Statement made by Kaperoni to address JayP's attacks on his no LOP list

[Darin]

Kap destroys his own credibility every time he refers to a redenomination as a devaluation. A 25000 dinar note worth 21 bucks becomes a 25 dinar note worth 21 bucks. How is that "taking their wealth"? It isn't.

Took their wealth in 2003? The exchange rate in 1995 was 3000 to 1. No one took their wealth in 2003. Anyone that did five minutes of research would know this, why doesn't Kap?

You could easily be interpreting this wrong, as many have done so in the past.

Does anyone fully understand how the process played out in 2003 when they did their exchange?

Yes, for those that did exchange their old for new received a 1:1 ratio of exchange.

But! Not everyone was in a place or time to exchange within their limited exchange window.

A) If they were outside of Iraq, they got the shaft. (Sounds like loss of wealth to me...)

If they did not exchange within reasonable time-frame, they got the shaft! (Sounds like loss of wealth to me.....)

The examples listed above, were basically people who had old dinars & got to sit and watch them turn to worthless paper (Sounds like loss of wealth to me)

Both examples were likely driven by fear of going to banks to exchange (I would have been scared too, that many people together is likely to draw a terrorist bombing).

I'm sure there was no huge education campaign during this event..

The borders were on lock down, so even if you had the guts to attempt to go to a bank, you were locked out.

Other foreign citizens holding old dinars, got the shaft..

The main reason I retained as much details as I did regarding this event is sometimes I worry that even if they were to do a re-denomination, they may pull the same stint!

Meaning, even if we chartered a jet to Iraq, they may not let us in & we get to watch our worthless paper turn into worthless garbage.

But, I can't see them doing that twice! That would just be cruel.....

[poke salad annie]

Kap destroys his own credibility every time he refers to a redenomination as a devaluation. A 25000 dinar note worth 21 bucks becomes a 25 dinar note worth 21 bucks. How is that "taking their wealth"? It isn't.

Took their wealth in 2003? The exchange rate in 1995 was 3000 to 1. No one took their wealth in 2003. Anyone that did five minutes of research would know this, why doesn't Kap?

People need to take time to think the process through. Of course a lop is not a devaluation. It's just shortening the label used to refer to the exact same potential value. The labels for everything in the financial system must all change at the same time i.e. every decimal point in the country has to move three places to the left. Instead of saying that will be 25,000 dinar for a 21 dollar item, a shopkeeper can say that will be 25 dinar. Of course that's what they probably do anyway. If you apply that improved efficiency to every computer entry, every bookkeeping system, pricing system etc. etc. it becomes obvious that a whole bunch of 'useless' zeroes can go. AND THIS IS WHAT SHABIBI CONTINUOUSLY SAYS HE'S GOING FOR!

Where I continue to find the most hope for us who are in this strange little community, is the probability of a subsequent RV.

Or better still, Adam's scenario of a 10 cent RV with a subsequent RD dropping one zero.

Of course at this point I would gladly take an RV of 1 cent with a 2 zero drop!

Go RV!

[Darin]

Hahahaha JayP didnt even attack him, just corrected his nonsense....

And Kap still continues to show how little he knows about Iraq and the dinar with statements saying that all their wealth was taken from them in 2003

What a clown.....

Another way Kap is looking at it is simply the loss of wealth was increasing up until 2003... See, if your Government is continuously printing money and taking away from the value of your dinars, your losing wealth.

Our dollar has lost value over the years as well.

As far as I recall, the old dinars were losing value as time progressed up until 2003. So, therefore, Kap could be stating that up until 2003, the dinar was losing value (wealth lost by the citizens who held it). People are reading this in one particular way.. That the 2003 event basically stole wealth from people (Which it didn't and your right, but the events leading to that did create loss of wealth to the citizens)

If your single-minded, you'll always see something in one dimension. Think outside the box & realize that in some cases the words people type out have different intentions.

[LouG]

Oh so now I need to do your homework for you because you are too lazy to verify anything for yourself?? Well that just takes the fun out of the learning experience which you need so badly....its not about being negative, its about seperating fact from fiction....

Almost all the crap Kap stated in his original post is nonsensical....and the funniest thing is that it would only take maybe 10 minutes of researching to understand this stuff....its not rocket science but apparently it is to some because you and kap just dont get it....

