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educate citizens changing money and use it before you delete the zeros of


trooper
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Yes, I'm just so emotional right now. I'm verklempt.

No, I just don't care to indulge your laser-like focus on the negative, or "reality," as you deign to call it.

I can tell you an okie story before your bedtime if your good.....im sure that will relieve the stress of living/reading about reality....

Keepmw, I got it, Sanssouci2 has been hacked.

laugh.giflaugh.gif

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You're the one who is "soon to be in hiding." I have nothing to hide. I used the same name.

You guys know everything there is to know, don't you? Feel the omnipotence.

u darn tootin, in hiding, once this fills my boots with an rv, you may seek to find me but you cannot go where i do. :D it's all good.

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Hi Doug,

Please see my post #25 of this thread.

Thanks

I was a business major, but knew nothing of currency, other than to spend it. Being involved in this investment has garnered a currency education, if through nothing else but osmosis.

But as someone looking to understand the introductory elements of international currency, can you imagine how difficult it is when listening to these posts go back and forth. I love the banter, but as far as an education, I have no idea who is correct. And that is the problem. Who really knows what they are talking about. And I am not speaking of anyone in particular at this moment, I do see trends. No wonder people are confused even when there are many here that know their stuff.

I spend probably spend too much time hooked up to the dinar sites, but many do not. To drop in and try to follow these debates it a monumental task.

Tiger, thank you for the delivery of your posts. Your information is educational and straight forward, and appreciated.

There are many here that know currency and understand international policies, and provide a great education for neophytes like me.

Speaking of that, what happened to Dalite, Drox, and Quiet Learner? They are missed.

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You really got me thinking about this. I did not realize how much Turkey had out there. Amazing, Turkey really did not have a choice. I do know Turkey had to RD more than once to settle the currency issue. IMO I do not think Iraq can wait for a possible RD in the future as well as issuing new currency again.

So I am going to think out of the box here. Let's say Iraq RV's at the rate they were before Saddam came into the picture, which is something like 3.00+. Okay the Iraqi people now have a currency that is worth more than the dollar. What do they do? They have a currency worth more than the dollar, they have a lot of dollars. Do they cash in and get what they can? My thought is some will, holding their dinar that is worth more. The US pays for their cash in. Iraq gets rid of dollarization, which they say they want.

We here in the United States cash in. I have no idea how much it is, nor do I know the quota of other people like us in other countries hold. But Iraq pays the bill, remember their currency is now more than the US and may be more valuable than some of the other countries....all in all the bill may not end up that much. Because no one has figured out how much US dollars the Iraqi people hold. As a matter of fact I do not recall that discussion at all.

Well my thinking out of the box is a bit blurry.....cause I haven't thunk it out much....just the top of me head! But I thought I would shoot it out there anyway.

Good posts JW....keep em coming!

Great thoughts zig....I dont see any other way to get people to the banks....

As far as the amount of USD....thats a great question for Darin...he would have some sort of idea im sure....glad I got you thinking my friend

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I am Sanssouci.

I don't come to this forum pretending to know everything there is to know. But neither is my head in the clouds, waiting with baited breath the gurus' every word.

I simply don't understand how it is that a dinar investor at any level can get his or her rocks off day in and day out on such small thinking as to focus predominantly upon the negative. If the "reality" of this investment is universally determined (by you, the LOPsters) to be so incontrovertibly negative and dour, why even bother investing in the Iraqi dinar at any level, be it one million, or in Keep's case, a paltry one thousand?

Awww sanssouci.....you dont like to turn on the old noggin do you?? We are discussing the similarities and differences between Iraq and Turkey....does that really bother you that much?? How can you take some actual fact, finding reading as being so negative when it is what it is?? No one is even talking about Iraq not being able to raise the value of the dinar hahahaha

You must really of had a bad day!! Try taking a nap...maybe that will help??

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Tigerstripes, they have educated the high ranking Parliament members, but they did not understand it. To this day, and still have questions. That article came out yesterday I believe about them not understanding blaming CBI has not educated Parliament. That is not true.

I am sure the CBI went to Parliament to present an education program to them, but hey, when only half of them show up for work, most of them missed the show.

