The Deity of Jesus Christ

Markinsa · October 4, 2017

1 Corinthians 6:19-20 (NASB)

19 Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and that you are not your own? 20 For you have been bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body.

Revelation 1:17-18 (NASB)
17 When I saw Him, I fell at His feet like a dead man. And He placed His right hand on me, saying, “Do not be afraid; I am the first and the last, 18 and the living One; and I was dead, and behold, I am alive forevermore, and I have the keys of death and of Hades.

How did the First and last die? When did God die?

Isaiah 55:10-11 (NASB)

10 “For as the rain and the snow come down from heaven,
And do not return there without watering the earth
And making it bear and sprout,
And furnishing seed to the sower and bread to the eater;
11 So will My word be which goes forth from My mouth;
It will not return to Me empty,
Without accomplishing what I desire,
And without succeeding in the matter for which I sent it.

Markinsa · October 4, 2017

7 hours ago, Botzwana said:

Well that is the point Markinsa....Revelation 1 is Jesus talking. He died on the cross remember? He is not God. Habbakuk says God cannot die. Numbers 23 says God is not a man. Therefore Jesus cannot be God.

Really? So is Jesus talking in Isaiah 44 and blaspheming God, claiming to be God? I am praying you see the truth in God's Word.

Revelation 1:17-18 (NASB)
17 When I saw Him, I fell at His feet like a dead man. And He placed His right hand on me, saying, “Do not be afraid; I am the first and the last, 18 and the living One; and I was dead, and behold, I am alive forevermore, and I have the keys of death and of Hades.

Isaiah 44:6-8 (NASB)

6 “Thus says the Lord, the King of Israel and his Redeemer, the Lord of hosts:

‘I am the first and I am the last,
And there is no God besides Me.
7 ‘Who is like Me? Let him proclaim and declare it;
Yes, let him recount it to Me in order,
From the time that I established the ancient nation.
And let them declare to them the things that are coming
And the events that are going to take place.
8 ‘Do not tremble and do not be afraid;
Have I not long since announced it to you and declared it?
And you are My witnesses.
Is there any God besides Me,
Or is there any other Rock?
I know of none.’”

Synopsis · October 4, 2017

Psalm 130:7-8 New International Version (NIV)

⁷Israel, put your hope in the Lord,
    for with the Lord is unfailing love
    and with him is full redemption.
⁸He himself will redeem Israel
    from all their sins.

New International Version (NIV)

Galatians 3:13-14 New International Version (NIV)

¹³Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us, for it is written: “Cursed is everyone who is hung on a pole.”^[a] ¹⁴He redeemed us in order that the blessing given to Abraham might come to the Gentiles through Christ Jesus, so that by faith we might receive the promise of the Spirit.

Footnotes:

Galatians 3:13 Deut. 21:23

New International Version (NIV)

Titus 2:11-14 New International Version (NIV)

¹¹For the grace of God has appeared that offers salvation to all people.¹²It teaches us to say “No” to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age, ¹³while we wait for the blessed hope—the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ, ¹⁴who gave himself for us to redeem us from all wickedness and to purify for himself a people that are his very own, eager to do what is good.

New International Version (NIV)

Synopsis · October 4, 2017

1 John 2:18-27 New International Version (NIV)

Warnings Against Denying the Son

¹⁸Dear children, this is the last hour; and as you have heard that the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come. This is how we know it is the last hour. ¹⁹They went out from us, but they did not really belong to us. For if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us; but their going showed that none of them belonged to us.

²⁰But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and all of you know the truth.^[a] ²¹I do not write to you because you do not know the truth, but because you do know it and because no lie comes from the truth. ²²Who is the liar? It is whoever denies that Jesus is the Christ. Such a person is the antichrist—denying the Father and the Son. ²³No one who denies the Son has the Father; whoever acknowledges the Son has the Father also.

²⁴As for you, see that what you have heard from the beginning remains in you. If it does, you also will remain in the Son and in the Father.²⁵And this is what he promised us—eternal life.

²⁶I am writing these things to you about those who are trying to lead you astray. ²⁷As for you, the anointing you received from him remains in you, and you do not need anyone to teach you. But as his anointing teaches you about all things and as that anointing is real, not counterfeit—just as it has taught you, remain in him.