I can hold a class later on tonight if you wish to attend and you can learn the facts about redenomination and what happens in this process...bring your leader kap too....then he might not sound so misinformed when speaking....and he might not get bashed so hard when the garbage starts flowing from his mouth....

Do we really need to go over every point he tried to bring up as to why it wont lop?? Hahahaha at least give me a challenge here.....saying that they cant lop because then the smaller bills would be worth more then the larger is probly the funniest crap I have yet to hear and really does show the lack of understanding on his part....would you like me to break everything down for you piece by piece?? You have to promise not to start crying though....

I don't know why your picking on kap anyway, Let's include them all then because your leader AM, Sonny1, Frank26, and all the others all say the same thing - no LOP and no re-denomination. Seems only a few posters without the skills to own a website, are the negative ones.

The only class you have credentials to teach is clown 101. I might attend that to watch u ride your trike.

[HopefulTxn]

I dont know, last i checked the US never did that. In fact, if you find a US $1,000 note it is not worth $1. Go teach your crap to someone else.

The US didn't issue high denominations because of inflationary problems, and they didn't remove them because of inflationary problems. You, like others, seem intent on comparing apples to oranges with people that realize or have researched the difference.

Iraq had an inflation problem that caused the physical base of their monetary system to expand from 25 billion dinar to roughly 30 trillion. That is a 1,000+ fold increase.

Are you, and Kap, trying to say that because a country suffers inflation, introduces higher denominations of currency to offset the value loss of the national currency, then removes that inflation, that the monetary base is suddenly going to be valued many (500+) times more that it was before the inflation problems even occurred?

I, like everyone else, is hoping that the CBI is fudging the numbers of what is in circulation. If they are not doing that, then we have a serious problem.

[LouG]

People need to take time to think the process through. Of course a lop is not a devaluation. It's just shortening the label used to refer to the exact same potential value. The labels for everything in the financial system must all change at the same time i.e. every decimal point in the country has to move three places to the left. Instead of saying that will be 25,000 dinar for a 21 dollar item, a shopkeeper can say that will be 25 dinar. Of course that's what they probably do anyway. If you apply that improved efficiency to every computer entry, every bookkeeping system, pricing system etc. etc. it becomes obvious that a whole bunch of 'useless' zeroes can go. AND THIS IS WHAT SHABIBI CONTINUOUSLY SAYS HE'S GOING FOR!

Where I continue to find the most hope for us who are in this strange little community, is the probability of a subsequent RV.

Or better still, Adam's scenario of a 10 cent RV with a subsequent RD dropping one zero.

Of course at this point I would gladly take an RV of 1 cent with a 2 zero drop!

Go RV!

No you want to change the rules too? put the crack pipe away.

Edited November 26, 2011 by LouG

[HopefulTxn]

I don't know why your picking on kap anyway, Let's include them all then because your leader AM, Sonny1, Frank26, and all the others all say the same thing - no LOP and no re-denomination. Seems only a few posters without the skills to own a website, are the negative ones.

The only class you have credentials to teach is clown 101. I might attend that to watch u ride your trike.

At least AM mentions the possibility of an RD, even if he doesn't believe in it. I do have to acknowledge that.

[sonny1]

Too funny. Its like. Its like 8th grade. There currency was devalued.

[keepmwlknfny]

Another way Kap is looking at it is simply the loss of wealth was increasing up until 2003... See, if your Government is continuously printing money and taking away from the value of your dinars, your losing wealth.

Our dollar has lost value over the years as well.

As far as I recall, the old dinars were losing value as time progressed up until 2003. So, therefore, Kap could be stating that up until 2003, the dinar was losing value (wealth lost by the citizens who held it). People are reading this in one particular way.. That the 2003 event basically stole wealth from people (Which it didn't and your right, but the events leading to that did create loss of wealth to the citizens)

If your single-minded, you'll always see something in one dimension. Think outside the box & realize that in some cases the words people type out have different intentions.

He along with many others spew the same crap that the dinar was devalued in 2003 and they lost everything then so it has to RV to give it back...

He has been saying this kind of crap for YEARS now Darin.....the majority of the people who got left out from the exchange in 2003 were business men in those surrounding countries who did regular day to day business with Iraq....yea they got the shaft, along with anyone outside the country, but basically the true citizens of Iraq lost their wealth over a decade ago and it just got worse over time.....

