JayP

Patriotic_Mess... With all due respect, let's make that more clear.. please speak for yourself when you say that these are what WE call them "lopsters", because some people here do not like to negatively call people names or label people in a hidden attempt to discredit them so new users will only consider one side. I like to think that is not the intention of this site. The same can be said for those that say what you are saying or believe, that those are what WE call PUMPERS planted here to create hype... but I know that this statement is not true, and it would not be fair to speak for everyone. I think that you are entitled to your opinion, as those that are more conservative based on historical facts and definitions of what a RD actually means based on research, are entitled to theirs. It is not fair to label you, or those that think a RD is possible... Aquafuzz... do yourself the favor.. look at all the information, research everything, ask for proof from anyone trying to tell you something is happening, or where they are basing their opinions on, and validate for yourself to see if there is any truth or substantial evidence to his/her theory, and keep an open mind to any possibility. We are all in this together, and want the same outcome, but do not do yourself the disservice of closing your mind to one possibility or the other in fear of being labeled. Do not be afraid to look at the definition of a RD, and then look at why a country would RV, what the impact on the nation it would have, both advantages and disadvantages, and the answers to your question will be very easy to come by. This is a great document to help you learn a bit more http://www.unc.edu/~lmosley/APSA%202005.pdf I have been looking for years to see more evidence that Iraq can change their value of the current unit of currency they use today 1000x higher, and more importantly, to try and prove that the CBI really does not have 27.6 Trillion Dinar in circulation. This to me is the key number that if we can show is not true, then we stand to potentially make plenty on this investment

This is actually not a new article, and in fact an archived article from that site that someone pulled up. The date at the top of the webpage is a constant date that always shows the current date on the site, but the date of the article itself can actually be found within the article. It translates a bit funny since it is part of the archived article, but it is from 2011. Here is the date: es from the Iraqi dinar "Tuesday 12 نيسان 2011 19:37 GMT" Some people on these sites pull these archived articles and present them as new either mistakenly, or to create more hype, and then we sometimes grab the link thinking that it is new or current... A tactic that I know some sites use to create a buzz... Thanks for sharing and posting what you are seeing out there at least JustNTime! It is appreciated...

Thanks Yota. There was a second article that talked about the similar time in September http://www.babnews.com/inp/view.asp?ID=49901 "announced that the Economic Committee in the House of Representatives, in an agreement with the Iraqi Central Bank to begin the process of removing zeros from the local currency in September." It also states: "He added that “the agreement granting process to ensure the currency switch for a full year on the two currencies that are traded the old and new" Here is the good news though. It also states in this article: "while the Iraqi government expresses its fears of the project will increase as the phenomenon of money laundering, “according to her belief ” , and is working to convince the central bank to stop implementation of the project, agree the Securities Commission with the government’s position to delete the zeros and says it would negatively affect the financial trading in the stock market ." Once again, the government's inability to agree on anything is playing into our favor in this case

Here is something that I pointed out a couple days ago in another post regarding the mobile banking. There was a document from Feb 2010 from the Embassy Baghdad that explains why they are pushing for this. Here are 2 paragraphs from it, but please note the text that I bolded: SUMMARY: With two cell phones for every three Iraqis, it appears great market potential exists for "mobile banking" -- allowing Iraqi subscribers to use mobile phones to view account balances and make electronic payments and funds transfers. Significant impediments -- none insurmountable -- stand in the way of quick growth in Iraq's mobile banking sector: a general mistrust of banks by the population; existing Iraqi laws and regulations; lack of electronic core banking systems in the state-owned banks; and the need to further develop the switch infrastructure. Mobile phone companies and others are enthusiastic about pushing ahead with one model or another in the near term. The Central Bank of Iraq also seems positive about the inevitability and promise of mobile banking, though it is wary of "mobile wallet," whereby the cell phone accounts themselves store value. DOD's Task Force for Business Stability Operations (TF BSO) is coordinating with the Iraqi electronic banking consortium AMWAL and AsiaCell on a pilot mobile banking project for 300 of both entities' employees. The other major cell phone provider in Iraq, Zain, is considering providing a more limited mobile phone-based money transfer service that would run through credit and banking institutions outside Iraq. For the time being, however, the only large-scale functioning e-payment system used for mass distribution of salaries and pensions is the Iraqi government's "Smart Card," operated through two state banks. (Private banks are offering smaller-scale services.) (SBU) COMMENT: Getting the necessary regulatory, technical, and consumer protection infrastructure in place for mobile banking obviously will take some time. Delays, however, could lead the private sector and public to find more immediate workarounds, which may lead to prudential and security vulnerabilities. Once operational, the attractiveness of mobile banking may spur many more Iraqis to move their money into the formal financial system, a boon to economic development. Iraq's private banks (who have a technological and service advantage over the state banks) may also stand to gain as they are better able to offer these services. Despite these advantages, however, growth of the private banking sector will be limited as long as Iraqi government entities are forbidden from doing business with private banks - the government accounts for approximately 60 percent of employment and GDP. As Iraq inevitably presses ahead with some sort of mobile, electronic transaction mechanism, we should look to ensure that these developments keep with global best practices, efficient use of appropriate technology, and safeguards against fraud, money laundering and other abuses. I have the entire text, but did not want to bore you with the entire read, but this the way they would like to go to entice the citizens to use the banking systems. It would take quite a bit to implement the technology, but it would be a great thing. This is one of the things I have been looking at long term as something worth getting excited about, and I have been liked hearing of the recent news about the banking...