Footnotes:

1 John 2:20 Some manuscripts and you know all things

New International Version (NIV)

Philippians 2:5-11N ew International Version (NIV)

⁵In your relationships with one another, have the same mindset as Christ Jesus:

⁶Who, being in very nature^[a] God,
    did not consider equality with God something to be used to his own advantage;
⁷rather, he made himself nothing
    by taking the very nature^[b] of a servant,
    being made in human likeness.
⁸And being found in appearance as a man,
    he humbled himself
    by becoming obedient to death—
        even death on a cross!

⁹Therefore God exalted him to the highest place
    and gave him the name that is above every name,
¹⁰that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow,
    in heaven and on earth and under the earth,
¹¹and every tongue acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord,
    to the glory of God the Father.

Footnotes:

Philippians 2:6 Or in the form of
Philippians 2:7 Or the form

New International Version (NIV)

Psalm 2 New International Version (NIV)

Psalm 2

¹Why do the nations conspire^[a]
    and the peoples plot in vain?
²The kings of the earth rise up
    and the rulers band together
    against the Lord and against his anointed, saying,
³“Let us break their chains
    and throw off their shackles.”

⁴The One enthroned in heaven laughs;
    the Lord scoffs at them.
⁵He rebukes them in his anger
    and terrifies them in his wrath, saying,
⁶“I have installed my king
    on Zion, my holy mountain.”

⁷I will proclaim the Lord’s decree:

He said to me, “You are my son;
    today I have become your father.
⁸Ask me,
    and I will make the nations your inheritance,
    the ends of the earth your possession.
⁹You will break them with a rod of iron^[b];
    you will dash them to pieces like pottery.”

¹⁰Therefore, you kings, be wise;
    be warned, you rulers of the earth.
¹¹Serve the Lord with fear
    and celebrate his rule with trembling.
¹²Kiss his son, or he will be angry
    and your way will lead to your destruction,
for his wrath can flare up in a moment.
    Blessed are all who take refuge in him.

Footnotes:

Psalm 2:1 Hebrew; Septuagint rage
Psalm 2:9 Or will rule them with an iron scepter (see Septuagint and Syriac)

New International Version (NIV)

Synopsis · October 4, 2017

1 hour ago, Botzwana said:

Phillipians 2:5-11....Hmm....The Amplified Bible, for example, translates Phil. 2:3, 5 this way:

"Instead, in the true spirit of humility (lowliness of mind) let each regard the others as better than and superior to himself.... Let this same attitude and purpose and [humble] mind be in you which was in Christ Jesus. - Let Him be your example in humility."

Some trinitarians insist that this scripture proves that Jesus was (and is) "equal with God." But all the real evidence proves just the opposite! Phil. 2:6 is, in reality, proof that Jesus has never been equally God with the Father!

Philippians 2:6 Amplified Bible (AMP)

⁶who, although He existed in the form and unchanging essence of God [as One with Him, possessing the fullness of all the divine attributes—the entire nature of deity], did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped or asserted [as if He did not already possess it, or was afraid of losing it];

Amplified Bible (AMP)

Philippians 2:6 Amplified Bible, Classic Edition (AMPC)

⁶Who, although being essentially one with God and in the form of God [^[a]possessing the fullness of the attributes which make God God], did not ^[b]think this equality with God was a thing to be eagerly grasped ^[c]or retained,

Footnotes:

Philippians 2:6 B.B. Warfield, Biblical Doctrines.
Philippians 2:6 Joseph Thayer, A Greek-English Lexicon.
Philippians 2:6 Joseph Thayer, A Greek-English Lexicon.

Amplified Bible, Classic Edition (AMPC)

Botzwana, I suggest You read the verse after Philippians 2:5 from the Amplified Bible and Amplified Bible, Classic Edition. It is undeniable that Jesus Christ is actually in fact God no matter how You look at it. In Philippians 2:9-11 quoted in my post above, God The Father exalted Jesus Christ to the highest place and would not do that if Jesus Christ was not God and equal with God The Father. To bow the knee before Jesus Christ and all to call Jesus Christ LORD to the glory of God The Father is not possible if Jesus Christ is not God since God will not yield HIS glory to another.

Isaiah 42:8 New International Version (NIV)

⁸“I am the Lord; that is my name!
I will not yield my glory to another
or my praise to idols.

