Property Tax in North Dakota

[Abarvets]

This was sent to me today so I thought I would post and see what you all thought!

Charlene Nelson

Activist Post

North Dakota citizens may abolish property taxes, allowing them more control over government spending. Nearly 30,000 signatures were collected to place the people’s initiative on the ballot in June, 2012 that would constitutionally abolish all property taxes in North Dakota.

This landmark measure supports property rights, small government and freedom advocates around the country.

If the initiative is successful, North Dakota will be the first state to abolish all property taxes, both state and local, and will provide a model for the other states to do the same. North Dakota may be the first state to kick off the property rights revolution!

Since 1978 the state legislature has amended, altered or “reformed” property tax 134 times.

This tells us that the tax cannot be fixed.

Legislation to abolish property tax was introduced in the 2009 legislative session. The bill was defeated. There was even an attempt to turn the bill into a study to investigate the issue and that even failed.

Since the initiative qualified for the ballot, several city and county groups have come out in opposition to the measure, in direct violation of state law. The hysteria coming from government leaders include threats that this will be the end of public education, fire and police protection will be terminated, and there will be no more roads (remember that roads are funded through the gas tax).

If the measure passes, two very important issues will be addressed in order to pare down the size of government and spending:

1. The initiative mandates that schools and local governments must be “fully and properly funded” before the state can address any other budgeting (like special interests).

2. The measure also states that all “legal obligations” must be funded. Legal obligations are:

A. Statutory — the things that the state has directed local government to fund.

B. Contractual obligations — spending that the counties and cities have taken on through contracts like bonds, special construction, etc.

After schools, local governments and legal obligations are funded and the real debate begins! Does the city, county or state have the obligation to fund a museum or an art festival? Most people would say ‘no’. Does that mean that the local government can’t fund museums or art festivals? This is an issue of real self rule and local control. If the people really, truly feel they must have a museum or a new hockey rink, then they can vote themselves a new tax to fund it—a sales tax or user fee or special assessment or whatever. They just can’t fund it with property tax.

These two points will spark a whole new level of public discourse on the proper role of government and citizen involvement.

In addition to forcing the state to prioritize spending, it will also compel them to scrutinize current and future spending, especially if they want to avoid increasing taxes.

According to the Beacon Hill Institute study on EmpowerTheTaxpayer.blogspot.com, there is no need to increase taxes to “pay for” the missing property tax revenues. By putting an extra $3000-4000 in each family’s pocket, the state will enjoy an increase in sales and income tax revenues. Businesses will invest more heavily in our local economy, while the need for some government employees will vanish. The state’s economy will improve without increasing any taxes.

The national mainstream media is not covering this story. The NEA has pledged $4-5 million to fight passage of the measure — this in a state where a Senate race costs less than $1 million. They clearly see the national impact this measure will generate and want to stop it before any other states get any bright ideas.

North Dakota is one of the cheapest places to run a campaign, so if we get good support not only will this measure pass in our state, but we will see it being promoted in other states as well.

For more information, please visit our website: EmpowerTheTaxpayer.blogspot.com

Full text of the measure can be found HERE

Economic study of property tax abolition from Beacon Hill Institute can be found HERE (pdf)

Recent TV interview that explains the basics of the topic is HERE

Charlene Nelson has been a resident of North Dakota for 18 years. She was the State Chairman of the Constitution party for eight years and led the petitioning to get three presidential candidates on the ballot in North Dakota. In 2001 Charlene was the chairman of Protect Our Privacy, the citizen’s group that successfully repealed SB2919. This bill allowed banks to sell people’s personal financial information and in repealing it, we saw a major victory for privacy protection. In 2008, Charlene was the State Campaign manager for Ron Paul’s presidential campaign. Under her leadership, North Dakota was the first state to win double digit percentages for Ron Paul in the February caucus—winning 22% of the vote and tying for second place. For the last three years, Charlene has been the State Coordinator for Campaign for Liberty. Campaign for Liberty is a citizen activist group that educates people on political issues and effective activism. It encourages people to change their country and restore freedom by taking a role in the political process. Charlene believes in leading by example and has run for office. She has been the Municipal Judge for Casselton since 2009.