That is precisely what makes con artists like Okie and those like him so successful, a good con artist is only as good as they can speak. The fact that they know how to sound so convincing is the very tool that they use against those that are ignorant to the truths and facts, or are to naive to know when a person is telling a story, or giving facts. All you need to do is ask Okie for proof on any claim he makes, and when he cannot produce details to support his claim so you can research and validate for yourself, then that only proves my point. He will either never produce proof, and if you are on his site, he will tell you that no questioning, asking for proof, or talking about less than positive outcomes in this investment is allowed, and you will not be allowed to talk on the site. That ALONE, should tell you enough about his intentions. If I were to tell you to buy an investment from me, and said you are only allowed to ask about how much can be made, and not allowed to talk about very real risks, or ask for proof of what I say, would you buy this investment from me, or would that seem strangely suspicious of me?? I would hope your smart enough to answer NO to the first and yes to the latter of that question..... especially is I was wrong over 150 times about a RV that weekend over the course of a few years..

Good thoughts. As far as what they do in the interim, what happens when zeros are deleted from a nation's currency, and the currency is restructured and replaced with a new currency, is that they allow both currencies to co-exist, the old currency maintaining the current rate (in this case .00086) and the new currency having the new rate (in this case presumably .86 or higher), and there would be 2 prices listed for goods depending on the notes for the defined period of time of exchange. This gives them the rate they would want right away with the new notes. Of course that is IF they are even to get the cooperation from the gov't and go this route. Regarding the strength of the dinar, regardless of the beating it has recently taken against the dollar because of the regional issues in Syria and Iran, it still does not affect their strength, since that is defined by their ability to not be affected by the volatility in the region due to their currency being backed 100% by their Fx reserves, so the good news is that what we hold is certainly stable.

Nicely stated.. I agree with your thoughts here.. Thanks!! I have been saying for a while now that the privatization of the banks, and the improvements on the banking laws and technology is critical as well. In an article yesterday, I also pointed out a document that talked about the implementation and advantages of the mobile banking. I then read an article later in the day where they actually talked about the mobile banking also, and it was also mentioned in the world bank review. This was more exciting news to think about. While it would be a lot of work for that type of technology, it will get more citizens to use the banking systems.

Well, 2 things here. For one, it was JustNTime that posted the article here, unless Stryker is saying that Justntime is a "lopster" now... second, the CBI did not put that article out, that news site did, and they did that some time ago. Someone found the article, and pulled it up on that site, and mistakenly thought it was a new article, when in fact, I think it may be an archived article from that site. So not sure where Styker is getting at, but this is not a CBI site, so they cannot put the article out there on that news site, and I do not believe you JustNTime to be a "lopster" from what I have seen, so this was a rather incoherent rant by Stryker that frankly made no sense. I was not going to say that though, and only commented on that fact that once again, Stryker had to bring the quality of the discussion to such a low level with more antagonizing responses.

Yes, that is true Zig.. That is the only problem with this particular news site as well. This may just be an old archived article, so it may be the same article. I noticed yesterday that the date is not on this article, so there is no way of telling when this article was from. Not that anything has really changed much since this article was published by the news site, and it did at least remind us that the IMF does support the plan, so even though it was older, it was useful in clarifying something for us. I agree though, definitely keep on eye on what they do. I look at what they do to formulate an opinion as well, but then I look for something to verify my speculations based on what I see as well...

That's a real shame.. I was just thinking how this was one of the best threads I have read on here, with respectful opinions from many different angles, and now we go back to this method of trying to prove how one's opinion must be right over the other... such a shame.. we were so close... I think we have been watching the Iraqi politics for far too long... one step forward, 2 steps back.

