Feeling Like An Intentional Set Up.

[JustLooking79]

Hello everyone. Just joined and wanted to share something that has been on my heart. It concerns the possible removal of three zeros and placing the dinar closer to a 1:1 ratio with the US dollar. Although it would be the least desirable outcome for us investors, my gut is telling me that is the most likely and rational outcome from all this. But that is not what is really bothering me.

First, let me get the following out of the way:

1). When I first purchased my dinars, I never really bought the hype of overnight millionaires or what not. However, I was leaning more towards a revaluation of the dinar going from 1/10th of a US cent to perhaps a dinar being worth about 10 cents (which would still be rather profitable!). Then with time, the value would increase the more stable Iraq became. Those who held on instead of cashing in would remain for the long term investment opportunities.

2). I realize that with all investments, there is a risk of things not panning out. Nothing is guaranteed and anything could have happened. If there was no risk or if investments were a sure thing, we'd all be doing it.

So I wanted to get the above out of the way to show that I wasn't expecting an overnight miracle or that I was naive to think this was guaranteed.

With that said, let me get to the point. The discussion and possibility of removing three zeros kind of makes me mad at Iraq or feel as if this was designed to 'grab the money and run' by the GOI. Let's assume for a moment that CBI's claim is true and they're not just trying to throw investors off the scent of an upcoming RV. How would it go for us?

Two scenarios:

BEST case scenario: All this turned out to be were big fat INTEREST-FREE LOANS for the GOI and we even paid for the finance fees for them (the brokers who sold us our dinars). We buy their monopoly money thinking it could turn into something one day, but it turns out they will just remove three zeros so we will be less than where we started after you deduct all the costs of converting our USD into dinars then back into USD from the dinars.

WORST case scenario: All this turned out to be a big fat GIFT for the GOI if it is somehow set up that the dinars can only be converted in Iraq (which I am led to believe possibly happened last time (?).

So if the zeros are removed, at best we gave Iraq a free loan and at worst we simply threw our money at them. Since they seem to hold most of the power concerning an RV and/or RD, it really feels as if they knew what they were going to do and kind of screwed over their investors. It vaguely reminds me of what they did to the Jordanians the last time when they used their dinars to purchase goods from Jordan, then Iraq declared the old dinar invalid, THEN closed borders and wouldn't let Jordan cash in their dinars.

It would be like the US government coming into your store, buying hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of merchandise from you, then declaring the USD invalid and not allowing you to convert your USD into the new currency.

So I am a bit suspicious of Iraq at the moment and am worried about this potential RD although I understand it is the most logical move.

[Aqua Dude]

just keep "looking" 79...don't talk so much

[Dinar Buddy]

bogus. Bogus. Bogus

Please leave

[JustLooking79]

What is bogus? The possibility of an RD+RV? I know that is not a very popular discussion but it is at least a possible scenario worth discussing.

(?)

[Kanga]

What is bogus? The possibility of an RD+RV? I know that is not a very popular discussion but it is at least a possible scenario worth discussing.

(?)

Undoubtedly it is.

Please go to the lop forum, which you can find by clicking forums. There you will find lots of nice folks to talk to and become friends with.

[only 1-25k dinar]

I just started piece buying the dinars and WOW what a difference in opinion there is everywhere I look! Getting an education and exercising

my faith for sure with this 1st time investing experience...Thank you all so much!

[JustLooking79]

Thank you. Hopefully a moderator can move this thread. I would really like to discuss this topic but do not want to get in trouble if I make the same thread twice. Apologies for putting this in the wrong forum.

I placed it this forum because I thought my take on it was more 'personal perspective/opinion' than it was anything official about a LOP. As in, it was the way I personally view an RD- not that it is necessarily the way it will go down.

Apologies if I committed a forum no-no.

[matus55]

if you dont know what you are talking about please be quiet !!!!!

[JustLooking79]

if you dont know what you are talking about please be quiet !!!!!

What do you mean? Is this not the way a potential RD would occur?

