NDAA

[coldwarvet]

"... when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new guards for their future security."

- From The Declaration of Independence, written by Thomas Jefferson, signed July 4, 1776

[hoopdog]

Just a thought...the House passed the NDAA (National Defense Authorization Act) about an hour ago. The Senate version already passed. While overall, the bill is not a bad thing, there are two very disturbing sections as laid out by Congressman Justin Amash ® MI as follows: The detention provisions in the National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA) conference report (final version) are identical to the provisions in the Senate version. They jeopardize the constitutional rights of all Americans.

Sections 1021 and 1022 (previously Sections 1031 and 1032) permit the President to indefinitely detain American citizens, without charge or trial, at his discretion.

This is my first topic post, so if this link doesn't work, I apologize: http://www.rules.house.gov/Media/file/PDF_112_1/legislativetext/HR1540conf.pdf

MY THOUGHTS

This bill gives the POTUS the right to detain ANYONE (American citizens included) for an INDEFINITE AMOUNT OF TIME for any reason by using the U.S. Military. While the bill is aimed at terrorists, it is so ambiguous it can be bent in such a way that anyone can be detained for any reason for an unlimited amount of time.

OK...does anyone besides me find it odd that this bill passes prior to the IQD RV? Think about it...anyone in America who purchased IQD could be viewed as having ties with Middle Eastern contacts, who might have ties to terrorists. This means those who purchased Dinar CAN be arrested, held without due process at an undisclosed location for an unlimited amount of time. While being held, THEIR POSSESSIONS CAN BE CONFISCATED (including any and all Dinar).

Ok...now, the U.S. Government has the power to seize ALL IQD in America free of charge. And we have no leg to stand on because our House and Senate destroyed our due process rights.

Will they do this? I don't know. But they have given POTUS a huge amount of power and this scenario is possible.

Something to think about! When the RV happens, I'm going to be last in line while I watch others cashing in! Call me chicken...but call me free!

They let murderes out of prison early because they can't afford to keep them there and yet you think everyone that has IQD has ties to Iraq and therefor could go to prison? You seriously posted this? This has to be the most ridiculous post I have ever seen on this site and that is saying a lot! You purchased a legal curency in a legal manner. If there were an issue they would be going after the people selling it, which by the way the majority of the people selling it are registered with the US Treasury. Anyone crazy enough to purchase from someone that isn't, well buyer beware is all I have to say about that.

SEEM AS THOUGH THEY ARE TRYING TO JUSTIFY ARRESTING AND HOLDING TERRORIST BY PUTTING AMERICANS ON THE LIST SO THE TERRORIST WANT FEEL DISCRIMENATED AGAINST. GO FIGURE. GO RV! QUICKLY

A terrorist is a terrorist, nationality has nothing to do with it. I hope you are joking with your comment, but after reading several others I'm not sure of anything anymore. I can't follow this topic anymore it is just plain crazy! Anybody else think that way too many people are making more out of this than what it really is? Sorry but I think it's stupid!! Not calling anyone stupid, just a serious, ahh what's the point.

[easyrider]

Well.... I'll see you ALL in the joint my cell mate will be okie.

[dinarmite]

like Newt says.............. we need to choke some Left wingers

No choke them all.

[Dynomike]

THIS BUDS FOR U --DUEEEEEED ! ! !

[wolfman]

Off subject for a moment, but..I have a thought. Obama has said that he wants to bail out the IMF. Some people claim that Iraq has way too many dinars out that would add up to like 90 trillion dollars if it revaled at over three bucks. What if O and M decided that if they rv'd that high, and the U.S. has the large amount that some on here have been saying...then when it rv's both countries bail out IMF, US pays its debt, and both countries look good in the world opinion, both countries are RICH, the people of LOTS of countries reap the rewards, and the world is a better place.

Then we can all ride unicorns and chase rainbows.

Possible? I don't know. I just try to wrap my mind around how Iraq could revalue at a decent rate with all those dinars they've printed, and sold.

As far as the original post...I would not put anything past this administration. They are hell bent on destroying America as we know it, and THAT is as plain as the nose on your face.

This is the most catastrophic presidency on record, and I can't see how anyone who wanted to be re-elected could do half the things he has done to the American people.

The only problem is, we have no candidate. Again.

Where is the CANDIDATE??? If shear brains and knowledge alone were enough, then Newt it is. But with the two front-runners we are stuck with now, we have NO CANDIDATE!!!

