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What is the likely hood of all Iraqi Forces, Sunni, Shitte, Kurds actually succeeding with this Spring Offensive to retake Iraqi land lost/given to ISIS? You know given their religious divide. Could they ever get along? Do they have to segregate each Provence ? Why doesn't the U.S. run 200 bombing sorties a day? Starting by turning the ISIS t.v, radio, and propaganda building into sand.

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Why doesn't the U.S. run 200 bombing sorties a day? Starting by turning the ISIS t.v, radio, and propaganda building into sand.

 

Perhaps because you have missed the motive and goal of these rebels, and ISIS is useful

to those goals by those who create wars and who profit from them. Until we accept how

these matters work, and often have underlying targets from the planners who 'use' the

enemy to gain entrance to that target, we will continue to be misinformed by the media

and accept whatever they tell us. It is your choice, but it is obvious something other than

"war on terror" is going on and to ignore the obvious will continue to cause confusion.

 

Maybe we should ask Bashar Al Assad from Syria what is actually going on within his country,

because it is not as reported, and remember WHO it was that assisted in creating ISIS going back

to the crime commited in Libya, and we see now the fruit of that crime.

 

I agree with you that one would think we would be able to wipe them out...if not, then we must

take a look at the other options, and data available that suggests these 'rebels' are needful.

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Good post Jim...

 

Yes it has been pretty clear to me ever since we overthrew and created all the chaos in Libya. This is all a very deliberate plan to destabilize, weaken and divide the whole region. It just gets worse and more obvious as time goes by. I despise what our government is doing in our name. I feel much responsibility for the death, destruction and displacement of millions of innocent people that has been going on. I was oblivious to it all before Libya, apathetic, busy with life. I knew the wars in Iraq were NOT adding up to the narrative we were being told but I just brushed it off since there wasn't anything I could do about it anyways. I didn't feel responsible in any way. Then it hit me last year that I am responsible too (we all are) if I choose to stay blissfully unaware and just keep going along to get along, saying nothing. It is all of our responsibility to take notice of what is done in our name, get to the truth, denounce these crimes against humanity and do everything within our collective power to stop this insanity!

 

The truth is inconvenient but here is an excerpt and a link for anyone interested in what is coming out now...

official documentation about how our tax dollars are funding, training and supporting al-CIAda and ISIS directly from the policymakers and warmongers in our government...right from their own mouths.

 

America is Behind ISIS: Washington Confesses to Backing “Questionable Actors” in Syria

 

Excerpt from article:

 

"This latest attempt to overwhelm the Syrian people, its government, and its armed forces comes with several shocking revelations. Previously, veteran award-winning journalists foretold the coming conflict in Syria, warning how the US, Saudi Arabia, and Israel were openly planning to use Al Qaeda as a proxy force to overthrow Syria first, then Iran and how it would unfold into a cataclysmic sectarian war.

 

There were also signed and dated policy papers advocating the use of terrorism and the provocation of war to directly target Iran after Syria and Hezbollah had been sufficiently weakened.

 

However, now, there is a US Department of Defense (DoD) document confirming without doubt that the so-called “Syrian opposition” is Al Qaeda, including the so-called “Islamic State” (ISIS), and that the opposition’s supporters – the West, Turkey, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, and Qatar – specifically sought to establish safe havens in Iraq and eastern Syria, precisely where ISIS is now based.

 

America is Behind ISIS

 

Looking at maps recently produced by the Western media and Western policy think tanks, it can be seen clearly that Al Qaeda/ISIS is streaming out of NATO and US ally territory, forming up in these two safe havens, and aimed both at the Syrian government and Iran.

 

Despite the Western narrative of “moderate rebels,” the West itself has been increasingly admitting that such “rebels” do not exist. They also admit that to establish “stability,” they must begin openly working with “questionable actors.”

