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AT THE LAST TRUMPET


MyLadiesDaddy
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I’ll try to make this as short and sweet as I can.

 

LGD, this has been a great thread with good contribution from others and to think it all started with your claims that: 

•             ‘At the Last Trumpet’

•             ‘ Were being warned’ (tag)

•             ‘…those loud trumpet sounds that have been heard all over the world. I wondered if they maybe could be the seven trumpets in the book of Revelation.’

•             ‘…it hit me like a freight train, their pleadings and warnings from God.’

•             ‘God is getting our attention.’

 

Now, since I know that not to be true based on Scripture I pointed out the error to you with respect.  In your passionate way you mashed and ignored Scripture to defend your statement and instead of simply using Scripture to support your claim you spin off on dead babies, and burning you at the stake and the corruption of the church and state that my and Nelg’s attempts to educate you in public is wrong.

 

First of all we are called to defend the Gospel.  If a brother speaks in error (public or not) we have an obligation to correct and exhort.  And when I say we, I mean you too.  If I’m in error with using scripture to debunk your ‘Trumpet’ claims let me know by using Scripture.

 

However, your ‘trumpet’ claims are in error and lack Scriptural support.  Simple.  That’s my correction to you. And again, with respect I illustrated to you why.  Here it is once again:

 

“Now since there are no other New Testament scriptures regarding pre-rapture warning sounds from trumpets heard on earth you are faced with two options:

1.            The Holy Spirit wanted you to consider and come to understand that not all supernatural events or phenomena originate from God and could in fact be evil counterfeit manifestations of Holy miracles or just simply acts of nature that we don’t yet understand.

 

2.            You take out of context trumpet soundings from the Old Testament and  infuse them with a passionate ‘Last Days’ obsession with the end result being ‘error’ and the possibility of being labeled a ‘False Teacher’ such as Jesse Duplantis.  Duplantis and many others like him, too many unfortunately, fail to accurately communicate what God has said in the Bible and instead invent new meaning.  I’m trying to help you avoid the latter.

 

But what about those Old Testament Trumpets?  What about them? There were many ‘Trumpet’ soundings used to communicate with the Israelites.  You don’t get to cherry pick; if you take one to support your ‘Last Days’ theology you have to take them all.  And since we live under the dispensation of Grace and not the Law of Moses we don’t need any of them except as historical examples of God working with the Israelite’s toward the final atonement through the shed blood of Jesus Christ.”

 

I can understand how you and others may think I am being contentious for contentious sake but that is not the case.  Iron sharpens iron and that is what is taking place here; let’s face the furnace together and let the Holy Spirit burn off the dross with Scripture.

 

I stand on this truth: There is but one Church and Christ is its head and He sits on His throne managing it for His own glory. If you find failings in the church as you have emphasized, you might consider using the proper title; religion or the Church of Christ or the body of Christ depending on what you’re trying to communicate so others aren't confused.

 

As you can see words have meaning but often times people use them ignorantly or purposely to communicate a completely different meaning.

And in context with this ‘trumpet’ thread, Revelation is a word that means one thing to you and another to me and Nelg.  Nelg has tried to explain the difference and now I’m going to try as well.

 

The Revelation of Jesus Christ is his own ‘revealing’ of His person and of His mandates to his servants.  This ‘revealing’ and subsequent revelation (small R) to His servants is complete.  Period.  Faneeto…  And, there is a powerful warning with serious consequence for adding to or removing elements of Christ’s Revelation.  The Cannon is closed … everything you need to know is contained within those sixty six books of the Bible.

 

"All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work" (2 Timothy 3:16 - 17. Scripture is sufficient. It offers all we need for every good work.

 

I and Nelg both believe when reading Scripture one will experience a revelation (Small R) with regard to God working in ones life.

 

But where we disagree with you and others who hold a similar position is the claim that Revelation (large R) described by St. Paul in Galatians 1:12 (NRSV) referring to the divine message he had received by Christ, and by virtue of which he became apostle to the Gentiles applies to persons today.  It doesn’t, Christ REVEALED Himself and His mandates to St. Paul and ordained him as an Apostle to preach the Gospel to the gentiles.

 

Now, let’s go back to what kicked this all off; ‘TRUMPET SOUNDS’

•             ‘At the Last Trumpet’

•             ‘ Were being warned’ (tag)

•             ‘…those loud trumpet sounds that have been heard all over the world. I wondered if they maybe could be the seven trumpets in the book of Revelation.’

•             ‘…it hit me like a freight train, their pleadings and warnings from God.’

•             ‘God is getting our attention.’

 

Please LGD, sit down and review what I’ve written within these numerous posts and open your Bible and provide Scripture to support your claim that the ‘trumpet’ sounds now being heard around the world are pleadings and warnings from God and how they relate to the Seven Trumpets in Revelation.

 

You can start with this:

 

“But… as I explained on my previous post, ‘THE LAST TRUMPET’ is not the ‘SEVENTH TRUMPET’.  The seven seals (Revelation 6:1-17, 8:1-5), seven trumpets (Revelation 8:6-13; 11:15-19), and seven bowls/vials (Revelation 16:1-21) are three succeeding series of end-times judgments from God.

 

The judgments get progressively worse and more devastating as the end times progress. The seven seals, trumpets, and bowls are connected to one another.

 

THE LAST TRUMPET is personally sounded by God as the final calling of assembly for all of the saints’ dead or alive to join with Him in Heaven in an event known as the ‘Rapture’. THE RAPTURE will occur prior to the Seven Seals, Seven Trumpets and Seven Bowls.

 

As I said before, there will be no trumpet warnings prior to the LAST TRUMPET.  Your claim that the trumpet sounds presently heard around the world are warnings and pleadings from God is false and an egregious error that will perpetuate a ‘Last Days’ false teaching.

 

The LAST TRUMPET will sound without warning and the Rapture will occur SUDDENLY.”

 

It’s a simple request.

 

GH

 

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As I read each of your post, I'm struck by the sincere hearts that so want to share the word of God to His peoples.  Some here have a gentle tone, some a stern tone and some with a loving, patient tone,  I find that all that is said here is the tone of God's loving heart.  It is up to us to rely on the grace of wisdom... wisdom comes from Him and Him alone. 

 

No one is perfect in understanding, or providing the correct interpretation of the Bible, God gave it to us as a tool of life.  If you read it, it makes a lot of sense in simple writings.  Why make it more than its suppose to be. 

 

Our thoughts, actions and words are what our lives are based on.  With these thoughts, actions, and words, is how God will judge us. 

 

God's word is not up for debate, His words are for us to live and love like Him. We pray and ask Him to give us the wisdom, courage, strength to be Christ like, like His son Jesus Christ. 

 

Keep a simple heart, in order to feel the love that God has for us, to understand what is expected of us, and to praise Him till kingdom comes. 