New International Version (NIV)

Synopsis · October 5, 2017

Just now, Botzwana said:

If God exaulted him...HOW could Jesus be God? Like when the Queen of england exaults a person...say Knighthood, the knight does not automatically become the Queen. Did not God exault Moses by choosing him to lead the Israelites? Moses however was never God.

God is not limited by man's intellect. Nor is God subject to the devices or constraints of man's reason. And, God is absolutely not bound to the promptings and or practices of man.

Proverbs 21:30 New International Version (NIV)

³⁰There is no wisdom, no insight, no plan
that can succeed against the Lord.

New International Version (NIV)

2 Peter 2:1-3 New International Version (NIV)

False Teachers and Their Destruction

2 But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them—bringing swift destruction on themselves. ²Many will follow their depraved conduct and will bring the way of truth into disrepute. ³In their greed these teachers will exploit you with fabricated stories. Their condemnation has long been hanging over them, and their destruction has not been sleeping.

New International Version (NIV)

Who is this "sovereign Lord" other that Jesus Christ HIMSELF? I posted earlier references to the deity of Jesus Christ and HIMSELF redeeming HIS people.

Jim1cor13 · October 5, 2017

If one researches the origins of these matters and ancient beliefs, they predate all forms of organized religion.

The belief in a man "god" has its roots in much ancient mythology going back to Horus, Mithra, etc.

The pattern has been followed throughout religious history, with much borrowed from ancient "gods and goddesses"

in which there were literally thousands over many thousands of years. Ancients viewed the planets as "gods" and named

them as such, the main "god" being the sun or "Son".

Edited October 5, 2017 by Jim1cor13

DinarDavo · October 5, 2017

7 minutes ago, Synopsis said:

God is not limited by man's intellect. Nor is God subject to the devices or constraints of man's reason. And, God is absolutely not bound to the promptings and or practices of man.

“As the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways and my thoughts than your thoughts. Isaiah 55:9

The believer's walk is and has always been one of "faith"....to think that we can intellectualize our understanding of God is pure folly...IMHO.

Synopsis · October 5, 2017

Just now, DinarDavo said:

“As the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways and my thoughts than your thoughts. Isaiah 55:9

The believer's walk is and has always been one of "faith"....to think that we can intellectualize our understanding of God is pure folly...IMHO.

Thank You, DinarDavo, I agree!

Jim1cor13 · October 5, 2017

50 minutes ago, Botzwana said:

Right! So the belief that Jesus IS God comes from Pagan beliefs!

There are many modern beliefs that have their origins in some form of "pagan" religions.

Certain ideologies and teachings stem from ancient thought. Some folks adopt them

because they may fit with their particular views of our world. Some of those views

can be pretty twisted, but there is little doubt as to some of their origins.

Here is what I have found in many cases...

Some folks are content with their faith, and practice what is most important, such as learning

what it means to love each other, which has nothing to do with the warm fuzzy feelings often associated

with "love". Others feel they must try and prove what cannot be proven, and in doing so they often

toss aside anyone who does not believe as they do which is the opposite of humility.

I have seen many discussions turn into heated debates and outright anger due to certain subjects.

History shows us that some went as far as murder in the name of their god and we have seen this

in modern times. Most religions insist they are the only true faith, etc. They also often teach the

idea that those who do not submit will be treated to a plethora of sadistic measures to punish them.

This type of teaching also has its roots in very ancient mythology but is apparently found to be very

handy when it comes to the methods used to convince another, and if all else fails, pour on the

horror show. It is quite effective...but also totally contrary to humility and love.

Men have tried to fashion a god after themselves throughout history, and in doing so, they come up with

some very strange and dark ideas as to how that god treats others. It ends up treating others in ways

that vengeful men treat their neighbors who they are supposed to love as themselves.

To me, it is all a matter of the heart. The bottom line is always treating others as we desire to be treated,

which all of us have failed miserably at, but it is part of the human experience. It is a universal teaching of how

we interact with others, and one of the most misunderstood. The most difficult thing

to do is to love without bias, without expectations, and without trying to force others to believe the same

as we do. We have been told that there is faith, hope and love...and the greatest of those is love, not creeds,

or doctrines or dogma, but love. Love does not set out to harm others, true love finds ways to edify and

practice kindness towards others. A rare thing today in some cases especially when it comes to certain

beliefs.