1,000 dinars would become 1 dinar. The 25,000 dinar notes we hold would become 25 dinars. Assuming a 1:1 ratio, it would be $25. Then, let's say Iraqis are paying 1,000 dinar for a loaf of bread. The cost of a loaf of bread would now cost 1 dinar.

So they remove 3 zeroes from both the notes and the cost of goods and services?

If I do not know what I am talking about, please feel free to educate me. I am here to learn- not get into pissing contests or get snubbed by everyone here. I signed up because I thought this was the place to discuss and learn but so far I'm being met with nothing but rudeness and vagueness? Am I supposed to just be running around posting 'GO RV!!!!!' instead of asking questions or discussing scenarios?

[coleman619]

bogus. Bogus. Bogus

Please leave

You are a clown

[DAME1]

The people of Iraq have been held under the gun their entire lives...Iraq has the potential to be one of the wealthiest countries in the world an RD or a Lop would not fix this situation. They are in the process of rebuilding an entire nation. They need MONEY and lots of it...changing their currency is riduclous and costly....they need essentials water power infrastructure security etc......if you add nothing to nothing you still have NOTHING.....IMO the only thing that makes this investment a risk is if they continue to use the dollar as they are doing now.....so stop it and rvvvvvvvv already!!!!!!

[jlymonstone]

Hey 79, one thing you will learn quickly is that if you're not a 100% pipe-dreaming koolaid drinker, they will try to discredit you on these forums. If you say anything other than GO RV, you are labled as negative, debbie downer, etc. Unless you're ready to throw your entire heart and soul into the I'M GONNA BE AN OVERNIGHT MILLIONAIRE CLUB, then you're gonna get the proverbial "why are you here" ? Anyone who questions the Koolaid Drinkers will be instantly bashed. And don't take it personal, it's not that they are pumpers or have an agenda. They just want to silence you because they don't want to have to think about any scenario other than I'm gonna be rich next Monday. They don't want anyone questioning the dream because it forces them to take a hard look at their investment.

[TFK]

Undoubtedly it is.

Please go to the lop forum, which you can find by clicking forums. There you will find lots of nice folks to talk to and become friends with.

Ahhh. very refreshing thought. If your talking LOP, please keep it in that section. Most of us really don't care to hear about a lop.

[anonmouse013]

What do you mean? Is this not the way a potential RD would occur?

1,000 dinars would become 1 dinar. The 25,000 dinar notes we hold would become 25 dinars. Assuming a 1:1 ratio, it would be $25. Then, let's say Iraqis are paying 1,000 dinar for a loaf of bread. The cost of a loaf of bread would now cost 1 dinar.

So they remove 3 zeroes from both the notes and the cost of goods and services?

If I do not know what I am talking about, please feel free to educate me. I am here to learn- not get into pissing contests or get snubbed by everyone here. I signed up because I thought this was the place to discuss and learn but so far I'm being met with nothing but rudeness and vagueness? Am I supposed to just be running around posting 'GO RV!!!!!' instead of asking questions or discussing scenarios?

I aplologize for some of the other immature a$$holes on this forum, but the LOP has been discussed ad nauseam.

Is it a real possibility? Sure it is. There are so many different varaints to the different scenarios - it boggles the mind.

Would it be logical? - hmmm, yes - in one manner... but not necessarily the best answer.

They could "lop" 1, 2 or all 3 "zeros" if they wanted.

Will we have a $5+ RV? Extremely doublful despite how many RV Rangers believe it to be. Wishful thinking does not make it so.

Many people here are very positive, but some are trying so hard to believe in this magical RV that they will bash & trash anyone that dosent completely believe we will magically become uber-rich overnight (Dinar zealots)

The rest of us look at this as a plausable investment with a potential for a good return.

Read the news, avoid any "guru" intel, and "wait & see" with the rest of us.

ANY investment can pan-out, or completely flop. Keep that in mind

[jg167]

What do you mean? Is this not the way a potential RD would occur?

1,000 dinars would become 1 dinar. The 25,000 dinar notes we hold would become 25 dinars. Assuming a 1:1 ratio, it would be $25. Then, let's say Iraqis are paying 1,000 dinar for a loaf of bread. The cost of a loaf of bread would now cost 1 dinar.

