Collectivists Hate Individuality

[thegente]

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-05-13/collectivists-hate-individuality-tribalism-and-fast-and-furious-7

 

 

 

THIS IS AN EXCELLENT ARTICLE:   Collectivists Hate Individuality, Tribalism, And 'Fast And Furious 7'?

 on 05/13/2015 21:00 -0400
 

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Submitted by Brandon Smith via Alt-Market.com,

Sometimes in the liberty movement — with discussions of potential collapse, war, revolution, social destabilization, etc. — it is easy to get so caught up in the peripheral conflict between the elites and the citizenry that we forget what the whole thing is really about. That is to say, we tend to overlook the very core of the conflict that is shaping our epoch.

Some would say that it is a simple matter of good versus evil. I don’t necessarily disagree, but good and evil are not defined methodologies; rather, they are inherent archetypes — facts born in the minds and hearts of all men. It’s a gift of comprehension from something greater than ourselves. They are felt, rather than defined, and attempts by institutions (religious, scientific, legal or otherwise) to force morality away from intuitive reason and into a realm of artificial hierarchical and mathematical standards tend to lead only to even more imbalance, destruction, innocent deaths and general immorality.

There have been many nightmare regimes throughout history that have claimed to understand and obey moral “laws” and standards while at the same time having no personal or spiritual connection to those standards. In other words, some of the most heinous acts of immorality are often stamped with the approval of supposedly moral social and governmental institutions.

This is why a person who calls himself a moral Christian, a moral Muslim, a moral atheist, a moral legislator, a moral conservative, a moral liberal, a moral social justice warrior, etc. is not necessarily a person who ultimately acts with moral conviction. It is not enough for one to memorize and follow the code of a belief system or legal system blindly. One must also understand the tenets of inborn natural law and of the human soul that make those codes meaningful (if they have retained any meaning), or he will eventually fall prey to the vicious calamities of dogma and the collective shadow.

If I were to examine the core methodologies that are at odds in our society today, I would have to say that the whole fight comes down not only to good versus evil, but to collectivism versus individualism. The same demands of understanding also apply to this dichotomy.

Nearly all human beings naturally gravitate toward social structures. This is not under debate. The best of us seek to work with others for the betterment of our own position in terms of survival and success, but also the betterment of our species as a whole, if possible. Beyond this, people often find solace and a sense of epiphany when discovering connections to others; the act of recognition and shared experience that is in itself a religious experience. This is what I would call “community,” as opposed to “collectivism.”

Collectivism is a bastardization and manipulation of the inherent desire most people have to build connections to those around them. It takes the concept of community to the extreme end of the spectrum, and in the process, removes all that was originally good about it. In a collectivist system, individualism becomes a threat and a detriment to the functionality of society. In a community, individualism is seen as a valuable resource that brings a diversity of ideas, skills and unique views, making the group stronger. Collectivism believes the hive mind is more efficient. Community believes voluntary action and individual achievement makes society healthier in the long run.

Our culture in general today is being bombarded with messages that aggrandize collectivism and stigmatize community and individualism. This is not by mere chance; it is in fact a program of indoctrination. I came across a rather strange and in some ways hilarious example of this while sifting through the propaganda platform known as Reuters.

As most liberty movement activists are well aware, Reuters is a longtime haven for Fabian socialists who despise honest reporting (to them media is a means of controlling the populace, not informing it) and who consistently inject concepts of collectivist (i.e., globalist) ideology into their articles.

The Reuters opinion piece linked here and written by Lynn Stuart Parramore presents itself as a kind of social examination of film and its reflection of the decline of American civilization. Rather oddly, the film chosen as a litmus test was “Fast And Furious 7.” Yes, that’s right. The “Fast and Furious” franchise apparently contains social commentary so disturbing to Reuters’ contributing “cultural theorists” that they felt compelled to write a short thesis on it.

First, I would like to point out that when I first read the article the original title was “‘Fast decline of postwar America & furious desire to cling to ‘family.’”

It appears that Reuters has since “amended” the title to stand out a little less as a collectivist expose. Just to be clear, I have no interest in discussing the content of the “Furious 7″ film. My commentary will focus not on the film but on Reuters’ commentary regarding the film...if that makes sense to you.