 

Who's to say that we don't ask God for guidance in all we do.  God's response is our personal keepsake, until He reveals to us when the time to share. I've prayed on many things, and some answers that I receive are my personal keepsakes.  He'll let me know when to share and what to keep close to my heart.  He knows what is best for me and those who I touch.  He knows that I need time to contemplate, understand thoughtfully on what He has given me before I blurt something out that is not in line of what He wanted me to share. 

 

I pray that all who read this thread will relax their God given heart, to think thoughtfully and deeply, allow God to dwell in your hearts, to prepare you for His Kingdom. 

 

JMH simple O   

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Wowweeeeeee, my light just came on. George hayduke, I also have always associated the

"Last trumpet" found in 1Thessalonian 4:15-18 with the "7 trumpets" in the book of Revelation. After reading your post of 2 days ago, I have re-read, studied and still just didn't get what you was and what wasn't. Now today, with your new post.........I've opened my Bible once again and HELLO........I GOT IT......I LOVE IT. Our Lord once again has gifted me with an understanding which could only come from His Holy Spirit but was provided and taught by one of His chosen teachers to bring to light for me..I know this has been the whole point of yours and Nelgs' postings but I feel like our Lord has given me an extra bonus here......how we must praise and glorify His holy name.

LGD, surely you and I both have misunderstood some of the things that George and Nelg have shared with us. I personally feel that both of them have explained revelation, how and when we receive it. I also feel as Nelg said that one does not just receive divine knowledge and wisdom with out reading, studing or hearing God's word 1st. We are a deceived and deprave people. Until we read His word, we don't even have the capacity to want to read it. If and when we do, (truely seeking) it becomes more than just knowledge. It is an understanding of the reality and relevance of the works of God testified to by scripture. Does that make sense? Only the Holy Spirit, who searches the "deep things of God" can bring this understanding to our minds and our darkened hearts of sin. But we must 1st read, hear or study for our selves. We, who along with correct instruction from scripture, have an annointing of the Holy Spirit which opens our hearts and minds to the things of our Lord. I think what george and nelg were saying (excellent explanations) the Holy spirit imparts to us or enlightens us to the revelation found only in Gods word......this is not new revelation as I feel a george does on this, the cannons have been closed. God gave us everthing, all He had, even His precious Son. LGD, I ask you, what else can He give? I know with all my heart that you know that, I read most of your post and yes I'm guilty of even negging you at times. (Sorry, I promise I won't do it any more) anyway, the Holy Spirit opens and unveils our minds and attunes our very hearts so that we can understand what God has already revealed to us in His holy word. 2Cor.3:14-16; Eph.1:17, 18; 3:18,19......not "new revelation" but what He has already reveal in His sacred scripture and text. I pray that I've not cluttered your mind and only wish that I could express or explain in a more eloquent and clear manner, but The Lord has not given me that gift... my gift is one of a helper, a cleaner upper after others that are seen before others to carry Gods word to others and I love it. I praise Him and glorify His name as I deserve no gifts or anything else that He has so graciously given. LGD, my prayers are with ya and for ya to night.....God Bless......

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Romans 10:17

So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

 

I know that everyone here will say that I'm wrong and I can handle that.

 

But this Scripture is telling us that we receive faith by, "HEARING", the word of 

 

God. 

 

I am a trucker and have driven over the road for 22 yrs. As you can imagine that lifestyle 

 

​gave me an inordinate amount of time on my hands. I chose to use that time by,"listening", 

 

to the spoken word of God at first on tape and later on CD. I chose the King James version 

 

read by James Earl Jones. I would take it so far as to listen to those tapes and CDs even 

 

whilst I slept. No man on earth has as soothing a voice as James. 

 

Now understand this, 22 yrs listening to the spoken word. And now everyone here 

 

expects me to believe that I don't understand the Holy Word. 

 

I started this thread with a question. 

 

I was asked to use Scripture to back my point of view. 

 

I later realized that the,"sky trumpets", had nothing to do with the seven trumpets. 

 

If you're up to it this would also be good reading Why are the "last trumpet" and the "seventh trumpet" not the same trumpet?

Read more: http://dinarvets.com/forums/index.php?/topic/214532-at-the-last-trumpet/#ixzz3yUcOY7jj

 

I repeatedly stated that I'm only seeking knowledge and not trying to sway anyone's opinion.

 

but to take all this to the Lord in prayer. 

 

My beloved Brother, again I mean no disrespect. Though I know how this sounds coming from an 

 

uneducated trucker. Please, if you love the Lord, and I know you do, Take these questions to Him. 

 

And he shall guide you into all truth. 

Read more: http://dinarvets.com/forums/index.php?/topic/214532-at-the-last-trumpet/page-2#ixzz3yUdcseJU

 

​Learning all I can, I was just talking with Eagle Eye today and we both agreed that just 

 

because someone doesn't see in the Word that which you see has no bearing on their 

 

salvation what so ever. 

 Matthew 7:13

Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:

 

If you claim to love the Lord Jesus Christ then there is nothing that gives anyone the right 

 

to say otherwise. However, God described the road to salvation as a,"narrow", road. That 

 

can only mean one thing. Those who love the Lord are on the same path, 

 

but all are at different places. 

 

In this endeavor my very salvation has been brought into question and still I choose not 

 

to retaliate. Because I have been at that spot on the narrow path and I know now that no

 

man knows another's heart.

 

And to make it clear to all those that seemingly can't understand my words I know now that 

 

The,"Last Trumpet", of 1st Corinthians 15:52 is the First Trumpet of

 

REVELATION 4:1

 

 After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter.

Edited by ladyGrace'sDaddy
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.IMHO also we ARE in the end times...there WILL be signs in the heavens and on the earth...but if you or I are not eye-witnesses..we are  false witnesses...

Read more: http://dinarvets.com/forums/index.php?/topic/214532-at-the-last-trumpet/page-3#ixzz3yUvWqgsP

 

As this thread is about strange events in the heavens I thought that this article given to me from a dear 

 

friend here, cowtoter, would be appropriate. I quoted my beloved Brother Eagle Eye for what will be 

 

obvious reasons..

 

 

 

Is this the hand of God? Incredible cloud formation above Portugal looks like a fist from Heaven

 

  • The incredible cloud formation dubbed the 'Hand of God' was spotted over the Portuguese island of Madeira 
  • It was snapped by weather blogger Rogerio Pacheco who saw the unusual clouds out of his bedroom window 
  • Amazed onlookers have compared the bright orange cloud from everything from a fist from heaven to a comet  
  •  

An incredible cloud formation which appeared over the skies of Portugal has been dubbed the 'hand of God'. 

The cloud took the form of a fist from Heaven with a hand holding a fireball as it dominated the skyline across the island of Madeira on Monday.  

And weather blogger Rogerio Pacheco, 32, could not believe his luck when he looked up at the clouds while commuters made their way to work in the morning rush hour.