JWJW.... I want to announce to the entire DV site I have fallen in love with you :hug: Thank you for telling it like it is !!!!!!

Back of Shelley! Get in line!

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I am Sanssouci.

I don't come to this forum pretending to know everything there is to know. But neither is my head in the clouds, waiting with baited breath the gurus' every word.

I simply don't understand how it is that a dinar investor at any level can get his or her rocks off day in and day out on such small thinking as to focus predominantly upon the negative. If the "reality" of this investment is universally determined (by you, the LOPsters) to be so incontrovertibly negative and dour, why even bother investing in the Iraqi dinar at any level, be it one million, or in Keep's case, a paltry one thousand?

No disrespect to any of the loppers whatsoever...Ive had my fair share of disagreements w many...but their whole deal is simple...although it makes no sense to me...they want to be wrong about the RD...they all are for the most part very intelligent people who just over think and analize the crap out of everything....and their intelligence gets the best of them....

See if it LOPs then they can say "see I told you so" and will never be wrong...as they had it all figured out.

BUT when it RVs they will all disappear(RICH$$$) boasting to everyone they know saying...those guys in Iraq said they were gunna RD and damned if they didnt RV"..."doesnt matter now Im loaded"!!! Lol

Now me Im the kinda person who couldnt care less if I am wrong....everytime Im wrong I learn something....thats what lifes about. I will sing the RV tune with hopes that it will do what I want it to....but if doesnt....I will keep doing what Ive always done....workin hard for my money! Lol

Bottomline here is the Loppers are people who cant handle the thought of being wrong....so they protect themselves....but mannn Im gunna tell you if I was as head strong about the outcome this thing....as the loppers are....I wouldnt be in or if they are like keep who really would love to see it happen....I would put my dinars away and forget about it....surely wouldnt spend time around here especially as much as some of them do...time is money and I spend way to much on this stuff as it is....and Im gettin ready to be rich$$$!!!

Go RV!!!

DISCLAIMER: Loppers I truly mean no disrespect to any of you...it takes all kinds and I have learned for the most part to just move on if I see something that I dont agree with....for the most part anyway....there are several of you that have earned my respect just by your loyalty and consistency....those are 2 important things that I admire about anyone....even you loppers. Shhhhhhhh dont worry I know all of you really want it to happen...secrets safe with me:) :)

I am sure the CBI went to Parliament to present an education program to them, but hey, when only half of them show up for work, most of them missed the show.

Back of Shelley! Get in line!

Lol thanks....Carrello :)

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You're like Grover Dill, Scut Farkus' useless sidekick in A Christmas Story. Did you know that? That's how you come off most of the time with your juvenile taunting.

Why don't you use your own noggin, and submit a truly devastating riposte for a change? I'd love it. I'd eat it up. Or is that above your pay grade?

I wish I could wish upon you your beloved RD. I am Sanssouci, still heckling from the balcony.

Its funny how you get so frazzled.....

Its actually below my pay grade FYI....I have people to do that for me hahaha Would you like to discuss Turkey some more?? Or we can talk about dinar now if you would like....

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Is that the best you can do? This has exactly nothing to do with what I said about Iraq using Turkey as an example and you know it but you post drivel like that in an attempt to belittle what I said, the Iraqis said to look to Turkey as an example of the method of how they intended to do the RD, they did NOT use it as an example of whether it would be successful or not. What does what you said there have to do with the WAY the RD is to be done? The Turkey example is used to show how the RD would be done and that the zeros would be removed from the currency, what does that have to do with Turkey's situation or with success or failure? The comparison was not about comparing Turkey to Iraq in any way except how the RD was to be carried out. Trying to belittle me does not change the fact that if the RD takes place it will be done in the same manner that Turkey did it and that means removing the zeros from the currency.

Doug by know means am trying to belittle you....I just ask that you think about what your telling people....members like keep or hopelesstexan or mrfnhappy have been around for a long time now and bring some very valid points which most on here know how to take...you havent been around long enough...30 days and all you do is bark of a LOP day in and day out...we get it believe me...keep has done a great job of keeping us grounded! Lol

Just hang around and watch a little! Earn some respect and then go for it....when someone like you comes on and so quickly starts the LOP LOP LOP TALK....it becomes very suspect.

