said, “The benefit would be more in appearance. Currently, the value of the Iraqi dinar has dropped and is unstable. After removing zeros instead of saying 123,000 IQD is equal to US$100 we will say 123 Dinars is equal to US$100. It is just to show that Iraq has a strong economy.”

Making changes in Iraq’s banknotes may add to already heightened tensions between Baghdad and Erbil. Kurdish MPs in Baghdad say that if such a law is passed in parliament, the new bills must have Kurdish alongside Arabic script on them, as stipulated by the constitution.

“So far, there has not been any designs for the new bills,” Haji noted. “Without a doubt, having Kurdish written on the new bills will be our pre-condition.”

According to Article 4 of the Constitution, Kurdish and Arabic are the official languages of Iraq and both languages must appear on Iraqi banknotes.

Section two of the article says, “Use of both languages is enjoined by the principle of equality such as banknotes, passports, and stamps.”

Haji is optimistic about the future use of the Kurdish language on Iraqi official documents.

“I don’t expect that this constitutional right will be ignored or cause more tensions between Baghdad and Erbil,” he said. “This is a legal and constitutional subject. There are also Kurdish-Arabic interpreters in Parliament. Kurdish MPs can speak Kurdish if they want. However, it has become a habit for them to speak Arabic in the Parliament.”

MP Faizulla is more skeptical, saying, “Many constitutional articles and rights have already been violated. This will depend on agreements between the political parties. If the political parties don’t agree, it most likely won’t happen.”

[jackster]

Jackster-Economists are split on this as well at least the ones I have been in contact with. I know two that teach hear in the ATL(emory univ & kennesaw st.), they play in my golf league/club and debate the merits at nausea. I first heard bout this venture over 5 years ago(invested just over two years) from my ex-finacial advisor. My point, there are many differing views on this,and when it pops (RV or RD) the bragging can then commence.

What points do these economists differ on?

What have they said would happen in Iraq with a 1:1 RV? What would happen to the price of milk? What would the average Iraqi do with their new IQD? Invest? Spend? Convert US$? How about exportation of goods?

People can opine about whether or not an RV will happen. But, what happens to the people in Iraq and their economy if it does occur? That's the 62 million IQD question.

And thank you for your very civil post.

BTW, I heard of this back in February from a friend that bought into it. Last time we spoke he was selling his pop-up camper for $6,000 for more IQD. This is after he used up his savings on IQD. If this RVs, he'll be extremely wealthy. If it doesn't.....

[DaveD]

That’s pretty clearly a lop.

It describes exactly what has happened in all of the other redenominations/lops that have happened in the past. They even talk about what the rate will be after the swap.

Countries lie and hide 1% or even ½% moves in their currency. Certainly Iraq is not openly stating over and over again they will RV 100,000% in the near future.

They also state clearly that it will be ALL notes. This nonsense pushed by some gurus about smaller denominations is just a pump to sell the more expensive notes. The people who fell for that scam will lose the most.

[DaveD]

What points do these economists differ on?

What have they said would happen in Iraq with a 1:1 RV? What would happen to the price of milk? What would the average Iraqi do with their new IQD? Invest? Spend? Convert US$? How about exportation of goods?

People can opine about whether or not an RV will happen. But, what happens to the people in Iraq and their economy if it does occur? That's the 62 million IQD question.

And thank you for your very civil post.

BTW, I heard of this back in February from a friend that bought into it. Last time we spoke he was selling his pop-up camper for $6,000 for more IQD. This is after he used up his savings on IQD. If this RVs, he'll be extremely wealthy. If it doesn't.....

Think about this Jack. We don’t have to ask what would happen after a big RV. Simply ask yourself what would be happening in Iraq today if they thought the dinar was going to RV 100,000% in the near future.

The dinar would be the hottest commodity in the world. The demand would be through the roof. People would be murdering each other on the streets for it. There would be total chaos. There would be no dinar available anywhere. The supply would dry up in seconds.

People would offering you 50 cents a dinar for it right now… because if they could double their money that would seen as a phenomenal return. That’s what would be happening if Breitling and other who claim they are pre-announcing a 100,000% increase.

Now for reality… what IS actually happening in Iraq today. People don’t want dinar. Article out just the other day that stated most people convert most of their pay to dollars as soon as they get paid. The street rate of the dinar has sunk against the dollar. There’s been dozens of articles talking about the dinar dropping in value and what can the CBI do to pull it back up to the official rate. Obviously the people of Iraq believe all this delete 3 zero talk is a normal redenomination/lop and not a big RV.

[caz1104]

Think about this Jack. We don’t have to ask what would happen after a big RV. Simply ask yourself what would be happening in Iraq today if they thought the dinar was going to RV 100,000% in the near future.

The dinar would be the hottest commodity in the world. The demand would be through the roof. People would be murdering each other on the streets for it. There would be total chaos. There would be no dinar available anywhere. The supply would dry up in seconds.

People would offering you 50 cents a dinar for it right now… because if they could double their money that would seen as a phenomenal return. That’s what would be happening if Breitling and other who claim they are pre-announcing a 100,000% increase.

Now for reality… what IS actually happening in Iraq today. People don’t want dinar. Article out just the other day that stated most people convert most of their pay to dollars as soon as they get paid. The street rate of the dinar has sunk against the dollar. There’s been dozens of articles talking about the dinar dropping in value and what can the CBI do to pull it back up to the official rate. Obviously the people of Iraq believe all this delete 3 zero talk is a normal redenomination/lop and not a big RV.

