jks9779

It is very important that we always read Scripture in context. Proof-texting verses to try and make them fit into our own interpretation of Scripture is very dangerous. For example: You're right about Romans 6:23. The wages of sin ARE death. We all sin. We all deserve death. However, the idea that death is what satisfies God's wrath cannot be drawn from Romans 6:7. Here's the full context of the verse: "What shall we say, then? Shall we go on sinning so that grace may increase? 2 By no means! We are those who have died to sin; how can we live in it any longer? 3 Or don’t you know that all of us who were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? 4 We were therefore buried with him through baptism into death in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, we too may live a new life. 5 For if we have been united with him in a death like his, we will certainly also be united with him in a resurrection like his. 6 For we know that our old self was crucified with him so that the body ruled by sin might be done away with,[a] that we should no longer be slaves to sin— 7 because anyone who has died has been set free from sin. 8 Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with him. 9 For we know that since Christ was raised from the dead, he cannot die again; death no longer has mastery over him. 10 The death he died, he died to sin once for all; but the life he lives, he lives to God. " Now, when read in full context, Paul is not saying that death satisfies the penalty for sin, He is only saying that death frees believers from the clutches of sin. Being spiritually dead IS in fact separation from God. A man without Christ is spiritually dead. Paul describes it as “being alienated from the life of God” in Ephesians 4:18. (To be separated from life is the same as being dead.) The natural man, like Adam hiding in the garden, is isolated from God. When we are born again, the spiritual death is reversed. Before salvation, we are dead (spiritually), but Jesus gives us life. “And you He made alive, who were dead in trespasses and sins,” (Ephesians 2:1 NKJV). “When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your sinful nature, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins” (Colossians 2:13). Hell IS separation from God since it is described as the second death. The book of Revelation speaks of a “second death,” which is a final (and eternal) separation from God. Only those who have never experienced new life in Christ will partake of the second death (Revelation 2:11; 20:6, 14; 21:8). And about Jeremiah 7:31, context doesn't seem to be an issue since you've provided enough in your quote, it's just your interpretation that is a little illogical. God is referring to child sacrifice, which is definitely something that he detests. It is a sin. God hates all sin. He is holy. Your illustration and the point you tried to make of it are not taking into account that God is just. Yes, He is love and He is merciful. He's allowing us to live isn't He? But He is also holy and just. We cannot begin to understand God’s justice unless we first understand sin. Sin is lawlessness (1 John 3:4) and iniquity (Daniel 9:4-5; Micah 2:1; James 3:6). It embodies everything contrary to God’s holy nature and is offensive to Him. Thus, sin is a crime against God and justice demands a penalty of death and separation from Him for it (Romans 1:18-32; 2:5; 3:23). But God sent His Son, Jesus Christ, to earth to pay that penalty for us (Romans 5:8-11; 6:23) and made salvation available to all who believe in His name (John 1:12; 3:15-17; 20:31). God’s own righteousness is provided as a gift to sinners who accept Jesus Christ as their Savior and is based upon His grace and mercy in response to our faith (Romans 3:23-26; Ephesians 2:3-7). His mercy and grace are not in spite of His justice, but because of it. He loved us so much that despite the fact that our sin demands our death, He sent His Son to be our substitute upon the cross, thus demonstrating that His justice was not violated, but instead satisfied (1 Thessalonians 1:10; 5:9). As for the future, the book of Revelation reveals the justice of God in all its glory during the end times. When the saints watch the destruction of the earth, their song will be of God’s righteous judgment upon the inhabitants for their ultimate sin of rejecting Him (Revelation 11:16-18; 15:3-4; 16:7; 19:1-4). Again, context is very important and can drastically change the meaning of a verse if it is applied incorrectly. I'll continue to pray that the Lord enlightens you with the truth as you search His Word. In Christ,

The actual phrase "your soul will burn in Hell forever" is nowhere to be found in the Bible, however, when the verses referenced above are taken into context with the rest of Scripture, there can be no other alternative. The Bible is very clear about what happens to believers when we die. We are given glorified bodies and we spend eternity in Heaven with Jesus Christ. The Bible is also very clear about what happens to unbelievers, as is mentioned by the verses above that are referenced. Whether it is the soul or the spirit that goes to Hell really doesn't matter since the pain and torment of Hell will be very real and will be very terrible, irregardless. My personal guess is that it is the spirit that goes to Hell and the spirit that goes to Heaven. The soul dies along with the body. Unbelievers are described as spiritually dead (Ephesians 2:1-5; Colossians 2:13), while only believers are said to be spiritually alive (1 Corinthians 2:11; Hebrews 4:12; James 2:26). If we are spiritually dead when we die, we go to hell. If we are spiritually alive when we die, we go to heaven. Bane, I would ask that you be careful not to discredit the entire account of the Bible based on the fact that it doesn't say word for word what you want it to say about one of the many subjects that are covered in the Scriptures. Any wise person would tell you that that is foolish. Like I said earlier, the Bible is very clear about the torment of Hell. That it is eternal. That it is fire. That it is painful. Whether it is your soul, spirit, or heck even your physical body that experiences that pain shouldn't really make much of a difference.

Certainly not trying to bring religion into anything. I'm only trying to "give the reason for the hope that I have," just as my faith asks of me. Bashing doesn't bother me. My savior was hated, humiliated, and crucified for me. That I may only share in an inkling of suffering for His name is a great honor.

I totally agree with you, the soul does die. There is a difference between soul and spirit. Hebrews 4:12 tells us so. Jesus' spirit lived on, as do all believers'. The punishment of the wicked dead in hell is described throughout Scripture as “eternal fire” (Matthew 25:41), “unquenchable fire” (Matthew 3:12), “shame and everlasting contempt” (Daniel 12:2), a place where “the fire is not quenched” (Mark 9:44-49), a place of “torment” and “fire” (Luke 16:23-24), “everlasting destruction” (2 Thessalonians 1:9), a place where “the smoke of torment rises forever and ever” (Revelation 14:10-11), and a “lake of burning sulfur” where the wicked are “tormented day and night forever and ever” (Revelation 20:10). I hope I've answered your question, Bane.

Jesus Christ was completely human and at the same time, completely deity. It's a mystery that we will not be able to understand the full implications of. Paul tells the Ephesians that Christ "did not consider equality with God something to be grasped but instead He emptied Himself taking on the form of a servant..." So He gave up His rights to deity while He was on Earth, yet He was still fully God. Also, Jesus Christ never "died" in the sense that you're thinking. Habakkuk, in the original Hebrew, is referring to a spiritual death, much like the one that unbelievers face when they go to Hell. Jesus Christ died in the flesh, not spiritually. His spiritual life continued on. Just as all believer's spirits will after physical death. This is the eternal life that is promised to all believers. This is a complicated subject, but I'll pray that God, even if you're not a believer, will grant you the grace needed to understand this subject, so that this misconception of our great faith can be avoided. In Christ,

RIch, this is seriously some ingenious thinking and makes a lot of sense. Of course, I hope this isn't the case, but again, it makes a lot of sense. I'm with you, Bane. I'm not giving up my dinar for .27 cents. Not gonna happen. I'm in this for the long haul.

If you'd like to know for certain whether you will be raptured, I'd be more than happy to help