 

Michael O’Hanlon, a signatory of the Brookings Institution’s “Which Path to Persia?” policy paper calling for terrorism and intentional provocations to overthrow the government of Iran, stated in a USA Today op-ed titled, “Michael O’Hanlon: American boots needed in Syria,” that:

 

In the short term, this strategy requires an acceleration of our train and equip
for Syrian opposition fighters — including perhaps a bit less puritanical approach in who we are willing to work with. Most Syrian moderates are tired of waiting for us, or already dead given our delays in helping them. So we may have to tolerate working with some questionable actors to get things started.

 

“Working with some questionable actors,” is O’Hanlon and US policymakers’ way of saying they intend to provide open material support to terrorists, including Al Qaeda, as they’ve been covertly doing all along, and as was warned against as early as 2007 by Pulitzer Prize-winning journalist Seymour Hersh in his article, “The Redirection: Is the Administration’s new policy benefiting our enemies in the war on terrorism?” which explicitly stated (emphasis added):

 

To undermine Iran, which is predominantly Shiite, the Bush Administration has decided, in effect, to reconfigure its priorities in the Middle East. In Lebanon, the Administration has coöperated with Saudi Arabia’s government, which is Sunni, in clandestine operations that are intended to weaken Hezbollah, the Shiite organization that is backed by Iran. 
The U.S. has also taken part in clandestine operations aimed at Iran and its ally Syria. A by-product of these activities has been the bolstering of Sunni extremist groups that espouse a militant vision of Islam and are hostile to America and sympathetic to Al Qaeda.

 

If  Pulitzer Prize-winning journalists predicting verbatim the Syrian conflict and Western support for Al Qaeda terrorists years before these events unfolded, and US policymakers are now openly admitting they are willing to work with Al Qaeda isn’t convincing enough, perhaps a signed and dated Department of Defense document admitting as much is.

 

DoD Document Admits Plot to Carve Out Safe Haven for ISIS 

 

Judicial Watch, a US-based foundation seeking “transparency” in government, released a 7 page document dated 2012, detailing the background and status of the Syrian conflict. It admits that the Muslim Brotherhood and Al Qaeda form the basis of the “opposition.” It then admits that (emphasis added):

 

Development of the current events into proxy war: with support from Russia, China, and Iran, the regime is controlling the areas of influence along coastal territories (Tartus and Latakia), and is fiercely defending Homs, which is considered the primary transportation route in Syria. On the other hand, opposition forces are trying to control the eastern areas (Hasaka and Der Zor), adjacent to the western Iraqi provinces (Mosul and Anbar), in addition to neighboring Turkish borders. 
Western countries, the Gulf States and Turkey are supporting these efforts.
  

 

It also admits that terrorists are entering Syria from Iraq, hardly what one could call a “civil war,” and clearly instead an invasion.

 

The document also admits that (emphasis added):

 

The opposition forces will try to use the Iraqi territory as a safe haven for its forces taking advantage of the sympathy of the Iraqi border population, meanwhile trying to recruit fighters and train them on the Iraqi side, in addition to harboring refugees (Syria).         


If the situation unravels 
there is the possibility of establishing a declared or undeclared Salafist principality in eastern Syria (Hasaka and Der Zor), and this is exactly what the supporting powers to the opposition want, in order to isolate the Syrian regime, which is considered t he strategic depth of the Shia Expansion (Iraq and Iran).

 

That “Salafist principality” mentioned by the DoD in 2012 is of course now known as the “Islamic State.” The DoD at the time openly admitted that the opposition’s foreign sponsors supported the creation of such a principality, and clearly ISIS must have had such support to maintain its hold on vast expanses of territory in both Syria and Iraq, while propping up a military machine capable of fighting the combined forces of Iran, Iraq, Syria, and Lebanon. Indeed, the DoD’s admissions in this document explain precisely how ISIS has been able to perpetuate its activities throughout the region – with “Western countries, the Gulf States, and Turkey” supporting these efforts.