So what about the newest Furious film has the collectivists so concerned? As the article states, “something alarming lurks at the heart of ‘Furious 7.'” The film’s depiction of America as an economically wounded nation in which good men cannot find a means to make an honest and adequate living doesn’t seem to bother them as much as the response of the main characters to such circumstances. The article almost revels in the postwar degradation of American living standards, outlining how fiscal decline has led to the disruption of the American family and posits that the golden era of the 1950’s economic boom is a relic, erased by the rise of a severe “haves and have-nots” division in the American class sphere. This is, of course, a decidedly simplistic view that appeals more to Marxists than to anyone with true knowledge of the breakdown of the U.S.

Reuters takes issue with “Furious 7″ because of what it refers to as the “1950’s fantasy” narrative it clings to, in which the heroes long for a return to the middle-class dream, turning away from the corrupt structure of the system and reverting to the “tribalism” of families and posses. The “myth of the posse,” they state, “ignores the interconnectedness of the broader society” and “the idea of a common culture of citizenship recedes into the background, as does faith in a society based on shared principles of justice.”

I find this conclusion rather fascinating in its collectivist bias. We are led to believe by Parramore’s article that it is the “Ayn Randian” code of contemporary economics and market efficiency that has led America astray. To put it simply, the free market did this to us.

This is the great lie promoted ad nauseam by collectivists today — collectivists who would like to divert blame for economic failure on more individualistic market ideals. The reality is that America has NOT supported free market methods for at least a century. The advent of parasitic central banking as an economic core in the Federal Reserve and constant government intervention and regulation that have only destroyed small business rather than kept large businesses in check has caused the very negative financial environment that Parramore at least recognizes as the source of our ills. Corporations themselves exist only because of government regulatory license, after all, but you won’t ever catch Reuters criticizing that.

It was collectivism and the rise of the statist model that bled America dry, not free-market methods that have not existed in this country for more than 100 years. The delusion that free markets are the problem was the same delusion that helped bring down Occupy Wall Street; the movement failed in part because its foundational philosophy was built on disinformation that rang false with otherwise sympathetic people.

So an action movie presents a competing model to collectivism, because collectivism has always been the problem, despite what Reuters has to say. That model is a return to classic human community in the form of family and “tribalism” where regular individuals matter, a point the Reuters article subtly mocks as a “fantasy.” But here we find the collectivists using the kind of rhetoric one would come to expect from social Marxists. The article continues:

"When the personal posse replaces civic spirit, and the us-against-them mentality prevails, monsters can breed…"

 

"This is what is now happening in many corners of the world, where neglected groups have formed posses positively bloodthirsty in their quest to assert that they matter on the global stage to show they are not just victims of a rigged game…"

I’m not exactly sure what “bloodthirsty groups” Parramore is referring to as “posses,” but I suspect this is a reference to the rise of ISIS, among others. And here we find the Fabian socialist-style propaganda at play.

You see, the Fabian ideology is the driving force behind globalization — the same globalization that triggered the vast downward slide in American prosperity; the same globalization that has generated anger and dissension among the downtrodden and poverty-stricken; the same globalization that has created artificial economic interdependency among nations and the domino effect of fiscal crisis around the globe; and the same globalization that has led to the predominance of covert agencies, covert agencies which have been funding “bloodthirsty posses” like ISIS for decades. And the source philosophy behind globalization has always been collectivism — the “interconnectedness of broader society” that Parramore proclaims as lost in the pages of the “Furious 7″ screenplay.

Parramore ends with a stark warning to us all:

"… a return to tribal instincts and the letting go of the broader common bonds and the welfare of the greater human family has a dark side. It is ultimately a dangerous road to travel."

Those of us who support the idea of localized community (i.e., tribalism) and the value of the individual over the arbitrary collective are, supposedly, playing with fire; and we should be scared, very scared. We would not want to be labeled as “bloodthirsty monsters” hell-bent on disturbing the tranquility of the “greater human family.” Oh, boy.