The awe-inspiring snaps have since been shared online after Mr Pacheco opted to post them on his blog.

Amazed onlookers have compared the bright orange cloud to everything from a flaming fist of fury to the iconic comet featured in the classic video game Final Fantasy VII.

Mr Pachero said: 'As soon as I saw the sky, I was immediately intrigued and I just had to grab my camera to take photo.'  

 

309F184700000578-3419473-image-a-157_145

 

The unusual cloud formation that was spotted over the Portuguese island of Madeira, which has been compared to the 'Hand of God' 

 

309F185400000578-3419473-image-a-156_145

 

Amazed onlookers have compared the bright orange cloud to everything from a flaming fist of fury to the iconic comet featured in the classic video game Final Fantasy VII
 

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LGD, I think if you want to spend your time looking for signs and wonders then that is perhaps where you are in your walk..........As for me, I will have faith with all the promises and miraculous miracles he has already shown us in His holy word. I have no need to prove that the end times are upon us as "the end times" began with the crucifixion of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. No hostility here, but as you expained only moments ago, each of us are at different stages and understandings in our walk with Him. I have complete conviction and a sure rest in knowing that "HE WILL COME". As to when, this is for Him only to know, the only worry one should consider is, "are you ready?"..

I pray your evening is easy, I pray that we all can rest easy and peacefullly in our Lords rest...."Surely I am coming quickly." Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus! Rev.22:20

The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all. Amen Rev.22:21

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Do All Roads Lead to God?

 

What did Jesus Christ, one of the most respected religious teachers in history, say on this subject? “Enter through the narrow gate,” he told his disciples. Why? “For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.”—Matthew 7:13, 14, The Holy Bible—New International Version.

 

Was Jesus really saying that some religions lead “to destruction”? Or was he teaching that only unbelievers are on the broad road, whereas those who believe in God—no matter what their religion—are on the narrow road that leads to life?

Immediately after stating that there are only two roads, Jesus said: “Be careful of false prophets. They come to you looking gentle like sheep, but they are really dangerous like wolves.” (Matthew 7:15, New Century Version) Later he said: “Not everyone who calls me ‘Lord, Lord’ will enter the Kingdom of heaven, but only those who do what my Father in heaven wants them to do.” (Matthew 7:21, Today’s English Version) If someone is called a prophet or claims that Jesus is his “Lord,” it is reasonable to say that he is a religious person, not an unbeliever. Clearly, then, Jesus was warning that not all religions are good and not all religious teachers should be trusted.

___________________________________________________________________________________________

 

Remember John is sharing with us visions, Re 1:1― “A revelation by Jesus Christ, which God gave him, to show his slaves the things that must shortly take place. And he sent his angel (Jesus) and presented it in signs through him to his slave John,”

So at Re 4:1 the description is of a ‘voice as of a trumpet’ not the sound of an instrument trumpet, Jehovah’s trumpet an angels, with voice that is loud and clear as the sound of a trumpet.

    

2 What John next beholds surpasses anything presented by video to modern man! He writes: “After these things I saw, and, look! an opened door in heaven, and the first voice that I heard was as of a trumpet, speaking with me, saying: ‘Come on up here, and I shall show you the things that must take place.’” (Revelation 4:1) John in vision penetrates the invisible heavens of Jehovah’s presence, exalted far above physical outer space as explored by human astronauts, even far above the galaxies of the material universe. As though by entering an opened door, John is invited to feast his eyes on a breathtaking panorama of the ultimate spirit heavens where Jehovah himself is enthroned. (Psalm 11:4; Isaiah 66:1) What a privilege!

 

3 The Bible does not identify this “first voice.” Like Jesus’ strong voice heard earlier, it has a commanding trumpetlike sound. (Revelation 1:10, 11) It brings to mind the penetrating horn blast that signaled Jehovah’s presence at Mount Sinai. (Exodus 19:18-20) Undoubtedly, Jehovah is the majestic Source of the summons. (Revelation 1:1) He has opened the door so that John, in vision, can enter the most holy location in all the vast realm of Jehovah’s sovereignty.

 

16 Another thing that accompanies Christ’s descent from heaven is the sound of “God’s trumpet.” (1 Thess. 4:16) The trumpet in this case is not a war signal for assembling troops that they might fight and put the enemy to death. Rather, the blast of “God’s trumpet” is a peaceful one for assembling Jehovah’s people, as when the two silver trumpets were blown in Moses’ day to assemble the 12 tribes of Israel. (Num. 10:1-10) Elsewhere, in 1 Corinthians 15:52, the apostle Paul connects such a rousing assembly “trumpet” with the resurrection of the Christian dead, when he says: “During the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised up incorruptible, and we shall be changed.” Who are the first to respond to that “last trumpet,” when it, as “God’s trumpet,” sounds forth for the gathering of the dead back to life? In answer, 1 Thessalonians 4:16 says: “And those who are dead in union with Christ will rise first.”

 

1Cor 15:25―in a moment, in the blink of an eye, during the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised up incorruptible, and we will be changed.

 

 

The,"Last Trumpet", of 1st Corinthians 15:52 is the First Trumpet of REVELATION 4:1

 

What you are saying with these scriptures just doesn’t work.

 

I don’t know what you are looking for, may be this will help?

 

The seven trumpets

first Re 8:7

 

second  Re 8:8,9

 

third Re 8:10,11

 

fourth Re 8:12

 

fifth Re 9:1-11

 

sixth Re 9:13–11:14

 

seventh Re 10:7; 11:15–14:20

 

 


 
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Wowweeeeeee, my light just came on. George hayduke, I also have always associated the

"Last trumpet" found in 1Thessalonian 4:15-18 with the "7 trumpets" in the book of Revelation. After reading your post of 2 days ago, I have re-read, studied and still just didn't get what you was and what wasn't. Now today, with your new post.........I've opened my Bible once again and HELLO........I GOT IT......I LOVE IT. Our Lord once again has gifted me with an understanding which could only come from His Holy Spirit but was provided and taught by one of His chosen teachers to bring to light for me..I know this has been the whole point of yours and Nelgs' postings but I feel like our Lord has given me an extra bonus here......how we must praise and glorify His holy name.

