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"Enoch8" chat

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Enoch Chat ~ August 17, 2011

Enoch8: Eagle just got his hands on this and published it on the Hub.

Enoch8: That doc is partly where I arrived at some of my own views and data.

Enoch8: I had lost it.... due to forgetting to rename it LOL

Enoch8: Got all excited and forgot to rename it.

Chuckles: yeah my "Iraq info" folder is getting pretty stuffed

Enoch8: ha ha

Enoch8: CBI docs alone is getting a bit large

Chuckles: good times, hope this ride is almost over in terms of seeing something happen

Chuckles: lots of positive things for sure

Enoch8: Did you guys notice, that there were 74 Trillion IQD in liquid assets, in 2009?

Chuckles: some serious coinage

Enoch8: Over and above the budget, I might add.

Chuckles: still Iraq's US reserves are about what roughly 46 billion and what is Kuwait is around 20 billion

Chuckles: at the end of 2010

Enoch8: Right.... and we also pointed out, that the oil and budget is gaining money and adding to that each year.

Enoch8: Good way to ruin an economy.

Enoch8: It might of had to do with one of the development programs or something.

Enoch8: They have the money and do not need to take it from CBI Reserves.

Enoch8: I forget what they wanted it for.

Chuckles: [link to www.economywa...s]

Chuckles: i like the stats on the right when you scroll down

Chuckles: that's 2010

Chuckles: but you've probably seen this

Enoch8: Close.....

Enoch8: Some of that was projected in the MOP doc

Enoch8: Feasibility and de flate-ors.

Enoch8: It also is consistent with oil prices in 1988 and today..... about 630% Inflation on world market.

Enoch8: 1988 Basis year.... there was about $80 Billion worth of ID, in circulation.

Enoch8: That alone means the demand is up by 6.3 times.

Enoch8: My estimate from the MOP doc was that they needed to have about $560 Billion worth in circulation, to be with 1988 standard.....

Enoch8: Today at today's rate... there are on about $26 Billion worth in circulation.

Enoch8: That tells me, they are at least 20 times undervalued, even with $30 Trillion in circulation.

Enoch8: That also does not factor in 35% increase in population or the need additional incomes to double the standard of living from that time.

Chuckles: yeah that is the kicker, and with 80% now having cell phones and internet

Chuckles: the word can travel fast

Enoch8: Right..... and I ain't near done with this...

Enoch8: That tells me..... (Even with $30 Trillion in circulation,) they need a minimum of a 58 to one increase in the Rate.

Enoch8: And....

Enoch8: I am still not done...

Enoch8: The world demand for IQD is at least 5 times that.... due to the fact that international corporations and treasuries are doing 5 times the volume of holding foreign currency reserves..... and Iraq was not even on their radar back then.

Enoch8: That means with all those combined factors..... (Even with 30 Trillion in circulation)..... they could be easily as much as 290 times undervalued.... once it is a recognized currency.

Enoch8: EVEN WITH 30 T in circulation!!!

Enoch8: See it?

Chuckles: yeah crazy

Enoch8: OK.... now dig this....

Enoch8: As of 2009, there was 22 Trillion out of Iraq....

Enoch8: Today that is about 23 Trillion.

Enoch8: That means, about 75% will go to international treasuries and removed from circulation.... and they simply monetize non liquid assets to cover that 75%..... effectively paying for it in futures, etc. by monetizing non liquid assets, that are worth more.

Enoch8: That effectively increases the value another 4 times.

Enoch8: 290 x 4 = 1163 Times increase in the Nominal Rate.

Enoch8: 1163 x .00086 = 1 to 1

Enoch8: Bottom side....

Enoch8: BUT

Enoch8: if that number removed is 85%..... then it is higher.

Enoch8: Roughly about 10 or 15% higher.

Enoch8: How close is that, to the Feasibility number?

Enoch8: $1.134

Enoch8: AND

Enoch8: If they remove soiled bills from circulation once they do this..... or accounting for math errors..... we get to close to the $1.30

Chuckles: hmm, that would be a sweet spot

Enoch8: $1.42 based on the MOP projected de flaitors for 2011.

Enoch8: Yep

Enoch8: 1.00 to about 1.50

Enoch8: And this is used in Traditional Gravity Equations, to arrive at PPP Optimum Equilibrium Exchange Rates.

Enoch8: This is also why it may never increase back to over 3.00.... because it creates a Trade Deficit..... in the non oil sector.

Enoch8: Not good for the people or the economy..... or the stability, to go over that.

Enoch8: This is from some very sharp Harvard Economists and others.

Chuckles: You're on a roll..LOL!

Enoch8: They make me look like a 1st grader!

Enoch8: I just saw your question about CBI (the question was why haven't we seen the DFI funds reflected on the books?)

Enoch8: They could not add those back to these as liquid assets until June 30, 2011 and the audits are not out yet, for how that adds to this.... and not to mention.... there are hundreds of accounts out there, that would add to these amounts.... like the one last week for over $100 Million Dollars.