So they remove 3 zeroes from both the notes and the cost of goods and services?

If I do not know what I am talking about, please feel free to educate me. I am here to learn- not get into pissing contests or get snubbed by everyone here. I signed up because I thought this was the place to discuss and learn but so far I'm being met with nothing but rudeness and vagueness? Am I supposed to just be running around posting 'GO RV!!!!!' instead of asking questions or discussing scenarios?

Yes this is exactly how it would, and is in my view likely to happen. This moves the dinar to the $1 range and cuts the dinars in circulation down to only 59B from 59T. This process would likely cost a couple of $100M USD. Compare that to an RV of only 50% so instead of 1170 IQD/USD its now 600 IQD/USD, then lets say only 2% of the dinars come in for exchange. That 1.2T dinars would have been $250M and is now $500M. An RV is what is expensive, not the RD (but folks here do not want to hear that). If the dinar value goes up due to GDP going up, then they have the money but an RV does not provide any money, it does not create wealth in reality only on paper dreams which will last about 2 seconds.

[JustLooking79]

Hey 79, one thing you will learn quickly is that if you're not a 100% pipe-dreaming koolaid drinker, they will try to discredit you on these forums. If you say anything other than GO RV, you are labled as negative, debbie downer, etc. Unless you're ready to throw your entire heart and soul into the I'M GONNA BE AN OVERNIGHT MILLIONAIRE CLUB, then you're gonna get the proverbial "why are you here" ? Anyone who questions the Koolaid Drinkers will be instantly bashed. And don't take it personal, it's not that they are pumpers or have an agenda. They just want to silence you because they don't want to have to think about any scenario other than I'm gonna be rich next Monday. They don't want anyone questioning the dream because it forces them to take a hard look at their investment.

Thank you for the insight. I was sitting here scratching my head at the reactions I received from posting this thread.

Don't get me wrong- I completely understand the RD is a buzz kill. I just heard about the dinar and bought my first million a couple of months ago (so I am new to all this). Upon first reading about the removal of three zeros, my heart certainly sank at that possibility. Hence, this thread. I feel it would almost be a rip off on Iraq's part if they were to do such a thing to the investment in their currency that THEY approved and encouraged.

So absolutely- I get the fact the concept of an RD is a downer. But at the same time, I would like to be reasonable and look at the possible outcomes, even if it is negative. I would hate to get my hopes up higher than they already are only for them to come crashing down at a possible scenario I was not willing to consider like an RD. So, yes. 'GO RV!!!' but at the same time, I would like to be educated on and prepared for all possible outcomes without getting flamed.

I truly hope it does RV without an RD but I suppose time will tell. Fingers crossed. If not, I will lose a lot of confidence in investing in Iraq for the future.

[Dalite]

Thank you. Hopefully a moderator can move this thread. I would really like to discuss this topic but do not want to get in trouble if I make the same thread twice. Apologies for putting this in the wrong forum.

I placed it this forum because I thought my take on it was more 'personal perspective/opinion' than it was anything official about a LOP. As in, it was the way I personally view an RD- not that it is necessarily the way it will go down.

Apologies if I committed a forum no-no.

Welcome to DV.

There are some smart minds here that will have rational discussion about possible outcomes.

You have to wade through some that have been conditioned by the Pumpers to only accept one outcome.

It seems to be a divide between those looking at all possibilities, and those who will only accept one.

Your post was well thought, and presented some very real possibilities.

Obviously, you can think for yourself, and have already picked up on the prevailing mood of the "Go RV!!!" crowd.

Don't let them discourage you from viewing all possible outcomes and finding the best way to profit from each one.

Keep looking for the truth; you will never be unprepared for the outcome...

Since it hasn't RVed the last 15 or 20 times the Pumpers promised, some of the folks are bordering on suicidal.

Keep it real...