When I read this kind of agenda-based garbage, I am reminded of the insanity of slightly more open social Marxists, such as feminists, who have through dishonorable tactics conjured an atmosphere of collective and legal pressure designed not to present a better argument, but to make all opposing arguments a sin against the group. That is to say, social Marxists do not have a better argument, so their only option is to make rational counterarguments socially taboo or even illegal.

If you want to know where social Marxism (collectivism) is headed, this is it: the labeling of individualistic philosophies as dangerous thought crimes and tribal communities as time bombs waiting to explode in the face of the wider global village. They desperately hope to conquer the world by dictating not only national boundaries and civil liberties, but the very moral code by which society and individuals function. They wish to bypass natural law with fear, fear that the collective will find you abhorrent and barbaric if you do not believe exactly as they believe. Individualism will one day be the new misogyny.

Think of it this way: If an undoubtedly forgettable movie like “Furious 7″ can’t even portray a fictional step away from the abyss of collectivist cultism without a prophecy of doom from Reuters, then is anyone really safe from these lunatics?

 

[Thaiexpat]

Excellent read. Appreciate you bringing this over and how it is so true today. This "sickness" has been going on for a long time, as stated in the article. The idea that I am beholden to follow a set of rules, outside of my "tribal" affiliation is so widely accepted now that questioning it marks you as a "kook" or "anti-social nutcase". I cant tell you how many times I have argued these points with so-called "well-educated" types who can't see how their thinking and acceptance to collectivism has destroyed America (or the rest of the free world). My question to them, which NO ONE has been able to answer with any sort of FACTS, is this: What facts do you rely upon to show that the code, regulations or statues apply to me? Show me a FACT. There is not one. Their counter would be use the non-sense of "Well, if we didn't have these rules and if you werent obligated to follow them, then you could get away with murder or the like...". This statist reply doesn't address the real issue of from whence did I incur the obligation to follow their rules, ideas or political positions. If you have no authority over me as an individual, how did you MAGICALLY obtain dictate powers over me because you were "elected"? Today, we see the state enforcing rules/regulations that limit our freedoms as people-born-free without an obligation to the state UNLESS we CHOOSE to be subjected to its whims. For example, when I joined the Marines, I signed/took an oath to follow their rules. When I broke them, I found myself in the Red-line Brig and doing 30-days Correctional Custody. However, outside of this and a few other conditions, in which, I affirmed my desire to be subjected to some set of rules, I have made no other commitment to anything. I don't need a law telling me "don't hurt other. Don't steal or don't kill someone". A moral "law" is found in the individual's moral compass. Only those without such, need such regulation, rules and governance. It burns me up to see the state (and its boot-lickers) telling a baker "You aren't allowed to refuse making a cake for a XXX couple". From where did the state get such power over the individual? How can the "State" tell us what we can do or not do with our bodies, our opinions, our livelihood.....? For the good of society, will be the response.

Well, I've ranted enough. How free are you if you live in abject fear of the state or under the opinion of the public which supports that tyranny? We were born-free without any obligation to the state. Dunno, just saying....Peace

Edited May 14, 2015 by Thaiexpat

[thegente]

Very well said TXP! It burns me up as well...people are so conditioned to accept what the so-called authorities tell them is "the law" they simply don't know HOW to think any other way anymore. When I try to engage some people on certain subject, I usually get the glazed over "deer in the headlights" look, or outright hostility/anger, with them spewing things like "you're un-American or "If you don't like America, move to Russia" memes. I thought America was supposed to be ABOUT dissent and individual rights over the so-called "collective"?

Really amazing how many have been absolutely brainwashed by a steady diet of propaganda and media distractions.

[Whatshername]

"We are led to believe by Parramore’s article that it is the “Ayn Randian” code of contemporary economics and market efficiency that has led America astray. To put it simply, the free market did this to us."

ATLAS SHRUGGED... Now Non-Fiction

Great article! Thanks Gente

[thegente]

Your very welcome Whats!! We do not have a "free market" we have Corporate Fascism and Crony Capitalism, that is rigged from top to bottom for the elites and their puppets to gain wealth. They are what is and has been destroying a powerhouse economy for the last century. Nothing more than parasites living off the sweat of others, bankers and politicians produce NOTHING.

Edited May 14, 2015 by thegente

[Jaxinjersey]

Who is John Galt?  What else is there to say?!!!

