educate citizens changing money and use it before you delete the zeros of

[redsand]

**Lets change the tone here, shall we?**

Its nice to know that its December in Iraq. Our troops come "home" in December. We could have an RV in December. Hey - let's enjoy December!

ps. My birthday is 12/21. Can I have a little more dinar for my birthday? Lets say a 10,000 note from each...thanks.

You missed what I said....

What I was getting at was what the smaller bills would be worth in dinar....not meaning they will have all these small divisions of coins for exchange...not all of them at least....

We wont know exactly what coins/fils they plan on releasing until they are brought forward to light....

My main point is this.....if you have a 500 note and they lop, it will be equal to .50 of a dinar......if you have a 250 note and they lop, it will be equal to .25 of a dinar....if you have a 50 note and they lop, it basically wont be worth squat.... .05 of a dinar.....its all affected the same, you cant lop some notes and not the others....will they have a .05 dinar coin for you to exchange? No, but if you have enough you could most likely trade them in for a 1/4 dinar or something if thats whats decided on as far as coins.....

I get your point. For the most part, it does make sense. Thats just one scenario out of many that could happen. They can also do a hybrid of a lop for these instances.

[Elixirbaby]

**Lets change the tone here, shall we?**

Its nice to know that its December in Iraq. Our troops come "home" in December. We could have an RV in December. Hey - let's enjoy December!

ps. My birthday is 12/21. Can I have a little more dinar for my birthday? Lets say a 10,000 note from each...thanks.

sure no problem. Where should I mail it to?

Go RV

[keepmwlknfny]

Iraq and Turkey are nowhere near the same. You have any idea how many notes were in circulation when Turkey RD? Any idea of how many Turkish citizens held bank accounts? How many international companies were flocking to Turkey when they RD? How many bigtime Ivestors where headed to Turkey? Turkeys oil? Turkeys gold? Turkeys natural resources? Minerals? Natural Gas? Did the US occupy Turkey for 8 yrs before the RD? Was Turkeys inflation artificial? Did US print the Lira?

A lot of that doesnt really matter when it comes to a country deciding to redenominate.....inflated money supply, yes......difficult for banking transactions, yes.....suffering from periods of hyperinflation and gaining control and lowering to a more stable and suitable rate, yes.....

Investments, who has bank accounts, natural resources isent going to have the effect on whether a country decides to RD like you would think....and thats mostly because the value of what you have stays the same when they RD....there is no difference....

The fact of the matter is that both countries suffered from hyperinflation (yes turkey was worse but its like saying between two people that are dead that one is more dead then the other) both countries suffered an inflated money supply from the hyperinflation and along with that came the low value and purchasing power.....Iraqs oil doesnt erase an inflated money supply....wish it could, but it doesnt have the affect we want it to....

[Flyers1]

JWJ very well put!! I actualy ENJOYED reading Doug's comments at one time but now I just ignore them. Why? Becauuse I can tell you what he's written without reading a sentence. Nothing new. Same thing over and over and over and over and over....did I say over?

But I will say this, he has brought some solid points on why the RV won't happen.

[redsand]

A lot of that doesnt really matter when it comes to a country deciding to redenominate.....inflated money supply, yes......difficult for banking transactions, yes.....suffering from periods of hyperinflation and gaining control and lowering to a more stable and suitable rate, yes.....

Investments, who has bank accounts, natural resources isent going to have the effect on whether a country decides to RD like you would think....and thats mostly because the value of what you have stays the same when they RD....there is no difference....

The fact of the matter is that both countries suffered from hyperinflation (yes turkey was worse but its like saying between two people that are dead that one is more dead then the other) both countries suffered an inflated money supply from the hyperinflation and along with that came the low value and purchasing power.....Iraqs oil doesnt erase an inflated money supply....wish it could, but it doesnt have the affect we want it to....

As of right now, Turkey's debt is increasingly getting worse. What Turkey did in 2001 worked for then. Right now, not so good. With a world economy that is dynamically different (add economic issues throughout the world), following Turkey's path will not be smart. I saw the link you put up yesterday. I don't buy all those figures. There debt is around 135 billion.

[zigmeister]

Doug Doug Doug.....cmon already....whats your agenda Doug? They havent clearly stated anything.

Youve been around here for all of 30 days and you got it all figured out.....you constantly ask why know one wants to consider the possibilities....yet everything you say is stated as fact....we have kicked this dead horse over and over...we are now having to battle the horseflies....we ALL know the possibilitiea Doug...you arent stating anything new...u should check out the LOP Talk section if you want to discuss your "possibilities"....i gotta tell you...you dont seem to think a LOP is a possibility...you obviously rant like its a guarantee....