Enoch8: Who knows how much these other unreleased funds are, exactly?

Enoch8: Saddam had accounts all over the world, hiding and laundering money.

Enoch8: Not to mention his allies.

Enoch8: Copy it and post it in your forum, if you like.

Chuckles: cool, i was gonna ask that

Chuckles: thanks, Peace!

Figures based at the end of 2010


Central bank Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System (Washington) International Reserves US$ 132.375 billion (Source: IMF; Data updated: November 2010) Gross Domestic Product - GDP US$ 15.227 trillion (2010 estimate) GDP (Purchasing Power Parity) 15.227 trillion of International dollars (2010 estimate)


Central bank Central Bank of Iraq International Reserves US$ 46.8 billion (31 December 2008 estimate) Gross Domestic Product - GDP US$ 108.418 billion (2010 estimate) GDP (Purchasing Power Parity) 125.665 billion of International dollars (2010 estimate) Real GDP growth


Central bank Central Bank of Kuwait International Reserves US$ 20.267 billion (Source: World Bank; Data updated: December 2009) Gross Domestic Product - GDP US$ 172.778 billion (2009 estimate) GDP (Purchasing Power Parity) 145.292 billion of International dollars (2009 estimate)

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Yes, I know the above is old, and it was already posted in the chat logs. I thought it might get people back into focus here of why we're in this investment, if some good hard numbers were thrown out there.

I'm not saying a date and or rate--- but the logic to these chats are pretty sound

here is another [older] chat by Enoch 8


Putting the new figures together.

Part I

Even the most hard core lopster out there, could not make a legitimate argument, that .000865 is not based on only 50% of the $43 Billion Reserves claimed previously. ($43 Billion divided by 27 Trillion in circulation, are the earlier publications from both CBI and the IMF is using only about 50% of the value of the reserves to support the Program, Defacto Rate, $.000865. The REER, (Real Estimated Exchange Rate) in IMF Public Information Notice published Feb 10, 2010, reflects 292 vs 1170, which is the DeJure Rate, mentioned also by the IMF, stating that Iraq is using a Defacto Conventional Peg, and has a 2 rate system. The REER as of Dec 2009 shown by the IMF is $.00342, about 200% of the Reserves, that were at that time, $43 Billion.

Earlier this year, in March, we talked about the fact that the 2010 budget, approved was based on $62.50 Oil. Now that increase is hitting the books. This year, they are planning a 2011 Budget based on $70 Oil, that is expected to be well over $100 per barrel in 2011. So, here we go again.

$50 Billion, In Reserves, will increase even the Program Defacto Rate, at 50%, even in the worst nightmarish argument the most hard core lopster could make, not including removal of much of the 27 Trillion, and even without the additional investments into Iraq, as this article suggests….. and not including doubling the economy….. you can figure the REER to be at the worst possible scenario…… on the world exchange, to be revised to 250 % of the Reserve for the REER Value, because Iraq last month was decreased from 25% Fractional Reserve, in lending requirements, to 20%.

So….. here is how that information figures…… plan on about double, that Reserve, at the point of an RV, to a minimum of $100 Billion, based on the projections of doubling the economy,,,(Which is under estimating it by 10 times, in my opinion…), but go with that. 20% Fractional Reserve Requirement means you can multiply that by 5 times, to an estimated $500 Billion as the basis for the REER of the same 27 Trillion.

$500 Billion divided by 27 Trillion IQD = $.0185….. which is almost 2 cents…. even without removal of zeros. Seems like we have been here before, haven’t we? LOL

Stay with me here. I am nowhere near done running this.

OK….. CBI has stated all year long, they plan on removal of the large bills from circulation. They have stated they have only about $7 Trillion in the combined Stock and Quazi Stock….. the M2.

That means that about 70% of the zeros are already removed, because they are now in the reserves of other countries and supported by the investments of those countries an converted into Oil, Gold, Natural Gas, Banking Programs and numerous other investments into Iraq, further increasing their Reserves and Increasing the Value of the remaining M2.

Here is the preliminary math, before any further removal of IQD, which does not yet include, adding the 5 items listed by the IMF, in page 31 of the most recent addendum to Article XIV SBA, that Non Convertible Currency, Non Mint Precious Metals, Non Liquid assets, IE OIL and Natural Gas,,,, etc, etc, Lending Interest, OFAC Blocked Accounts and Frozen Assets, etc, etc……

Part II

Take the same $500 Billion figure we just did in part I, and use the last reported M2…. to get a new figure for the REER that would likely be the IMF Art. VIII rate.

$500 Billion divided by 7 Trillion IQD, is just over 7 cents, $.0714 and we still have not removed any more zeros than what is already removed. Remember…. 70% have already been removed.

I do not usually endorse F26, but he is partly right about that, just in a different way of saying it.

Now…. We are not yet done.