 

Narratives of a US “war on the Islamic State” are meant clearly to obscure this admitted and documented conspiracy, and serve as a means for US troops to directly violate Syrian airspace and territory incrementally until US forces are able to openly begin dismantling the Syrian military and government directly."

 

Link For Full Article: http://www.syriahr.com/en/2015/05/america-is-behind-isis-washington-confesses-to-backing-questionable-actors-in-syria/

 

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They say that over 75% of the bombing runs do not drop because there is no intelligence on the ground telling them which are the bad guys!

 

ISIS fighters & the defense forces all look alike! A rag-tag collect of rag-heads carrying AK-47's.

 

Iraq is waiting for someone to come in and save them without cost to the government or the country!

 

I say let them kill each other & we can deal with whoever takes over after that!

 

50 million people threatened by a few thousand terrorist! WOW :(

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Good post Jim...

 

Yes it has been pretty clear to me ever since we overthrew and created all the chaos in Libya. This is all a very deliberate plan to destabilize, weaken and divide the whole region. It just gets worse and more obvious as time goes by. I despise what our government is doing in our name. I feel much responsibility for the death, destruction and displacement of millions of innocent people that has been going on. I was oblivious to it all before Libya, apathetic, busy with life. I knew the wars in Iraq were NOT adding up to the narrative we were being told but I just brushed it off since there wasn't anything I could do about it anyways. I didn't feel responsible in any way. Then it hit me last year that I am responsible too (we all are) if I choose to stay blissfully unaware and just keep going along to get along, saying nothing. It is all of our responsibility to take notice of what is done in our name, get to the truth, denounce these crimes against humanity and do everything within our collective power to stop this insanity!

 

The truth is inconvenient but here is an excerpt and a link for anyone interested in what is coming out now...

official documentation about how our tax dollars are funding, training and supporting al-CIAda and ISIS directly from the policymakers and warmongers in our government...right from their own mouths.

 

America is Behind ISIS: Washington Confesses to Backing “Questionable Actors” in Syria

 

Excerpt from article:

 

"This latest attempt to overwhelm the Syrian people, its government, and its armed forces comes with several shocking revelations. Previously, veteran award-winning journalists foretold the coming conflict in Syria, warning how the US, Saudi Arabia, and Israel were openly planning to use Al Qaeda as a proxy force to overthrow Syria first, then Iran and how it would unfold into a cataclysmic sectarian war.

 

There were also signed and dated policy papers advocating the use of terrorism and the provocation of war to directly target Iran after Syria and Hezbollah had been sufficiently weakened.

 

However, now, there is a US Department of Defense (DoD) document confirming without doubt that the so-called “Syrian opposition” is Al Qaeda, including the so-called “Islamic State” (ISIS), and that the opposition’s supporters – the West, Turkey, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, and Qatar – specifically sought to establish safe havens in Iraq and eastern Syria, precisely where ISIS is now based.

 

America is Behind ISIS

 

Looking at maps recently produced by the Western media and Western policy think tanks, it can be seen clearly that Al Qaeda/ISIS is streaming out of NATO and US ally territory, forming up in these two safe havens, and aimed both at the Syrian government and Iran.

 

Despite the Western narrative of “moderate rebels,” the West itself has been increasingly admitting that such “rebels” do not exist. They also admit that to establish “stability,” they must begin openly working with “questionable actors.”

 

Michael O’Hanlon, a signatory of the Brookings Institution’s “Which Path to Persia?” policy paper calling for terrorism and intentional provocations to overthrow the government of Iran, stated in a USA Today op-ed titled, “Michael O’Hanlon: American boots needed in Syria,” that:

 

In the short term, this strategy requires an acceleration of our train and equip
for Syrian opposition fighters — including perhaps a bit less puritanical approach in who we are willing to work with. Most Syrian moderates are tired of waiting for us, or already dead given our delays in helping them. So we may have to tolerate working with some questionable actors to get things started.