LGD, surely you and I both have misunderstood some of the things that George and Nelg have shared with us. I personally feel that both of them have explained revelation, how and when we receive it. I also feel as Nelg said that one does not just receive divine knowledge and wisdom with out reading, studing or hearing God's word 1st. We are a deceived and deprave people. Until we read His word, we don't even have the capacity to want to read it. If and when we do, (truely seeking) it becomes more than just knowledge. It is an understanding of the reality and relevance of the works of God testified to by scripture. Does that make sense? Only the Holy Spirit, who searches the "deep things of God" can bring this understanding to our minds and our darkened hearts of sin. But we must 1st read, hear or study for our selves. We, who along with correct instruction from scripture, have an annointing of the Holy Spirit which opens our hearts and minds to the things of our Lord. I think what george and nelg were saying (excellent explanations) the Holy spirit imparts to us or enlightens us to the revelation found only in Gods word......this is not new revelation as I feel a george does on this, the cannons have been closed. God gave us everthing, all He had, even His precious Son. LGD, I ask you, what else can He give? I know with all my heart that you know that, I read most of your post and yes I'm guilty of even negging you at times. (Sorry, I promise I won't do it any more) anyway, the Holy Spirit opens and unveils our minds and attunes our very hearts so that we can understand what God has already revealed to us in His holy word. 2Cor.3:14-16; Eph.1:17, 18; 3:18,19......not "new revelation" but what He has already reveal in His sacred scripture and text. I pray that I've not cluttered your mind and only wish that I could express or explain in a more eloquent and clear manner, but The Lord has not given me that gift... my gift is one of a helper, a cleaner upper after others that are seen before others to carry Gods word to others and I love it. I praise Him and glorify His name as I deserve no gifts or anything else that He has so graciously given. LGD, my prayers are with ya and for ya to night.....God Bless......

 

You are quite welcome.  I am sure Nelg is as blessed as I am with your personal revelation (small r) lol. And, you are so right to acknowledge that Christians are at different stages of their Sanctification (or walk as it were) and it is common for a new believer or young believer (in the faith) to make statements of error based upon their happiness, joy or passion or ignorance that the word of Truth that the Lord revealed to them applies to all mankind or Christians is representative of a NEW REVELATION. 

 

Some take it a step further believing Satan's lie that they are a new prophet or apostle or vessel crying out in the wilderness that a NEW REVELATION has been given only to them.

 

This is where Elders of Christ's Church (male & female) are to use scripture to instruct, correct, exhort and sometimes rebuke the Christian in error.

 

Why?

 

Because Error uncorrected becomes a False Teaching that will lead non-believers and new believers astray from the already existing and complete ordained Revelation of Christ.

 

As believers we're here to grow into a fuller understanding of Gods Will in our lives through His Word in order to reflect His Light and Glory upon a lost world so that more persons would come to realize redemption is available to them and He be Glorified. 

 

And that is what is considered an Essential Component of the Gospel. There are other Essential Components of the Gospel but for simplicity sake I'm going to illustrate using the one that is the most important.

 

Also, as believers we can disagree on NON-ESSENTIAL components of scripture without destroying the Essential Components of the Gospel.

 

Here is a simple example:

  • ESSENTIAL : 'Jesus Christ was crucified as the atoning sacrifice for all of mankind's lost souls and arose from the dead three days later.'  This IS the foundation of the Christian faith.  (All Christians believe and agree with this)
  • Non-Essential: 'The Rapture occurs prior to the Tribulation; in the middle of the Tribulation; at the end of the Tribulation.  Otherwise known as the Pre-Trib, Mid-Trib, and Post-Trib argument.'  As a Christian, you can believe and argue for any of the 'Trib' positions and you will still be a Christian. 

However, What a Christian cannot do without initially being in error is to change an ESSENTIAL COMPONENT INTO A NON-ESSENTIAL COMPONENT AND VISA VERSA.

 

For example:

  • Believing Jesus Christ was a prophet and that he was crucified for his loving parables and life example for us to follow but he did not rise from the dead to save mankind's souls. (Non-Christian)
  • Believing a NEW REVELATION AND THUS NEW GOSPEL has been given to self proclaimed Last Days Prophets and Apostles proclaiming the new Revelation of Jesus Christ is now fulfilled by their anointing and prophecy that the shed blood of Christ was insufficient for the atonement and that the Church of Christ must be cleansed by fire and Gods wrath through the complete Tribulation. (Non-Christian)

Scary and sad doctrines eh?  And yet there are many, many similar lies parroted by non-believers and well meaning Christians who have failed to test their own faith with Scripture.

 

And, that is why Elder Christians are called to correct, exhort, instruct and possibly rebuke those Christians who demonstrate, proselytize and preach Scriptural error. Simultaneously, the Holy Spirit will touch the receptive heart, mind and soul of the Christian in error with Scriptural clarity and sufficiency for repentance or ultimate personal accountability at the Bema Seat of Christ.

 

Thank you again for your prayerful consideration and follow up.

 

GH

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Btw...... the 2016 ligonier conference starts feb 25-27.....and yes, I'll be there....I know you and I don't see eye to eye on this but it is such a blessing for me....so much for me to learn and since our Lord didn't choose to make me His untill I was 52, I have only a short time to learn all I can and praise Him and glorify Him with all I can....what a mighty and awesome God we have.....how amazing and oh what a Savior our Lord Jesus Christ

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I've read your post twice and understand the essentials and nonessentials. Still being a fairly new believer I know I have been guilty of these things you speak of... Every time I receive something new, I am so overwhelmed and amazed that its hard to think that others have had this same experience. Thankfully our Lord has given me a sister-in-law that has given gentle guidance and has helped me grow somewhat away from this arrogance and pride, but I have so much to learn. You and nelg have certainly shown patience here on dv. Sometimes I read post and just almost explode with the things I would like to say but here the two of you come and loving explain with kjndness the true word of God. I pray the Lord will give me that kindness someday...

I will read your post again, my comprehension is not like most and its getting late. I thank you for your time and I thank you and nelg for being here. I just love how our almighty God uses you both. What a gracefull and longsuffering holy God we have.

God bless

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You are quite welcome.  I am sure Nelg is as blessed as I am with your personal revelation (small r) lol. And, you are so right to acknowledge that Christians are at different stages of their Sanctification (or walk as it were) and it is common for a new believer or young believer (in the faith) to make statements of error based upon their happiness, joy or passion or ignorance that the word of Truth that the Lord revealed to them applies to all mankind or Christians is representative of a NEW REVELATION. 

 

Some take it a step further believing Satan's lie that they are a new prophet or apostle or vessel crying out in the wilderness that a NEW REVELATION has been given only to them.

 

This is where Elders of Christ's Church (male & female) are to use scripture to instruct, correct, exhort and sometimes rebuke the Christian in error.

 

Why?

 

Because Error uncorrected becomes a False Teaching that will lead non-believers and new believers astray from the already existing and complete ordained Revelation of Christ.

 

As believers we're here to grow into a fuller understanding of Gods Will in our lives through His Word in order to reflect His Light and Glory upon a lost world so that more persons would come to realize redemption is available to them and He be Glorified. 

 

And that is what is considered an Essential Component of the Gospel. There are other Essential Components of the Gospel but for simplicity sake I'm going to illustrate using the one that is the most important.

 

Also, as believers we can disagree on NON-ESSENTIAL components of scripture without destroying the Essential Components of the Gospel.