Doug...anything is possible....but there are a lot of smart people here on both sides of this...checkem out...if you want me to point you in the rite direction just let me know...I will give you some names...and as always....GO RV!!!

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I know, and I agree with your assessment. I just wish they had some other tack besides seeking the negative in everything. Like Keep, if he is really so smart, he should have something better than taunting in his intellectual quiver.

It's not frazzlement, Keep. I'm inviting you to the dance. Hit me with something good!

See, like I just said to DougsDinar: "I wish I could wish upon you your beloved RD." I'm not congratulating myself, but I think this was a clever response.

Read more: http://dinarvets.com...0#ixzz1fFiQrh7G

I dont seek the negative.....both sides of the story come out at me....I see both....but usually the "realistic" side is more "negative" just because its not what we wanna hear or cause it might mean we wont make tons of money.....sorry....it is what it is....

There are positive things happening in Iraq and for our investment, but not all of it is tied to a RV.....and this wont be something that would happen tommorow.....I actually look forward to seeing if I can pick apart something because if I cant, then I know its something solid....

As you get tired of seeing things get shot down all the time that sound great, I get tired of seeing anything negative twisted around somehow as either something good, or something that doesnt apply to Iraq for nonsensical reasons....

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Absolutely correct! Thank you!

Not true. you would have two prices for good. A soda for example: 1 new dinar, or a 1000 current dinar. Citizens would carry exactly as much as they do now. obviosly you hate lop talk, but how many times has the cbi said the two currencys will coexist for a period. so yhere will be two prices, pretty basic stuff....

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As of right now, Turkey's debt is increasingly getting worse. What Turkey did in 2001 worked for then. Right now, not so good. With a world economy that is dynamically different (add economic issues throughout the world), following Turkey's path will not be smart. I saw the link you put up yesterday. I don't buy all those figures. There debt is around 135 billion.

I agree! Look at Turkey's M2 Money Supply: http://www.indexmundi.com/facts/turkey/money-and-quasi-money#FM.LBL.MQMY.CN

It has done nothing but increase every year since there RD. Significant increases at that!

If somebody could let me know how there RD actually worked that would be helpful. I do not see any sort of reduction of money supply during the past 50 years.

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I am sure the CBI went to Parliament to present an education program to them, but hey, when only half of them show up for work, most of them missed the show.

Back of Shelley! Get in line!

Oh great! My Dinar movie has a love triangle! I hope this is the only twist to the story. GO RV!wink.gif

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I was a business major, but knew nothing of currency, other than to spend it. Being involved in this investment has garnered a currency education, if through nothing else but osmosis.

But as someone looking to understand the introductory elements of international currency, can you imagine how difficult it is when listening to these posts go back and forth. I love the banter, but as far as an education, I have no idea who is correct. And that is the problem. Who really knows what they are talking about. And I am not speaking of anyone in particular at this moment, I do see trends. No wonder people are confused even when there are many here that know their stuff.

I spend probably spend too much time hooked up to the dinar sites, but many do not. To drop in and try to follow these debates it a monumental task.

Tiger, thank you for the delivery of your posts. Your information is educational and straight forward, and appreciated.

There are many here that know currency and understand international policies, and provide a great education for neophytes like me.

Speaking of that, what happened to Dalite, Drox, and Quiet Learner? They are missed.

Thankyou Carello. Very kind words.

Please do not get me confused with someone who knows currency. The only thing I really know about currency is that I don't have nearly as much of it as I would like. Whether that be dollars, dinars or whatever they use on the small pacific island that I one day hope to reside on!

What I can see from the articles and information that we are being presented with, is that the powers that be aren't fully disclosing all of their information and intentions. Truth be told, we can have all the conversations/debates/banter we like (and it's great that we get to do this on forums such as these), but until they dish out more info, we can only speculate on their intentions.

Yes, they have used Turkey etc as examples of recent redenominations, and the posts previous in thread about Russia's redenomination etc are classic examples of how a redenomination would work. No argument from me on that. Could Iraq do the same thing? Of course they could. It's their money. They can do whatever they like with it.