[Jim1cor13]

Excellent read. Appreciate you bringing this over and how it is so true today. This "sickness" has been going on for a long time, as stated in the article. The idea that I am beholden to follow a set of rules, outside of my "tribal" affiliation is so widely accepted now that questioning it marks you as a "kook" or "anti-social nutcase". I cant tell you how many times I have argued these points with so-called "well-educated" types who can't see how their thinking and acceptance to collectivism has destroyed America (or the rest of the free world). My question to them, which NO ONE has been able to answer with any sort of FACTS, is this: What facts do you rely upon to show that the code, regulations or statues apply to me? Show me a FACT. There is not one. Their counter would be use the non-sense of "Well, if we didn't have these rules and if you werent obligated to follow them, then you could get away with murder or the like...". This statist reply doesn't address the real issue of from whence did I incur the obligation to follow their rules, ideas or political positions. If you have no authority over me as an individual, how did you MAGICALLY obtain dictate powers over me because you were "elected"? Today, we see the state enforcing rules/regulations that limit our freedoms as people-born-free without an obligation to the state UNLESS we CHOOSE to be subjected to its whims. For example, when I joined the Marines, I signed/took an oath to follow their rules. When I broke them, I found myself in the Red-line Brig and doing 30-days Correctional Custody. However, outside of this and a few other conditions, in which, I affirmed my desire to be subjected to some set of rules, I have made no other commitment to anything. I don't need a law telling me "don't hurt other. Don't steal or don't kill someone". A moral "law" is found in the individual's moral compass. Only those without such, need such regulation, rules and governance. It burns me up to see the state (and its boot-lickers) telling a baker "You aren't allowed to refuse making a cake for a XXX couple". From where did the state get such power over the individual? How can the "State" tell us what we can do or not do with our bodies, our opinions, our livelihood.....? For the good of society, will be the response.

Well, I've ranted enough. How free are you if you live in abject fear of the state or under the opinion of the public which supports that tyranny? We were born-free without any obligation to the state. Dunno, just saying....Peace

 

Well stated Doc, thank you for that. Fear is the order of the day, being pumped into

peoples living rooms daily, after awhile it takes its intended toll, and creates a willing

participant in the giving away individual sovereignty and liberties via propaganda and

fabrications. We see it works well unfortunately. Thank you for your thoughts Doc,

much appreciated and spot on. I hope you are doing well!

 

Great article thegente. The handlers do not want individuality no more than a religious

or political institution desires those who can think for themselves...it becomes a threat

to how they master their subjects who they think for. You know how it goes...if you do not

follow the majority thinking, you will likely get attacked.

 

Have a good day thegente.

Edited May 14, 2015 by Jim1cor13

[Thaiexpat]

JimCor, gente and others who see the light. Great discussion. Wish there were more folks like you TRUE Americans. I used to comment a lot in the forums, but cut-back to limit the frustration I felt when reading the many comments from so-called patriotic members. So many people still FOOLISHLY believe there is a difference in the 2-part system or that the system can be changed by voting. Really now?  Hasnt the past decade removed this mental block yet? As another Libertarian has stated so well, "Have you had enough of the a$$ raping, America?" When will it stop? When will the system be dismantled? Not until the very idea that the state is superior to the individual is crushed will we see it happen.

Again, for those who doubt what I say, I ask this simple question:

How and where did the state get power over me?

The simplest and most common answer is: "Well, you's a citizen, aint you?"

Define citizen. Just remember the OBLIGATION must be MUTUAL. I am obligate to follow the "law" in EXCHANGE for security/protection. This is the definition. Does the government guarantee my security/protection? Can I sue the government if I get hurt for breach of contract? Certainly not. therefore, there is NO obligation for anyone to follow the political entity called government unless you freely choose to. Yes, the courts have ruled on this issue and have clearly stated the government has NO OBLIGATION to provide even the most basic of services including security.

So who should I follow? This is where the clan/kinship/family or the local community comes in. Follow your parents, listen to your family members, give regards to those older in your community (however, having grey-hair doesnt mean you actually deserve any respect), consider what your close friends say or, for those who have served in combat, those brothers-in-arms: for they are interested in your well-being (usually! Hahaha), not some faceless, nameless statist. Back in the day, people focused on THEIR community-did things for free, built the barn, drew in the crops-all thru VOLUNTEERISM. Today, it is "either pay up to the GOD of the STATE or face the full WRATH of this god".

Again, HOW did I succumb to the State's will? Where is the contract? There is NONE and NO FACTS to support the idea I am subjected to the wims of the state. AND, neither is anyone else, but thru your acceptance of something that you think is true. "I am citizen (Ah, sorry. NO YOU ARE NOT), so I must offer allegiance and fidelity to the same. Never mind, the state doesnt have to show me the same.....". You should be loyal to yourself, your clan/family and to your friends This is REAL. This is human and this is living free. part 2 of the rant! Sorry!  

[Jim1cor13]

 

So many people still FOOLISHLY believe there is a difference in the 2-part system or that the system can be changed by voting. Really now?  Hasnt the past decade removed this mental block yet? As another Libertarian has stated so well, "Have you had enough of the a$$ raping, America?"

 

Thank you Thaiexpat. Appreciate your perspective, and no need to apologize

my friend. Truth is truth, and most people truly are NOT interested in truth,

only those who agree with their news programmed views and opinions. I wish

it were different, but I am thankful more are taking notice to the very things you

discussed. You have a good understanding, you know how the game is being played

and you are not afraid to say it, I respect that very much!

 

You are right, no such thing as 2 party system, JUST a system that is hell bent on

continuing its fraud against the people, no matter who is called "president". It is a

"ruse", and I cannot understand how most buy into it thinking anything will change.

 

I posted a video the other night in political section titled "what do they want?" along with

a few questions I thought were pertinent, but it appears too many are perhaps unable

to think outside the party line, or state propaganda system, i don't know, but we MUST

start thinking for ourselves, because we see what happens when we allow someone else

to do that...we end up a slave of the state and the feds, nothing normal about that at all.

 

Perhaps the trick is the "strawman" issue, the person represented by the all capital letters

of ones name, the one who is registered at birth and monetized like everyone else? I don't

know, but I do know we give our consent to these issues when we fail to think and ask questions,

and dig for answers as best one can.

 

All one can do is encourage people to think, I don't care if someone agrees with me or not, i just

try to get family and friends to THINK for themselves and ask questions so they can form their own

understanding instead of anothers version. I do not push my thinking on them, I just ask them

questions until I receive the blank stare, but at least they do begin to wonder, and that is hopefully

the start of them looking outside of the illusion for themselves. They do not need to know what I

think...they need to KNOW what they think and why.

 

Not easy, and most are not interested, so maybe that is part of the reason we see what we see...

easy targets and boxed in by those who think they know what is best for us.

 

 

Until we stop believing the official narratives and start doing our own due diligence, the box

remains closed upon us, and we continue to believe someone will save us from ourselves,

and history shows this is an illusion, and the state and feds certainly love to make us believe

otherwise, even though it should be clear it is a lie.

 

Thank you Doc...always enjoy your input and perspectives, and how you are able to THINK.

 

Have a good day!

Jim

[Whatshername]

Thank you Thaiexpat. Appreciate your perspective, and no need to apologize

my friend. Truth is truth, and most people truly are NOT interested in truth,

only those who agree with their news programmed views and opinions. I wish

it were different, but I am thankful more are taking notice to the very things you

discussed. You have a good understanding, you know how the game is being played

and you are not afraid to say it, I respect that very much!

 

You are right, no such thing as 2 party system, JUST a system that is hell bent on

continuing its fraud against the people, no matter who is called "president". It is a

"ruse", and I cannot understand how most buy into it thinking anything will change.

 

I posted a video the other night in political section titled "what do they want?" along with

a few questions I thought were pertinent, but it appears too many are perhaps unable

to think outside the party line, or state propaganda system, i don't know, but we MUST

start thinking for ourselves, because we see what happens when we allow someone else

to do that...we end up a slave of the state and the feds, nothing normal about that at all.

 

Perhaps the trick is the "strawman" issue, the person represented by the all capital letters

of ones name, the one who is registered at birth and monetized like everyone else? I don't

know, but I do know we give our consent to these issues when we fail to think and ask questions,

and dig for answers as best one can.

 

All one can do is encourage people to think, I don't care if someone agrees with me or not, i just

try to get family and friends to THINK for themselves and ask questions so they can form their own

understanding instead of anothers version. I do not push my thinking on them, I just ask them

questions until I receive the blank stare, but at least they do begin to wonder, and that is hopefully

the start of them looking outside of the illusion for themselves. They do not need to know what I

think...they need to KNOW what they think and why.

 

Not easy, and most are not interested, so maybe that is part of the reason we see what we see...

easy targets and boxed in by those who think they know what is best for us.

 

 

Until we stop believing the official narratives and start doing our own due diligence, the box

remains closed upon us, and we continue to believe someone will save us from ourselves,

and history shows this is an illusion, and the state and feds certainly love to make us believe

otherwise, even though it should be clear it is a lie.

 

Thank you Doc...always enjoy your input and perspectives, and how you are able to THINK.

 

Have a good day!

Jim

Jim... May I ask, are you a sovereign? Do you pay income and property taxes, use banks, pay fines if caught speeding? Do you vote?

I have done a lot of research on the STRAWMAN theory... fascinating! And it makes a lot of sense until it comes down to practice. It's a legal nightmare. Have you, or do you know anyone who has successfully navigated that... path?

You keep saying "... most people truly are NOT interested in truth,

only those who agree with their news programmed views and opinions..."

While I would agree that it's nearly impossible to tell the difference (if there is any) between the "progressive" left and the "progressive" right... both are "continuing its fraud against the people" as you say. Do you lump Constitutional Conservatives in there also?

It is a small but vocal and determined group who espouse our Founding Principles of Liberty. That is who I listen to. Are you one of them?

Does the tyranny that's gone on for a long, long time come from the implementation of bad political ideology or Satan or a handful of very powerful boogymen (for lack of a better term!)?

As I see it, we only have 2 remedies to tyranny... Voting, and when that doesn't work, Revolution! Is there a third option? What is the solution, Jim? Thanks in advance

[Jim1cor13]

Hi WHN

 

I wish I had the answers my dear, all I can do is make observations from those I have

interacted with over 54 years, who I have shared with, talked with, voted for, campaigned

for, and I found it all to be vanity, even worse today. I have my thoughts on solutions and

have stated them many times here. I have no labels, I do not identify with labels, those

are political tools I have no desire to partake in nor promote. However things can change,

it is going to take ALL of us together, not just a few, and it must start with rejecting the

current status quo, rejecting the constant barrage of fear that is pumped out to people

daily in order to get some clarity of how far we have fallen as a country over the last 50 years.

 

I DO believe returning to a constitutional republic would be prudent, but I do not see that

happening in our life times due to the stranglehold the current circus has upon our once

decent republic. Many years ago I became weary of being lied to, being manipulated, and

I set out to try and understand how the system works. I was floored by what I found out, and

it did not come from some conspiracy web site, nor did i simply adopt someone elses version

of events. It took years to just get a grasp on how things work, why they are done, who pulls

the strings, and who benefits the most. The political machine in the beltway was hijacked a long

time ago, and no matter how hard we try and change this, so far it has been an exercise in

futility. Perhaps that is the way it is supposed to work. But...the special interest(s) and those

behind them that assist in pulling the strings so to speak, is not at all who we are told it is,

and that is troubling to me.

 

I am 'conservative' by nature, I do support those who espouse liberty for all, not just a few, 

certainly, but I also see yet another desire for too much control that comes from some, which

to me is contrary to liberty, so I tread slowly. I am 100% for being individual and being true to

ones self, not sold out to some corporate sponsor or any political special interests. I am sickened

by what I see that has taken place to this country over the last 20 years, and those who get away

with misleading people and the division that comes with it. I am sickened by how we willingly give

up our liberties due to whatever is the latest "threat", and how that has hurt our country and created

a mindset that is not only unhealthy, but is also destructive. The tactics used to get us to this point were

not by chance, it was by design, but each person must find that out themselves. I am sickened by the

poisonous people I see trying to constantly tell others how they should think and feel.