 

Here is a simple example:

  • ESSENTIAL : 'Jesus Christ was crucified as the atoning sacrifice for all of mankind's lost souls and arose from the dead three days later.'  This IS the foundation of the Christian faith.  (All Christians believe and agree with this)
  • Non-Essential: 'The Rapture occurs prior to the Tribulation; in the middle of the Tribulation; at the end of the Tribulation.  Otherwise known as the Pre-Trib, Mid-Trib, and Post-Trib argument.'  As a Christian, you can believe and argue for any of the 'Trib' positions and you will still be a Christian. 

However, What a Christian cannot do without initially being in error is to change an ESSENTIAL COMPONENT INTO A NON-ESSENTIAL COMPONENT AND VISA VERSA.

 

For example:

  • Believing Jesus Christ was a prophet and that he was crucified for his loving parables and life example for us to follow but he did not rise from the dead to save mankind's souls. (Non-Christian)
  • Believing a NEW REVELATION AND THUS NEW GOSPEL has been given to self proclaimed Last Days Prophets and Apostles proclaiming the new Revelation of Jesus Christ is now fulfilled by their anointing and prophecy that the shed blood of Christ was insufficient for the atonement and that the Church of Christ must be cleansed by fire and Gods wrath through the complete Tribulation. (Non-Christian)

Scary and sad doctrines eh?  And yet there are many, many similar lies parroted by non-believers and well meaning Christians who have failed to test their own faith with Scripture.

 

And, that is why Elder Christians are called to correct, exhort, instruct and possibly rebuke those Christians who demonstrate, proselytize and preach Scriptural error. Simultaneously, the Holy Spirit will touch the receptive heart, mind and soul of the Christian in error with Scriptural clarity and sufficiency for repentance or ultimate personal accountability at the Bema Seat of Christ.

 

Thank you again for your prayerful consideration and follow up.

 

GH

Nice and clear.  Thanks.  

LAIC, prayers are with you and your continued search for Truth.  

Been busy today and have not had time to get to all I wanted to do.  

 

Anyone who addresses a biblical or spiritual component that effects the life of a believer (or unbeliever), challenges a biblical doctrine, or questions the foundational issues will be subject to peer review.  That is, they will have their words questioned by others to see if what they have written or said will stand the test of scrutiny.  It is only right and correct to challenge any teaching to see if it is consistent with the rest of Scripture. That is the meaning of 1Jno 4:1ff  "Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.  By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God; and every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God; this is the spirit of the antichrist, of which you have heard that it is coming, and now it is already in the world. We are from God; he who knows God listens to us; he who is not from God does not listen to us. By this we know the spirit of truth and the spirit of error."  

There are many people teaching something about Christ or the church (His body of believers) that they might fulfill the commission of Christ (Mt 28:19-20). If they are new to the word of God, they have a tendency to follow the popular teacher and not study God's word on their own to find out if it is truth.  

 

There are three important biblical ways in which we are to use discernment.

(1) Test all teaching for sound doctrine, and especially against the core doctrines of the Faith as laid down in the sixty six books of the Bible. One of the prime rules of truth is that it does not contradict other truth.  It is called the law of non-contradiction.  For example, Jesus is the Christ.  He cannot be both Christ and not Christ, which would be a contradiction. Paul was very clear and blunt about accepting "another gospel", which was a perversion of the gospel (Gal 1:6-8).  

(2) Test all prophesies to see if they are biblical and if the predictions of a prophet all come true. Someone who says they are prophets and their words fail to be fulfilled are no prophet from God.  

(3) Test their lives, words and actions for the fruit of the Spirit. If a teacher of the word is living a sin-filled life, then it is doubtful that that person will speak truth if it suits his/her purpose.  (Don't get me wrong.  We all sin, but we do not continue to live in sin.  We are cleansed by Christ's blood.  But if a person makes a claim to be a spokesman for God, but out of his/her mouth comes vile words and they live an immoral life, then it doubtful that they teach truth (James 3).

 

Well, there I do again!  Getting off into teaching when I just wanted to say, "keep on keeping on," grow in the grace and knowledge of Christ our Savior.  

Nelg.

Edited by Nelg
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Wowweeeeeee, my light just came on. George hayduke, I also have always associated the

"Last trumpet" found in 1Thessalonian 4:15-18 with the "7 trumpets" in the book of Revelation. After reading your post of 2 days ago, I have re-read, studied and still just didn't get what you was and what wasn't. Now today, with your new post.........I've opened my Bible once again and HELLO........I GOT IT......I LOVE IT. Our Lord once again has gifted me with an understanding which could only come from His Holy Spirit but was provided and taught by one of His chosen teachers to bring to light for me..I know this has been the whole point of yours and Nelgs' postings but I feel like our Lord has given me an extra bonus here......how we must praise and glorify His holy name.

LGD, surely you and I both have misunderstood some of the things that George and Nelg have shared with us. I personally feel that both of them have explained revelation, how and when we receive it. I also feel as Nelg said that one does not just receive divine knowledge and wisdom with out reading, studing or hearing God's word 1st. We are a deceived and deprave people. Until we read His word, we don't even have the capacity to want to read it. If and when we do, (truely seeking) it becomes more than just knowledge. It is an understanding of the reality and relevance of the works of God testified to by scripture. Does that make sense? Only the Holy Spirit, who searches the "deep things of God" can bring this understanding to our minds and our darkened hearts of sin. But we must 1st read, hear or study for our selves. We, who along with correct instruction from scripture, have an annointing of the Holy Spirit which opens our hearts and minds to the things of our Lord. I think what george and nelg were saying (excellent explanations) the Holy spirit imparts to us or enlightens us to the revelation found only in Gods word......this is not new revelation as I feel a george does on this, the cannons have been closed. God gave us everthing, all He had, even His precious Son. LGD, I ask you, what else can He give? I know with all my heart that you know that, I read most of your post and yes I'm guilty of even negging you at times. (Sorry, I promise I won't do it any more) anyway, the Holy Spirit opens and unveils our minds and attunes our very hearts so that we can understand what God has already revealed to us in His holy word. 2Cor.3:14-16; Eph.1:17, 18; 3:18,19......not "new revelation" but what He has already reveal in His sacred scripture and text. I pray that I've not cluttered your mind and only wish that I could express or explain in a more eloquent and clear manner, but The Lord has not given me that gift... my gift is one of a helper, a cleaner upper after others that are seen before others to carry Gods word to others and I love it. I praise Him and glorify His name as I deserve no gifts or anything else that He has so graciously given. LGD, my prayers are with ya and for ya to night.....God Bless......

 

"even His precious Son"

Very true, spoken like an innocent child, hopefully you can keep that truth from being corrupted.

 

He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation; because by means of him all other things were created in the heavens and on the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities. All other things have been created through him and for him. (Colossian 1:15,16)

 

4 Jehovah has shown love in many ways, but there is one that stands out above all others. What is it? It is his sending his Son to suffer and die for us. We can safely say that this is the greatest act of love in all history. Why can we say that?