November 30, 2011

http://republicbroadcasting.org/?p=18252#.TtaDb9wOdCE.email

[kwg]

OK thats it I'm moving to North Dakota!! No property tax and the State Bank of North Dakota (mini Federal Reserve run like a credit union) just wish it was a little warmer.

[FlintNPebbles]

Hmmmm.....Interesting. I am going to contact my friend who is a County Treasurer in N.D. and see what she is hearing.

Gotta say though.....property taxes in ND are cheap compared to IL where I am now!!

I do like the idea....it will be interesting to see what would happen with it being implemented. ND does not have the immigration issue that we, in IL, live with. There are not 3 families with 10 kids attending school in one house and then a retired couple living on the same block with no kids in school. Why should they have to pay to fund a school that they are not 'using'.

Definitely will follow this....Thank you for posting.

OK thats it I'm moving to North Dakota!! No property tax and the State Bank of North Dakota (mini Federal Reserve run like a credit union) just wish it was a little warmer.

awwww it's not so bad!! Summers are great....they just don't last to long Gotta be tough to live in ND

[DinarMillionaire]

We need to copy this for the country.

Throw the BUMS out and take back our country.

[Luigi1]

ND can easy do away with no property taxes. Like Alaska, ND has oil revenues coming in to help balance the state's budget. This won't work in many other states without having to raise taxes elsewhere like sales or luxury taxes.

[Abarvets]

Hmmmm.....Interesting. I am going to contact my friend who is a County Treasurer in N.D. and see what she is hearing.

Gotta say though.....property taxes in ND are cheap compared to IL where I am now!!

Flint would love to hear from Folks in ND. Keep us posted. Had a friend in grad school from ND sent them the email, haven't heard back.

[Jmcc]

This whole tax thing has gotten way out of control, especially the people's control. Never thought that the federal government should have any say in what happens in my small town as far as education, but because of the way the system is set up, they do. Needs to be a complete reform of many things.

[Abarvets]

This whole tax thing has gotten way out of control, especially the people's control. Never thought that the federal government should have any say in what happens in my small town as far as education, but because of the way the system is set up, they do. Needs to be a complete reform of many things.

You are not alone in your feelings.

[Darin]

ND is rich in energy sources... The Bakkan oil area provides a lot of wealth to those in the western states. Many people, who may luckily have bought land in the right spot are now millionaires. The west is booming with oil rigs while most of ND is also putting up wind towers. I have a friend who has worked on both the oil rigs (as an electrician) and also put up wind towers. Long story short, N.D. is likely not hurting, considering that tax revenues from the millionaires, low population, low unemployment, and expanding business in the west.... I would likely argue that this may be more of an incentive to draw people to the state.

[Abarvets]

ND is rich in energy sources... The Bakkan oil area provides a lot of wealth to those in the western states. Many people, who may luckily have bought land in the right spot are now millionaires. The west is booming with oil rigs while most of ND is also putting up wind towers. I have a friend who has worked on both the oil rigs (as an electrician) and also put up wind towers. Long story short, N.D. is likely not hurting, considering that tax revenues from the millionaires, low population, low unemployment, and expanding business in the west.... I would likely argue that this may be more of an incentive to draw people to the state.

Thanks Darin. Don't they employ a lot of people in the telemarketing industry as well? I know someone who used to have to travel up there years ago to review scripts they used for products.

[DiveDeepSix]

Dang it! Here we go again LOL. I'm over in neighboring MN, and you guys are already killing us on the smoking ban for bars along the river and the taxes on alcohol and tobacco, along with the smoking ban here have pretty much wiped out over 1/2 the bars in the state of MN. Now property taxes too! Im moving, oh wait, nope I'm not both trees in ND died last year so I will stay. Just kidding, lotsa family and friends over there and I hope they get this passed and the other states follow suit.