[DAME1]

Hey 79, one thing you will learn quickly is that if you're not a 100% pipe-dreaming koolaid drinker, they will try to discredit you on these forums. If you say anything other than GO RV, you are labled as negative, debbie downer, etc. Unless you're ready to throw your entire heart and soul into the I'M GONNA BE AN OVERNIGHT MILLIONAIRE CLUB, then you're gonna get the proverbial "why are you here" ? Anyone who questions the Koolaid Drinkers will be instantly bashed. And don't take it personal, it's not that they are pumpers or have an agenda. They just want to silence you because they don't want to have to think about any scenario other than I'm gonna be rich next Monday. They don't want anyone questioning the dream because it forces them to take a hard look at their investment.

I respectfully disagree with your statement

I would hope that any of us who have invested in the dinar, would have done due diligence on our research, know the risks, but also see the wonderful possibilities of making lives better in every sense of the word, furthermore to think that we have the power or authority to silence another opinion is ludicrous. There are many of us who truly believe this currency will revalue ....if it does not, lives will still be blessed, and we go on....

[jg167]

WORST case scenario: All this turned out to be a big fat GIFT for the GOI if it is somehow set up that the dinars can only be converted in Iraq (which I am led to believe possibly happened last time (?).

I think this is very unlikely. The Central Bank of Iraq has been holding daily currency auctions so screwing all those buyers would be a very bad thing to do. The bad part is if the exchange process incurs sufficient fees or spread to put us further in the hole as opposed to exchanging straight up 1000 to 1.

[Froto]

With that said, let me get to the point. The discussion and possibility of removing three zeros kind of makes me mad at Iraq or feel as if this was designed to 'grab the money and run' by the GOI.

Wow! Let me get this straight. Iraq has never implied in any way, shape or form, anything close to an RV. There are many articles of them talking about a planned redenomination. They have severely limited the amount of IQD that can be legally taken outside of its borders. And now, if Iraq has the gall to actually do the only thing that they have said they planned to do, you are going to get mad at them?

Did you ever stop to consider this little internet industry that has been built up by convincing people they are going to be rich if they buy IQD. (even you admit to ONLY expecting 10,000% profit to start with)

You do realize much of the IQD the dealers sell has to be smuggled out of Iraq. Millionaires have been made in this industry, and I'm willing to bet most of them have never even been to Iraq.

I am in no way saying you should be made at them either. You didn't have to believe them.

[keepmwlknfny]

Hello everyone. Just joined and wanted to share something that has been on my heart. It concerns the possible removal of three zeros and placing the dinar closer to a 1:1 ratio with the US dollar. Although it would be the least desirable outcome for us investors, my gut is telling me that is the most likely and rational outcome from all this. But that is not what is really bothering me.

First, let me get the following out of the way:

1). When I first purchased my dinars, I never really bought the hype of overnight millionaires or what not. However, I was leaning more towards a revaluation of the dinar going from 1/10th of a US cent to perhaps a dinar being worth about 10 cents (which would still be rather profitable!). Then with time, the value would increase the more stable Iraq became. Those who held on instead of cashing in would remain for the long term investment opportunities.

2). I realize that with all investments, there is a risk of things not panning out. Nothing is guaranteed and anything could have happened. If there was no risk or if investments were a sure thing, we'd all be doing it.

So I wanted to get the above out of the way to show that I wasn't expecting an overnight miracle or that I was naive to think this was guaranteed.

With that said, let me get to the point. The discussion and possibility of removing three zeros kind of makes me mad at Iraq or feel as if this was designed to 'grab the money and run' by the GOI. Let's assume for a moment that CBI's claim is true and they're not just trying to throw investors off the scent of an upcoming RV. How would it go for us?

Two scenarios:

BEST case scenario: All this turned out to be were big fat INTEREST-FREE LOANS for the GOI and we even paid for the finance fees for them (the brokers who sold us our dinars). We buy their monopoly money thinking it could turn into something one day, but it turns out they will just remove three zeros so we will be less than where we started after you deduct all the costs of converting our USD into dinars then back into USD from the dinars.

WORST case scenario: All this turned out to be a big fat GIFT for the GOI if it is somehow set up that the dinars can only be converted in Iraq (which I am led to believe possibly happened last time (?).