Bottomline Doug...your making yourself look silly....this investment isnt for everybody...and obviously it isnt for you...so just sell me your dinar....I will give you 1200 per mill...and once it RVs...I will sell them back to you at 50% of the RV amount....sound good Doug???

Are you here to save us all???

Lol...seriously Doug...tellin a self proclaimes newbie that its definitely guna LOP...cmon Doug you dont know anything for sure! How would you feel if that person sold off and then it RVs next week? Would you care? I doubt it....Doug this is something that has never happened and will never happened before....comparing to Turkey Doug...cmon....Iraq and Turkey are nowhere near the same. You have any idea how many notes were in circulation when Turkey RD? Any idea of how many Turkish citizens held bank accounts? How many international companies were flocking to Turkey when they RD? How many bigtime Ivestors where headed to Turkey? Turkeys oil? Turkeys gold? Turkeys natural resources? Minerals? Natural Gas? Did the US occupy Turkey for 8 yrs before the RD? Was Turkeys inflation artificial? Did US print the Lira?

Doug Doug Doug....on the internet anyone can say whatever they want...even you...I just ask as well as many others Im sure....just dont state things as fact when you truly have no clue what EXACTLY is guna happen just like EVERYONE ELSE DOUGGG!!!

Just give a rest already! We are getting really close to that possible RV Doug and we all would really like to enjoy our final days here on DVs!

Go RV Doug!!! :)

You make some very good points JW, ones I had not thought out as well as I should have. Iraqs exchange rate while it is a fixed rate is also artificial. Turkeys was not. They are an undervalued economy artificially while Turkey was not. I think that is some very good points. Did I understand you correctly?

[JWJW11]

A lot of that doesnt really matter when it comes to a country deciding to redenominate.....inflated money supply, yes......difficult for banking transactions, yes.....suffering from periods of hyperinflation and gaining control and lowering to a more stable and suitable rate, yes.....

Investments, who has bank accounts, natural resources isent going to have the effect on whether a country decides to RD like you would think....and thats mostly because the value of what you have stays the same when they RD....there is no difference....

The fact of the matter is that both countries suffered from hyperinflation (yes turkey was worse but its like saying between two people that are dead that one is more dead then the other) both countries suffered an inflated money supply from the hyperinflation and along with that came the low value and purchasing power.....Iraqs oil doesnt erase an inflated money supply....wish it could, but it doesnt have the affect we want it to....

Aww man keep....lol....I hear you...and definitely know where you stand...and have learn to appreciate your opinion...BUT...I really think with all the action going on around us that this thing will turn out the way we are hoping for....oil gold and currency reserves are guna play a role in this...way to much big money flocking to the place...youd think the place was guna burn down if they didnt get over there now...it still might! Lol

And I still cant get past jow they intend to get past getting the large notes off the market when theres so many out there and no one uses banks....i kno what your thoughts are as we discussed the other day...but thats just not adding up for me...one way or the other it looks like we might find out real soon...we will see!

You make some very good points JW, ones I had not thought out as well as I should have. Iraqs exchange rate while it is a fixed rate is also artificial. Turkeys was not. They are an undervalued economy artificially while Turkey was not. I think that is some very good points. Did I understand you correctly?

Yes sir! That was definitely a point I was trying to make...everything in Iraq has been artificial and manipulated for years...we know that...Turkeys economy just sucked period...zig...they had quadrillions of notes in circulation....holycow thats ALOT!!! lol )

[keepmwlknfny]

As of right now, Turkey's debt is increasingly getting worse. What Turkey did in 2001 worked for then. Right now, not so good. With a world economy that is dynamically different (add economic issues throughout the world), following Turkey's path will not be smart. I saw the link you put up yesterday. I don't buy all those figures. There debt is around 135 billion.

Debt doesnt necessarily deem you a failing country or a weak one.....I mean I guess you could arguably say the US is weak or failing but we are still considered a strong nation in the world and we have probly 100 times that amount in debt....actually about 13 trillion in debt according to that same site....I havent seen any different numbers on inflation for Turkey either.....All countries as we know it have been steadily growing up to the ears in debt....its just been the way things are going in the global economy....Iraq has like 52 billion dollars in debt, but also has like 1/3 the population of Turkey....Iraq has been set up to get rid of all its debt its been carrying for years and it will take years to get it down but it wont stay down....