Not trying to be argumentive,but I'd be surprized if they thought/believed anything else. Just like anywhere you continously state the same thing over & over and the majority of people will believe or accept it. Makes no difference the subject ie politics,economy,personalities peolpe in general are easily led. With the lack of education, high un-employment,& extreme poverty in Iraq what choice do they have. Not saying what you state and what Iraq is going to do is not accurate, but just because they say it does'nt make it so. Our government & media are famous for this very thing.

[DaveD]

Not trying to be argumentive,but I'd be surprized if they thought/believed anything else. Just like anywhere you continously state the same thing over & over and the majority of people will believe or accept it. Makes no difference the subject ie politics,economy,personalities peolpe in general are easily led. With the lack of education, high un-employment,& extreme poverty in Iraq on dinar boards what choice do they have. Not saying what you state and what Iraq is going to do is not accurate, but just because they say it does'nt make it so. Our government & media are famous for this very thing.

Simple edit of your post is just as true.

Not sure why you think that's what they are being told. Most of the Gurus assure us that the CBI and Gov ae talking about a huge 100.000% rv.

Do you think all the articles mean a redenomination/lop or a big RV?

Sounds like you believe the articles mean lop... but that they are smokescreens.

History shows us that when countries redenominate/lop they regulary talk openly abut for up years in advance about it. This is nothing out of the ordinary.

I'm still waiting for the example of wnen a contry smokescreened about a lop and then turned around and had a massive RV.

Edited May 24, 2012 by DaveD

[jackster]

Think about this Jack. We don’t have to ask what would happen after a big RV. Simply ask yourself what would be happening in Iraq today if they thought the dinar was going to RV 100,000% in the near future.

The dinar would be the hottest commodity in the world. The demand would be through the roof. People would be murdering each other on the streets for it. There would be total chaos. There would be no dinar available anywhere. The supply would dry up in seconds.

People would offering you 50 cents a dinar for it right now… because if they could double their money that would seen as a phenomenal return. That’s what would be happening if Breitling and other who claim they are pre-announcing a 100,000% increase.

Now for reality… what IS actually happening in Iraq today. People don’t want dinar. Article out just the other day that stated most people convert most of their pay to dollars as soon as they get paid. The street rate of the dinar has sunk against the dollar. There’s been dozens of articles talking about the dinar dropping in value and what can the CBI do to pull it back up to the official rate. Obviously the people of Iraq believe all this delete 3 zero talk is a normal redenomination/lop and not a big RV.

Dave,

Thank you. I never thought about it that way.

Rumors spread faster than the truth. So, if a rumor, true or not, got out about a potential RV...dang!

Who would be in the know regarding any RV? Iraqi government. Bankers. I might be missing some others. These government officials, politicians and bankers have friends and relatives. Of course, they would want them to benefit as well as long as they kept it a secret. But some of them would have other friends and relatives and would want to them in on it as well. Just how many people could keep this a secret before someone in the media caught wind of it? 8 years of keeping one of the biggest financial secrets safe. Amazing!

Here's an idea. Many of the members of this forum believe this is going to help the people of Iraq. They also want to do good with their newfound riches. Let's inform the people of Iraq about this RV. Let's get the word out, because it will happen. Or so I have been told. The people of Iraq need to accumulate as much IQD as possible. I mean, the currency is right there. They don't need some Forex dude selling it to them with a 20% markup. They can get it cheaper.

Then, when it RVs (which is "any day now"), they'll be super rich and super happy with all of their economic woes behind them.

What am I saying here?!?!?! I almost started dreaming about that the RV could be real. What has Warren Buffet said about this? Nothing? Well then.....

And for those that want to call me sarcastic and arrogant in this post.....forget about it. Because I was.

[caz1104]

Simple edit of your post is just as true.

Not sure why you think that's what they are being told. Most of the Gurus assure us that the CBI and Gov ae talking about a huge 100.000% rv.

Do you think all the articles mean a redenomination/lop or a big RV?

Sounds like you believe the articles mean lop... but that they are smokescreens.

History shows us that when countries redenominate/lop they regulary talk openly abut for up years in advance about it. This is nothing out of the ordinary.

I'm still waiting for the example of wnen a contry smokescreened about a lop and then turned around and had a massive RV.

Dave-I don't take anything as gospel. Guru's imo are no more entertainment/opinion than anyone else. Yes I agree for the millionth time you are correct history shows us there has never been a RV of this magnitude. But I also know not everything is as cut and dry as many wish us to believe. I'm vested with what I could afford to loose, a gamble yes. If no RV and I either brake even or possibly double/triple my investment so be it. I will not be mad at anyone nor will I have felt I've been mis-lead. I made a conscience choice to take a chance and am glad I did. No one made me invest and no one will make me sellout,it will be my choice. IMO you do whats best for yourself and let others do the same. Good luck to guys down here. I gotta get out of here,can't see to dark-lol. Peace

Edited May 24, 2012 by caz1104

[marknet73]

I do see the IQD increasing in value. Just not like has been pumped relentlessly. It already has increased in value over the last ten years. I dont see why this trend could not continue BUT that is IF they dont redenominate. If they dont then the value could slowly rise BUT it would be in small increments and over a LONG period of time. Movements in currency are a big deal and have huge impacts on economies and inflation and prices and intrest rate and so forth. You just cannot suddenly increase the value of your currency by 100% or 1000% overnight. The consequences would be dire.