Thanks!! It's all good.. at least I have an idea where to look... thanks anyway...

Well.. glad to be here Well, this may come as a shocker (you may want to sit for this ) but I do agree with you to some extent, that you have to think outside the box a bit. I have heard that they were sucking up dinars from various others as well, so I have been looking for evidence of this as well. They said that in 2010 and 2011 as well, and I hoped that this would show in the CBI Annual Bulletin as well, so I watched the 2009 and 2010 reports when they were released, but there was nothing to support that, so I will definitely be watching for the release of the 2011. It was one of the things that was said that kept me hopeful though. I know you are not interested is showing how you know this though as you indicated above, so I will not ask if you know where they say this, and how much they have been drawing in. Some out there have been saying that has been happening for a couple years now, so you would think that would be somewhere if we know it is happening... Easy to be skeptical when people say they know something, but not know how they know it though... Thank you... I will look through Zigs posts to see what he may have posted that states this.. thanks for the lead at least

It would be great if they did so this ride can be over a bit faster, but in a recent article they stated: "that the new currency will be a global specification and high-tech and very difficult to forge because it contains the properties of being a major security printers will print in recent international and specialized to print currency." http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ikhnews.com%2Fnews.php%3Faction%3Dview%26id%3D33051&sl=ar&tl=en&hl=&ie=UTF-8 Based on this, and other articles like this when they talk about their plans, the notes will be, but not have been printed.

The other is the GBP. I believe their Fx reserves consist of 40% UD, 40%Euro, and 20% GBP if I remember what I read correctly... As you stated correctly, that is what makes up the 60B USD worth of Fx reserves that they have..

Yes, I have heard that about the use of a word that is not "delete" from a few of the gurus that talk about that. (Enorrste, co-creator of the GET Team, spoke to me saying the same thing once on a call). In the spirit of trying to keep an open mind, I have been trying to see if there has ever been a time when this word was used to state they were only removing certain denominations, and then giving value to new denominations. I have yet to find that though, but have seen on many occasions where different verbiage was used to describe the process of a redenomination, such as , eliminate, lift, delete, remove, (etc) zeros from circulation. So far I do not see anything to support a distinguishable difference to make us believe there is a difference between lift and delete, but I have been looking to see if this could possibly be the case. If you find anything, let us know! Thanks...

Someone asked in a post a couple days ago if the IMF supported this plan to delete the zeros. Unfortunately, it would seem that is the case. The good news is that I am not sure I have seen where the govt has agreed to their cooperation on this plan yet, so that is still a positive thing to hope that the govt does not support this... GO GOV'T! Finally, something we actually want the gov't to never be able to come to agreement with, and that is one thing we can usually count on them for!

sorry .. double post

This is a great thing. Any advancement in the legislation regarding banking is a great thing. There was a document sent from the Embassy of Baghdad in Feb 2010. It talked about Mobile Banking, what it would do for the economy, but the obstacles it was still facing. Here is a clip from it though: "Getting the necessary regulatory, technical, and consumer protection infrastructure in place for mobile banking obviously will take some time. Delays, however, could lead the private sector and public to find more immediate workarounds, which may lead to prudential and security vulnerabilities. Once operational, the attractiveness of mobile banking may spur many more Iraqis to move their money into the formal financial system, a boon to economic development. Iraq's private banks (who have a technological and service advantage over the state banks) may also stand to gain as they are better able to offer these services. Despite these advantages, however, growth of the private banking sector will be limited as long as Iraqi government entities are forbidden from doing business with private banks - the government accounts for approximately 60 percent of employment and GDP." This is encouraging for the overall economy to see articles like this talking about the legislation regarding the banking!

I am with you on that. It takes a big person to be able to do that. Hats off to him. I hope that maybe this will help usher in a new era of respect and open minds where we can enjoy good discussions and debate a bit easier around here!

Stryker.. I am not sure how many times I need to explain this, but I will say it once again. If you would not respond with things like this, talking about a person's character rather than showing how you disagree with a post, then you would not provoke a person to feel the need to defend him/herself. I will explain myself once again on this matter though. I have stated that I do not know if they will redenominate, nor has the CBI made any final determinations that any of us are aware of. What I have gone on record as stating, is that the CBI has stated their intentions to do this, but they still need the cooperation of the govt to follow through with this, something that I am not convinced they have been able to do. I do think though, that regardless of what happens, there is still potential for our investment, even in the worst case scenario. So, based on your definition of a "lopster", would you agree that I do not exactly fit the requirements of even your definition??? I hope this is the last time we need to discuss this. I have stated in a past post to sonny1, that this article is about the strength of the dinar currently, and the reserves that back it, not about redenomination, and I did not care to debate a Rd/Rv on this topic, as that is better fit for another time, not in the scope or context of this article. You are bringing it up here just because you saw my user name for some strange reason...