Hopefultxn had some great links that actually showed Turkeys progress in paying off its debt and it was at a much higher rate then Iraq is doing because of the money coming into the country....its all a balancing act no matter where your at in the international community....but as far as saying was Turkeys RD successful? At this point it is...and has been....redenominating doesnt directly affect how much debt you will aquire or how well you will do in the coming year GDP wise, how much money is being brought/made in country.....its just a matter of trying to start over so to speak...putting the past monetary failures behind you....

[JWJW11]

First off I am not a newbie just new to the site and I seriously don't see how they could be much clearer, Look to Turkey as an example-what did Turkey do? What have other countries who have RDed their currency done? You know full well you are simply twisting things so go ahead neg me but we both know what removing three zeros mean.

Yea Doug...I know your not new....I kno exactly who you are and as usual you dont answer one of my questions....do you even read the post before you type? You just asked me what Turkey did??? After I just asked you several questions about Turkey! LMAOOO

PS Doug....I dont give out negatives...they mean nothing

[redsand]

Inflation is around 7 percent in Turkey. Its on the upswing. I can't post it but I see it.

[sonny1]

If Iraqs plan is what the article says, they would have to RV first or they would need wheel barrels to go shopping to hold there money.

[sonny1]

Actually it's just the opposite, that's the problem they already have and that's what the RD is supposed to eliminate.

Smaller notes and same exchange rate equals........... more notes, exactly what they don't want

[tigerstripes]

Actually it's just the opposite, that's the problem they already have and that's what the RD is supposed to eliminate.

1000 times fewer Dinar but each Dinar is worth 1000 times more so it works out to value neutral, same buying power for the citizen but a heck of a lot less physical cash to have to carry around.

Hi Doug,

Please see my post #25 of this thread.

Thanks

[Snatcher]

"the project to delete three zeros from the Iraqi currency is not working to increase the value of the Iraqi dinar against foreign currencies

Read more: http://dinarvets.com/forums/index.php?/topic/93342-educate-citizens-changing-money-and-use-it-before-you-delete-the-zeros-of/#ixzz1fDgDGXib

Ok Explain to me how this sounds good. Unless Their just blowing smoke up our areses This most definitly does not sound good for the home team

To me it is saying ,"That just removing the 000 notes from circulation isn't increasing it's value against other currencies". IMO -Yes it is lowering the number of larger notes in circulation but because they have not RV the currency yet and put out the lower notes it has not strengthen the value.

[mrmcwhipit]

Actually it's just the opposite, that's the problem they already have and that's what the RD is supposed to eliminate.

1000 times fewer Dinar but each Dinar is worth 1000 times more so it works out to value neutral, same buying power for the citizen but a heck of a lot less physical cash to have to carry around.

fewer dinar but each one is worth a thousand times more? hmmm sounds like they have more value as in RV

[tigerstripes]

The new Dinar has a new exchange rate to reflect the re denomination and the old Dinar still retains the old exchange rate until it's retired, that's the way RDs are done, again look to Turkey. The Iraqis have even discussed the duel pricing that will be in place as the old and new notes co-exist and that has been explained, that's what is meant by the RD being value neutral. It should be obvious that the new lower denominations could not have the same low exchange rate, the exchange rate changes proportionally to the denomination change so the net value remains the same, or value neutral as they have stated many times. Don't confuse the value with the exchange rate.

Okay great - two exchange rates. New Iraqi Dinar (NID) / Old Iraqi Dinar (IQD).

I haven't seen an article (again I may have missed it) where anybody from CBI or Iraqi Parliament discusses two exchange rates. If you could point me in that direction it would be greatly appreciated. Again, I'm just looking at the articles that come out of Iraq stating what their intentions are.

The other problem that could possibly occur with two dinar exchange rates, is that pricing would then have to include three prices (if you include $US - which I would assume would still be in use for some time). I don't know the details of Turkey or other countries redenominations, but did they have three prices being used all at once? Again just a question.

To your other point about exchange rate vs value - I think I need to ponder that. My initial thought would be that the value of the dinar (old or new) would have everything to do with the exchange rate. Let me think about it before I reply further.

Thanks for the discussion.

[RodandStaff]

With all due respect Human known as "keepmwlknfy". The denominations you are suggesting here and in other posts are illogical. Not only are they illogical they have never existed. It would be similar to issuing a Half penny today in the US - illogical and not needed in any capacity. Humans can't be Beat. Go Humans.