5 The Bible calls Jesus “the firstborn of all creation.” (Colossians 1:15) Just think—Jehovah’s Son was in existence before the physical universe. How long, then, were Father and Son together? Some scientists estimate that the universe is 13 billion years old. Yet, even if this estimate is correct, it would not be long enough to represent the life span of Jehovah’s firstborn Son! How was he occupied during all those ages? The Son joyfully served as his Father’s “master worker.” (Proverbs 8:30; John 1:3) Jehovah and his Son worked together to bring all other things into being. What thrilling, happy times they had! Who of us, then, can begin to fathom the power of a bond that has existed over such an immense span of time? Clearly, Jehovah God and his Son are united by the strongest bond of love ever forged.

 

6 Nevertheless, Jehovah dispatched his Son to the earth to be born as a human baby. Doing so meant that for some decades, Jehovah had to forgo intimate association with his beloved Son in heaven. With intense interest, He watched from heaven as Jesus grew up to be a perfect man. At about 30 years of age, Jesus got baptized. On that occasion the Father spoke personally from heaven: “This is my Son, the beloved, whom I have approved.” (Matthew 3:17) Seeing that Jesus faithfully did all that had been prophesied, all that was asked of him, his Father must have been so pleased!—John 5:36; 17:4.

 

7 How, though, did Jehovah feel on Nisan 14, 33 C.E., as Jesus was betrayed and then arrested by an angry mob? As Jesus was ridiculed, spat upon, and struck with fists? As he was scourged, his back torn to ribbons? As he was nailed, hands and feet, to a wooden pole and left to hang there while people reviled him? How did the Father feel as his beloved Son cried out to him in the throes of agony? How did Jehovah feel as Jesus breathed his last and, for the first time since the dawn of all creation, His dear Son was not in existence?—Matthew 26:14-16, 46, 47, 56, 59, 67; 27:26, 38-44, 46; John 19:1.

 

8 Since Jehovah has feelings, the pain he must have suffered over the death of his Son is beyond the power of our words to express. What can be expressed is Jehovah’s motive for having allowed it to happen. Why did the Father subject himself to such pain? Jehovah reveals something wonderful to us at John 3:16—a Bible verse so important that it has been called the Gospel in miniature. It says: “God loved the world so much that he gave his only-begotten Son, in order that everyone exercising faith in him might not be destroyed but have everlasting life.” So God’s motive amounted to this: love. No greater love has ever been shown.

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You are quite welcome.  I am sure Nelg is as blessed as I am with your personal revelation (small r) lol. And, you are so right to acknowledge that Christians are at different stages of their Sanctification (or walk as it were) and it is common for a new believer or young believer (in the faith) to make statements of error based upon their happiness, joy or passion or ignorance that the word of Truth that the Lord revealed to them applies to all mankind or Christians is representative of a NEW REVELATION. 

 

Some take it a step further believing Satan's lie that they are a new prophet or apostle or vessel crying out in the wilderness that a NEW REVELATION has been given only to them.

 

This is where Elders of Christ's Church (male & female) are to use scripture to instruct, correct, exhort and sometimes rebuke the Christian in error.

 

Why?

 

Because Error uncorrected becomes a False Teaching that will lead non-believers and new believers astray from the already existing and complete ordained Revelation of Christ.

 

As believers we're here to grow into a fuller understanding of Gods Will in our lives through His Word in order to reflect His Light and Glory upon a lost world so that more persons would come to realize redemption is available to them and He be Glorified. 

 

And that is what is considered an Essential Component of the Gospel. There are other Essential Components of the Gospel but for simplicity sake I'm going to illustrate using the one that is the most important.

 

Also, as believers we can disagree on NON-ESSENTIAL components of scripture without destroying the Essential Components of the Gospel.

 

Here is a simple example:

  • ESSENTIAL : 'Jesus Christ was crucified as the atoning sacrifice for all of mankind's lost souls and arose from the dead three days later.'  This IS the foundation of the Christian faith.  (All Christians believe and agree with this)
  • Non-Essential: 'The Rapture occurs prior to the Tribulation; in the middle of the Tribulation; at the end of the Tribulation.  Otherwise known as the Pre-Trib, Mid-Trib, and Post-Trib argument.'  As a Christian, you can believe and argue for any of the 'Trib' positions and you will still be a Christian. 

However, What a Christian cannot do without initially being in error is to change an ESSENTIAL COMPONENT INTO A NON-ESSENTIAL COMPONENT AND VISA VERSA.

 

For example:

  • Believing Jesus Christ was a prophet and that he was crucified for his loving parables and life example for us to follow but he did not rise from the dead to save mankind's souls. (Non-Christian)
  • Believing a NEW REVELATION AND THUS NEW GOSPEL has been given to self proclaimed Last Days Prophets and Apostles proclaiming the new Revelation of Jesus Christ is now fulfilled by their anointing and prophecy that the shed blood of Christ was insufficient for the atonement and that the Church of Christ must be cleansed by fire and Gods wrath through the complete Tribulation. (Non-Christian)

Scary and sad doctrines eh?  And yet there are many, many similar lies parroted by non-believers and well meaning Christians who have failed to test their own faith with Scripture.

 

And, that is why Elder Christians are called to correct, exhort, instruct and possibly rebuke those Christians who demonstrate, proselytize and preach Scriptural error. Simultaneously, the Holy Spirit will touch the receptive heart, mind and soul of the Christian in error with Scriptural clarity and sufficiency for repentance or ultimate personal accountability at the Bema Seat of Christ.

 

Thank you again for your prayerful consideration and follow up.

 

GH

So tell me if you an Glen are the well educated ones that know  how to, " interpret", the Holy Word 

 

How comes you'ns can't even read my post correctly? I'm not God and my words DO mean nothing 

 

but what I've said. They contain no ambiguity, they come strait from the heart and they have no need 

 

for your friend,"Herman", and still neither of you'ns can understand them. You said, to Learning all I can,

 

 And, you are so right to acknowledge that Christians are at different stages of their Sanctification (or walk as it were)

 

Yet it was my post that gave that knowledge to Learning all I can. 

 

 Matthew 7:13

Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:

 

If you claim to love the Lord Jesus Christ then there is nothing that gives anyone the right 

 

to say otherwise. However, God described the road to salvation as a,"narrow", road. That 

 

can only mean one thing. Those who love the Lord are on the same path, 

 

but all are at different places. 

Read more: http://dinarvets.com/forums/index.php?/topic/214532-at-the-last-trumpet/page-3#ixzz3ycq3jcgk

 

And that is NOT the first time that you and,"GLEN", have misquoted me. So tell me while you'ns are publicly 

 

castrating me, where in the Word does it give you the right to claim or even suggest that someone is NOT 

 

saved? I will restrain my emotions, in the name of the Lord, and not make any such Claims about you and Glen.