Well, I suppose if you read the entire post you would see that this was not the first post between carrello and I. This was a response to her post to me. You seem quick to jump on the person you obviously oppose the views of, maybe because trying to discredit the person's character rather than the post is easier for you, I am not sure, but let's look at the facts of the post since you accused me: Yesterday at 7:06: I responded to Sonny1, asking him a question about his post. Nothing negative, but an honest question and comment. Nothing was directed towards carrello. Yesterday at 7:12 carrello immediately antagonizes with a post "Round Four. Ding." I obviously found that response to my post unnecessary, and antagonistic in nature, and responded jokingly to relax, I mean no harm, and I was just asking an honest question. She then angrily responds back to me about her feelings for asking her to relax. Do you see how antagonistic behavior does become reciprocal and can get out of hand quickly? Maybe, if we just responded to each others posts, and dealt with the details of the post, not a person's character, and had a healthy back and forth discussion of the information presented, it would be a much more warm, enjoyable, and friendly read of the exchange of views for all of us.

Flyboy42, I was not provoking you, nor pointed anything towards you. Sorry if you somehow thought I was directing this towards you in some way, and in fact I do not think that I have ever even communicated with you. Either way, my apologies for offending you, and let me clarify. If you are open to all opinions, and think all opinions are allowed, not just the "RV Tomorrow", or "no possibility of Rd", then you definitely are not like Okie and the minions that need his site. If you believe that this site should only allow those types of opinions, then like it or not, but that is what his site IS for, to only allow that opinion to be put out there, and they do not allow any other opinions. If someone does have an opinion that is not RV tomorrow, or that a Rd is a potential outcome, they will be banned. I do not believe that is the intent of the owner of this site. It sounds to me like you do believe that all opinions are welcome, so I do not think that this applies to you at all, no need to feel offended. I agree, this is a great point, which is why I put the question out there to be considered for discussion. If they enjoy having the strongest currency in the middle east, would they risk that stability with a Rv that would extend beyond their ability to have a currency 100% backed by their foreign reserves? Are they willing to weaken their currency where they would be exposed to the volatility of the region?

I think to some extent, you are correct, there is a certain level of speculation that you need to open yourself up to within rationale reasoning. The point of being in this investment though, is to hope that maybe the speculation and hopes of them may come true, but on the more realistic and grounded thought process, if what we see at face value is the results, then that does not mean that all is lost, because I still see potential in the long term as an emerging market, one that can still bring returns unlike most currency investments. Maybe not in the millions, but enough to make the return acceptable by any investment standards. If we are worried about how much can be made, that is not the worst thing to have to worry about in any investment! Let's just hope that is somehow true, and what happens... that would be a wonderful thing!

Well, the rate does not make a difference actually. They would be able to use it today, just as they would be able to use it after it changes it's rate, regardless of whatever the new rate is. The value has nothing to do with what currency they use to pay debt in. Here is the link that shows the status of processing and payment of claims that Iraq owes. You can see here, that the debts are owed in USD. If Iraq was to give a new rate, regardless of how much or little the rise may be, this would not change. http://www.uncc.ch/status.htm What Iraq does have though, as was pointed out in this article, a very strong currency, but that is because of their reserves. So that brings us back to the original question then. Would they risk losing that stability that they seem to enjoy today by a RV that would weaken their currency, and expose them to that volatility?

Sonny1, in all due respect, in the case of Iraq, that actually is the case. They do not pay in Dinar, debts are paid in USD. Using your example, if Iraq owes China money, they cannot just arbitrarily say, ok, here is Dinar, but since we owe you in USD, we are going to arbitrarily make our Dinar worth 1000x more than it is now, and make the US accept that, exchange for USD so we do not have to pay out as much. The truth is, a country cannot back it's currency with it's own currency. They can back it in Fx reserves so that it is not affected by market volatility, which was what this article was about, but they cannot say that money in their own vaults will make that same money stronger. Let's remember, this article was about the 60B in reserves, which is foreign exchange reserves, and does not consist of Dinar, so they do not take ID currency in cash vaults into consideration as backing...