 

“Working with some questionable actors,” is O’Hanlon and US policymakers’ way of saying they intend to provide open material support to terrorists, including Al Qaeda, as they’ve been covertly doing all along, and as was warned against as early as 2007 by Pulitzer Prize-winning journalist Seymour Hersh in his article, “The Redirection: Is the Administration’s new policy benefiting our enemies in the war on terrorism?” which explicitly stated (emphasis added):

 

To undermine Iran, which is predominantly Shiite, the Bush Administration has decided, in effect, to reconfigure its priorities in the Middle East. In Lebanon, the Administration has coöperated with Saudi Arabia’s government, which is Sunni, in clandestine operations that are intended to weaken Hezbollah, the Shiite organization that is backed by Iran. 
The U.S. has also taken part in clandestine operations aimed at Iran and its ally Syria. A by-product of these activities has been the bolstering of Sunni extremist groups that espouse a militant vision of Islam and are hostile to America and sympathetic to Al Qaeda.

 

If  Pulitzer Prize-winning journalists predicting verbatim the Syrian conflict and Western support for Al Qaeda terrorists years before these events unfolded, and US policymakers are now openly admitting they are willing to work with Al Qaeda isn’t convincing enough, perhaps a signed and dated Department of Defense document admitting as much is.

 

DoD Document Admits Plot to Carve Out Safe Haven for ISIS 

 

Judicial Watch, a US-based foundation seeking “transparency” in government, released a 7 page document dated 2012, detailing the background and status of the Syrian conflict. It admits that the Muslim Brotherhood and Al Qaeda form the basis of the “opposition.” It then admits that (emphasis added):

 

Development of the current events into proxy war: with support from Russia, China, and Iran, the regime is controlling the areas of influence along coastal territories (Tartus and Latakia), and is fiercely defending Homs, which is considered the primary transportation route in Syria. On the other hand, opposition forces are trying to control the eastern areas (Hasaka and Der Zor), adjacent to the western Iraqi provinces (Mosul and Anbar), in addition to neighboring Turkish borders. 
Western countries, the Gulf States and Turkey are supporting these efforts.
  

 

It also admits that terrorists are entering Syria from Iraq, hardly what one could call a “civil war,” and clearly instead an invasion.

 

The document also admits that (emphasis added):

 

The opposition forces will try to use the Iraqi territory as a safe haven for its forces taking advantage of the sympathy of the Iraqi border population, meanwhile trying to recruit fighters and train them on the Iraqi side, in addition to harboring refugees (Syria).         

If the situation unravels 
there is the possibility of establishing a declared or undeclared Salafist principality in eastern Syria (Hasaka and Der Zor), and this is exactly what the supporting powers to the opposition want, in order to isolate the Syrian regime, which is considered t he strategic depth of the Shia Expansion (Iraq and Iran).

 

That “Salafist principality” mentioned by the DoD in 2012 is of course now known as the “Islamic State.” The DoD at the time openly admitted that the opposition’s foreign sponsors supported the creation of such a principality, and clearly ISIS must have had such support to maintain its hold on vast expanses of territory in both Syria and Iraq, while propping up a military machine capable of fighting the combined forces of Iran, Iraq, Syria, and Lebanon. Indeed, the DoD’s admissions in this document explain precisely how ISIS has been able to perpetuate its activities throughout the region – with “Western countries, the Gulf States, and Turkey” supporting these efforts.

 

Narratives of a US “war on the Islamic State” are meant clearly to obscure this admitted and documented conspiracy, and serve as a means for US troops to directly violate Syrian airspace and territory incrementally until US forces are able to openly begin dismantling the Syrian military and government directly."

 

Link For Full Article: http://www.syriahr.com/en/2015/05/america-is-behind-isis-washington-confesses-to-backing-questionable-actors-in-syria/

 

 

Thank you Maggie, excellent data, and nothing more to say. This has been evident

for several years.