Actually I think South Dakota has some pretty sweet tax breaks too, can't remember if it was sales tax or what I think it was no state income tax, but I'm not sure. I do know it's to get more people and businesses to move into the state. Both great areas for hunting and such good people and they have 4 trees left.

[krome2ez]

On top of all that,

ND has only a 3.5% un-employment rate.

Now, if you could only deal with the cold. Brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.

[Darin]

Thanks Darin. Don't they employ a lot of people in the telemarketing industry as well? I know someone who used to have to travel up there years ago to review scripts they used for products.

Call centers in general, yes. Not an abundance of them from what I have seen. You got your telemarketing, tele-relays, customer service centers, bill collector centers, etc. etc.

I know of smaller towns in MN that have call centers too..

Dang it! Here we go again LOL. I'm over in neighboring MN, and you guys are already killing us on the smoking ban for bars along the river and the taxes on alcohol and tobacco, along with the smoking ban here have pretty much wiped out over 1/2 the bars in the state of MN. Now property taxes too! Im moving, oh wait, nope I'm not both trees in ND died last year so I will stay. Just kidding, lotsa family and friends over there and I hope they get this passed and the other states follow suit.

Actually I think South Dakota has some pretty sweet tax breaks too, can't remember if it was sales tax or what I think it was no state income tax, but I'm not sure. I do know it's to get more people and businesses to move into the state. Both great areas for hunting and such good people and they have 4 trees left.

Some towns in ND followed MN & actually banned smoking in public places, including bars, truck stops, etc. etc. But, this is based upon city ordinance & has to be voted upon.

Smaller towns, or casinos, and your okay.

LOL @ the tree-statement...

Has anyone ever driven through ND? Wow, talk about a boring drive... No trees! At least the western part of the state it gets pretty cool looking as your about to enter Montana as you start to see the mountains.

On top of all that,

ND has only a 3.5% un-employment rate.

Now, if you could only deal with the cold. Brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.

This far north, weather is not so bad. I reside in MN but ND is just right next door. Mid 30s today, and still no official snow on the ground that is here to stay.

Flurries every once in awhile, like today..

But, the winters this far North can sometime be bad (as in cold).. But ironically, the Summers up this far north can get pretty hot too...

[DiveDeepSix]

Yeah, it's an extemely boring drive, went out snowmobiling in the Cooke City/ Red Lodge area, and it was awesome. You're right its like driving across a pool table and seeing a huge wall in front of you on the horizon. Badlands area is pretty awesome looking too, wouldn't want to get stuck out there it's very desolate in most places.

We've been lucky so far, and I hope it stays that way, what was it last year we (MN) set 2 new records for lowest actual temp and longest stretch of days spent below zero, man that sucked. Gotta love the lakes in the summer time though!

Edited November 30, 2011 by DiveDeepSix

[Darin]

Yeah, it's an extemely boring drive, went out snowmobiling in the Cooke City/ Red Lodge area, and it was awesome. You're right its like driving across a pool table and seeing a huge wall in front of you on the horizon. Badlands area is pretty awesome looking too, wouldn't want to get stuck out there it's very desolate in most places.

We've been lucky so far, and I hope it stays that way, what was it last year we (MN) set 2 new records for lowest actual temp and longest stretch of days spent below zero, man that sucked. Gotta love the lakes in the summer time though!

Only time I entered Montana was to hit up Red Lodge. Broke a Ski there! Better than my 1st time skiing in Virginia, MN - broke a thumb! LOL

I remember reading in my vehicle a low temp of -30+

Can't beat the lakes, your right.. I did a fishing trip at lake of the woods in late August... I recall even in late August one day fishing I was extremely hot & at night it got colder the 2nd night than the one before.