If that is so, that love is the greatest, then something went wrong a long time ago and the division we often see

among folks is a reflection of that. I find it is profitable to try and never allow any ideology to come in between how

I treat other people. It is a dangerous path to take when anyone places their belief above the value of their fellows,

because it often leads to a violent end.

Just my two cents

gregp · October 5, 2017

20 hours ago, Botzwana said:

Well that is the point Markinsa....Revelation 1 is Jesus talking. He died on the cross remember? He is not God. Habbakuk says God cannot die. Numbers 23 says God is not a man. Therefore Jesus cannot be God.

FYI:

I only believe in the King JAMES version of the Holy Bible.

Let me share this;

God the Father, saw there was no hope for us. We were and are currently so full of sin that he sent his only Son to earth to save us. Jesus gave up his post in Heaven because there was no hope for us and he loved us as does his Father. He walked the earth professing his love and his Fathers love but only a small crowd believed. He died on the cross to become sin. He took our sins so the Father wouldn't throw us in the eternal lake of fire. You must repent of your sins to be saved. You must accept that Jesus is Lord and your Savior and you will be saved and gain eternal life. Baptism is also required after. Baptism is a show of faith. As you are dunked completely under water, your old life of sin is submerged, and buried, then your old life of sin is changed as you come out of the water. This is a faith thing. Bury your old life of sin. Arise as a reborn Christian in Christ. You now have everlasting life.

❤️❤️❤️

Although we will all continue to sin, you must pray and repent to God the father and pray in the name of Jesus Christ.

Thanks

gregp · October 5, 2017

9 minutes ago, Botzwana said:

Yup...every religion goes to war.....Except Jehovah´s Witnesses. That in itself is worthy of praise.

I have some great friends that are jehovahs witnesses. Good people.

The only way to Heaven is through Jesus Christ. No religion. Just Jesus. It's so simple. NO RELIGION. Just Jesus. He died a brutal death to show us all. I personally need Jesus more than any of us here.

ATHIM · October 5, 2017

If Jesus is not the Son of God then there is no salvation in Christianity.

Botswana, you quote Greek but are you Greek? Ask them who Jesus is and why Him being the Son of God is of greater significance than all the rhetoric which surrounds His otherwise misinterpreted incarnation and Gospel.

Let US make man in OUR image according to OUR likeness. Who is the "US" and "OUR".

The devil will of course leave the Jehovah's Witnesses alone because that's what they are, alone. Their Bible is an elaborate fairy-tale that robs salvation from those who would otherwise find it.

There is no other way to resolve all these sinful ideological differences, man has gone too far, it is time for everyone to die unto judgement. Sorry if my comments hurt your feelings. No I am certainly not, man brought this upon himself.

Suddenly we will all be dead. You better be able to bet your soul on your faith because that's what's coming up.

Shedagal · October 5, 2017

My ability to post links is horrible, but I am going to try anyway. A very dear Christian brother named Nabeel Quershi converted to Christianity from the Muslim faith in which he was raised. He had a medical degree but felt called to the ministry and got a Doctorate of Divinity from Oxford. He died last month at age 34 from cancer. I had followed him and prayed for his healing (along with so many others). My heart hurts at the loss of this precious gift. Anyway, I found this explanation he gave on the Trinity during a question and answer session. I am not posting to enter into the debate (I don't enjoy that), but because I think it fits here. https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=nabeel+quershi+on+trinity&view=detail&mid=F2BC1A14D18247CAF1C1F2BC1A14D18247CAF1C1&FORM=VIRE

Markinsa · October 5, 2017

@Botzwana You know I read that whole thing, and I found that link this evening, and the only thing that ran through my mind was, Bill Clinton, and the below statement:

It depends upon what your definition of is is

I don't have the background to dispute any of what was said in that post, but I just felt dirty reading it.

Listen:

God made salvation simple, he made it free, the plan is simple and the ONLY way any of it would work is if he did everything himself. You would get way more out of reading your bible if you would just exchange God with Jesus in the Old Testament and Jesus with God in the New Testament. So many things would become clear to you if you did that. Don't believe me, pray about it before you begin reading, ask God/Jesus to reveal himself to you while you read.