 

I hope you are doing well!  :)

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Opinion piece................thank god everyone has one, but that doesn't make it true. Those that believe this also are the ones that applaud Barry every time he apologizes to the world on our behalf........................Sad when our POTUS dispises the country he represents. 

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Opinion piece................thank god everyone has one, but that doesn't make it true. Those that believe this also are the ones that applaud Barry every time he apologizes to the world on our behalf........................Sad when our POTUS dispises the country he represents. 

 

Hardly Caz...it's NOT an 'opinion piece' when there is OFFICIAL DOCUMENTATION from the guberment to back it up.

 

As for those who have pulled their heads out of the sand...We know that when Obama 'apologizes to the world'...

it's a bunch of lies and a lame attempt to cover his, and all the others involved, criminal activities. It doesn't work.

 

It's really NOT that hard to figure out Caz....give it a whirl sometime.

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Great thread Kevin.

 

Now we need  spread the word to every living soul that will listen to us. Especially LE and the military.  Be relentless as this is OUR  country and it  is for " we the people"  and not for me the president

 

Good to hear from  you Maggie. Its been a while.

 

Thanks for info Jim!!

Edited by SocalDinar
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Maggie,

"official documentation" from the guberment...............lol really Maggie?  As we all know the guberment never lies............lol

Not saying your wrong but putting faith into anything the gov says is crazy! 

Edited by caz1104
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And by the way I gave it a "whirl" ....... and found it's better that I don't rely on others to form my opinions. Give that a "whirl" it's NOT that diffiCULT. And even tho I seldom agree with your views, it's good to see u posting again.-Peace 

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Maggie,

"official documentation" from the guberment...............lol really Maggie?  As we all know the guberment never lies............lol

Not saying your wrong but putting faith into anything the gov says is crazy! 

 

Caz...The documentation that was obtained in the articles above was NOT intended for us to see or know about.

 

Can't you see the difference between the propaganda we are fed daily and information that shows completely different motivations and intent behind the all the lies and confusion? Not saying we know even a small fraction of what it is that the guberment is doing. It is BECAUSE I don't believe them that I look for other alternatives to the MSM,,,to try and gather more accurate information...and that helps a lot in seeing a heck of a lot more than we would otherwise. The internet has become a great tool in that regard.

 

 

And by the way I gave it a "whirl" ....... and found it's better that I don't rely on others to form my opinions. Give that a "whirl" it's NOT that diffiCULT. And even tho I seldom agree with your views, it's good to see u posting again.-Peace 

 

Please DON"T rely on others opinions...always look for yourself. Sorry Caz but I just don't get the sense you are willing to look.

 

I don't care if you agree with my views or not...what I do want is for Americans to CARE enough to get to the truth.

 

Can we agree that the US Coalition over in Iraq and Syria are not there to do what we have been told? Before you answer please read both articles above^^^ and then try looking for some information on your own to refute them or back them up....that thing called discernment. Otherwise you are just adding yet another (uninformed) 'opinion'. I contributed with the best I could find in regard to the original post...how about you contribute too?

 

Prove Me Wrong...That You Actually Care Enough To Look Into This Yourself.- Peace Caz

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Correction:

I was the only one to bring in an article on this thread...there is another thread that was started out with a similar article.

 

Check it out Caz...Obama ordered CIA to train ISIS jihadists: Declassified documents

 
BTW NYK This is a good thread... Thank You :)
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Maggie,

LOL please let me know when u find the whole truth. And because I don't cut & paste, my opinion(uninformed) is worth less than yours.............please!  That doesn't mean I don't research on my own. Your LOPster mentality(it is because you say so)  is sickening. My point is NO ONE(outside of those involved) knows the WHOLE truth. So you can continue with your informed(sic) opinions and believe them to be true. I will continue to read as much as I can on a continuous basis and know that even when I think I have all the answers there is always more to the story. 

 

I do believe our government like all (imo) act in ways that they believe are advantageous to them,whether it be strategic, economic, or politically  driven. We are no worse or better than any other. I do choose to believe that while not perfect our gov/country is still the best option to follow. The best part is that I have the option of leaving this country & re-establishing my self somewhere else. And to criticize our actions/intentions as a whole is not good(imo). Especially if one doesn't know what our counterparts true intentions goals are. I will criticize individual leaders & gov on occasion if I believe their actions to be detrimental to our nation as a whole, but like I said while not perfect IMO its still the best of whats available. With no articles attached, and uninformed as they may be(sic), these are my opinions-Peace 

Edited by caz1104
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Maggie,

LOL please let me know when u find the whole truth. And because I don't cut & paste, my opinion(uninformed) is worth less than yours.............please!  That doesn't mean I don't research on my own. Your LOPster mentality(it is because you say so)  is sickening. My point is NO ONE(outside of those involved) knows the WHOLE truth. So you can continue with your informed(sic) opinions and believe them to be true. I will continue to read as much as I can on a continuous basis and know that even when I think I have all the answers there is always more to the story. 

 

I do believe our government like all (imo) act in ways that they believe are advantageous to them,whether it be strategic, economic, or politically  driven. We are no worse or better than any other. I do choose to believe that while not perfect our gov/country is still the best option to follow. The best part is that I have the option of leaving this country & re-establishing my self somewhere else. And to criticize our actions/intentions as a whole is not good(imo). Especially if one doesn't know what our counterparts true intentions goals are. I will criticize individual leaders & gov on occasion if I believe their actions to be detrimental to our nation as a whole, but like I said while not perfect IMO its still the best of whats available. With no articles attached, and uninformed as they may be(sic), these are my opinions-Peace 

 

Your post doesn't reflect whether you believe our guberment trained, armed and supported ISIS...or not.

 

I have seen plenty that says they have and still continue to do so. Our government is currently training yet  more "moderate rebels" in Turkey, Jordan, Qatar and Saudi. Their goal is to pump out 5000 'moderate rebels' a year over the next three years....All while knowing that the 'moderate rebels' that we trained over the past 4 years either were killed or joined ISIS. To me THAT is sick...

 

Knowing the difference between right and wrong... and knowing the total chaos, death, and destruction that ISIS has brought to so many innocent people...as an American I am going denounce those policies and actions loud and clear...

 

'NOT IN MY NAME'!!!

 

Please spare me the love it or leave it rhetoric....last I checked, I still have the right to speak out against this and rightly so.

 

You go ahead and trot on your merry way Caz...tra-la-la-la-la...'America is the best',..'I don't know nuttin'...'Whatever the guberment wants to do...well they have their 'reasons'...'It's not for me to know'...'America works just fine for ME'...'America is the best'...'Even if it's true that our guberment created and still supports ISIS...well that's okay by me'...'don't wanna think about the millions of innocent people affected by our policies and what my tax dollars pay for'...America still works for me'...

 

So that is where our 'opinions' differ Caz...you and a lot of others share the same view on this...does that make you feel better?

 

Have a lovely day Caz ~ Peace

(to say that sounds pretty empty and shallow right now)

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LOL!!!

 

Your Moral High Horse is laughable. My point is still the same, there are in my opinion way to many layers to state one way or another completely. I don't think we will ever know what/why/when/where our gov or any gov does what it/they do with 100% certainty.  As for your "love it or leave it" statement, if you read my statement I was speaking for myself and no else.

 

Those of you who wish to condemn our country at drop of the hat, remind me of a anything/everything must be a conspiracy group. Don't look now but I think someone is watching/following you. 

 

I'm glad "America works for u" - overall I 100% agree 

 

And when I say "peace", my intentions is to say no malice/hate intended, nothing more.

 

Peace

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