But, and I hope it's an important but, they have never come out and said, as far as I can tell, that they intend to follow that path to the letter. Now the confusing thing about that to me, is that those previous redenominations were, pretty much, value neutral. If this is a value neutral event, wouldn't it be a good idea to explain to parliament and the people of Iraq to ease fears?

One more question I have: Do they have reporters in Iraq. Do the powers that be in Iraq ever give interviews, or do they only issue statements? If they do actually conduct interviews with reporters, could some of them please start asking the right questions???????

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Lemme give you a link that says it will raise the value. Use google translate. You will love this article. I think it posted here on DV.

http://www.nakhelnew...s.php?nid=11244

Here it is already translated.

Central Bank reveals details of the Iraq Currency

Palm - the central bank of Iraq, that Iraq's new currency will increase by three zeros, indicating that he had conducted an extensive study concluded that the lifting of the zeroes will strengthen the value of the Iraqi currency.

The deputy governor of Central Bank of Iraq the appearance of Mohammed Saleh during a media statement: The Central Bank is determined to raise the three zeros from the currency of the new Iraqi and presented its project to the government and the House of Representatives and is awaiting the government's decision and the Council of Representatives.

Economists and shows that the process of removing three zeros from the Iraqi currency will lead to increased value, and to increase the purchasing power of citizens, noting to the need to pursue policies to persuade the citizens quiet and get a feel for a period not exceeding two years.

And the benefit that the draft lifting the three zeroes from the currency made by the government five years ago to the Central Bank, and has undergone throughout this period to an extensive study over the need to raise zeros to strengthen the value of the Iraqi currency, adding that the deletion of zeros enhance the value of the Iraqi currency and reduce the cost of handling cash, and currency its current estimated size of today Petrlionat dinars, which makes the process of dealing with the monetary cost is high.

The Central Bank of Iraq began to discuss amending the categories of the dinar last year and is still a large part of the payments being in cash due to the evolution of the banking system, noting that the President of the Securities Commission of Iraq has said, earlier, that the deletion of zeros from the Iraqi currency will not affect the circulation of the Iraqi Stock Exchange and shares.

From what I can decipher of the article, he did say that the removal of the zeros would raise the value. Interesting considering that another article came out the other day with Mr Saleh saying that that it wouldn't raise the value. Is this translation issues?

I wonder about the bit that says five years ago? Have they been planning this for five years. Probably. Should be a pretty good plan by now.

Another interesting part is where it talks about the need to persuade the citizens quiet (reduce fear) and get a feel for a period not exceeding two years. That part I agree with. need to relieve the fear of the people that they will lose money as part of the process. What about the period of two years? Other redenominations have run concurrent currencies whilst they draw in the old currency. Note their references to Turkey, Brazil and Romania in this article: http://translate.goo...%26prmd%3Dimvns

(See Doug. I told you I'd post one if I found one).

Now, they are just saying here that other countries have redenominated, not that we are following their example to the letter.

So, the question is: what is the full plan? What process will take two years? Running twin currencies, or a straight revaluation????

Don't know why that link didn't work????? Maybe try this???

http://translate.google.com.au/translate?hl=en&sl=ar&u=http://www.nakhelnews.com/&ei=KjrXTqnEIIGM2gW85Py4Dg&sa=X&oi=translate&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CCEQ7gEwAA&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dnakhelnews.com%26hl%3Den%26biw%3D1280%26bih%3D603%26prmd%3Dimvns

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From what I can decipher of the article, he did say that the removal of the zeros would raise the value. Interesting considering that another article came out the other day with Mr Saleh saying that that it wouldn't raise the value. Is this translation issues?

I wonder about the bit that says five years ago? Have they been planning this for five years. Probably. Should be a pretty good plan by now.

Another interesting part is where it talks about the need to persuade the citizens quiet (reduce fear) and get a feel for a period not exceeding two years. That part I agree with. need to relieve the fear of the people that they will lose money as part of the process. What about the period of two years? Other redenominations have run concurrent currencies whilst they draw in the old currency. Note their references to Turkey, Brazil and Romania in this article: http://translate.goo...%26prmd%3Dimvns

(See Doug. I told you I'd post one if I found one).