6 hours ago, Synopsis said:

Philippians 2:5-11 (NASB) Changed from (NIV)

5 Have this attitude in yourselves which was also in Christ Jesus, 6 who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped, 7 but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men. 8 Being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross. 9 For this reason also, God highly exalted Him, and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name, 10 so that at the name of Jesus every knee will bow, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, 11 and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

I fear the Jesus you are following is not the same Jesus that was preached by Paul.

2 Corinthians 11:3-4 (NKJV)

³But I fear, lest somehow, as the serpent deceived Eve by his craftiness, so your minds may be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. ⁴For if he who comes preaches another Jesus whom we have not preached, or if you receive a different spirit which you have not received, or a different gospel which you have not accepted—you may well put up with it!

So let me approach this from a different angle:

How many times have you wanted to hear God's Voice? Me 100's, 1,000's of times, so as I'm driving home, I'm listening to a audio tape by Derek Prince, titled "How To Hear Gods Voice - PART 2". So, I'm listening and he's talking about Jesus, and he quotes the below scripture:

John 10:26-28 (NASB)

26 But you do not believe because you are not of My sheep. 27 My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me; 28 and I give eternal life to them, and they will never perish; and no one will ****** them out of My hand.

John 10:14-18 (NASB)

14 I am the good shepherd, and I know My own and My own know Me, 15 even as the Father knows Me and I know the Father; and I lay down My life for the sheep. 16 I have other sheep, which are not of this fold; I must bring them also, and they will hear My voice; and they will become one flock with one shepherd. 17 For this reason the Father loves Me, because I lay down My life so that I may take it again. 18 No one has taken it away from Me, but I lay it down on My own initiative. I have authority to lay it down, and I have authority to take it up again. This commandment I received from My Father.”

So here's my question: How can you tell the difference between God's Voice and Jesus's voice when they're talking to you?

.

Markinsa · October 5, 2017

1 minute ago, Botzwana said:

Wish I knew how to quote 4 different people....Darn....

Why do you believe in only the KJV of the Bible? Do you think jesus spoke in the king´s english?

I agree with most of what you said after that though.

Find each topic you want to quote, click "+" next to the "Quote Edit Options" Menu at the bottom of each post. :twothumbs:

Markinsa · October 5, 2017

A CRITIQUE OF THE NEW WORLD TRANSLATION OF THE CHRISTIAN GREEK SCRIPTURES' TREATMENT OF NINE TEXTS EMPLOYING ΘΕΌΣ IN REFERENCE TO JESUS CHRIST.

6.3. Purpose and Hypothesis

The purpose of this study has been to determine the trustworthiness of the NWT as an academic or devotional resource. The criterion for establishing trustworthiness in this study is the assumption that if a Bible translation’s treatment of the original text, either in toto, or in regard to passages related to a specific major subject or theme, can be objectively determined to be erroneous, such a translation is untrustworthy.

My hypothesis entering into this project was that the research would show that

(a) the theological biases of NWT’s translators against the notion of the divinity of Jesus Christ caused them to violate their own stated philosophy of translation and the rules of Koine Greek grammar and exegesis, and

(b) that the NWT is therefore, not suitable for academic use, or devotional use by those holding orthodox Christian beliefs.

I conclude that

(1) the theological biases of the translators have caused them to violate their own stated philosophy of translation and the rules of Koine Greek grammar and exegesis,

(2) resulting in a treatment of the original text that can be objectively determined to be erroneous, and

(3) the NWT must therefore be deemed untrustworthy as either an academic or devotional resource.

These conclusions confirm my original hypothesis. It might be inferred from the amount of and nature of the supporting documentation in the NWT that the translators believed themselves to be conveying an accurate translation. However, the tendency to embrace readings which deliberately conceal other plausible readings has resulted in the promotion of a “preferred religious view.” One can only conclude that the consistency shown in this regard betrays a strategy designed to subvert possible interpretations which conflict with Jehovah's Witness doctrine.

All translators have biases, and these biases are only problematic if and when they become a controlling influence in the translation process, as they have in the case of the NWT. Jehovah’s Witnesses, catholics, protestants, atheists, or Buddhists are equally capable of producing an accurate and trustworthy NT translation, if they adhere to the rules of Greek grammar and exegesis, and sound values and philosophy of translation. It is not the specific bias of the translators that renders the NWT unsuitable for academic or devotional use; rather the fact that this bias came to exert a controlling influence which resulted in erroneous translation.