[Gooserider67]

Being a new property owner I find it crazy of how every little thing is taxed. I pay tax when I purchased my house and land, I pay taxes on that property every year even if it is fully paid for, if improvements are made I pay taxes at the lumber yard, I pay for tax on the labor for the improvement, and I pay a improvement tax to the government. OMG!!!! where does it end.... having the American Dream of owning my own property is an amazing feeling but the liberties and freedoms that we have are stolen on a daily basis either by the loss of a freedom or paid by taxes... This madness has to come to an end, I can live without a new hockey rink, or art museum and I can most defiantly live without the government in my face and in my hip pocket...

[BrokeNoMore]

On top of all that,

ND has only a 3.5% un-employment rate.

Now, if you could only deal with the cold. Brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.

That's because unemployed folks freeze to death each winter and aren't around to be counted. That 3.5% is based on a 12 month average, with living unemployed people only being counted from May to October, so really it's 7%.

Just kidding.

[wiyakpa]

North Dakota: Measure to get rid of property tax on ballot

Mon, May 2 2011 — Source: Valley News Live A proposed constitutional amendment to abolish property taxes in North Dakota has been approved for the ballot. Secretary of State Al Jaeger said Friday the initiative had enough petition signatures to qualify for the June 2012 primary election. It will be listed as Measure 2.

http://www.citizensincharge.org/news/north-dakota-measure-to-get-rid-of-property-tax-on-ballot

[Abarvets]

Has anyone ever driven through ND? Wow, talk about a boring drive... No trees! At least the western part of the state it gets pretty cool looking as your about to enter Montana as you start to see the mountains.

This far north, weather is not so bad. I reside in MN but ND is just right next door. Mid 30s today, and still no official snow on the ground that is here to stay.

Flurries every once in awhile, like today..

But, the winters this far North can sometime be bad (as in cold).. But ironically, the Summers up this far north can get pretty hot too...

As far as the drive I have to drive up the state of Illinios from time to time. Yicks nothing to see but corn and soy. We used to have a joke when I lived out in Nebraska that all you had to do was look out side and you could see in the distance what tomorrow's weather was going to be!

Is it true they are still thinking of having the mosquito as the unofficial state bird in MN?

On top of all that,

ND has only a 3.5% un-employment rate.

Now, if you could only deal with the cold. Brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.

Krome could not agree with you more on that cold thing. Ran south the first chance I got! Most of my family has followed.

[Dah-kota]

Come on over to N. Duh-Kota

I've lived here for the last 5yrs. after moving here from San Diego...which has the population of 3 times as many

people as the WHOLE big state of ND. Go figger.

I came here to slow my life down (brakes on) so I could live another 100yrs.

If you want a calm....no crime...no rush hr. traffic...this is the place to be.

No one locks homes or takes keys out of cars in most towns.

Bismarck is the closest BIG City to me. Only 1 hr. away...that you could drive blind-folded.

Nothing here is very *High Tech*. Boring most times. But, you make your own pleasures.

Lots of praries, no Mts. to speak of.

The people are sooooooo caring & giving.

The oil boom is bringing people in from all over and ND needs lots of construction workers, too.

Need lots more homes to be built.

If ya can handle the cold...which we got our 1st dusting last night...please come here to live the easy life.

Be sure to stop by and visit me! I'd be glad to party hard with any or all of the DinarVet Family!

[nettie]

ND can easy do away with no property taxes. Like Alaska, ND has oil revenues coming in to help balance the state's budget. This won't work in many other states without having to raise taxes elsewhere like sales or luxury taxes.

I live in the St. Louis area, and just last night on our local news they were talking about MO doing away with State income tax. However to do that they would raise our sales tax to about 10%. That would end up being way more taxes for me to pay than just paying my local income tax. People don't realize when you are talking raising sales tax it is on EVERYTHING you buy, food, gas, groceries, cars etc. I don't care to pay all that here!

[Abarvets]

Come on over to N. Duh-Kota

I've lived here for the last 5yrs. after moving here from San Diego...which has the population of 3 times as many

people as the WHOLE big state of ND. Go figger.

I came here to slow my life down (brakes on) so I could live another 100yrs.