Now, they are just saying here that other countries have redenominated, not that we are following their example to the letter.

So, the question is: what is the full plan? What process will take two years? Running twin currencies, or a straight revaluation????

Sorry - link no good. Don't know why. The article was actually posted by Trooper back on November 5. See here: http://dinarvets.com/forums/index.php?/topic/90302-dinar-was-equal-to-the-dollar/page__p__729717__fromsearch__1entry729717

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If they can RV, then there is no RD needed.....

You cant RV the dinar to a 1 to 1 level with the USD and then redenominate....with what the CBI is stating with a RD by removing the zeros...it would be like getting a new 10 dinar note (RVd of course) then removing three zeros from that?? It would be like taking your RVd 10 dinar note and making it the value of .010 dinar....

This article can be taken two ways.

(1). They are going to Revalue then Redenominate the old IQD with the new IQD after they educate the citizens on how to exchange their old IQD for the new IQD over a period of time.

(2). They do a straight Redenomination using both the old and new IQD whilst educating the citizens on how to exchange the old IQD for the new IQD and then getting rid of every last old IQD note (3 zero's).

I believe it will be the first rather than the latter.

KeepM, of course they can Revalue the IQD to a 1:1 parity with the USD and then Redenominate.

Your quote above is all wrong, because they won't be deleting (in your example quote above) the 3 zeros from the NEW IQD but rather by pulling in the old 3 zero IQD notes once they Revalue the current IQD and educate the citizens on how to exchange their old IQD for the new IQD.B)

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You know what tigerstripes it had not occurred to me until this moment. We are so focused on how Iraq is going to pay for this, we kind of overlook the full picture don't you think? Sort of *** for tat? From my understanding Iraq, is mostly in dollars at this point. Any one can correct me, please do. What's your thoughts?

Absolutely. I don't think it has been said anywhere just how many $US are floating around in Iraq. The latest figures from the CBI state over 8 trillion dinars worth of Foreign Currency deposits. Maybe not all $US but a good portion probably would be. So, is this figure just a revolving door that they use for their daily auctions?? Or do the $US come from payments from the MOF that they receive for oil sales? There is another section on the spreadsheet that covers amounts due from the MOF, but that figure fluctuates a little here and there month to month, but isn't really coming down much.

I really don't understand their spreadsheet and can't honestly say whether it's right or wrong. That 8 trillion dinars worth of foreign currency deposits is piquing my interest at the moment.

There's another thread running in the Opinions section where I have again attempted to start discussion about the financials. Maybe some clever heads can get together to try to understand the numbers. http://dinarvets.com/forums/index.php?/topic/93268-for-keepmwlknfny-mrfnhappy-dinark-are-u-still-aroundetc/

Note: I am not inetersted in arguments or denigrating any member of this site, whatever their beliefs may be. What I am interested in is discussions that can help to make sense of what is happening and what the future hold for our dinars. I believe that everybody who frequents these forums would be happy to get a good return on their investment. I also think that people on here are pretty smart. Maybe we can all use those smarts to pick the numbers apart and make some sense out of them.

(That's just a little warning because some of the posts on that thread are not particularly helpful to the cause)

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You completely missed the point, sure they would keep a RV quite but they planed to RD instead would talk about a RD, they would talk about it a LOT! If the plan was to RV without RDing first there would be little reason to say much of anything one way or the other except for references made from time to time to misdirect speculators. Sure they could be doing that now and I'm not saying their not but they sure are going into detail about how they are planing to do this, smoke and mirrors? Maybe so but there's also another old saying, where there's that much smoke there must be a fire!

No they would talk about an RD if they were planning to RV, so speculators would stay away. I have yet to figure out how you loppers can think that the CBI, and Iraqi government are honest people. They are deceivers, and their religion commands them to deceive the non muslims. Negative Negative WOW!