6.4. Recommendations for Further Research

This research has been based on a narrowly focused subject with a relatively small sample of texts, demonstrating that the NWT’s treatment of the divinity of Jesus Christ favors a theological bias over the evidence of the Greek manuscripts. Is this controlling influence of theological bias unique within the NWT, or are other areas similarly affected? There are many texts imply the deity of Christ without the explicit use of θεός (such as the “I Am” texts of John’s gospel). It may be interesting to evaluate the NWT’s treatment of such a group of texts.

Jehovah’s Witnesses’ theology is significantly divergent from mainstream protestant & catholic theology in regard to soteriology, pneumatology, ecclesiology and thanatology (Bowman 1991). Also, the literature of the Watchtower Society is virtually silent on the love of God, preferring the sovereignty and justice of God as themes of study.

It may be interesting to evaluate the NWT’s treatment of texts referring to death, or the Holy Spirit, or church leadership with a methodology similar to this present research to see if a controlling influence of a preferred religious view is also evident in regard to these areas. Any such investigations would serve to either confirm or weaken the conclusions of this research.

ATHIM · October 5, 2017

1 hour ago, Botzwana said:

Genesis 1:26 US could be one...could be two....heck us could be one million. No number is given at Genesis 1:26 so that proves nothing of a Trinity.

As far as ¨our¨Bible being wrong...scholars will disagree with you. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_World_Translation_of_the_Holy_Scriptures

How many times have your false prophets called the end of the world, the house of Roses built for Abraham in California, the 144,00 who are all Jumbled Witnesses, you are lost, that's why you have to die to know the truth because the more you read the the less you know. You changed the Bible from the original text as man does to suit his father the devil of which you are a disciple, simple as that. I am Greek, know the Greek have seen your bible it is a lie and you are filled with the lies of your deluded cult. You know very little about atonement, the blood of Christ and why he HAD to be a part of God to create the value redemption that His sacrifice did. I don't have time to debate with you and I have not come for you. You will see the Son rise from the Greek Orthodox Church and from this you will know you were deceived.

Others will argue me but I have gone beyond caring. Time to die and learn the truth.

Markinsa · October 5, 2017

On 10/4/2017 at 11:47 PM, Botzwana said:

It is one guy´s opinion. I posted other scholars that agree with the nwt. But this is not really the point. This is about the deity of Christ right?

Yes it is his opinion, but this was a reference at the bottom of the wikileaks link you provided. And it really is the point, all of the material you are using is coming from the Watchtower's playbook of denial of Jesus's deity. @ATHIM has given his testimony concerning his Greek heritage and the watchtower's bible translation, so that's two wtnesses that have come forward to tell you that translation you are using is suspect. Does that not give you concern that you are leaning on false theology?

After many years of following a theology such as this, I can understand how hard it would be to admit that you have been wrong, and I humbly and sincerely suggest that you ask Jesus in prayer who is right and who is wrong. If you aren't hearing Jesus's voice you're in the wrong flock of farm animals.

.

On 10/4/2017 at 11:47 PM, Botzwana said:

JW´s have put out plenty of books talking about god´s love for us.

You can read all of those books, but if you're worshipping the wrong God, all the love in the world will not save you.

The reason Jesus is the ONLY way to God is because HE is God.

.

Markinsa · October 5, 2017

20 minutes ago, Botzwana said:

I could use your Bible and still come away that Jesus is not God. In fact I have not quoted the NWT at all during this. Look back. I even quote the amplified Bible.

http://www.answering-christianity.com/sami_zaatri/10_reasons_jesus_not_god.htm Here is a non witness site that agrees with me. So you know it is not just JW´s that believe it.

Of course you can:

Genesis 3:1-5 (NASB)

3 Now the serpent was more crafty than any beast of the field which the Lord God had made. And he said to the woman, “Indeed, has God said, ‘You shall not eat from any tree of the garden’?” ²The woman said to the serpent, “From the fruit of the trees of the garden we may eat; ³but from the fruit of the tree which is in the middle of the garden, God has said, ‘You shall not eat from it or touch it, or you will die.’” ⁴The serpent said to the woman, “You surely will not die! ⁵For God knows that in the day you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”

Synopsis · October 5, 2017

40 minutes ago, Botzwana said:

That scripture is about Satan tempting Eve. What does that have to do with the deity of Christ? Please don´t be another Synopsis that posts Daniel scriptures about pineapples when the subject is about hell. Or are you trying to say that I am Satan now?