Really it all comes down to how situations like Iraq is in are dealt with in reality. Redenominations are what is done to hyperinflated currencies. It is either that or continue to use your hyperinflated currency. Yeah over time you can increase or even decrease the value in SMALL increments but we are talking decades to make any real progress on an already hyperinflated currency. Who knows. Maybe this was the plan all along. Trillions would still be made just over decades instead of overnight which is impossible. Really this would be the only way as the oil is pulled from the ground. Iraq could then actually afford small increases with increased oil production and actually working with surpluses instead of having to borrow money to meet their budgets.

Another increase that I could see happening is from 1166 to 1000.Not overnight but slowly up until they are ready to redenominate. They have told us more than once point blank that they are going to do this which still blows my mind. This way they would be on par with the dollar at the time of the RD. Transactions with old and new would be much easier. All of this has been discussed by myself Legolas and JMW along with a few others and opinions varied but I still think it is clear that they want to do it. Who knows. They could bring the new currency in on par with the dollar while leaving the old at 1166.

Bottom line. Yes. The IQD could continue to increase in value. MAYBE even faster than we have ever seen any currency increase but never by 100% to 1000% overnight and certainly not by 10,000% or 100,000% overnight like has been hyped by many.

O yeah. There is always the topic of monetary policy. What would happen if Iraq put the IQD on the open market and went from peg to float? Would anyone want to trade it? I doubt it but I am no Forex expert. For the dinar to increase on a float it would take demand for the currency. I just dont see it. Iraq still has an unsure future and dont forget they are right next door to Iran and Syria. Not to mention they are a developing nation and almost ALWAYS developing nations remain pegged. Stability is what Iraq needs and floating their currency would take that away.

Hopefully we'll continue to see gradual incremental changes or maybe more likely the move from 1166 to 1000. i saw a very recent article stating they planned to do just that. To me that would be a great sign and at least in the realm of possibility. The best thing would be that they continue to take small steps which don't involve a redomination and that's what i'm holding out for but who knows?

[DaveD]

Here's the problem if it doesn't lop. Iraq is still a cash based society and they don’t trust banks. For us a $20 bill is fine as our biggest common bill. I know we have 50’s and hundreds, but most people don’t have them. We use credit cards or debit cards or checks for big purchases. Iraqis don’t do that for the most part. So if they don’t lop they will almost for sure have to come out with larger bills. Probably the 50,000 100,000 and even a 200,000 dinar note will be put out if there is no lop. We’ve seen rumors of those larger bill in the past… they will appear if the lop doesn’t happen.

[dinarck]

Mr Rich-Caz here. Long time no talk-lol. Dude u should be happy we venture down to the basement,the more that visit and comment bumps your thoughts/opinions/agendas to the top of the forum list. Thus the more opportunities to influence/educate/brainwash others. Your welcome

My only agenda is the truth and to point out a serious lack of common sense which the dinar word is over ridden with. I am sorry that this upsets you so greatly. I know that you use the arrogance excuse but something tells me that it is really your dream of free riches under attack that really moves you to respond to my posts. I just wish that you would bring something to the discussion instead of remarks about the way I go about posting which is meaningless to the topic at hand. Whether you like the way I present my opinions or not doesnt change what my opinions represent. What they represent is a threat to the RV dream and that is not acceptable to many yet no one even attempts to show where my opinions are wrong with logic and economic facts. Instead they bring incoherent rants about conspiracies and forum generated garbage that many have taken as facts.

It is telling that you say I am brainwashing people yet you and Easy are cheerleading a RV that is nothing more than a fabricated ageanda to sell dinar. How am I brainwashing people with actual economic reality while you and Easy are ”informing” people of a ”possible” RV. Haha... Come on dude. Even denying the facts that myself, Dave, Jackster, Legolas, JMW, and others just like us have brought forward is really nothing more than pumping dinar for Ali or Roger. All of this ” nobody knows” nonsense just keeps the cash register smokin at Dinar Trade. I am sure Ali appreciates it.

Edited May 24, 2012 by dinarck

[caz1104]

My only agenda is the truth and to point out a serious lack of common sense which the dinar word is over ridden with. I am sorry that this upsets you so greatly. I know that you use the arrogance excuse but something tells me that it is really your dream of free riches under attack that really moves you to respond to my posts. I just wish that you would bring something to the discussion instead of remarks about the way I go about posting which is meaningless to the topic at hand. Whether you like the way I present my opinions or not doesnt change what my opinions represent. What they represent is a threat to the RV dream and that is not acceptable to many yet no one even attempts to show where my opinions are wrong with logic and economic facts. Instead they bring incoherent rants about conspiracies and forum generated garbage that many have taken as facts.

It is telling that you say I am brainwashing people yet you and Easy are cheerleading a RV that is nothing more than a fabricated ageanda to sell dinar. How am I brainwashing people with actual economic reality while you and Easy are ”informing” people of a ”possible” RV. Haha... Come on dude. Even denying the facts that myself, Dave, Jackster, Legolas, JMW, and others just like us have brought forward is really nothing more than pumping dinar for Ali or Roger. All of this ” nobody knows” nonsense just keeps the cash register smokin at Dinar Trade. I am sure Ali appreciates it.