Bottom line is Kap is full of crap.....and shouldnt be talking about something he does not understand

[LouG]

Too funny. Its like. Its like 8th grade. There currency was devalued.

Thank you Sonny1

[HopefulTxn]

Too funny. Its like. Its like 8th grade. There currency was devalued.

Yes, 'their' currency was devalued. But not in 2003 like what was stated.

What devalued their currency was Saddam Hussein getting into a war with Iran during the 80's, spending the foreign currency reserves of the CBI to help fund that war and replacing those funds with debts to Turkey, Saudi Arabia and Kuwait - as well as going on a currency printing spree. He was actually the first one to introduce 000 notes to their monetary system because the value of the currency was in the crap house.

[LouG]

He along with many others spew the same crap that the dinar was devalued in 2003 and they lost everything then so it has to RV to give it back...

He has been saying this kind of crap for YEARS now Darin.....the majority of the people who got left out from the exchange in 2003 were business men in those surrounding countries who did regular day to day business with Iraq....yea they got the shaft, along with anyone outside the country, but basically the true citizens of Iraq lost their wealth over a decade ago and it just got worse over time.....

Bottom line is Kap is full of crap.....and shouldnt be talking about something he does not understand

Well he seems to do quit well understanding it. And i think you need to stop posting negative comments about others to make yourself look better. It's not working. You better hope for a RV, then you can get a facelift.

[keepmwlknfny]

Well he seems to do quit well understanding it. And i think you need to stop posting negative comments about others to make yourself look better. It's not working. You better hope for a RV, then you can get a facelift.

I dont have to say anything to make myself look better.....Kap did it himself by opening his mouth!

You sure told me off!! Ohhh man!! Hahaha you have nothing.....you just continue to sit there and defend his garbage post that even a 8th grader could pick apart....you know why?? Cause its basic stuff here....its very simple I promise....

You can actually debunk most of what he was saying with this one statement.......a lop/rd doesnt devalue anything....other then that, if one bill is lopped, the entire currency is lopped....that alone is enough to sink his oh so great post....

[JayP]

Well he seems to do quit well understanding it. And i think you need to stop posting negative comments about others to make yourself look better. It's not working. You better hope for a RV, then you can get a facelift.

Well he seems to do quit well understanding it. And i think you need to stop posting negative comments about others to make yourself look better. It's not working. You better hope for a RV, then you can get a facelift.

hmmm.... start with better stop posting negative comments, and end with a negative comment yourself... hypocrisy is not a good argument to support your credibility...

[Darin]

He along with many others spew the same crap that the dinar was devalued in 2003 and they lost everything then so it has to RV to give it back...

He has been saying this kind of crap for YEARS now Darin.....the majority of the people who got left out from the exchange in 2003 were business men in those surrounding countries who did regular day to day business with Iraq....yea they got the shaft, along with anyone outside the country, but basically the true citizens of Iraq lost their wealth over a decade ago and it just got worse over time.....

Bottom line is Kap is full of crap.....and shouldnt be talking about something he does not understand

My point is, did he state specifically that the 2003 event of exchange was the reasoning of loss of wealth in specifics of the value of the dinar?

People lost money in 2003, just a matter of how you look at it.

They may have not gone out & exchanged for new dinars, for multiple reasons

They may have been locked out of the country....

Or they may have missed their opportunity to exchange because they buried their dinars & couldn't locate them in time.

The exchange of dinars was 1:1... So, old for new was 1:1 (exception was swiss dinars)

Now, its a no brainer that the value of the dinar lost its wealth over the years leading up to 2003...

Its all how you interpret it..

If he were to say.. In 2003, they did the exchange for old to new & many people lost value in their dinars because the dinar itself was devalued (that would be incorrect).

[LouG]

I dont have to say anything to make myself look better.....Kap did it himself by opening his mouth!

You sure told me off!! Ohhh man!! Hahaha you have nothing.....you just continue to sit there and defend his garbage post that even a 8th grader could pick apart....you know why?? Cause its basic stuff here....its very simple I promise....

You can actually debunk most of what he was saying with this one statement.......a lop/rd doesnt devalue anything....other then that, if one bill is lopped, the entire currency is lopped....that alone is enough to sink his oh so great post....

The problem is kap does not say that will happen. He never has. And you keep saying it will. Where is your proof? Your arguing over something that you don't have the answer too. And that makes you look foolish.