Botzwana, my view and opinion is You are disingenuous and irrational with the questions and responses You have posted that resulted in others providing grounded responses with the obvious implications to satisfy the questions You posed or clearly refuting the statements You have made. To me, this indicates You are in a state of denial with regard to the TRUTH. For my posts, and I am almost certain regarding others' posts You rigorously and erroneously dissect, I post out of genuine response having concern for the TRUTH and a high regard for being grounded in the TRUTH in belief, action, and speech with a desire for others, not only You, to receive and embrace the TRUTH. I, as well as You and everyone else, will be held accountable to the TRUTH. Any denial I, as well as You and everyone else, have will be addressed by the TRUTH.

Hebrews 4:12-16 New International Version (NIV)

¹²For the word of God is alive and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart. ¹³Nothing in all creation is hidden from God’s sight. Everything is uncovered and laid bare before the eyes of him to whom we must give account.

Jesus the Great High Priest

¹⁴Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has ascended into heaven,^[a] Jesus the Son of God, let us hold firmly to the faith we profess. ¹⁵For we do not have a high priest who is unable to empathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are—yet he did not sin. ¹⁶Let us then approach God’s throne of grace with confidence, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help us in our time of need.

Footnotes:

Hebrews 4:14 Greek has gone through the heavens

New International Version (NIV)

DinarDavo · October 5, 2017

6 hours ago, Botzwana said:

So you are saying the entire Bible that God had written is useless then. WHY did he write it if we cannot understand anything about him?

No, I am not saying that at all (all or nothing, where have I heard that before?). Logic tells me that at some point my little 3 pound brain will not be able to comprehend the vastness of the nature of the God that created the universe and all that is within it.....that is the point where one steps into faith.

... But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him. Hebrews 11:6

To quote one of my favorite theologians, Samuel Clemens, “It ain't the parts of the bible that I don't understand that concerns me, it is the parts I do understand”.

Markinsa · October 5, 2017

5 hours ago, Botzwana said:

That scripture is about Satan tempting Eve. What does that have to do with the deity of Christ? Please don´t be another Synopsis that posts Daniel scriptures about pineapples when the subject is about hell. Or are you trying to say that I am Satan now?

I used that verse to support your statement that you can use my bible to prove Jesus is not God. Of course you can, just like satan did to Eve she. He said, 'You surely will not die.'

You can twist the scripture a y way you want but that doesn't make it true.

ATHIM · October 5, 2017

Botswana, my last to you sir.

What was the question asked of Jesus the answer for which He was crucified?

(Matthew 26:63) ⁶³ . . . And the high priest answered and said to Him, “I put You under oath by the living God: Tell us if You are the Christ, the Son of God!”

(Mark 14:62) ⁶² Jesus said, “I am. And you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Power, and coming with the clouds of heaven.”

TickTock, nearly time to rock this world; better hold on Whatsabanana.

ATHIM · October 5, 2017

It does not matter what we think, what matters is what Jesus meant. When He spoke to the Apostles there was no confusion as to whom Jesus was and is. He is the Son of the most high God, the Christ, the savior, the One for whom the wise men traveled and still journey to be close to. 'The Father and I are one, he who has seen Me has seen the Father'. The Apostles who saw Him, knew Him, touched His wounds, saw His miracles and loved His face have said for 2,000 years with their very blood and lives - JESUS CHRIST IS THE SON OF GOD THE ONLY NAME UNDER HEAVEN BY WHICH A MAN MIGHT BE SAVED.

Do you think Jesus wanted us to fight over Him, He is ashamed of our behavior and angered by the way men have deformed the Gospel into their own image. Sin has reached a point at which our Father can not tolerate us any more because we are the makers of abominations through vanities and the distorter's of the truth. When no one can be truly saved because sin and defilement of the Gospel are so rampant, we have sadly left no choice for God other than to intervene as He did in the time of Noah.

This message is very sad to me being as I am in the middle of it all. People who wish for the return of Christ will soon wish they had prayed for more time to repent instead.

CRYPTO REWARDS!

The Deity of Jesus Christ

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