I am as sick about this as I was when John McCain won the nomination for 2008. It sucked then, and it sucks now. At least four more years of suckiness, and possibly eight more years of suckiness.

Depressing.

Very depressing.

[tilak]

I don't think your paranoid...

this is real and the law is ambiguous...Obama and is colleagues are slowly eradicating the entire constitution right before our eyes.

Time to move to Morocco or any country for that matter. You might have a better chance there living as an American citizen.

Fifth Amendment - an amendment to the Constitution of the United States that imposes restrictions on the government's prosecution of persons accused of crimes; mandates due process of law and prohibits self-incrimination and double jeopardy; requires just compensation if private property is taken for public use.

Well.... I'll see you ALL in the joint my cell mate will be okie.

LOL I want mine to be Dinar Thug from the Clown News Network.

[foghorn leghorn]

I'd Cop A Plea and Turn In Okie !

:D

Or cop an Okie and turn in a Plea

[tim5400]

SO the POTUS can arrest any CANDIDATE running for Office in 2012........WOW....CRAZY

[hame55]

I'm not advocating that it will happen...my main point is that it could happen. Have any of you looked at the bill that just passed tonight? We truly lost our Constitutional right to due process this evening...pretty scary stuff. Or am I just getting old and paranoid?

YES

We have lost our rights. Right after the OWS movement started (the people rising up...remember that?)

I think it has nothing to do with dinar - remember the dinar is part of the corporate state's overseas empire. It's a right-wing thing. So is this new law. It''s conservatives who are rich worried about losing their money and power.

Let's not get mixed up here.

Believe me - they are not worried about Muslims. They are worried about us.

[tankdude]

SEC. 1031. AFFIRMATION OF AUTHORITY OF THE ARMED FORCES OF THE UNITED STATES TO DETAIN COVERED PERSONS PURSUANT TO THE AUTHORIZATION FOR USE OF MILITARY FORCE.

(a) In General.--Congress affirms that the authority of the President to use all necessary and appropriate force pursuant to the Authorization for Use of Military Force (Public Law 107-40) includes the authority for the Armed Forces of the United States to detain covered persons (as defined in subsection () pending disposition under the law of war.

( Covered Persons.--A covered person under this section is any

person as follows:

(1) A person who planned, authorized, committed, or aided the terrorist attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001, or harbored those responsible for those attacks.

(2) A person who was a part of or substantially supported al-Qaeda, the Taliban, or associated forces that are engaged in hostilities against the United States or its coalition partners, including any person who has committed a belligerent act or has directly supported such hostilities in aid of such enemy forces.

© Disposition Under Law of War.--The disposition of a person under the law of war as described in subsection (a) may include the following:

(1) Detention under the law of war without trial until the end of the hostilities authorized by the Authorization for Use of Military Force.

(2) Trial under chapter 47A of title 10, United States Code (as amended by the Military Commissions Act of 2009 (title XVIII of Public Law 111-84)).

(3) Transfer for trial by an alternative court or competent tribunal having lawful jurisdiction.

(4) Transfer to the custody or control of the person's country of origin, any other foreign country, or any other foreign entity.

(d) Construction.--Nothing in this section is intended to limit or expand the authority of the President or the scope of the Authorization for Use of Military Force.

(e) Authorities.--Nothing in this section shall be construed to affect existing law or authorities, relating to the detention of United States citizens, lawful resident aliens of the United States or any other persons who are captured or arrested in the United States.

(f) Requirement for Briefings of Congress.--The Secretary of Defense shall regularly brief Congress regarding the application of the authority described in this section, including the organizations, entities, and individuals considered to be ``covered persons'' for purposes of subsection ((2).

SEC. 1032. REQUIREMENT FOR MILITARY CUSTODY.

(a) Custody Pending Disposition Under Law of War.--

(1) In general.--Except as provided in paragraph (4), the Armed Forces of the United States shall hold a person described in paragraph (2) who is captured in the course of hostilities authorized by the Authorization for Use of Military Force (Public Law 107-40) in military custody pending disposition under the law of war.

(2) Covered persons.--The requirement in paragraph (1) shall apply to any person whose detention is authorized under section 1031 who is determined--

(A) to be a member of, or part of, al-Qaeda or an associated force that acts in coordination with or pursuant to the direction of al-Qaeda; and

( to have participated in the course of planning or carrying out an attack or attempted attack against the United States or its coalition partners.