Bot... how do I say this??? I think I am in love with a machine, or least the logic of a smooth talking android if we wanna get technical! Well, I guess guys can love a car, or other mechanical machines! So, without gettin too mushy.... thanks for the "logical explanation"... whoever programmed you did one heck of a job!!! When this is over.... and I am sure I won't be alone... I owe you a portion of either you favorite drink or lubricant oil ....was that 10W30 or do you go for a stronger brew? Keep up the good work my mechanical friend!!!

GO RV Already Baby!!!

Edited November 30, 2011 by RodandStaff

[Shick]

And Najib said in a statement (the fraternity) that "the project to delete three zeros from the Iraqi currency is not working to increase the value of the Iraqi dinar against foreign currencies, but is a matter of formality for the restructuring of the currency and reduce the money supply." Najib and explained that "the project to delete the zeros of the Iraqi currency will make it easier for banks and banks, merchants and owners of large sums of money transfer money from one place to another is the opposite of what it is now the currency that they are replacing the current foreign currency."

Read more:

AM I LOOKING AT THIS CORRECTLY, THIS QUATE STARTS BY SAYING: NAJIB SAID: "THAT THE WHOLE PLAN IS TO REMOVE THE ZEROS AND NOT WORKING TO INCREASE THE VALUEOF THE DINARS.' NOW I UNDERSTAND WHY THERE IS A CALL FOR TAKING OFF THE ZEROS, (BECAUSE OF EASY TRANSITION) BUT ISN'T RVing THE DINARS JUST AS IMPORT, AS SPECIALLY WHEN IT COMES TO ECONOMY. THEIR NOT LOOKING AT THE BIG PICTURE AND HASN'T THE LARGER NOTES BEEN OUT THERE FOR A WHILE? GO RV!

[tigerstripes]

I will attempt to locate an article but I have seen at least twice where they do indeed discuss a duel exchange rate, that's how I even knew something like that could be done. As far as the differing exchange rates that's been mentioned several times. Unless I am mistaken I think articles covering both points have been posted on this site so I will see if I can locate them, if I can find something from the Iraqis themselves I will post it but I will not come back with an opinion piece from anyone, I never use anything like that as a source, not for these two points or anything else. As far as the exchange rate changing with the redenomination I mistakenly assumed that was a given but I guess I should have mentioned it from the beginning.

Great - I'm searching for for any articles that mention dual exchange rates too. If I find - I'll post.

Again - I think that the raise in the exchange rate with a redenomination should be be easily understood too. But that's not what I'm getting from the articles.

Think of it this way, old 25,000 Dinar equals approximately $22+/- while the new 25 Dinar note also will equal the same $22+/- and they will trade 1 for 1 so obviously the value is "value neutral" but the exchange rate PER Dinar is different. They have mentioned several times in the last few articles about the new 50 Dinar note that will have the value of 50,000 Dinar but marked as 50, same principle as the 25 vs 25,000 note example I used.

Sorry - missed that bit you added.

Yes, yes - value neutral for old dinar. Value increase (exchange rate increase) for new dinar vs old dinar.........if that's their intention.

[DogDoc94]

!

ps. My birthday is 12/21. Can I have a little more dinar for my birthday? Lets say a 10,000 note from each...thanks.

That may be an interesting birthday come next year according to some.......

[E. 1999]

Redenomination

What Does Redenomination Mean?

1. The process whereby a country's currency is recalibrated due to significant inflation and currency devaluation. Certain currencies have been redenominated a number of times over the last century for various reasons.

2. The process of changing the currency value on a financial security.

Investopedia explains Redenomination

1. For example, the Bulgarian lev was redenominated due to inflation arising at the end of the Second World War. After the redenomination, one "new" lev was equal to 100 "old" levs. The lev was redenominated three times in the twentieth century.

2. A recent example of redenomination arose when the euro was introduced and the denomination on many European securities had to be changed to the euro.

Read more: http://www.investopedia.com/terms/r/redenomination.asp#ixzz1fEd7ToX2

Read more: http://www.investopedia.com/terms/r/redenomination.asp#ixzz1fEcd8kRV

[USASHABIBI]

As of right now, Turkey's debt is increasingly getting worse. What Turkey did in 2001 worked for then. Right now, not so good. With a world economy that is dynamically different (add economic issues throughout the world), following Turkey's path will not be smart. I saw the link you put up yesterday. I don't buy all those figures. There debt is around 135 billion.

ahhhhhhh........i like turkey..........ahhhhhhhh............i eat turkey for thaksgiving..........ahhhhhhh.......very cheap

[redsand]

The RV does not directly equate to more wealth and I think a lot of people lose sight of that, Iraq's wealth is what it is and a RV does not create more wealth. The vast numbers of Dinar in circulation now reflect approximately Iraq's net worth and that's why they are so worthless based on the individual Dinar. When you base 1000 times fewer Dinar on the same basic net worth then it should be obvious that each Dinar will have to be worth 1000 times more to represent this same net worth, Based on their worth they can have a huge number of low value Dinar or they can have a smaller number of more valuable Dinar, what they CAN'T do is have a large number of Dinar at a high value at the same time because it exceeds their worth. Basically high volume at low value but not high volume and high value at the same time.