Sorry U feel that way Rich.1st off my post was done mainly tongue & cheek, sorry u did'nt see that. I thought by bumping your thread to the top of the forum list & keeping it fresh would put a smile on your face. But that would've been a first I see I had a couple of human conversations with a couple of others here,but I see you have no interest in such,too bad I thought we turned the corner,such is life. As for upsetting me..........won't happen.My lifes good and I don't sweat the small stuff,and arguing over a unknown clearly qualifies.As per the truth.......hmmm truths come in many forms and is for each to decide.Truths hmmmmmm please post where I cheerlead anybody,di I hope this thing RV's..............yes DUH. I don't see hoping for a positive is cheerleading but hey thats your opinion and I can live with it. I don't post articles or chats for I feel no need to try push an agenda or my beliefs on a particular subject/issue on anyone.Do I respond to trash talk...............you got me there,guilty.But never to an opinion. You have an agenda that I believe many here can see and it comes thru loud & clear with your posts. Your disgust for those you feel have done you wrong in regards to investing in the dinar. You know the ones that filled your head with thoughts of riches only to find out that it just might not come out like you thought. It has to be someones fault...........right? It could'nt be that it's your fault............could it? Nooooooo! Someone else is responsible for mis-leading you right? Thats why you chastise others and hate on "GURU's". Mr Rich like I have said numerous times you just might be correct with all you have stated, it could RD.............great. Then what? I do wish you a good day & sorry again for trying to keep this post front & center.

Edited May 24, 2012 by caz1104

[dinarck]

Sorry U feel that way Rich.1st off my post was done mainly tongue & cheek, sorry u did'nt see that. I thought by bumping your thread to the top of the forum list & keeping it fresh would put a smile on your face. But that would've been a first I see I had a couple of human conversations with a couple of others here,but I see you have no interest in such,too bad I thought we turned the corner,such is life. As for upsetting me..........won't happen.My lifes good and I don't sweat the small stuff,and arguing over a unknown clearly qualifies.As per the truth.......hmmm truths come in many forms and is for each to decide.Truths hmmmmmm please post where I cheerlead anybody,di I hope this thing RV's..............yes DUH. I don't see hoping for a positive is cheerleading but hey thats your opinion and I can live with it. I don't post articles or chats for I feel no need to try push an agenda or my beliefs on a particular subject/issue on anyone.Do I respond to trash talk...............you got me there,guilty.But never to an opinion. You have an agenda that I believe many here can see and it comes thru loud & clear with your posts. Your disgust for those you feel have done you wrong in regards to investing in the dinar. You know the ones that filled your head with thoughts of riches only to find out that it just might not come out like you thought. It has to be someones fault...........right? It could'nt be that it's your fault............could it? Nooooooo! Someone else is responsible for mis-leading you right? Thats why you chastise others and hate on "GURU's". Mr Rich like I have said numerous times you just might be correct with all you have stated, it could RD.............great. Then what? I do wish you a good day & sorry again for trying to keep this post front & center.

I have in the past and will here again admitt freely that I too was suckered into buying dinar by a stary eyed friend of mine who was suckered into it the same way by someone else. Better hurry, it could RV any day. No time to research. Hurry and contact Ali before its too late. I heard all the garbage about how the public wasnt suppose to know and how Iraq has alot of oil and George Bush said this or that. Bla bla bla. At the time I knew nothing about currencies and figured, Yeah, this has got to go back up. The difference here between me and you is that it only took two months of reading and learning for me to see that this was a con from the get go. People like you and Easy though seem to never learn and continue to push the charade of the "possibility". You are correct Caz. I was duped and I am angry about it. It isnt the money. The loss of the spread if I sell wont break the bank. What makes me angry is the hype that led me into dinar land in the first place. If the "RV" wasnt so "Imminet" I would have had time to learn more about how currencies work. But no. Hurry. Get your dinar before its too late. How fortunate you are to be privy to this information.

There was no one around cautioning me with economic facts before I bought. Only hype. Now you attack me for cautioning others with common sense logic, and reasoning. Why? Becase I am not nice about it? Really? The only way I can see to break the dinar zombie spell is tell it like it is and beating around the bush with pleasantries isnt my style. Seems it isnt the style of the Go RVers towards anyone who would dare question their precious "RV" either. Believe it or not Caz there are many desperate people out there who cannot afford the hype of hurry and buy dinar. Tell me, do you think that everything is OK and people can make up their own minds or do you think that just maybe misinformation, made up lies, and fabricated economic events may just be working in the dinar dealers favor? Are you OK with that because I am not. Soon Easy will be here to set the record straight and let me know that people are adults and no one needs me to save them from anything. Hahaha.. He cracks me up. I am only trying to quell at least maybe minutely some of the hype that suckered myself and my friend into spending thousands of hard earned dollars on a hyperinflated foriegn currency that we knew nothing about. If this site was more balanced and people actually understood that the dinar wasnt an overnight get rich sceme and more of a long term speculation on a currency that may or may not appreciate then yeah I would have no need to so bluntly point out the hype created nonsense that so many come into here with. You say that I belong here because I am not nice about smashing dinar dealer forum facts and ignorance based economic wishful thinking. Well then this is where I belong and how nice for the believers that I am here. That way the hype can go unimpeeded and the whole dinar industry can continue to thrive. Great. At least this section is still available for reality.

This is the way I see it Caz and I know that you wont like it and really I dont care. You are either part of the problem or part of the solution. Which are you? I know which Easy is but sometimes I see a glimmer of hope out of you. Afterall you are quite the moral person right? So why would you want to see people spending their hard earned money based off of blatant misinformation drummed up in an attempt to get rich selling dinar? Like has been pointed out, people are mortaging their houses, selling campers, spending rent money, ect. Think of familys with kids who have to do without because daddy listens to Okie. Its not even just Okie. Its people who everyday read on sites about the "RV". THERE IS NO SUCH THING. Yet it is spoken of by thousands daily like it is something that is real and sure to happen. Now I am the bad guy for trying to bring sanity back to people who are confused by all the lies and pumper facts that everyone believes so they must be true?

I have nothing against you Caz. As a matter of fact I think you are all right but please stop pointing out my tone or whatever method I use to get my point across. People can handle it and hopefully it might actually wake them up a little bit to what is really going on.

[caz1104]

I have in the past and will here again admitt freely that I too was suckered into buying dinar by a stary eyed friend of mine who was suckered into it the same way by someone else. Better hurry, it could RV any day. No time to research. Hurry and contact Ali before its too late. I heard all the garbage about how the public wasnt suppose to know and how Iraq has alot of oil and George Bush said this or that. Bla bla bla. At the time I knew nothing about currencies and figured, Yeah, this has got to go back up. The difference here between me and you is that it only took two months of reading and learning for me to see that this was a con from the get go. People like you and Easy though seem to never learn and continue to push the charade of the "possibility". You are correct Caz. I was duped and I am angry about it. It isnt the money. The loss of the spread if I sell wont break the bank. What makes me angry is the hype that led me into dinar land in the first place. If the "RV" wasnt so "Imminet" I would have had time to learn more about how currencies work. But no. Hurry. Get your dinar before its too late. How fortunate you are to be privy to this information.

There was no one around cautioning me with economic facts before I bought. Only hype. Now you attack me for cautioning others with common sense logic, and reasoning. Why? Becase I am not nice about it? Really? The only way I can see to break the dinar zombie spell is tell it like it is and beating around the bush with pleasantries isnt my style. Seems it isnt the style of the Go RVers towards anyone who would dare question their precious "RV" either. Believe it or not Caz there are many desperate people out there who cannot afford the hype of hurry and buy dinar. Tell me, do you think that everything is OK and people can make up their own minds or do you think that just maybe misinformation, made up lies, and fabricated economic events may just be working in the dinar dealers favor? Are you OK with that because I am not. Soon Easy will be here to set the record straight and let me know that people are adults and no one needs me to save them from anything. Hahaha.. He cracks me up. I am only trying to quell at least maybe minutely some of the hype that suckered myself and my friend into spending thousands of hard earned dollars on a hyperinflated foriegn currency that we knew nothing about. If this site was more balanced and people actually understood that the dinar wasnt an overnight get rich sceme and more of a long term speculation on a currency that may or may not appreciate then yeah I would have no need to so bluntly point out the hype created nonsense that so many come into here with. You say that I belong here because I am not nice about smashing dinar dealer forum facts and ignorance based economic wishful thinking. Well then this is where I belong and how nice for the believers that I am here. That way the hype can go unimpeeded and the whole dinar industry can continue to thrive. Great. At least this section is still available for reality.

This is the way I see it Caz and I know that you wont like it and really I dont care. You are either part of the problem or part of the solution. Which are you? I know which Easy is but sometimes I see a glimmer of hope out of you. Afterall you are quite the moral person right? So why would you want to see people spending their hard earned money based off of blatant misinformation drummed up in an attempt to get rich selling dinar? Like has been pointed out, people are mortaging their houses, selling campers, spending rent money, ect. Think of familys with kids who have to do without because daddy listens to Okie. Its not even just Okie. Its people who everyday read on sites about the "RV". THERE IS NO SUCH THING. Yet it is spoken of by thousands daily like it is something that is real and sure to happen. Now I am the bad guy for trying to bring sanity back to people who are confused by all the lies and pumper facts that everyone believes so they must be true?

I have nothing against you Caz. As a matter of fact I think you are all right but please stop pointing out my tone or whatever method I use to get my point across. People can handle it and hopefully it might actually wake them up a little bit to what is really going on.

Rich, I'm not here to make friends or enemies. I'm here to read and learn for myself. To me there is no problem and it's not my place to state otherwise. People have to decide for themselves what is right,we already have a gov that trys to be everyones best friend & oversee'er(is that a word?-lol) without succeeding at either. If you or anyone else wants to believe someone beit a "guru" or anyone else great,thats each's right/ responsibility. In countless of business's there is deception of the truth as well as our gov one would spend thousands of lifetimes tracking down such un-truths and still only scratch the surface. There are times when I believe you to be human and actually a good person not that it matters I doubt we will ever cross paths in the real world. But imo you gotta let it go,you can't save people from themselves. I do believe you believe you have this all figured out(dinar).........cool,and in your heart you think you are doing good. Heck some may even agree with you............cool also. But you gotta admit you're in the minority and your approach is kinda rough(putting it nicely). If your goal is to inform/help others try to understand the goal of a good communicator is being able to adapt to your audience. I promise to leave my thoughts to myself when it comes to YOUR posts-take care and much success.

[Rasica]

I'm posting this again.

This is not arrogance. This is not meant to demean anyone. These are simple hard cold facts.

Please... Tell me where I’m wrong.

Currently all the currency in the world added together. All the Dollars, Euro, Yen, Yuan, Pounds, and everything else. It all adds up to about 5 to 6 Trillion dollars worth of currency.

Iraq currently has 32 Trilion dinar. A $1 RV would give Iraq $32 trillion worth of currency… or basically 6 times more than the whole world combined right now.