(3) Disposition under law of war.--For purposes of this subsection, the disposition of a person under the law of war has the meaning given in section 1031©, except that

no transfer otherwise described in paragraph (4) of that section shall be made unless consistent with the requirements of section 1033.

(4) Waiver for national security.--The Secretary of Defense may, in consultation with the Secretary of State and the Director of National Intelligence, waive the requirement

of paragraph (1) if the Secretary submits to Congress a certification in writing that such a waiver is in the national security interests of the United States.

( Applicability to United States Citizens and Lawful Resident Aliens.--

(1) United states citizens.--The requirement to detain a person in military custody under this section does not extend to citizens of the United States.

(2) Lawful resident aliens.--The requirement to detain a person in military custody under this section does not extend to a lawful resident alien of the United States on the

basis of conduct taking place within the United States, except to the extent permitted by the Constitution of the United States.

© Implementation Procedures.--

(1) In general.--Not later than 60 days after the date of the enactment of this Act, the President shall issue, and submit to Congress, procedures for implementing this section.

(2) Elements.--The procedures for implementing this section shall include, but not be limited to, procedures as follows:

(A) Procedures designating the persons authorized to make determinations under subsection (a)(2) and the process by which such determinations are to be made.

( Procedures providing that the requirement for military custody under subsection (a)(1) does not require the interruption of ongoing surveillance or intelligence

gathering with regard to persons not already in the custody or control of the United States.

© Procedures providing that a determination under subsection (a)(2) is not required to be implemented until after the conclusion of an interrogation session

which is ongoing at the time the determination is made and does not require the interruption of any such ongoing session.

(D) Procedures providing that the requirement for military custody under subsection (a)(1) does not apply when intelligence, law enforcement, or other government

officials of the United States are granted access to an individual who remains in the custody of a third country.

(E) Procedures providing that a certification of national security interests under subsection (a)(4) may be granted for the purpose of transferring a covered

person from a third country if such a transfer is in the interest of the United States and could not otherwise be accomplished.

(d) Effective Date.--This section shall take effect on the date that is 60 days after the date of the enactment of this Act, and shall apply with respect to persons described in subsection (a)(2) who are taken into the custody or brought under the control of the United States on or after that effective date.

I added the bold - that part doesn't seem ambiguousto me. Just sayin...

[azpoolguy]

Remimber that the military take an oath to uphold and defend the Contitution not to protect the government

[tilak]

SO the POTUS can arrest any CANDIDATE running for Office in 2012........WOW....CRAZY

Yeah anything,,,,

[kliklok00]

SEC. 1031. AFFIRMATION OF AUTHORITY OF THE ARMED FORCES OF THE UNITED STATES TO DETAIN COVERED PERSONS PURSUANT TO THE AUTHORIZATION FOR USE OF MILITARY FORCE.

(a) In General.--Congress affirms that the authority of the President to use all necessary and appropriate force pursuant to the Authorization for Use of Military Force (Public Law 107-40) includes the authority for the Armed Forces of the United States to detain covered persons (as defined in subsection () pending disposition under the law of war.

( Covered Persons.--A covered person under this section is any

person as follows:

(1) A person who planned, authorized, committed, or aided the terrorist attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001, or harbored those responsible for those attacks.

(2) A person who was a part of or substantially supported al-Qaeda, the Taliban, or associated forces that are engaged in hostilities against the United States or its coalition partners, including any person who has committed a belligerent act or has directly supported such hostilities in aid of such enemy forces.

© Disposition Under Law of War.--The disposition of a person under the law of war as described in subsection (a) may include the following:

(1) Detention under the law of war without trial until the end of the hostilities authorized by the Authorization for Use of Military Force.

(2) Trial under chapter 47A of title 10, United States Code (as amended by the Military Commissions Act of 2009 (title XVIII of Public Law 111-84)).

(3) Transfer for trial by an alternative court or competent tribunal having lawful jurisdiction.

(4) Transfer to the custody or control of the person's country of origin, any other foreign country, or any other foreign entity.

(d) Construction.--Nothing in this section is intended to limit or expand the authority of the President or the scope of the Authorization for Use of Military Force.

(e) Authorities.--Nothing in this section shall be construed to affect existing law or authorities, relating to the detention of United States citizens, lawful resident aliens of the United States or any other persons who are captured or arrested in the United States.