 

I will do that which the Holy Spirit leads me to. And that is simply to let it go. " I know whom I have believed 

 

in, and that he is faithful to keep that which is given Him..." 

 

 

 

I've read your post twice and understand the essentials and nonessentials. Still being a fairly new believer I know I have been guilty of these things you speak of... Every time I receive something new, I am so overwhelmed and amazed that its hard to think that others have had this same experience. Thankfully our Lord has given me a sister-in-law that has given gentle guidance and has helped me grow somewhat away from this arrogance and pride, but I have so much to learn. You and nelg have certainly shown patience here on dv. Sometimes I read post and just almost explode with the things I would like to say but here the two of you come and loving explain with kjndness the true word of God. I pray the Lord will give me that kindness someday...

I will read your post again, my comprehension is not like most and its getting late. I thank you for your time and I thank you and nelg for being here. I just love how our almighty God uses you both. What a gracefull and longsuffering holy God we have.

God bless

As I have so many times already stated, I am not attempting to proselytize anyone here.

 

I was only thinking out loud, and relaying what the Holy Spirit gave me. As best I can. I

 

am only a man and therefor I do make mistakes. But one thing that is not in error is the one

 

message that I've been attempting to get Glen and George to do in multiple threads,and that is something

 

I now give to you.

 

Take everything to the Lord in Prayer. Don't settle for mans interpreting alone. But in all things 

 

acknowledge God through Jesus Christ and he shall direct your paths.   

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Well folks, I know this will come over like a lead balloon but I am just going to say what's been on my mind for 3 days now and it ain't nice.

I have found that many times when you speak to george and nelg, your statements and questions sound so very harsh. Here of late, I even hear sounds of jealousy that they may have been able to explain or put into context of correct instruction from Gods word. I find in many of your post to them a "put down" and yes even slanderous intent with, "they are learned and studied." I beg you, this is not the case. Am I trying to build then up and put you down? Absolutely not! But over the years they both proven themselves to me as men of God. Neither ever steers from Gods word. They use scripture that clarifies to the points or topics being discusssed. Many time the use scripture that interpret scripture. In other words they stay in order, they bring calm and understanding to God actual word. This is a gift that God Himself has given them and they have been obedient to obey. I feel much distress when you flippantly ridicule and try to offend.

Now, sometime back, I quite reading any of your post LGD, mainly because you got where you began throwing scripture every-which-a- way that had no revelance or bearing on what the topic was. Plus, it seemed you were almost demanding everyone to agree with you. If they didn't, I felt they were being attacked. Perhaps this is your way of reaching other, if so fine, that approach just doesn't float my boat.

I also felt that when you wrote your messsage, that there was a sense of superiority on you behalf. Almost like you were more saved or more justified than others. (Btw. That not how justification works but that another topic). I'm feel sure this was not the way you meant it but your demeanor and chosen words felt that way to me

I have read every inklin in this thread, some of it 2 and 3 times and again I find even more disrespect and arrogance in your dealing with certain people here than ever before.. You know the old saying, "when putting someone else down, we are trying to build SELF up.

It seems to me with your pettiness and jealousy you have tried your best to put these 2 men in a corner and make them look foolish...hasn't worked!.....You have called them the

"Educated" the "ones that has a friend called herman." WHY? You claim you have no need for "herman" and you sure don't want him in your life but you slander these 2 because they have something that you don't even want. WHAT? I'm puzzled! If this is not slander, jealousy and aggression towards that God Himself has callled to witness His word, then I don't know what is.

Now, please forgive me for my arrogance and bluntness, but you LGD, are not speaking with the voice of God when you continously pick, pull, drag and spinter another . Am I speaking with the voice of God right now...NO, I AM NOT! I have allowed myself to fall to the passions of anger and not really caring how I hurt you with my words. I have stooped to your level with little care as how my words can offend. I have even afforded myself with a feeling of aggression for you as you have ticked me off with your continuous put down of others to build yourself up. You must know, I am not jealous of others but have fallen into the same hateful display that you have shown towards george and nelg.

AIN'T IT GRAND TO DISPLAY OURSELVES AS A WITNESS TO GOD IN

SUCH A MANNNER?

Now if you coukd excuse me , your excellence, I will gather my witts about myself and check my heart. I surely will be convicted as soon as I can come down from my high horse here.....also, LGD, it surely would be great for you to check YOURS also.

Just one more thing, nelg and george do not need me to defend them...they are already defended by the Holiness of God. I apologize to the 2 of you if I have given too much attention to this matter. Im sure both of you have taken these insults as a grain of salt..

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Only a pure heart, unburdened by sin, can open itself to the desire that leads us to our Father.  This gives us spiritual vision to see with clarity what the Father has for us. 

 

Reading a lot as well, not only for patience for the every things of life we have to deal with.  But came across this scripture that kept poking at me...

 

Matthew 16:3-4

"You know how to interpret the appearance of the sky, but you cannot interpret the signs of times"

 

Thanks everyone for your love.

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Well folks, I know this will come over like a lead balloon but I am just going to say what's been on my mind for 3 days now and it ain't nice.

I have found that many times when you speak to george and nelg, your statements and questions sound so very harsh. Here of late, I even hear sounds of jealousy that they may have been able to explain or put into context of correct instruction from Gods word. I find in many of your post to them a "put down" and yes even slanderous intent with, "they are learned and studied." I beg you, this is not the case. Am I trying to build then up and put you down? Absolutely not! But over the years they both proven themselves to me as men of God. Neither ever steers from Gods word. They use scripture that clarifies to the points or topics being discusssed. Many time the use scripture that interpret scripture. In other words they stay in order, they bring calm and understanding to God actual word. This is a gift that God Himself has given them and they have been obedient to obey. I feel much distress when you flippantly ridicule and try to offend.

Now, sometime back, I quite reading any of your post LGD, mainly because you got where you began throwing scripture every-which-a- way that had no revelance or bearing on what the topic was. Plus, it seemed you were almost demanding everyone to agree with you. If they didn't, I felt they were being attacked. Perhaps this is your way of reaching other, if so fine, that approach just doesn't float my boat.

I also felt that when you wrote your messsage, that there was a sense of superiority on you behalf. Almost like you were more saved or more justified than others. (Btw. That not how justification works but that another topic). I'm feel sure this was not the way you meant it but your demeanor and chosen words felt that way to me

I have read every inklin in this thread, some of it 2 and 3 times and again I find even more disrespect and arrogance in your dealing with certain people here than ever before.. You know the old saying, "when putting someone else down, we are trying to build SELF up.