Currency is used to support an economy.

The whole world GDP (economy) is about $70 trillion now.

Iraq’s GDP is about $100 billion.

That means Iraq has just over 1/10 of 1% of the worlds economy… and they would have 6 times more currency than the rest of the world with a $1 RV.

6 times more currency with less than 1% of GDP.

Even if you believe the totally unsupported claims made by some of the gurus that maybe 50% or even 70 or 80% of the currency has already been removed. It hasn’t, but lets play along. Let’s say they've gone crazy and reduced 90%. They would still have 3 trillion.

At a $1 RV that would be $3 Trillion in currency.

That would mean they would 1/2 of all the currency that currently exist in the world with less than 1/100th of the worlds GDP.

Even under that most rosy of scenarios… there still is no logical explanation for a big RV.

I am telling you, you are wrong! We must NOT compare apples with oranges. You cannot compare one Nation States "Currency Supply" with another's "Currency Circulation".

CURRENCY [sUPPLY] IS NOT CURRENCY [CIRCULATION]!!!! CURRENCY SUPPLY IS M1 WHILE M2 CONTAINS FRACTIONAL DIGITAL CIRCULATION!

The U.S. alone has approximately 3 TRILLION CURRENCY SUPPLY WHILE THE U.S. HAS (ADMITTED) 72 TRILLION CURRENCY CIRCULATION!!!!!

WHEN ALAQ SAYS "WE HAVE 30 TRILLION IN CIRCULATION" THIS IS M2 WHICH IS FRACTIONAL BANKING BY DIGITAL CIRCULATION!!!!!!!

THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH CURRENCY SUPPLY WHICH THEY HAVE BOUGHT BACK AT THE RATE OF $1.5 BILLION/MONTH!!!!

IRAQ HAS REDUCED THE [sUPPLY] AKA; ACTUAL PHYSICAL IQD NOTES THAT YOU CAN TOUCH, FEEL, AND TAKE PHYSICAL POSSESSION THEREOF -> BY 70%, WHILE FRACTIONAL BANKING IS DIGITAL CIRCULATION

WHICH CAN INCREASE IRRESPECTIVE OF THE ACTUAL PHYSICAL NOTES!!

MAYBE THIS IS WHY YOU SIMPLY DO NOT UNDERSTAND THE M0-M1-M2 INFORMATION AND WHY THE MANTRA'D 30 TRILLION-60 TRILLION HAS [NOTHING] TO DO WITH THE REVALUATION!!

PLEASE STUDY FRACTIONAL [RESERVE] BANKING!

IRAQ IS WELL BELOW 4 TRILLION CURRENCY """""SUPPLY""""" WHERE AS U.S. IS NEAR 3 TRILLION CURRENCY """""SUPPLY""""".

Edited May 24, 2012 by Rasica

[Rasica]

Where do you get that the IQD is functioning at $.85? If it is, then how is the price of milk 2,155 IQD? Again, go speak with an economist? Why won't anyone that believes in the RV do their due diligence by speaking with a couple of professionals face-to-face? I understand that it's so much easier to believe faceless people who claim to be experts and have "intel".

If it is functioning at $.85, then why do the dealers sell 1 million IQD for $1200?

I don't believe 100% that an RD will happen. If it does happen, then your 25K note will be exchanged at 25 IQD. It will not retain its 25,000 value for months on end.

How does a vendor give change for 50 IQD for a milk purchase? If the milk costs 2,155 IQD, then there is no purchase of milk. If there was a 1:1 RV, then either the price remains the same @ 2,155 IQD and still no purchase. Or the price does not increase, it is bought for 1.85 IQD and change is given in the amount of 48.15 IQD.

Again, you are repeating what you have heard in these blogs and forums from people that no one can verify. Some guy is masquerading as a banker from Brazil. Really? Find a flesh and blood expert. And ask away. Let me know what they say.

I thought you guys did DD?

COST OF IRAQ LIVING VALUATION INDEX CAN BE FOUND HERE!

MILK IS $1.85 USD (NOT IQD) OR 2.155 IQD AFTER $.85 RELEASE.

Edited May 24, 2012 by Rasica

[jackster]

I thought you guys did DD?

COST OF IRAQ LIVING VALUATION INDEX CAN BE FOUND HERE!

MILK IS $1.85 USD (NOT IQD) OR 2.155 IQD AFTER $.85 RELEASE.

We do DD.

The link that you posted is titled "Local Price of Goods - Iraq Compared to Continent" The Continent is the Middle East and parts of North Africa.

This is the text on that site: "This is a cost of living indicator. The figure shows how much how much a bundle of goods and services costing US$1 in the US would cost in other countries (similar to The Economist's Big Mac Index). To arrive at the figure, the Global Property Guide takes the difference between the IMF's nominal GDP figures, and their purchasing power parity GDP figures for the latest year available. Note that currency undervaluation (as measured by PPP) is not a good predictor of future currency movements. These cost of living indicators refer to data collected annually"

This $.85 figure you're using in your posts has nothing to do with an exchange rate. 1 IQD does not equal $.85. Besides, that website has to do with property. You know, real estate.

Milk in Iraq costs 2,155 IQD. Do not forget the comma after the "2". You inadvertently used a period. Big difference. And there is no "AFTER $.85 RELEASE".

Also, quit yelling. That's what you're doing when you use all caps. And what's with the bold text? Are you yelling in a deep voice?