(f) Requirement for Briefings of Congress.--The Secretary of Defense shall regularly brief Congress regarding the application of the authority described in this section, including the organizations, entities, and individuals considered to be ``covered persons'' for purposes of subsection ((2).

SEC. 1032. REQUIREMENT FOR MILITARY CUSTODY.

(a) Custody Pending Disposition Under Law of War.--

(1) In general.--Except as provided in paragraph (4), the Armed Forces of the United States shall hold a person described in paragraph (2) who is captured in the course of hostilities authorized by the Authorization for Use of Military Force (Public Law 107-40) in military custody pending disposition under the law of war.

(2) Covered persons.--The requirement in paragraph (1) shall apply to any person whose detention is authorized under section 1031 who is determined--

(A) to be a member of, or part of, al-Qaeda or an associated force that acts in coordination with or pursuant to the direction of al-Qaeda; and

( to have participated in the course of planning or carrying out an attack or attempted attack against the United States or its coalition partners.

(3) Disposition under law of war.--For purposes of this subsection, the disposition of a person under the law of war has the meaning given in section 1031©, except that

no transfer otherwise described in paragraph (4) of that section shall be made unless consistent with the requirements of section 1033.

(4) Waiver for national security.--The Secretary of Defense may, in consultation with the Secretary of State and the Director of National Intelligence, waive the requirement

of paragraph (1) if the Secretary submits to Congress a certification in writing that such a waiver is in the national security interests of the United States.

( Applicability to United States Citizens and Lawful Resident Aliens.--

(1) United states citizens.--The requirement to detain a person in military custody under this section does not extend to citizens of the United States.

(2) Lawful resident aliens.--The requirement to detain a person in military custody under this section does not extend to a lawful resident alien of the United States on the

basis of conduct taking place within the United States, except to the extent permitted by the Constitution of the United States.

© Implementation Procedures.--

(1) In general.--Not later than 60 days after the date of the enactment of this Act, the President shall issue, and submit to Congress, procedures for implementing this section.

(2) Elements.--The procedures for implementing this section shall include, but not be limited to, procedures as follows:

(A) Procedures designating the persons authorized to make determinations under subsection (a)(2) and the process by which such determinations are to be made.

( Procedures providing that the requirement for military custody under subsection (a)(1) does not require the interruption of ongoing surveillance or intelligence

gathering with regard to persons not already in the custody or control of the United States.

© Procedures providing that a determination under subsection (a)(2) is not required to be implemented until after the conclusion of an interrogation session

which is ongoing at the time the determination is made and does not require the interruption of any such ongoing session.

(D) Procedures providing that the requirement for military custody under subsection (a)(1) does not apply when intelligence, law enforcement, or other government

officials of the United States are granted access to an individual who remains in the custody of a third country.

(E) Procedures providing that a certification of national security interests under subsection (a)(4) may be granted for the purpose of transferring a covered

person from a third country if such a transfer is in the interest of the United States and could not otherwise be accomplished.

(d) Effective Date.--This section shall take effect on the date that is 60 days after the date of the enactment of this Act, and shall apply with respect to persons described in subsection (a)(2) who are taken into the custody or brought under the control of the United States on or after that effective date.

I added the bold - that part doesn't seem ambiguousto me. Just sayin...

The part you highlighted in bold (specifically the second part) can be interpreted as stating that the President is not REQUIRED to indefinitely detain American citizens without charge or trial. It still PERMITS him to do so.

And for the record, I am NOT STATING that the President WILL use this power to arrest citizens...I am merely stating he NOW HAS THAT RIGHT (unless he veto's this bill) to detain ANY American citizen. The point of this post was to let people know our beloved Congress (loved by 9% / hated by 91%) handed the President unprecedented power and no one seems to be very concerned about it.

They let murderes out of prison early because they can't afford to keep them there and yet you think everyone that has IQD has ties to Iraq and therefor could go to prison? You seriously posted this? This has to be the most ridiculous post I have ever seen on this site and that is saying a lot! You purchased a legal curency in a legal manner. If there were an issue they would be going after the people selling it, which by the way the majority of the people selling it are registered with the US Treasury. Anyone crazy enough to purchase from someone that isn't, well buyer beware is all I have to say about that.