It seems to me with your pettiness and jealousy you have tried your best to put these 2 men in a corner and make them look foolish...hasn't worked!.....You have called them the

"Educated" the "ones that has a friend called herman." WHY? You claim you have no need for "herman" and you sure don't want him in your life but you slander these 2 because they have something that you don't even want. WHAT? I'm puzzled! If this is not slander, jealousy and aggression towards that God Himself has callled to witness His word, then I don't know what is.

Now, please forgive me for my arrogance and bluntness, but you LGD, are not speaking with the voice of God when you continously pick, pull, drag and spinter another . Am I speaking with the voice of God right now...NO, I AM NOT! I have allowed myself to fall to the passions of anger and not really caring how I hurt you with my words. I have stooped to your level with little care as how my words can offend. I have even afforded myself with a feeling of aggression for you as you have ticked me off with your continuous put down of others to build yourself up. You must know, I am not jealous of others but have fallen into the same hateful display that you have shown towards george and nelg.

AIN'T IT GRAND TO DISPLAY OURSELVES AS A WITNESS TO GOD IN

SUCH A MANNNER?

Now if you coukd excuse me , your excellence, I will gather my witts about myself and check my heart. I surely will be convicted as soon as I can come down from my high horse here.....also, LGD, it surely would be great for you to check YOURS also.

Just one more thing, nelg and george do not need me to defend them...they are already defended by the Holiness of God. I apologize to the 2 of you if I have given too much attention to this matter. Im sure both of you have taken these insults as a grain of salt..

Your attempt at angering me is in vain. 

 

I was not the one that called either of those two men anything. I challenge you to show me where I called them 

 

names and to then report that to Adam Montana. I did say that they were,"educated", but only because that is 

 

what they themselves have insinuated in there discussions. You have accused me of quite a lot but you didn't 

 

reference anything that you claimed to something that I said. I would like for you to do so, but you will probably 

 

not. Oh and one thing else, there was a man that did respond here who has not one but TWO Doctorate degrees 

 

and is himself something of a war hero. Maybe you should ask Eagle Eye who is being more Christ like here. 

 

I now will leave you alone with the sincere request that you either put me on ignore or give Adam Montana a 

 

call.  

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That's fine with me - this thread was never about who was more Christ like.  It was my questioning LGD's authority or knowledge that the Holy Spirit prompted him to consider that the 'Strange Trumpets Sounds'  heard around the world were the same as the 'Seven Trumpets' of Revelation.  This has never been about opinion or personality; it has been about inerrancy within Scripture.  I respect LGD's right to opinion but I hold to the rule of accountability of a Saint by Saints regarding a Divine proclamation.  He has refused to answer or clarify the foundation of his claim.

 

He could have simply said, I don't have to answer your questions regarding the Divine Revelation that "…it hit me like a freight train, their pleadings and warnings from God." But he didn't. He presumed I made a video mocking the "Strange Trumpet Sounds" and presumed aloud that I did not believe the strange phenomena presently being reported in the news. None of which is true and, I explained that to him without malice and than other his acknowledgment that he thought I made the video he's made no effort to offer an apology for his presumption.

 

If this Thread has gotten off track it is entirely of LGD's making and effort. I have asked him to join me to face the fire of the Holy Spirit and he has refused. That is why I am going to open a new thread in the proper forum illustrating in third person why Divine Proclamations without Scriptural support are 'False Teachings' and the consequences thereof.  And, just so there is no doubt in anybody's mind I will be using LGD's Divine Proclamation as the example.

 

For the record I believe 'Learning all I can' has a tender heart and genuine love for Christ and is a tremendous testimony to the Faith. If anything she and her passion and humility should be noted prayfully. 

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And that is NOT the first time that you and,"GLEN", have misquoted me. So tell me while you'ns are publicly 

 

castrating me, where in the Word does it give you the right to claim or even suggest that someone is NOT 

 

saved? 

 

Please for the Glory of God - present the statement of yours that I misquoted leading you to believe I am castrating you in public.  If so I'll apologize and wash your feet internet style

 

 

 

"where in the Word does it give you the right to claim or even suggest that someone is NOT saved? 

 

"Outside are the dogs, the sorcerers, the sexually immoral, the murderers, the idolaters, and everyone who loves and practices lying." Rev 21:15

 

False Teachings expose False Teachers who love and practice lying. Got it? Read it, Receive it and Believe it.

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Your attempt at angering me is in vain.

I was not the one that called either of those two men anything. I challenge you to show me where I called them

names and to then report that to Adam Montana. I did say that they were,"educated", but only because that is

what they themselves have insinuated in there discussions. You have accused me of quite a lot but you didn't

reference anything that you claimed to something that I said. I would like for you to do so, but you will probably

not. Oh and one thing else, there was a man that did respond here who has not one but TWO Doctorate degrees

and is himself something of a war hero. Maybe you should ask Eagle Eye who is being more Christ like here.

I now will leave you alone with the sincere request that you either put me on ignore or give Adam Montana a




Just so you know.......I wasn't trying to be Christ-like. I was showing and telling you that we are a deceived and depraved man.....its so easy for us to be hàteful, arrogant and full of pride when we are not attuuned to the Lords ways. I have displayed to you what you have displayed to others.....was this right for me to do so? NO! But sometime harsh words can and will allow others to see their err. If you feel you have truely done, said and everything you could possibly do to build others up, then I or any one one else here can help ya....but if you can see that we both are still sinners and in desparate need of God to do a mighty work in us, then, I'm all for ya.?.. otherwise I will as you suggested put you on ignore as I just can't bare this arrogant behavior towards others. I've spoke my peace, LGD, and unless you can change your disrespect and inconsideration towards others, I will harbor in my heart everything you have brought forth for the last few days. Of course you don't need to change for me........but isn't that what God would want you to do? Ask Him, then truely wait for His answer. Edited by Markinsa
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10 Finally, be strong in the Lord and in the strength of His might. 11 Put on the full armor of God, so that you will be able to stand firm against the schemes of the devil. 12 For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the powers, against the world forces of this darkness, against the spiritual forces of wickedness in the heavenly places. 13 Therefore, take up the full armor of God, so that you will be able to resist in the evil day, and having done everything, to stand firm. 14 Stand firm therefore, having girded your loins with truth, and having put on the breastplate of righteousness, 15 and having shod your feet with the preparation of the gospel of peace; 16 in addition to all, taking up the shield of faith with which you will be able to extinguish all the flaming arrows of the evil one. 17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God.

 

18 With all prayer and petition pray at all times in the Spirit, and with this in view, be on the alert with all perseverance and petition for all the saints, 19 and pray on my behalf, that utterance may be given to me in the opening of my mouth, to make known with boldness the mystery of the gospel, 20 for which I am an ambassador in chains; that in proclaiming it I may speak boldly, as I ought to speak.

 



 



 

15 And the evil spirit answered and said to them, “I recognize Jesus, and I know about Paul, but who are you?”

 

 

Jesus, please give us a Spirit of Love, Forgiveness and Reconciliation.

 

.

 

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