So, let's say an RV happens at 1:1. Does the price of milk become 1.85 IQD? Does it remain at 2,155 IQD? Can you please answer that one question? Focus.

I am telling you, you are wrong! We must NOT compare apples with oranges. You cannot compare one Nation States "Currency Supply" with another's "Currency Circulation".

CURRENCY [sUPPLY] IS NOT CURRENCY [CIRCULATION]!!!! CURRENCY SUPPLY IS M1 WHILE M2 CONTAINS FRACTIONAL DIGITAL CIRCULATION!

The U.S. alone has approximately 3 TRILLION CURRENCY SUPPLY WHILE THE U.S. HAS (ADMITTED) 72 TRILLION CURRENCY CIRCULATION!!!!!

WHEN ALAQ SAYS "WE HAVE 30 TRILLION IN CIRCULATION" THIS IS M2 WHICH IS FRACTIONAL BANKING BY DIGITAL CIRCULATION!!!!!!!

THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH CURRENCY SUPPLY WHICH THEY HAVE BOUGHT BACK AT THE RATE OF $1.5 BILLION/MONTH!!!!

IRAQ HAS REDUCED THE [sUPPLY] AKA; ACTUAL PHYSICAL IQD NOTES THAT YOU CAN TOUCH, FEEL, AND TAKE PHYSICAL POSSESSION THEREOF -> BY 70%, WHILE FRACTIONAL BANKING IS DIGITAL CIRCULATION

WHICH CAN INCREASE IRRESPECTIVE OF THE ACTUAL PHYSICAL NOTES!!

MAYBE THIS IS WHY YOU SIMPLY DO NOT UNDERSTAND THE M0-M1-M2 INFORMATION AND WHY THE MANTRA'D 30 TRILLION-60 TRILLION HAS [NOTHING] TO DO WITH THE REVALUATION!!

PLEASE STUDY FRACTIONAL [RESERVE] BANKING!

IRAQ IS WELL BELOW 4 TRILLION CURRENCY """""SUPPLY""""" WHERE AS U.S. IS NEAR 3 TRILLION CURRENCY """""SUPPLY""""".

Dave,

I think she's got you there. She DID say that you're wrong, so it must be true. Plus, she said in bold caps. What can you do?

Also, did you see her picture in her profile of her weiner dog in the passenger seat without a seatbelt? She ain't messing around.

Edited May 25, 2012 by jackster

[Rasica]

We do DD.

The link that you posted is titled "Local Price of Goods - Iraq Compared to Continent" The Continent is the Middle East and parts of North Africa.

This is the text on that site: "This is a cost of living indicator. The figure shows how much how much a bundle of goods and services costing US$1 in the US would cost in other countries (similar to The Economist's Big Mac Index). To arrive at the figure, the Global Property Guide takes the difference between the IMF's nominal GDP figures, and their purchasing power parity GDP figures for the latest year available. Note that currency undervaluation (as measured by PPP) is not a good predictor of future currency movements. These cost of living indicators refer to data collected annually"

This $.85 figure you're using in your posts has nothing to do with an exchange rate. 1 IQD does not equal $.85.

Milk in Iraq costs 2,155 IQD. Do not forget the comma after the "2". You inadvertently used a period. Big difference. And there is no "AFTER $.85 RELEASE".

Also, quit yelling. That's what you're doing when you use all caps. And what's with the bold text? Are you yelling in a deep voice?

So, let's say an RV happens at 1:1. Does the price of milk become 1.85 IQD? Does it remain at 2,155 IQD? Can you please answer that one question? Focus.

Your Milk of 1.85 IQD is not correct it is $1.85 USD (see my original chart below) or 2,155 IQD. If IQD is pegged at The Cost Of Living Index of $.85 aka; the "lifting" of three zeros from its PV of $.00085 the milk become 2.155 Dinars not 2,155.00 Dinars.

The $.85 is The Cost Of Living Index! OBTW you're Welcome!

To understand 1:1 we must accept the FACT that:

1) (Goods & Services) are pegged already to the USD by $.85.

2) IQD is not pegged to anything and is under 'tight monetary control'

This is my reply from the other day on this topic:

please study free floating exchange rate theory and tight monetary control which is for rapidly growing nation states like Iraq.

Iraq does not publish official house price statistics, and all other statistical work in Iraq is in abeyance (IQD is NOT) pegged to a GNP/GDP like all Nation States that deal with Re denomination/LOP/Exchange.

The IQD value of .00085 is for churning purposes through their choreographed 'auctions' to generate profit while Iraq rebuilds its Infrastructure through tight monetary control.

For those above who have a difficult time understanding the mechanics of 'tight monetary control' simply think "IQD is NOT real world yet" it has NOT been assigned a value in the world market place.

Please also remember that the USD is used for OIL transactions until IQD is pegged. For that matter, even though Iraqis use a government card for food etc, when they do come in contact with the IQD they shun from it and opt for the USD when possible. Its the PEOPLE of Iraq who want the IQD pegged.

Local Price of Goods - Iraq Compared to Continent ~

UAE $1.37 Kuwait $1.14 Israel $1.04 Qatar $0.95 Bahrain $0.86

Iraq $0.85

Notice that this price is exactly 3 zeros less than the 'tight monetary controlled' IQD $.00085 or 1165 to 1 USD

but Iraq's functioning value is at $.085 with an IQD that is simply being used presently by Iraqis which is not released to the real world

thus keeping Iraq safe from high or even higher hyperinflation that plagued Germany after WWII. Very smart move by Iraq and the IMF.

Saudi Arabia $0.83Oman $0.82Libya $0.78Jordan $0.77Algeria $0.69Lebanon $0.67Morocco $0.62Syria $0.60Yemen $0.58Iran $0.51Tunisia $0.48Egypt $0.45

Milk is $1.85 or 2,155 dinars

Cigarettes are $1.50 or 1747 dinars

Nike Tennis Shoes are $150 or 174,750 dinars

Rent 1 bedroom apartment/month is $416 or 484,640 dinars

Average income/month is $561.25 or 653,856 dinars

Cheese 1kg is $8.40 or 9,786 dinars

Average electricity bill/month for 2 bedroom apartment is $118 or 137,480 dinars

Rent/Electricity pretty much uses up 1 month salary

So when the GOI/CBI went ahead and purchased $1.5 Billion IQD from the free market place/month how did this affect the economy?

It simply kept this 'tight monetary controlled' economy in check by encouraging savings/loans and prices stable.

Why does Iraq want to revalue and then slowly re denominate? To incourage investments into Iraq and to encourage purchasing power

by every level of socioeconomic strata in Iraq within the competitive global economy.

This is a cost of living indicator. The figures show how much how much a bundle of goods and services costing US$1 in the US would cost in other countries (similar to The Economist's Big Mac Index).

To arrive at the figure, the Global Property Guide takes the difference between the IMF's nominal GDP figures, and their purchasing power parity GDP figures for the latest year available.

Note that currency undervaluation (as measured by PPP) is not a good predictor of future currency movements.

These cost of living indicators refer to data collected annually (for date of collection, see Data FAQ )

Source: calculated using figures from the IMF World Economic Outlook Database

Salaries - (are going up quickly)

entry level - 200,000 Dinars a month

experienced - 300,000 a month

professionals - 500,000 a month

Taxes are not being collected yet, no agency exists to collect them. Ready for June?

This post has been edited by Rasica: Yesterday, 04:32 PM

Read more: http://dinarvets.com...0#ixzz1vpqAP4vO

According to your scenario

Edited May 25, 2012 by Rasica

[DaveD]

This is truly like talking to a 3 year old child who just strings words together that have no meaning.

[dinarck]

Rich, I'm not here to make friends or enemies. I'm here to read and learn for myself. To me there is no problem and it's not my place to state otherwise. People have to decide for themselves what is right,we already have a gov that trys to be everyones best friend & oversee'er(is that a word?-lol) without succeeding at either. If you or anyone else wants to believe someone beit a "guru" or anyone else great,thats each's right/ responsibility. In countless of business's there is deception of the truth as well as our gov one would spend thousands of lifetimes tracking down such un-truths and still only scratch the surface. There are times when I believe you to be human and actually a good person not that it matters I doubt we will ever cross paths in the real world. But imo you gotta let it go,you can't save people from themselves. I do believe you believe you have this all figured out(dinar).........cool,and in your heart you think you are doing good. Heck some may even agree with you............cool also. But you gotta admit you're in the minority and your approach is kinda rough(putting it nicely). If your goal is to inform/help others try to understand the goal of a good communicator is being able to adapt to your audience. I promise to leave my thoughts to myself when it comes to YOUR posts-take care and much success.

You are right. I cannot save people from themselves. This is evident by the many regulars who still believe in fairy tales. What I can do is put out a point of view that is based in reality hoping that a few stary eyed ”investors” may read it and actually have something other than misinformation to base their decision on. I didnt have this when I got started.

Yes, I am in the minority. I find myself proud to be here. I will not follow along with economic fantasy because it means I will become an overnight millionare. I have enough common sense to know otherwise unlike the ”majority”.

Now that you will not respond to my ”aggression” any longer I fail to see how or why we would have a future exchange. With that being said, all the best to you as well.

[jackster]

This is truly like talking to a 3 year old child who just strings words together that have no meaning.

My grandson is almost 3. He can be frustrating at times just like Rasica and others.

[GotSix]

You are right. I cannot save people from themselves. This is evident by the many regulars who still believe in fairy tales. What I can do is put out a point of view that is based in reality hoping that a few stary eyed ”investors” may read it and actually have something other than misinformation to base their decision on. I didnt have this when I got started.

Yes, I am in the minority. I find myself proud to be here. I will not follow along with economic fantasy because it means I will become an overnight millionare. I have enough common sense to know otherwise unlike the ”majority”.

Now that you will not respond to my ”aggression” any longer I fail to see how or why we would have a future exchange. With that being said, all the best to you as well.

I'll be more than happy to respond & exchange with u big guy ....you know very well Caz is not one of those you need to save.....you sound sooo much like the left.....trying to impose & save us all.....most here know what's going on & do not need your holly guidance...soooo it would be appreciated that in the future you soley go after those who are truly on your agenda......

[jackster]

I'll be more than happy to respond & exchange with u big guy ....you know very well Caz is not one of those you need to save.....you sound sooo much like the left.....trying to impose & save us all.....most here know what's going on & do not need your holly guidance...soooo it would be appreciated that in the future you soley go after those who are truly on your agenda......

holly guidance? soley? what is soley? Couldn't find it in the dictionary. I found sole. Which can be a fish or the bottom of one's foot. And sole corporation.

Dinarck, go easy on him. He appears to be challenged to get his own thoughts in here, let alone trying to comprehend yours.