A terrorist is a terrorist, nationality has nothing to do with it. I hope you are joking with your comment, but after reading several others I'm not sure of anything anymore. I can't follow this topic anymore it is just plain crazy! Anybody else think that way too many people are making more out of this than what it really is? Sorry but I think it's stupid!! Not calling anyone stupid, just a serious, ahh what's the point.

You apparently did not read my entire post...I never said anyone was going to prison. I stated that the National Defense Authorization Act has language in it that states the President of the United States CAN use the military to detain American citizens for basically any reason at all and for any length of time. Do I think he will arrest Dinar holders? Of course not! But he can...that is the entire point of the post. The new law (unless he veto's it) will give him the power to detain anyone he chooses to detain. That kind of power is something to be concerned about! The reason I used the Dinar purchases as an example, was simply to make people understand POTUS can use ANY excuse to detain someone. For example...if you gave money to a charity years ago, and now that charity gets linked to ANY type of terrorist group or activity unbeknownst to you, YOU can be detained. Again, this is a stretch...but it is legitimate. Our Congress gave POTUS power that is unconstitutional and it should alarm everyone...

[Chooch]

like Newt says.............. we need to choke some Left wingers

Your boy "Newt" is a devout Satanist. I suggest you research it and stop believing what you see on tv.

[Bongalow]

Well here is the skinny tonight!!! I buried a good friend of mi e and I decided to get drunk. I do not care what gov agency you all are referring to but as an American , personally I do not care. I have lots of weapons and cold beer and the constitution says I can. If you want it come and get it. !! I dare you. Other than that I have bEen on this ride fer to long. RV already and lets play ball or get off the plate, cuz eventually the pitcher will. BAck you off anyway. Don't tread on me !!! Damn I am good on my phone and drunk. I should get an award for fat fanger syndrome A++++!!!

[Hell froze over]

I'm not advocating that it will happen...my main point is that it could happen. Have any of you looked at the bill that just passed tonight? We truly lost our Constitutional right to due process this evening...pretty scary stuff. Or am I just getting old and paranoid?

No its a new day in America and if you were to get the Asian markets to all raise there rates I would bet those old countries wanted our government to have a little more control over its people. I mean come on you did not hear much on occupy congress right before all the Iraqis IMF ect. were due in D.C. the following week .They got the hell beat out of them and it was made very clear .YOU WILL NOT OCCUPY D.C. not this week.

Edited December 15, 2011 by Hell froze over

[HopeTas]

The National Defense Authorization Act is a frightening step toward our loss of freedom. People can be detained indefinitely without trial and held like the prisoners in Guantanamo. I pray that our president vetoes this bill.

[enerhealth]

Go RON PAUL!

[BadCobra]

I'm not advocating that it will happen...my main point is that it could happen. Have any of you looked at the bill that just passed tonight? We truly lost our Constitutional right to due process this evening...pretty scary stuff. Or am I just getting old and paranoid?

Absolutely, I have been monitoring this closely, and have similar concerns. Like you, I am not saying that it is inevitable and about to happen, but rather that is CAN happen and so few Americans know about it or sadly even care about what our politicians are doing to strip away our liberty.

They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. ~Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759

Some additional information on this link (hope it works): http://paul.senate.gov/?p=published_article&id=408

[sourpuss]

I'm not advocating that it will happen...my main point is that it could happen. Have any of you looked at the bill that just passed tonight? We truly lost our Constitutional right to due process this evening...pretty scary stuff. Or am I just getting old and paranoid?

I agree the bill is disturbing but I don't think its to come after IQD investors..I THINK ITS MUCH WORSE THAN THAT and ties into the FEMA camps theory, I think i want to cash in my dinars and move to a nice little peaceful country somewhere..somewhere small!

Go RON PAUL!

YES .. go RON PAUL..but even tho the people are finally speaking, they aren't going to let him be a presidential candidate..but I can have hope:)

[harleyrider1]

Unfortunately you are probably right. Maybe a little paranoid but right nonetheless. It's like the patriot act. We don't need protected from terrorists we need protection from our government.

Wish I could give you more than a simgle +1...I say +1111111111111111111111.....

[tep]

Call you congressmen now and tell them no on NDAA!

[tep]

Call you congressmen now and tell them no on NDAA!

[Fingers_crossed]

thats why i keep some in the truck i also will be first in line

So randalln...just curious....where do you park your truck???:lol::lol::lol: