Good reason not to lop

[lookin4dough]

I am new to this forum and I am not looking to argue. I have a considerable amount of dinar and like all of you, hope that an RV happens soon. I have read just about all of the posts in the LOP talk section and have done extensive research on my own. I have seen the numerous reports indicating that Iraq is considering lopping the 3 zeros off of their currency. My question is why wouldn't they? As others have stated, doing this would keep billions of dollars inside Iraq, that would be paid out in the event of a generous RV. I know that many people believe that many governments including our own have large reserves of Dinar and would be mad if Iraq "defaulted" on their currency, but in reality, with the amounts these countries hold, even with the lop, they should make out well. Iraq is a country coming out of a time of turmoil, so if they did want to lop the zeros, do you really believe they would worry about long term "damage" to the power of the dinar? It's kind of like a company going through bankruptcy, a lot of people included in the bankruptcy lose what is owed them and are pissed off, but if it's a significant enough company, these same people are probably dealing with the same company a year or two later. Again, I am not trying to start arguments, but I am looking for some good valid reasons why I shouldn't worry about a LOP.

[Triple xXx]

I am new to this forum and I am not looking to argue. I have a considerable amount of dinar and like all of you, hope that an RV happens soon. I have read just about all of the posts in the LOP talk section and have done extensive research on my own. I have seen the numerous reports indicating that Iraq is considering lopping the 3 zeros off of their currency. My question is why wouldn't they? As others have stated, doing this would keep billions of dollars inside Iraq, that would be paid out in the event of a generous RV. I know that many people believe that many governments including our own have large reserves of Dinar and would be mad if Iraq "defaulted" on their currency, but in reality, with the amounts these countries hold, even with the lop, they should make out well. Iraq is a country coming out of a time of turmoil, so if they did want to lop the zeros, do you really believe they would worry about long term "damage" to the power of the dinar? It's kind of like a company going through bankruptcy, a lot of people included in the bankruptcy lose what is owed them and are pissed off, but if it's a significant enough company, these same people are probably dealing with the same company a year or two later. Again, I am not trying to start arguments, but I am looking for some good valid reasons why I shouldn't worry about a LOP.

I am just trying to understand what exactly "deleting the zeros" or LOP actually is. I have heard multiple definitions.

[marknet73]

I totally see what you're asking and why you're asking it. I own a considerable amount of dinars and got into this investment to make some BIG money. I've done a whole lot of research and it just seems to me like it's in their best interest not to lop. I think with all of their assets and economic potential that they can afford at least a modest RV - maybe not $3.22 or $5.72 like some people are saying but somewhere between .10 and 1 US dollar. This would go a long ways towards helping boost their economy and paying off all their debts and a lot of the articles I've read are saying that this has to happen in order for them to get Chapter 7 dropped. On the other hand some of the actual news articles I've seen lately talk about removing 3 zeros from the currency which to me would mean exchanging a 25K bill for a 25 dollar bill (no net gain or loss). Maybe this is just a smoke screen and the big shots want to keep the fact of an upcoming RV secret to keep out additional investors. It seems to me that a lop is done in countries where there is high inflation with little potential for economic growth. It doesn't seem like that would be in Iraq's best interest. Plus the value has been super steady (1165-1170 to the USD) for the past few years and it seems like that's been kept artificially low. There's so much information out there that it's easy to get confused with all the numbers. This is a super high risk investment but the potential payoff is huge if they do RV. I'm definitely glad I'm in on it but I'd also like more convincing information as to why a LOP can't happen. Hopefully this rollercoaster ride will be over soon and we can all make a nice fat return on our investment. Cheers.

[Triple xXx]

I think with all of their assets and economic potential that they can afford at least a modest RV - maybe not $3.22 or $5.72 like some people are saying but somewhere between .10 and 1 US dollar. This would go a long ways towards helping boost their economy and paying off all their debts and a lot of the articles I've read are saying that this has to happen in order for them to get Chapter 7 dropped.

So you have actually read in black and white where the Dinar MUST be revalued in order for the Chapter 7 to be released???

[marknet73]

So you have actually read in black and white where the Dinar MUST be revalued in order for the Chapter 7 to be released???

Nothing in black and white from the news but I'm sure someone on this site probably has something that can enlighten us both. Most of what I'm going by on the Chapter 7 deal is just people's opinions. I've attached the article I read a few months back talking about the Ch. 7. Hopefully this is the case but honestly there are a ton of opinions out there on what can happen, I just hope we all can make a good profit on our investment. Well, time to feed my 21 month old and run some errands. I'll be back on here tonight and try to find out some more positive info.

Here is an article that will help. The part at the end about "Life on Mars" is a conspiracy theory and is supposed to predict when the Dinar will revalue (or RV).

Iraq is under chapter 7 UN sanctions and as we all know we may see the removal or modification of Chapter 7 sanctions this Tuesday the 16th as the UNSC meets on this very issue.

Chapter 7 is the 7th chapter of the UN charter which places nations under strong international economic sanctions.

Iraq has been under UN Chapter 7 sanctions from 1991 until present.

They were placed under these sanctions right after the invasion of Kuwait.

It was under the authority of Chapter 7 sanctions that the UN/IMF/World Bank came into Iraq and took over the Central bank and the currency of Iraq.

When they did this they deemed all Iraqi Saddam Dinars void and issued the New Iraqi Dinar that we now hold.

This company DelaRue printed 9 Trillion IQD and they introduced this in October of 2003 and gave the Iraqis 3 months to exchange the old for the new.

A total of 4.5 trillion was exchanged and went into circulation and the rest was placed into protective storage.

When the new IQD was printed there were 14 denominations printed but only 9 have been issued to date and it is speculated the lower denominations that were not released are the ones that are about to go into circulation now as they remove the larger “zero notes”

It is speculated that the 5 missing denominations that we are about to see are the 25 dinar the 10 dinar the 5 dinar the 1 dinar and the 1/2 dinar notes.

When they did this change of currency they also devalued the currency to near worthless.

This massive devaluation was done for specific reasons.

Reason 1 was to prevent and hinder the resistance from having the funding to fight the US and British forces.

And the second reason was to prevent or reduce the pending humanitarian disaster that would have been caused by a flood of refugees into surrounding nations.

So by doing this massive over night devaluation they effectively froze/removed the personal monetary assets of all Iraqis.

Now it is under this same authority of the UN Chapter 7 and the sweeping powers it gives the international community over Iraqi assets that the revaluation of the Iraqi Dinar will happen and this also provides the legal bases of same.

So all that we will be seeing when the revaluation takes place is the return of the assets which were removed from the nation of Iraq and its people.

It is not like the nation of Iraq will be getting something out of no where…it is just that what was taken from the people and the nation of Iraq will be returned and even then only a fraction of what they once had.

So the reality of the situation is that after all is said and done the nation of Iraq after coming out of near 20 years of economic sanctions and after the return of the assets and wealth to the people and nation of Iraq the value of the Iraqi Dinar even AFTER the revaluation will be a fraction of what it was pre UN sanctions.

As it should be.

So what we are seeing now with all of the confusing articles on the removal of zeros is to be expected.

My analysis of all of the “removal of zero” articles is the following:

1. They are about to revalue the Iraqi Dinar to at or just above $1.00.

2. They at the same time will place into circulation the lower denominations, 25,10,5,1, and 1/2 dinar notes.

3. They will then give a set time for the removal of the “3 zero notes” (large denominations) and that deadline may be the end of 2010.

Now I have always thought we would see the removal of Chapter 7 sanctions at or near the same time as the revaluation of the Iraqi Dinar and as stated before we see that they have set this Tuesday the 16th for the meeting on this very subject.

So that is it…we see Iraq moving forward with the free and open democratic elections and we have the UNSC meeting this very week on the removal of Chapter 7 sanctions so all in all things are looking great.

So I just thought I would share this refresher with all on just where we have come from in an effort to clarify just where we now stand.

Hope that helps.

Edited December 5, 2010 by marknet73

[Traconesu02]

I see this deletion of zeros and increasing the value of the dinar one and the same.

If the smaller denominations come out and say a 25 dinar note is worth the same as a 25000 dinar note is worth.

Then the iraqi people will be able to purchase the same products with 1 dinar which they used to have to pay 1000 dinar for.

Where they used to pay 1000 dinar for an item they will give the vendor 1 dinar.

He is happy because that one dinar is worth the same as the 1000 dinar that he used to get for that same item.

Now since 1 dinar is worth as much as 1000 dinar used to be worth.

That 1 dinar is now worth .86 USD

Iraq has just deleted the 3 zeros as they put it and increased the value of their dinar all at once.

With the RV completed - we can now exchange our dinar at the new value of .86 USD per dinar.

Through our banking system and US Treasury those larger notes that we hold will be returned to Iraq and destroyed.

JMHO -

I am not going to answer any slamming.

I am simply giving you my personal opinion on the deletion of zeros.

You can slam this all you want - it is simply the way I believe this will all pan out.

If it does not work out this way - then OK. That is the way the cookie crumbles so to speak.

God Bless Us All.