So if the zeros are removed, at best we gave Iraq a free loan and at worst we simply threw our money at them. Since they seem to hold most of the power concerning an RV and/or RD, it really feels as if they knew what they were going to do and kind of screwed over their investors. It vaguely reminds me of what they did to the Jordanians the last time when they used their dinars to purchase goods from Jordan, then Iraq declared the old dinar invalid, THEN closed borders and wouldn't let Jordan cash in their dinars.

It would be like the US government coming into your store, buying hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of merchandise from you, then declaring the USD invalid and not allowing you to convert your USD into the new currency.

So I am a bit suspicious of Iraq at the moment and am worried about this potential RD although I understand it is the most logical move.

They very well could be playing us speculators and it might not even be intentional.....the point is, Iraq will gain strength in the currency, it does seem undervalued but the million dollar question is how they will go about raising the value......slow and gradual rise? RD and then RV? Both scenerios are very possible in Iraqs situation....

Dont let the GO RV crowd get you down, your asking completely legitimate questions and the some that will bash you for asking those questions, are the ones that are scared to hear the answers....your doing the right thing by questioning everything you see and hear.....and just to let you know, there are more then a handful of people here that like to openly discuss possibilities other then a straight up RV because as we know, this is NOT a guarantee....anything can happen.....

[Bumper64]

just keep "looking" 79...don't talk so much

bogus. Bogus. Bogus

Please leave

if you dont know what you are talking about please be quiet !!!!!

You are a clown

Let's all PLAY NICE!!!!!!!

No need to be so harsh to everyone that makes a post you don't like!!

Let's clean these forums up!!!

[Royce]

What do you mean? Is this not the way a potential RD would occur?

1,000 dinars would become 1 dinar. The 25,000 dinar notes we hold would become 25 dinars. Assuming a 1:1 ratio, it would be $25. Then, let's say Iraqis are paying 1,000 dinar for a loaf of bread. The cost of a loaf of bread would now cost 1 dinar.

So they remove 3 zeroes from both the notes and the cost of goods and services?

If I do not know what I am talking about, please feel free to educate me. I am here to learn- not get into pissing contests or get snubbed by everyone here. I signed up because I thought this was the place to discuss and learn but so far I'm being met with nothing but rudeness and vagueness? Am I supposed to just be running around posting 'GO RV!!!!!' instead of asking questions or discussing scenarios?

79 : This is a great site! I spent 2 years watching and reading on other sites before I found Dinar Vets. If you are really a newbie, I would encourage you to spend some time on the forums section. it is a great place to get the knowledge that you need before you post! Your ideas have been discussed many many times, and you can find them on the Forums list. Be patent and watch and read. This is an investment! For some of us it has been a very long investment. It could be a very long investment for you too! Or not! No one knows "THE RATE OR THE DATE " So sit back and watch roller coaster! The ride is not over!

[JustLooking79]

Thanks for all the opinions from both sides.

Froto- I completely understand what you are saying. Some excerpts from my OP should show that I do understand and agree with what you say. We knew what we were getting into, nothing is guaranteed, the general official sentiment is more along the lines of an RD than it is an RV, I could see how an RD would be very beneficial for them and more logical, an RD does seem to be the road we're going down more than anything else, etc.

But it is the other things that concern me and make me suspicious of Iraq's responsibility. I don't think it all rests on the shoulders of dealers (although you raise a good point that the hype rests on their shoulders). But I'm referring to the GOI's approval and encouragement of the investment in the dinar not to mention the auctions they hold and the amount they are printing and pumping. The list goes on and on to make it at least appear the GOI is behind it a bit.

Obviously they will do what they need to do without worrying about what will be lining our pockets. But I am a bit worried they may be swindling investors with the part they are playing and I feel that is a fair concern even if others may feel it is unjustified.

[Jim1cor13]

Thank you for the insight. I was sitting here scratching my head at the reactions I received from posting this thread.

Don't get me wrong- I completely understand the RD is a buzz kill. I just heard about the dinar and bought my first million a couple of months ago (so I am new to all this). Upon first reading about the removal of three zeros, my heart certainly sank at that possibility. Hence, this thread. I feel it would almost be a rip off on Iraq's part if they were to do such a thing to the investment in their currency that THEY approved and encouraged.