When I said the RV does not create more wealth it does not in the sense that it would create more net worth than they already have but if the exchange rate times Dinar in circulation is lower than their net worth THEN they RV to bring it more inline with what they can afford to back, I think it's pretty much accepted that Iraq's net worth is more than the current exchange rate times the Dinar in circulation so a modest RV upwards can be expected just not to 30 Trillion Dollars worth!

Ok - I'll bite. What do you presume the RV rate will be?

[Maggie123]

A lot of that doesnt really matter when it comes to a country deciding to redenominate.....inflated money supply, yes......difficult for banking transactions, yes.....suffering from periods of hyperinflation and gaining control and lowering to a more stable and suitable rate, yes.....

Investments, who has bank accounts, natural resources isent going to have the effect on whether a country decides to RD like you would think....and thats mostly because the value of what you have stays the same when they RD....there is no difference....

The fact of the matter is that both countries suffered from hyperinflation (yes turkey was worse but its like saying between two people that are dead that one is more dead then the other) both countries suffered an inflated money supply from the hyperinflation and along with that came the low value and purchasing power.....Iraqs oil doesnt erase an inflated money supply....wish it could, but it doesnt have the affect we want it to....

Keep,

I have never addressed you directly... while I have been in your world many times having read what you say with an open mind and with great respect for your opinions. I ask you for just a moment to set your opinions of what you see as the facts and what the articles are telling us aside.

Let's just for the fun of it say that everything lined up for an RV. How would you speculate on the way that would happen? Would they drop the zeros from the exchange rate, announce the new rate and then put out smaller denoms to make change? I know there has to be more to it than that.... Come On Keeps I know you have thought about this in the past and I would love to hear your take on how an RV could happen in a perfect world. I am not asking you to change your mind, it's just I have always wondered how you would explain how an RV would happen and the logistics of it all. Maybe just a fantasy of mine but could you indulge me just this once?

You could call it my Christmas Present.

[zigmeister]

Aww man keep....lol....I hear you...and definitely know where you stand...and have learn to appreciate your opinion...BUT...I really think with all the action going on around us that this thing will turn out the way we are hoping for....oil gold and currency reserves are guna play a role in this...way to much big money flocking to the place...youd think the place was guna burn down if they didnt get over there now...it still might! Lol

And I still cant get past jow they intend to get past getting the large notes off the market when theres so many out there and no one uses banks....i kno what your thoughts are as we discussed the other day...but thats just not adding up for me...one way or the other it looks like we might find out real soon...we will see!

Yes sir! That was definitely a point I was trying to make...everything in Iraq has been artificial and manipulated for years...we know that...Turkeys economy just sucked period...zig...they had quadrillions of notes in circulation....holycow thats ALOT!!! lol )

You really got me thinking about this. I did not realize how much Turkey had out there. Amazing, Turkey really did not have a choice. I do know Turkey had to RD more than once to settle the currency issue. IMO I do not think Iraq can wait for a possible RD in the future as well as issuing new currency again.

So I am going to think out of the box here. Let's say Iraq RV's at the rate they were before Saddam came into the picture, which is something like 3.00+. Okay the Iraqi people now have a currency that is worth more than the dollar. What do they do? They have a currency worth more than the dollar, they have a lot of dollars. Do they cash in and get what they can? My thought is some will, holding their dinar that is worth more. The US pays for their cash in. Iraq gets rid of dollarization, which they say they want.

We here in the United States cash in. I have no idea how much it is, nor do I know the quota of other people like us in other countries hold. But Iraq pays the bill, remember their currency is now more than the US and may be more valuable than some of the other countries....all in all the bill may not end up that much. Because no one has figured out how much US dollars the Iraqi people hold. As a matter of fact I do not recall that discussion at all.

Well my thinking out of the box is a bit blurry.....cause I haven't thunk it out much....just the top of me head! But I thought I would shoot it out there anyway.

Good posts JW....keep em coming!