Apology To KeepMWlknfny

[gallinipper]

i think they will lop and revalue.

[Tropics]

500,000 iqd for an apartment is only $425 and 1000 iqd for a loaf of bread is under a dollar. That does not seem to me like prices are out of control. Hopefully we will soon find out who is right, but it cracks me up how many people willingly jump on the doom and gloom bandwagon.

[hoosier1470]

lol your going wayyyy too much into this man just wait and find out.

I agree, and also...Iraq has no notes anywhere as near as the notes that Turkey had previously! Im sorry, there are just way too many reasons that are obvious for Iraq not to need to LOP! Just read the articles, look at the history of other COMPARABLE situations...because every reval that has happened in other countries based their decisions on their own situation! And the situation in Iraq is totally different than almost any other possible reval in history! Just hang in there, and dont worry about the lop....its not going to happen!!! JMO!

[JuryPicker]

Anybody would have to lop with a 20 million dollar bill. From the pictures it would appear that the lowest bill was a One Hundred Thousand Dollar Note. I tend to look at the news and go just the opposite of what it says. Why would they need to pull the larger denoms in if they were just going to lop them to 25 Bucks? What difference would it make? And O Yea I Apologize too,,,,,,LOL

[JuryPicker]

[quote)

but it cracks me up how many people willingly jump on the doom and gloom bandwagon.

That's because 99.9 percent of people are negative by nature. Their parents were negative and their parents and on and on. The other .1 of people are usually Millionaires Plus.

[Legolas]

Keepm and many of the rest of us have repeatedly and eloquently attempted to explain in simple terms how reality trumps fantasy every time, but very few want to give up the dream of magically turning $1,000 into One Million, or even Three Million Dollars or more overnight. The math is relatively simple, without even looking at all of the OTHER facts which make any of this highly improbable. It has been no secret that there are at least 24 Trillion Dinars in circulation. If each of these Dinars suddenly becomes 1-3 DOLLARS, WHERE is the money going to come from to back it? And don't throw out terms like "fractional banking" to try to explain it. No matter how one tries to "fraction" it, 24-72 TRILLION DOLLARS is a ridiculous amount of money, even for any huge GROUP of countries, let alone a small country like Iraq which is struggling to even function, let alone thrive. They currently have an annual budget of roughly 86 BILLION Dollars, with a 17 Billion Dollar deficit, yet we think that TOMORROW, they will suddenly have 72 TRILLION DOLLARS in circulation, with a simple stroke of a pen. That should strike even the most delusional among us as virtually unfathomable.

Yes, Iraq may one day in the future become a relatively wealthy country, IF they somehow manage to overcome what is currently an overwhelming number of very significant issues. But 72 TRILLION dollars worth of success seems highly unlikely ,if not absolutely impossible even in the best of circumstances, and certainly not overnight. Yet people continue to listen to the pumpers and gurus, who every week tell us that "it's done" and for $3, $5 and even $6 per Dinar. The talk of removing the three zeros is likely to become a reality, but for entirely different reasons than we've been led to believe. It's fairly obvious by now that the zeros move is primarily about banking and economic simplification, making counting and purchasing much easier. Hopefully, with that simplification will come a slight increase in value. Finally, it should be obvious to any rational individual that they wouldn't be talking about this move year after year, and now almost daily for the past few weeks if there was any intention whatsoever of doing what the gurus and pumpers would like you to believe. Shabibi isn't an idiot by any stretch of the imagination.

[keepmwlknfny]

KeepM,

Last night I challenged you to your comment about whether or not there are actually 24+ trillion dinar in circulation. Around 3 last night I found the UNC article that gave detailed information as to the Turkey LOP. After reading the article and seeing that the median dropping of the zeros is 3, and wrapping my cerebral cortex around the rest of the article, I offer a sincere apology.

My battle has been in whether or not there were subsequent printings of the Dinar to replace the worn out bills over the last 7 years. This would be huge, if they were removed and not replaced, as it would greatly reduce the actual amount of physical Dinar world wide. I am amazed at the ineptitude of some to believe in a RV with 24-28 trillion Dinar in the float being able to RV at any actual value. What would prompt anyone to think that even with fractional banking that any country in the world could possibly sustain a 20-75 trillion dollar amount of physical currency in the marketplace? That is more than almost every country on earth combined! My only hope was that the removal of the 000's was that they were being withdrawn over the last couple of years to a more measurable amount of 20 billion.

After reading the article from the CBI and their insistence of removing the 3 (000's) and the definitive connection with Turkey it became evident that they are planning a LOP. We can only hope that Shabbibi keeps his inferred intent to bring the currency back to the 70's and 80's amount, after the LOP. This would equate to at least a tripling of most of us in this investment. Those who bought at 1100-1200 per million would see a cash in rate of 3000 to 3500.

Accept my apology and know I was not being argumentative against you but rather reading the articles and reports with a slant of they had already been removed during the last 12 to 24 months. Peace Out!

Hey bro,

No need to apologize!! Its all good my dude! I was just trying to point out a piece that most people probly just skim over and didnt actually catch....hell im guilty of the same thing at times!! I know you werent being argumentative, but I do like to have a debate over these topics to get to the bottom of things....I think alot of people get too wrapped up in what the gurus say because they spin these articles to mean its a straight up RV when in fact these articles (true or not) are pointing to a redenominaiton/lop.....and everytime these delete the zeros comes up so many people comment that this is great news when its the last thing that we want as investors.....it doesnt matter if Iraq is different then Turkey as far as production, or that Turkey had six zeros instead of three.....what these zeros articles have mentioned almost everytime is that the study is being copied from the process that happened in Turkey....using the situation in Turkey and what they did, as a guide almost to what they are planning in Iraq....which as we can see from what people have posted that it was NOT a straight up RV and that it was a redenomination/lop but the only good part is that when Turkey did lop, they raised the exchange rate which is pretty common when something like this happens......We should all understand that inflation is not the only reason countries lop...there are other reasons like monetary inflation and it even happens AFTER periods of hyperinflation when things stabilize in the economy....All Im doing is bringing all sides of this investment to the table, its not about trying to be negative or all doom and gloom, its seeing things for what they really are and taking the blinders off so that we can all be better prepared for whatever outcome there is.....I dont profess to know whats going to happen or when and Im not saying that its def going to lop.....just trying to clear up some confusion around these forums about what removing the zeros really is......STAY THIRSTY MY FRIENDS!!

Keepm and many of the rest of us have repeatedly and eloquently attempted to explain in simple terms how reality trumps fantasy every time, but very few want to give up the dream of magically turning $1,000 into One Million, or even Three Million Dollars or more overnight. The math is relatively simple, without even looking at all of the OTHER facts which make any of this highly improbable. It has been no secret that there are at least 24 Trillion Dinars in circulation. If each of these Dinars suddenly becomes 1-3 DOLLARS, WHERE is the money going to come from to back it? And don't throw out terms like "fractional banking" to try to explain it. No matter how one tries to "fraction" it, 24-72 TRILLION DOLLARS is a ridiculous amount of money, even for any huge GROUP of countries, let alone a small country like Iraq which is struggling to even function, let alone thrive. They currently have an annual budget of roughly 86 BILLION Dollars, with a 17 Billion Dollar deficit, yet we think that TOMORROW, they will suddenly have 72 TRILLION DOLLARS in circulation, with a simple stroke of a pen. That should strike even the most delusional among us as virtually unfathomable.

Yes, Iraq may one day in the future become a relatively wealthy country, IF they somehow manage to overcome what is currently an overwhelming number of very significant issues. But 72 TRILLION dollars worth of success seems highly unlikely ,if not absolutely impossible even in the best of circumstances, and certainly not overnight. Yet people continue to listen to the pumpers and gurus, who every week tell us that "it's done" and for $3, $5 and even $6 per Dinar. The talk of removing the three zeros is likely to become a reality, but for entirely different reasons than we've been led to believe. It's fairly obvious by now that the zeros move is primarily about banking and economic simplification, making counting and purchasing much easier. Hopefully, with that simplification will come a slight increase in value. Finally, it should be obvious to any rational individual that they wouldn't be talking about this move year after year, and now almost daily for the past few weeks if there was any intention whatsoever of doing what the gurus and pumpers would like you to believe. Shabibi isn't an idiot by any stretch of the imagination.

Well put Legolas!! Nice to see you still around bro!!

[Legolas]

Well put Legolas!! Nice to see you still around bro!!

Thanks Keep.......it gets harder every day to continue reading the posted insanity, but I'm still around. Keep up the good work!

[keepmwlknfny]

but it cracks me up how many people willingly jump on the doom and gloom bandwagon.

So comprehending all aspects of this investment classifies as jumping on the doom and gloom bandwagon?? Thats one hell of a thought process you have there! We are all here for the same reason, to make money....its just that some have been around enough to know the difference between fact and fiction and what we are really facing.....aka we took the blinders off....we are in no way confessing that this is how its going to happen or that it will.....just that its a possibility and the fact of these zeros articles being a bad thing for this investment....

[explorer]

No Kidding!

lol your going wayyyy too much into this man just wait and find out.

[Darin]

We can't really compare Iraq situations to others, since every other situation is like comparing apples to oranges.

Yes, they have articles talking about the removal of 3 0's. We've seen, removed, lifted, and raising the 3 zeros in the articles.

Yes, we can assume that it could mean the removal of the 3 0's from a nominal value, or the currency itself.

Either way, this is going to cost the GOI & CBI money to do so. Because they'll need to print new bills.

We may not necessarily know how much is in circulation. -- We can only see public #s, which may not be accurate, and could be smoke.

Here is a question though, the currency was introduced in 2003... With bills of 000s, and the question I wonder is why introduce so many 000s if a LOP was predicted in the near future.

Why spend so much $, time, and effort, if with all the 000s you were going to need to LOP in the future.

What about the buying & selling the CBI makes as the value raises??

How is the everyday citizen going to feel comfortable using the dinar if once again they have to trade their old currency for new currency

Than consider that if there is currently if there is 24-27T in circulation, a lop would make that 24-27B in IQD value which is roughly 21-25 Billion in USD value.

I think the U.S. alone is pushing 1 trillion in hard currency (value wise). And we prefer the use of electronic currency

Iraq prefers the use of hard-currency as the banks are pushing them to become familiar with the use of electronic cards.

Some see the logical way is to LOP - but its hard to fathom the idea that they would spend that sort of money, and do that sort of work just to reduce carrying cash.

A LOP is in the realm of possibilities, but, I think for us, the more reasonable way of going about things is actually a slow rising in value over time. CBI makes money on the buy/sell of IQD.

Which is what most speculative investors prefer not see, as that will mean a very long wait. IMO it is a situation I deem worse than a LOP because we will always be thinking it could RV at any time.

At least with a LOP we see movement, it puts an end to the ride, and we sit there thinking roughly the most we may make is roughly 3 times our original investment.

[gbrlgms]

Sorry no link but here is article.

An advisor of the Iraqi Central Bank, Dr. Mohammed Saleh appearance that the bank adheres to its policy regarding the removal of three zeros from Iraqi dinar traded at present.

The Chancellor said in an interview for Radio Free Iraq that the application of political restructuring of the Iraqi currency would fix the management problems, faced by the inflation of the cash block in the country’s $ 28 trillion dinars, especially since the structure of the current currency is no longer commensurate with the prices and costs in Iraq.

He said the Iraqi Central Bank Consultant to the current situation was appropriate to start this project, which would boost the Iraqi economy, but on this project must first get approval from the Iraqi government, which in turn be submitted to the Iraqi Council of Representatives for approval.

The proposal to delete three zeros from the currency has triggered controversy among economists of Iraqis and was the most prominent points of disagreement among them on what could be its implications on the economic sector, especially in the case of operation, a sudden and fast.

This has prompted the dispute, an economist on behalf of the Patriarchs, which had already been for years an economic adviser to the Iraqi Central Bank show that the fear of the implementation of the project at this time despite the completion of all studies about him the fact that the economic situation does not help that.

To that, the adviser to the Central Bank of the appearance of Mohammed Saleh, said that such fears are unwarranted, and that the economic situation in Iraq is good and able to withstand the application of this project, and that this experience had previously been applied in countries such as Turkey, which has by deleting six zeros from the currency before the period is not too distant future.

well,this is the problem Dr. Mohammed Saleh blows a lot of smoke and a lot of confusion if you have been following his patterns you will know that this guy job is to confuse,there have been many ocassions that dr shabibi has come out to rectify the statements from Dr. Mohammed Saleh.You need to follow the patterns of all the articles and you will see that most of the time are smokes.Only listen what shabibi has to say.

lol your going wayyyy too much into this man just wait and find out.

that what iam saying just wait and relax.nobody knows for sure,nobody here knows how this is going to go down.take a chill.

[tjmunson]

My only question is....what the heck is Bill Maher doing on the Turkish currency???

[Fred A]

If theres a lop and flop, theres nothing anywhere saying it wont happen again in the future,even with new currency then . this is the chance we take. heck i hat eto say it but ill give myself a - for this. means nothing to me anyway.

Edited April 17, 2011 by Fred A

[wingsofhope]

Thanks for the effort Ore, you have discovered the real LOP/RV numbers. The Kool Aid Groupies will bash away as usual but dont let it get to you

[keepmwlknfny]

Thanks for the effort Ore, you have discovered the real LOP/RV numbers. The Kool Aid Groupies will bash away as usual but dont let it get to you

Yep...I second that...good job Ore!

[Old Constipate]

1+1=3 and 3+3= 1 1/2.

If you can follow that you are on the verge of thinking like an Iraqi.

It seems to me I remember reading many times that Iraq doesn't follow our reasoning patterns. So to say it is unreasonable to LOP seems to mean there is a good chance they will.

And to think all of this is under Apology to keepmwlknfny.

Keep up the good work and keep the opinions coming. We enjoy it all.