So absolutely- I get the fact the concept of an RD is a downer. But at the same time, I would like to be reasonable and look at the possible outcomes, even if it is negative. < JL79, NEVER believe it is a negative thing to investigate BOTH sides and all aspects of this circus...it is called being PRUDENT. I would hate to get my hopes up higher than they already are only for them to come crashing down at a possible scenario I was not willing to consider like an RD. So, yes. 'GO RV!!!' but at the same time, I would like to be educated on and prepared for all possible outcomes without getting flamed.

I truly hope it does RV without an RD but I suppose time will tell. Fingers crossed. If not, I will lose a lot of confidence in investing in Iraq for the future.

Hi JustLooking

First, welcome to DV. Second, I apologize for the ignorant manner

in which the negative crowd here has treated you. It is sickening, because

these same folks will post about "negativity" and then have no problem with

doing the exact opposite to anyone that does not fit their fantasy. It is these folks

who are bringing this site down to the level of PD or any of the other sites that

truly are more of a cult than a place to learn together without the smart and harsh

comments.

So be prepared to be accused of being a "troll", but I will advise you to NEVER stop

researching and being willing to learn. Let those who have no genuine desire to learn

anything other than what rumors tell them dish out their own brand of "negativity". They

are the TRUE trolls parading about discussing being "positive" yet they have little problem

attacking anyone they feel is a threat because of wanting to learn or understand facts instead

of long accepted fables as somehow being truthful. Many hide behind their computer and will

bash you personally and call it "being positive", while YOU have been quite pleasant, but YOU are

the one who will get labeled as being negative.

This is severe twisted logic and behavior that appears to be the norm now, and these kind of folks

unfortunately have joined together to show their ignorance to anyone who does not agree with their

platform of lies.

On the other hand, there are many here who are intelligent, willing to discuss all aspects of this speculation

without feeling threatened, they are not harsh, and NOT negative like those you have run into, although these

folks I speak of are NOT wanted here. The only thing wanted by a majority is to be fed lies and this comes even from

those who once were respected, but have now simply joined in the bash fest against anyone who does not agree

with their outlook even when it is based upon sound and diligent research and verifiable facts. How sad is it when

any situation becomes supported by nothing but lies and promises that cannot be fulfilled?

So personally, I apologize and I am saddened and sickened of this school playground mentality in which those who pretend

to be "positive" are actually the bullies which will attack you and bash you, label you, then post about how they want ALL others to

leave so they can have their own fantasy forum. So be it.

You are on the right track my friend...of course we all hope for a good outcome, but absolutely no one can offer a guarantee

that the outcome will be an event that we actually want. So continue to ask questions, continue to be respectful, even when facing

those who are the actual trolls here, and at some point you may find a few who are willing to learn together instead of acting

like spoiled brats.

Forgive me please for my anger, but the manner in how you were welcomed is shameful and those responsible I am sure

would never appreciate receiving this kind of treatment, but they can certainly dish it out under the guise of being 'positive'.

Incredible to see, and watch things implode here, and for the most part it is overlooked. DO not allow them to sway you,

and draw you into their twisted definitions of what is 'positive' or 'negative' as it is evident those who attack have not a clue

what either means.

Thank you for your post JL79 and continue your approach...also, pay no attention to the rumor section as it is only here

for traffic means, and certainly has benefited not one single person other than to manipulate far too many to go spend

more money on IQD that they should be using to buy food and pay their mortgages with. But around here, it is called

"entertainment". Their is NOTHING "entertaining" about being lied to, but it is used as an excuse because without the

rumors that are spread, few would bother coming here, because their entire foundation and belief has been built upon

lies, and the frustration continues to build until we see the type of ignorant behavior that you unfortunately have seen today.

Do not allow these types to pull you down. I look forward to having good discussion with you at some time, if that is even

possible any longer.

All my best to you JL79

Jim

---

Edited July 19, 2011 by Jim1cor13