[keepmwlknfny]

The problem is kap does not say that will happen. He never has. And you keep saying it will. Where is your proof? Your arguing over something that you don't have the answer too. And that makes you look foolish.

Excuse me? Kap doesn't say what will happen?

If you have been comprehending this thread you would understand that no one is saying this is how it will go down and that iraq wont/can't rv....simply that pepperoni is confused and incorrect on his statements regarding lops....and there are answers to how incorrect he is, its called researching on the dynamics of lopping zeros off a currency and what happens.....

But he just must be waaaayyyy to busy with his "translator" LOL to properly understand a subject he wants to spread around the dinar community.....his nonsensical reasons are the only thing looking foolish when this kind of stuff is easily verified

[JayP]

The problem is kap does not say that will happen. He never has. And you keep saying it will. Where is your proof? Your arguing over something that you don't have the answer too. And that makes you look foolish.

Just to clarify, I never said that will happen, I have, and am saying that is what the CBI wants to do, and has stated that for years, but if they are going to be able to follow through with that, that is yet to be seen, as we do not know what will happen until all is said and done. It is Kap that is saying that there is no way that it would happen, and guarentees millions to be made to his members by saying that it definitely cannot and will not redenominate, while in these posts, nobody is saying that it definitely will redenominate. So, it is important to note WHO exactly is making guarentees here. The funny thing though, is that while Kap makes these guarentees, he himself stated "Nobody knows anything until the CBI does it's job." Yes Kap, that was a quote from Kap in his post on 11/23 at 12:28 AM on his site responding to a post about his 10 reasons post. If you make guarentees to people that they will make millions, then you really screwed the pooch when you follow up a statement like that with saying nobody knows...

[LouG]

Excuse me? Kap doesn't say what will happen?

If you have been comprehending this thread you would understand that no one is saying this is how it will go down and that iraq wont/can't rv....simply that pepperoni is confused and incorrect on his statements regarding lops....and there are answers to how incorrect he is, its called researching on the dynamics of lopping zeros off a currency and what happens.....

But he just must be waaaayyyy to busy with his "translator" LOL to properly understand a subject he wants to spread around the dinar community.....his nonsensical reasons are the only thing looking foolish when this kind of stuff is easily verified

I think your confused. Look at what Jayp has written, if he has not come out and stated it, he implies very heavy that redenomination is what is going to happen. Drugs play with ones mind. You might want to kick the habit.

Just to clarify, I never said that will happen, I have, and am saying that is what the CBI wants to do, and has stated that for years, but if they are going to be able to follow through with that, that is yet to be seen, as we do not know what will happen until all is said and done. It is Kap that is saying that there is no way that it would happen, and guarentees millions to be made to his members by saying that it definitely cannot and will not redenominate, while in these posts, nobody is saying that it definitely will redenominate. So, it is important to note WHO exactly is making guarentees here. The funny thing though, is that while Kap makes these guarentees, he himself stated "Nobody knows anything until the CBI does it's job." Yes Kap, that was a quote from Kap in his post on 11/23 at 12:28 AM on his site responding to a post about his 10 reasons post. If you make guarentees to people that they will make millions, then you really screwed the pooch when you follow up a statement like that with saying nobody knows...

Kap has never guaranteed anything. I have listened to him for years back on the j4d days. He is the most conservative of all the gurus. I think you putting words in his mouth and trying to make them fact because your own statements cannot be supported by anything factual. I do agree he thinks this will RV. That being said, where does he promise anything to people? I think you should shut the trap before trap shuts you. Ever heard that one before? Its southern from old school. If you can comprehend.

[JayP]

I think your confused. Look at what Jayp has written, if he has not come out and stated it, he implies very heavy that redenomination is what is going to happen. Drugs play with ones mind. You might want to kick the habit.

Once again, a perfect example of a poor translation of something written. Let's try this one more time, I implied nothing, I flat out said it, the CBI wants to redenominate, IF that happens, we have yet to see how it will all play out, but never once have I stated it WILL happen that way. I think that it may be a very likely possibility and scenario, but I do not guarentee anything like you are saying with guaranteeing millions. If I felt that way, I have no problem in saying that without needing to imply anything. I do challenge you to show me where I have stated anywhere that it will definitely redenominate, and made any attempt to prove that is will definitely redenominate, other than proving that it is in fact a possibility that we need to consider and plan for, not lie to people and tell them they do not even need to consider it as remotely possible even. Nice try, but please try again

[carlablum]

Wow! all the little jabs going on in this thread!