 

Am I a sovereign? Yes, we are all sovereign, as far as I can tell, but as you stated, difficult to

put into practice...why is that? The system tells us it owns us, and that we can neither buy or sell without

our little "passes" and "marks" of ownership. If one goes back in history and actually finds out how this

system came into being, which we are all part of due to how it is set up, we all accepted the requirements,

without understanding what they meant for the most part. That has to change if we are ever to truly

learn what a sovereign individual is in regards to liberty and conduct. I have yet to fully understand

all the details in regards to how to UNDO the 'strawman' illusion, but I am still learning. It is not about

trying to get away with anything that I can see, although some promote it as such which is simply wrong.

 

The confusion to me is how it is presented, and sometimes for the wrong reasons, that I reject because

it is BS, but "sovereignty" is true, and the principles are valid. Power should be in the hands of the

people, not in some obscure group in washington or any special interest, it must be returned to the

people. Common Law is a must, personal responsibility is a must, rejecting those who try and think

for us is a must. How did that all become lost? It was not like we were not warned, but we ignored the

pleas of those who understood our REAL threat were those we thought had our best interests at heart,

those who ended up selling us out and reaping the rewards from their 'masters' at a tragic expense

to this country, and it continues to this day with so many still believing it will change with the next new

pretty face who is running for office telling us all what we want to hear, not what we need to hear.

 

I DO know a few who have navigated the legal path in regards to their sovereign rights, etc., and yes,

they have not paid income taxes in many years, and they are not yet in jail I agree, it is all

fascinating, but I am one that treads slowly until i have some understanding, so far that is limited

but I do have some very good contacts, and plan on utilizing them in the near future, so that I can

understand the legal aspects without the hype involved to be able to make an informed decision.

As it stands, there are few that should be trusted in this regard, so I found a few that have no agenda,

other than teaching about common law, individual rights, and how to address these issues within

our communities. It also involves what right does the state have over us, etc. Very fascinating indeed,

and sad there appears so much deception in regards to those who exercise authority over us when

they have no constitutional right to do so.

 

The tyranny is nothing new, what has been shall be again, nothing new under the sun. Only tactics

and how it is sold to the people, is cleverly altered, but it is the very same tactics that history shows

has worked, we see it daily via media, politics, religion, etc. Bad political ideology? No, TOO much

politics, TOO many people desiring control over others, TOO many people with an agenda that is

often self serving. I do not support the arrogance I have found at most political settings, nor do I

allow anyone to tell me how I should think or feel, even when i DO support their message. I stop

listening the moment I see the motive and who benefits, when it is a select few who think they have

all the answers, when in reality, it is they who want the 'power' and control. Happens too often, because

I do not shut down the brain because someone is telling me what I want to hear. Following the money

trail has taught me many things, and it is often a direct path to arriving at truth and exposing the

fiction we too easily believe in.

 

Revolution is always an option, but never the way that so many try and sell it. I do not support any

revolution that is based upon ego from those who think they have all the solutions. I DO support a

revolution of truth, and the pursuit of justice and holding leaders accountable for their actions. So far,

our judicial system often exonerates the guilty, such as criminal banks, politicians, etc., and rewards

them for their crimes, whilst the innocents are sacrificed by means of collusion and fraud. Yes, a true

revolution against these things would be wonderful, as long as it is not coming from bloated ego's and

corrupt agenda's.

 

Ok dear, thought I would hit upon a few things, but try not to rehash what I have stated many times as

far as my opinion about solutions. No solution can be found until we are ready and willing to seek truth

at all costs, even if it shatters our beliefs or way of thinking, and we must never be afraid of being "wrong",

else how can we ever learn? We must be willing to reject what is contrary to love and liberty, we must be

willing to practice loving our neighbors as ourselves, without prejudice, and that does not mean rolling over

and allowing ourselves to be walked upon, it means what it says, because THAT is the start to a TRUE

revolution. If love is not the foundation, then the end result will continue to fall into corruption, and we

plainly see we are there now. We have had enough self serving agenda's, and ego filled voices who

could care less about you and me. But all of these things can only start, when we stop believing those

who have lied to us, and they are many.