If you want a calm....no crime...no rush hr. traffic...this is the place to be.

No one locks homes or takes keys out of cars in most towns.

Bismarck is the closest BIG City to me. Only 1 hr. away...that you could drive blind-folded.

Nothing here is very *High Tech*. Boring most times. But, you make your own pleasures.

Lots of praries, no Mts. to speak of.

The people are sooooooo caring & giving.

The oil boom is bringing people in from all over and ND needs lots of construction workers, too.

Need lots more homes to be built.

If ya can handle the cold...which we got our 1st dusting last night...please come here to live the easy life.

Be sure to stop by and visit me! I'd be glad to party hard with any or all of the DinarVet Family!

Sounds like North Central Wisconsin where I had family. My Great Aunt used to say that if they were coming home and saw the lights on they knew they had company from Chicago! We used to make our own mischief, Goodness what fun! But that dog gone cold, yicks! So, have you taken up crosscountry skiing? I do enjoy doing that. I am not a Berkie person but it is nice and relaxing out there in the quiet.

I live in the St. Louis area, and just last night on our local news they were talking about MO doing away with State income tax. However to do that they would raise our sales tax to about 10%. That would end up being way more taxes for me to pay than just paying my local income tax. People don't realize when you are talking raising sales tax it is on EVERYTHING you buy, food, gas, groceries, cars etc. I don't care to pay all that here!

You will end up doing like most of my friends up in Cook county Illinois. They go to another county to buy everything! Interesting that they couldn't understand why revenues had not gone up like the politicans had thought they would!

[FlintNPebbles]

Come on over to N. Duh-Kota

I've lived here for the last 5yrs. after moving here from San Diego...which has the population of 3 times as many

people as the WHOLE big state of ND. Go figger.

I came here to slow my life down (brakes on) so I could live another 100yrs.

If you want a calm....no crime...no rush hr. traffic...this is the place to be.

No one locks homes or takes keys out of cars in most towns.

Bismarck is the closest BIG City to me. Only 1 hr. away...that you could drive blind-folded.

Nothing here is very *High Tech*. Boring most times. But, you make your own pleasures.

Lots of praries, no Mts. to speak of.

The people are sooooooo caring & giving.

The oil boom is bringing people in from all over and ND needs lots of construction workers, too.

Need lots more homes to be built.

If ya can handle the cold...which we got our 1st dusting last night...please come here to live the easy life.

Be sure to stop by and visit me! I'd be glad to party hard with any or all of the DinarVet Family!

Which direction from Bismarck do you live?

My son just came home from visiting in ND for Thanksgiving and he was talking about how the crime rate has jumped 600% in western ND....mostly in the oilfields. When I was younger and the last oil boom hit ND (I was in the thick of it in Tioga) I remember hearing about all sorts of shooting and stabbings....pretty scary stuff for someone who was used to living without any crime of any sort.....now living close to Chicago it's daily news

Even with the cold weather I would LOVE to move back to ND....it's a wonderful state but you are right about the lack of *high tech* you get used to it and it's hard to understand how people live without it.

[Abarvets]

Which direction from Bismarck do you live?

My son just came home from visiting in ND for Thanksgiving and he was talking about how the crime rate has jumped 600% in western ND....mostly in the oilfields. When I was younger and the last oil boom hit ND (I was in the thick of it in Tioga) I remember hearing about all sorts of shooting and stabbings....pretty scary stuff for someone who was used to living without any crime of any sort.....now living close to Chicago it's daily news

Even with the cold weather I would LOVE to move back to ND....it's a wonderful state but you are right about the lack of *high tech* you get used to it and it's hard to understand how people live without it.

Flint did your son think the crime increase was due to new folks coming into the area for the oil? Is it the same type of crime that you went through or is it smaller stuff stealing and the such?

Can relate to hearing bad news on the TV. News stories when I lived in the big city went like this: murder, murder, murder, fire, shooting, robbery, then weather followed by sports and one feel good story to top off the night. Usually never made it past the second murder before turning off the set.