[lookin4dough]

I totally see what you're asking and why you're asking it. I own a considerable amount of dinars and got into this investment to make some BIG money. I've done a whole lot of research and it just seems to me like it's in their best interest not to lop. I think with all of their assets and economic potential that they can afford at least a modest RV - maybe not $3.22 or $5.72 like some people are saying but somewhere between .10 and 1 US dollar. This would go a long ways towards helping boost their economy and paying off all their debts and a lot of the articles I've read are saying that this has to happen in order for them to get Chapter 7 dropped. On the other hand some of the actual news articles I've seen lately talk about removing 3 zeros from the currency which to me would mean exchanging a 25K bill for a 25 dollar bill (no net gain or loss). Maybe this is just a smoke screen and the big shots want to keep the fact of an upcoming RV secret to keep out additional investors. It seems to me that a lop is done in countries where there is high inflation with little potential for economic growth. It doesn't seem like that would be in Iraq's best interest. Plus the value has been super steady (1165-1170 to the USD) for the past few years and it seems like that's been kept artificially low. There's so much information out there that it's easy to get confused with all the numbers. This is a super high risk investment but the potential payoff is huge if they do RV. I'm definitely glad I'm in on it but I'd also like more convincing information as to why a LOP can't happen. Hopefully this rollercoaster ride will be over soon and we can all make a nice fat return on our investment. Cheers.

Hey Marknet, thanks for the answer. It get's confusing reading the different opinions on the forum. Thanks again.

[Triple xXx]

I see this deletion of zeros and increasing the value of the dinar one and the same.

If the smaller denominations come out and say a 25 dinar note is worth the same as a 25000 dinar note is worth.

Then the iraqi people will be able to purchase the same products with 1 dinar which they used to have to pay 1000 dinar for.

Where they used to pay 1000 dinar for an item they will give the vendor 1 dinar.

He is happy because that one dinar is worth the same as the 1000 dinar that he used to get for that same item.

Now since 1 dinar is worth as much as 1000 dinar used to be worth.

That 1 dinar is now worth .86 USD

Iraq has just deleted the 3 zeros as they put it and increased the value of their dinar all at once.

With the RV completed - we can now exchange our dinar at the new value of .86 USD per dinar.

Through our banking system and US Treasury those larger notes that we hold will be returned to Iraq and destroyed.

JMHO -

I am not going to answer any slamming.

I am simply giving you my personal opinion on the deletion of zeros.

You can slam this all you want - it is simply the way I believe this will all pan out.

If it does not work out this way - then OK. That is the way the cookie crumbles so to speak.

God Bless Us All.

Something seems wrong with that math!

If 1 IQD= $0.86 and 25,000 IQD= $25 THEN......if I cash in one 25,000 IQD ($25) I will have $21.50 NOT $21,500!!!!!!!!!!!!

I think that is the other way around. A 25,000 note is equal to $25. $25 is not equal to 25,000......

Edited December 5, 2010 by Triple xXx

[Traconesu02]

Something seems wrong with that math!

If 1 IQD= $0.86 and 25,000 IQD= $25 THEN......if I cash in one 25,000 IQD ($25) I will have $21.50 NOT $21,500!!!!!!!!!!!!

I think that is the other way around. A 25,000 note is equal to $25. $25 is not equal to 25,000......

I am sorry - I did not have any $25 anywhere in my calculations. You must have got that from some other post.

[ECSxFenrir]

My understanding of a lop seems to be extremely unfair to the Iraqi citizens. Let me know if this example makes any sense:

I'm an American citizen, for whatever reason our country falls, value of the USD is stripped away. I kept large sums of money in my house in a mattress. So I've kept everything in physical form and not in the bank. So before sanctions or whatever caused the USD to fall I was well off. Now through these long yrs I've been able to hold onto a bulk of my physical money and now chpt 7 is going to be lifted with a lop...before everything went south I was well off at the rate of $3+ under Sadam. Now it's worth .86? I'm not too thrilled to have set through all this war and anguish to have my phone now be worth so little.

As I also recall the government officials are paid in IQD, right? I personally wouldn't be pleased or back a lop. Persuading M and S would be in my best interest for a higher but realistic RV or RI.

Please let me know the holes in my assumptions.

[marknet73]

Hey Marknet, thanks for the answer. It get's confusing reading the different opinions on the forum. Thanks again.

Looking4dough, I'm glad I could hopefully help a little bit. I agree with that post at the end that a lop wouldn't be too good for Iraqi citizens and it seems like it would discourage investment. No matter what happens I see their currency appreciating in value over the long haul. I think a modestly higher RV rate - nothing crazy - will go a long ways towards giving their currency more status and stimulating investment over there. I still want to see more concrete answers as to why it has to RV and how that will positively effect their economy much better than a plain and simple removal of the zeros from the currency.

[ECSxFenrir]

Looking4dough, I'm glad I could hopefully help a little bit. I agree with that post at the end that a lop wouldn't be too good for Iraqi citizens and it seems like it would discourage investment. No matter what happens I see their currency appreciating in value over the long haul. I think a modestly higher RV rate - nothing crazy - will go a long ways towards giving their currency more status and stimulating investment over there. I still want to see more concrete answers as to why it has to RV and how that will positively effect their economy much better than a plain and simple removal of the zeros from the currency.

I'm not a "#'s" type of guy but I agree it would be nice to see in numbers combined with the different theories (lop, RV-ea rate & a RI) over time how the Iraqi and global markets would be effected. Those showing which one is most profitable and feasible. Sounds like an expensive ass project that I'm sure someome somewhere has done. Maybe the big wigs who will put hedge funds into the investment have already done it.

[keepmwlknfny]

There really arent any good, solid reasons to NOT lop.........we just have to hope and pray!!

[marknet73]

I'm not a "#'s" type of guy but I agree it would be nice to see in numbers combined with the different theories (lop, RV-ea rate & a RI) over time how the Iraqi and global markets would be effected. Those showing which one is most profitable and feasible. Sounds like an expensive ass project that I'm sure someome somewhere has done. Maybe the big wigs who will put hedge funds into the investment have already done it.

I totally agree! It would be awesome to see that.

[rocketman2010]

Well you have too look at it as if you were a poor Iraqie 25,000 Dinars is 25 U.S dollars. And it only gets you $25 worth of food. Removing three zeros gives you $25 dinar. RVed at $3 is $75 worth of food. The Iraqie will be Happy.

[DgreenFSU66]

I see this deletion of zeros and increasing the value of the dinar one and the same.

If the smaller denominations come out and say a 25 dinar note is worth the same as a 25000 dinar note is worth.

Then the iraqi people will be able to purchase the same products with 1 dinar which they used to have to pay 1000 dinar for.

Where they used to pay 1000 dinar for an item they will give the vendor 1 dinar.

He is happy because that one dinar is worth the same as the 1000 dinar that he used to get for that same item.

Now since 1 dinar is worth as much as 1000 dinar used to be worth.

That 1 dinar is now worth .86 USD

Iraq has just deleted the 3 zeros as they put it and increased the value of their dinar all at once.

With the RV completed - we can now exchange our dinar at the new value of .86 USD per dinar.

Through our banking system and US Treasury those larger notes that we hold will be returned to Iraq and destroyed.

JMHO -

I am not going to answer any slamming.

I am simply giving you my personal opinion on the deletion of zeros.

You can slam this all you want - it is simply the way I believe this will all pan out.

If it does not work out this way - then OK. That is the way the cookie crumbles so to speak.

God Bless Us All.

i also see this as the way that they will go. it keeps it easy on the vendors and the banking system. plus it coincides with the statements that 25 dinar will be the same as 25,000 note.

[KeithZ]

Something seems wrong with that math!

If 1 IQD= $0.86 and 25,000 IQD= $25 THEN......if I cash in one 25,000 IQD ($25) I will have $21.50 NOT $21,500!!!!!!!!!!!!

I think that is the other way around. A 25,000 note is equal to $25. $25 is not equal to 25,000......

You would actually have $29.25 usd if you started with $25.00 usd.....in this case a of a .86 IQD RV 1.17USD would equal 1 Dinar

[ECSxFenrir]

Well you have too look at it as if you were a poor Iraqie 25,000 Dinars is 25 U.S dollars. And it only gets you $25 worth of food. Removing three zeros gives you $25 dinar. RVed at $3 is $75 worth of food. The Iraqie will be Happy.

Ok I can see the point from a poor person. But from my scenario where you were well off now your stack of physical IQD is worth A LOT less. Buying something that is $75 worth makes sense is prices remain the same after a lop. Would they?

Also what if I'm wealthy in IQD like a politician. I want a RV/RI because if not its true I didn't lose out by the lop in country but my buying power outside of the country is crap right? For goods that come into the country of substantial wealth like a lamborghini is going to cost how much IQD? So you can't purchase it out of the country because the value of your money and inside would still like a wheelbarrel if you had physical IQD.

I apologize if this is convoluted I'm on my phone and the idea of a lop still seems odd to me. I know it has been dome before but in this case it seems it would do a disservice to the citizens than what may be achieved economically as a country. Feels like you trade crap situation for another.

Edited December 7, 2010 by ECSxFenrir