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Yes I read what you said and no I didn't say it WAS going to LOP I just explained that deleting the zeros means removing them from the currency and not the exchange rate, that's what the OP asked. The Iraqis have made that crystal clear but some folks seem to get upset whenever anyone points that out. Just like everyone else I do not know if they will LOP or not but if they do then what they are going to remove the zeros from should be obvious by now

BTW you are also dead wrong about who I am..

Removing the zero's means taking them out of circulation. Deleteing the zero's means taking them out of circulation also. According to all these auctions, there should be no more than 4 trillion left there. They are not going to remove the zero's from a literal note, because if they were, why would they be stating they are going to issue a 50,000 thousand, and 100,000 dinar note? I have a pair of scissors for all you loppers so you can go ahead and cut your zero's off what you have. Where do I send them?

The new Dinar has a new exchange rate to reflect the re denomination and the old Dinar still retains the old exchange rate until it's retired, that's the way RDs are done, again look to Turkey. The Iraqis have even discussed the duel pricing that will be in place as the old and new notes co-exist and that has been explained, that's what is meant by the RD being value neutral. It should be obvious that the new lower denominations could not have the same low exchange rate, the exchange rate changes proportionally to the denomination change so the net value remains the same, or value neutral as they have stated many times. Don't confuse the value with the exchange rate.

You talk turkey so much, I believe you are a turkey.

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They're never going to trust the banking industry again because they lost .675 dinar, that they ALSO could not have cashed out PRIOR to a lop? .675 dinar? You know what .675 dinar is worth, right? 0.000581 USD. 0.0581 cents. About 5 hundredths of a cent. You're saying people in Iraq will never trust the banking system again, because they lost 5 hundredths of a cent. Five hundredths of a cent which they couldn't cash out now, either. You know this happens millions of times a day in the US, right? Haven't you seen office space or Superman III? Has everyone in the US lost faith in the banking system due to losing five hundredths of a cent?

Dinarbots logic circuits seem to be malfunctioning, time to call the repair man.

Have him check your math circuits as well, because 50 dinar would become 50 fils, not half a fil. 50 fils, a denomination that HAS existed before.

janderson, you might want to revisit the math. If an Iraqi went to bed with 525,000.675 dinar and woke up to 525.000675 dinar, the difference would be worth more than five hundredths of a cent(524,475.000 dinar). I know in our excitement, sometimes we get our numbers a little skewed, but I think Dinarbot raises a valid point.

That being said, if the government is effective in their communication to their citizens and makes them understand that the smaller amount still has the same purchasing power, it's all good, at least for them.

Absolutely not what we want to see. We want to see that person with 525,000 dinar have the purchasing power of about 525,000.00 US dollars. Just sayin... :D

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You completely missed the point, sure they would keep a RV quite but they planed to RD instead would talk about a RD, they would talk about it a LOT! If the plan was to RV without RDing first there would be little reason to say much of anything one way or the other except for references made from time to time to misdirect speculators. Sure they could be doing that now and I'm not saying their not but they sure are going into detail about how they are planing to do this, smoke and mirrors? Maybe so but there's also another old saying, where there's that much smoke there must be a fire!

On that I agree with you. +1 for ya.

Too bad that from the get-go people are making more out of this than was written (again!). It says the same thing they always say.

Delete the zeroes doesn't increase the value.

It's a large project to implement and will take a lot of time.

People must be educated.

It will ease transactions.

Nowhere does it...

say RV

indicate a rate

indicate a date

Same old BS....

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This Dinarnoob is so very confused so please forgive my ignorance. Is it possible that when they talk about getting rid of the 3 zeros that they aren't talking about off of the notes themselves but off of the .00086 making one dinar worth .86 cents? And all of my 25,000 dinar notes worth $21,500...i realize that this is most likely a pipe dream but would somebody please educate me without making me feel like a dumbazz :-)

Thanks!!

This is what I have heard has already happened within Iraq. I was not privy to the dinar situation until a week or so ago. After learning about the dinar I wanted to get more info so I asked the man who owns the building I office in and he made a phone call to a relative in Iraq yesterday to find out what was going on, and he said that the 3 zero move to the left was already a done deal and will be implemented by the end of December. I am no guru or hater, I was considering purchaisng some dinar myself and wanted more direct intel.

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