Once the IMF places Iraq and CBI back into Article VIII, meaning they have a Convertible Currency, there are estimates all over the ball park, as to how much that is figured in the amount remaining of OFAC Frozen and Blocked assets and Saddam Money and Gold, after the Paris Club is settled with BIS who is the overseer of the settlements with Raafadin and Ramadi along with the other debts, in UN Chap VII. Those figures will add several Hundred Billion to those Reserves, after the debt settlements. Also, the Non Mint Prcious Metals would get added to these figures.

Also, however much IQD, the CBI holds in Reserves, will then be convertible and added to that amount. That is several Trillion worth in Dollars value. Currently under Art. XIV SBA they are not allowed to include IQD in the Reserves, because it is not convertible, YET. LOL How funny is that!!!

Also….. you could add other futures, treasuries and lending assets to this Reserves amount under Art VIII that are not allowed to be used under Art. XIV agreements.

I have no earthly idea, what exactly these amounts might be, but have figured all year, that these Reserves would support just over $1.00 maybe a significant amount more, and without any further removal of IQD, that is not replaced immediately, by the smaller bills.

This is in now way a prediction of $1.13….. but is it not true, the Ministry of Planning told us that as a model number 4 years ago? Well that 3 year projection has been over for over a year. Who knows for sure, where that will come out at now? Anything else is unsubstantiated and is 100% speculation. I think we can almost prove conclusively, it is over a Dollar…. sorry but I could not prove any more than that. But I also cannot disprove it either.

Do you see it?

They can cover just over a dollar right now and the zeros are already removed!

Get it ? ~ How cool is this?

Reply With Quote Reply With Quote

Edited by Bumper64
can't post links to other Dinar sites!
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According to several of our IQD smarty pants, Enoch8 is supposed to be scary smart. He is regarded to be at the pinnacle of the intellect spectrum when it comes to economics.

And, no, I do not have a link.

Thank you Fuzzy, for the information. Your effort is appreciated.

And if we are real quiet, maybe the lopsters won't find us. Maybe we should use an electric fence. Zap! And then we could eat them with butter, or make a Lopster Roll. We have enough Lopsters here, so everybody is invited for a Lopster Roll. Come on down. The fence is fine.

Here Loppy, Loppy....we're waiting.

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According to several of our IQD smarty pants, Enoch8 is supposed to be scary smart. He is regarded to be at the pinnacle of the intellect spectrum when it comes to economics.

And, no, I do not have a link.

Thank you Fuzzy, for the information. Your effort is appreciated.

And if we are real quiet, maybe the lopsters won't find us. Maybe we should use an electric fence. Zap! And then we could eat them with butter, or make a Lopster Roll. We have enough Lopsters here, so everybody is invited for a Lopster Roll. Come on down. The fence is fine.

Here Loppy, Loppy....we're waiting.

Ohhhhh but they always can smell that smell they know so well....butter and yes whispers of an RV. ;) where is that yorkie?

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Something thing to think about---which has not been taken into account for this post---it was stated again for the umpteen time that most of the 000s are now owned by foreign government banks, not in country---but the focus of turning in the privately owned 000s would be given a time period to cash in---boulder dash by every source says privately there is just not enough spread around anywhere to warrant being treated differently--now it has already been stated publicly the governments can convert their holds AFTER six months for what ever agreement which they set up as individual countries--mainly oil at a set rate and mainly NO TIME LIMIT!

When you compare the population of Kuwait against the Population of Iraq Vs money held in reserve by both countries one way higher to the other with extending that to reserves of both countries well then IRAQ holds all the cards----to at the very least set the RV at the same rate + or - just to keep harmony with its neighbors eventually surpassing them and the rate going higher as the neighbors run out of their abilities to keep pumping the crude

Just my opinion of course

capt cliff

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Carrello +1 I am out of +'s so maybe someone can give Carrello one for me! The article that says enoch8 is scary smart! lol

I know there are some lopsters who are really smart also, but I like enoch8!

PS do not think Carrello is any dummy either! ;)

Edited by abby01
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And this is used in Traditional Gravity Equations, to arrive at PPP Optimum Equilibrium Exchange Rates.
Purchasing Power Parity is a theory of exchange rate determination which asserts that the nominal exchange rate between two countries should be equal to the ratio of aggregate price levels between related countries. My link

Here is an document which somewhat explains the formula as to how an exchange rate is determined. This is heavy stuff. I am not sure if the post is correct I just don't have the will to put together these math equations, however this is not the equation the Cindy Loppers are using to determine if there is going to be an RV. I have determines in through my research there will be an RV, just a matter of how much and I think the $1.20 -$1.50 is in the range of my thinking since first learning about this investment.

The IMF had posted a research document that determined that the dinar needs to be between $1.17 to $1.22 above the US Dollar and below the Euro and British Pound; this IMF info. was put out 2 years ago (sorry I do not have a link, and have spent some time looking for the source - you will have to take my word on this one).

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