Why not just agree to disagree?

Just a thought,

Carla

[HopefulTxn]

My point is, did he state specifically that the 2003 event of exchange was the reasoning of loss of wealth in specifics of the value of the dinar?

People lost money in 2003, just a matter of how you look at it.

They may have not gone out & exchanged for new dinars, for multiple reasons

They may have been locked out of the country....

Or they may have missed their opportunity to exchange because they buried their dinars & couldn't locate them in time.

The exchange of dinars was 1:1... So, old for new was 1:1 (exception was swiss dinars)

Now, its a no brainer that the value of the dinar lost its wealth over the years leading up to 2003...

Its all how you interpret it..

If he were to say.. In 2003, they did the exchange for old to new & many people lost value in their dinars because the dinar itself was devalued (that would be incorrect).

He seems to be stating that the value of the dinar was devalued IN 2003:

9. In 2003 when the NID was introduced at it’s initial rate, the previous currency was in essence devalued taking all wealth from the country to prevent funding of terrorism. Raising the currencies value will in essence, return that wealth now that the GOI is stable and economic conditions have improved.

Which, as you mentioned previously is an inaccurate statement. The value of the dinar was in a downward spiral since the early 80's and hit the bottom of the bucket in the 2000's.

Since the currency was issued at a 1:1 ratio (except Swiss dinar which were 1 Swiss Dinar for 150 NID), which had a higher USD value than when Saddam was running the country, the statement of 'essentially devalued' is baseless and is not substantiated in any way.

[keepmwlknfny]

The problem is kap does not say that will happen. He never has. And you keep saying it will. Where is your proof? Your arguing over something that you don't have the answer too. And that makes you look foolish.

Excuse me? Kap doesn't say what will happen?

If you have been comprehending this thread you would understand that no one is saying this is how it will go down and that iraq wont/can't rv....simply that pepperoni is confused and incorrect on his statements regarding lops....and there are answers to how incorrect he is, its called researching on the dynamics of lopping zeros off a currency and what happens.....

But he just must be waaaayyyy to busy with his "translator" LOL to properly understand a subject he wants to spread around the dinar community.....his nonsensical reasons are the only thing looking foolish when this kind of stuff is easily verified

[JayP]

Wow! all the little jabs going on in this thread!

Why not just agree to disagree?

Just a thought,

Carla

Well said carla... in a separate post I stated that we do not need to make things personal, but this is the way he debates. Tells people that they are guaranteed to make millions, and sells his text service so they will find out first when they will be millionaires, and then when anyone disputes the fact that there is no guarantee of that, and a redenomination is entirely possible, he resorts to insults rather than just disputing with solid info to prove how he was correct to begin with. It is not necessary, and counterproductive. When you post something making guarantees, and someone asks for proof, and you cannot provide that, no need to insult, just respond with the proof, admit that maybe the response has a pretty good point and commend people for thinking things through, or not respond at all, not a hard concept to understand in how to have a healthy, and informative debate.

[LouG]

Just to clarify, I never said that will happen, I have, and am saying that is what the CBI wants to do, and has stated that for years, but if they are going to be able to follow through with that, that is yet to be seen, as we do not know what will happen until all is said and done. It is Kap that is saying that there is no way that it would happen, and guarentees millions to be made to his members by saying that it definitely cannot and will not redenominate, while in these posts, nobody is saying that it definitely will redenominate. So, it is important to note WHO exactly is making guarentees here. The funny thing though, is that while Kap makes these guarentees, he himself stated "Nobody knows anything until the CBI does it's job." Yes Kap, that was a quote from Kap in his post on 11/23 at 12:28 AM on his site responding to a post about his 10 reasons post. If you make guarentees to people that they will make millions, then you really screwed the pooch when you follow up a statement like that with saying nobody knows...

Where is your proof the CBI wants to do this? I did a bit of digging myself. Here is part of the April transcript from Shabibi. So Jayp, your information is false.

Shab’s answer:

Well thank you very much for this question and the ... ahmmm ....... even if I know the answer I cannot tell you .. (laughter) the thing is ... you cannot have an economist saying without....the answer depends, so the question here is if revaluation is really going to depend on what extent we are going to continue controlling the inflation.. as you know, if you go to the Central Bank website ... the first job is maintaining price stability .