 

Have a good day!

[Whatshername]

Thank you... Much appreciated 

[Thaiexpat]

WSN, JimCor and others

Yes, the problem lies in what we believe to be true verse what is true. From day 1, we are fed the lies of the State. And who is the one telling us these things? Our parents/family/friends. Why? Because they are of the belief system that supports the State. My god, if my mother and father (God, rest his soul) taught me what I should have been taught to be a freeman, life might be a whole lot different. Well, we cant blame them since they didnt understand/know either. But WE DO. So we start from now. 

I've been in this for over a decade. I filed my Affidavit of Corporate Denial, Revocation of Signature, Admiralty Administrative stuff, UCC-1 paperwork, Birth certificate (actually naturalization papers), Etc, etc, etc. I have met with a number of the Sovereign movement "experts" and discovered nothing really works well. There are 4 options/answers in dealing with the government:

1 Yes: you agree to everything. The laws do apply to me. I agree to this slavery

2. No. disagree with the issue. This puts you in dishonor and you will need to prove your case. Good luck to you in their Kangaroo Courts

3. No answer. Government will use this tacit procreation to label you a #1 (agree). Failure to reply will result in an agreement. 

4. Conditional response. I agree once you PROVIDE the FACTS supporting your claim. "Your claim that Regulation XY applies to me....Do you have any FACTUAL EVIDENCE to support this claim..." Then everything is thrown back into their laps to PROVE their claim. 

If you can always remember this idea-prove the jurisdiction, then you can limit the damage that is done to you. Remember, the Mafia doesnt like people standing up to it. But if you can expose their actions as nothing more than criminal at best, then you have stood as a Sovereign before this criminal cartel advertising itself as government. 

Again, always ask them "from WHERE did you get your authority over me?" "Is there a contract between us?" "have I committed a tort (injury)?" "Then WHY are you even talking with me?"

The Preamble to the Constitution has the answer: "...thru the CONSENT of the governed...". Well, when did I give my consent? Date? Paper? WHEN? And if I freely gave my consent, could I just as freely WITHDRAW my consent? Are you subject to their rules thru physical presents? Are you subjected to the Constitution? Really? You signed that document? Do I need a piece of paper telling others: I was born free, can speak freely, defend myself, have protection against certain aspect of government. etc. George Carlin said it best, "If government can take it away, it aint a right; its a privilege.."  So how did the people allow government to limit or regulate something it had NO POWER to limit or regulate to begin with? How did government obtain your "rights" and make them PRIVILEGES? You see, folks, all the crap-n-nonsense that is happening today is to KEEP YOU FROM THINKING ABOUT THE REAL ISSUE-your freedom! Worry about the coming economic collapse, worry about the race riots, worry about what so-and-so is wearing to some event, but, for God's sake, DO NOT THINK ABOUT YOUR ENSLAVEMENT! 

Geez, I gotta stop reading these post! hhahaahahahaha. Cheers and to your LIBERTY-you've had it all along.

[Jim1cor13]

Thank you Thaiexpat. It is truly a maze to sort through, which

makes it difficult for folks to even try. I think you got right to the

point and very well stated. Bottom line is this:

 

As long as we continue to believe the lies, we continue to give

consent to the exercise of rule by the state/feds. We also give

consent by not confronting their schemes against the people.

I do think we are all at fault more than most would want to admit,

because it is not enough to complain and point fingers, we must

learn and then take steps to dismantle the monster Washington

has become...but even then, there are other hands involved, outside

of the beltway most are not even aware of. So it would appear we

are all boxed into something we lost the ability to get free from long

ago, and that is very sad.

 

What options there once were, they have been cleverly removed, and

the public allowed it, not knowing the consequences of blindly accepting

the rule of criminals over us. So much has been altered and changed,

including the history of this land, most are not aware of. If they can alter

the facts, and no one questions, if they can tell us lies, and no one questions,

I am not too hopeful we will ever as a people be able to escape the box we

were placed in. As long as most are comfortable and remain good little

consumers and tax payers, at what point can anyone try and change the course

we have been on for well over 50 years?

 

Thanks Doc, your point is well taken. 

[sxsess]

The only thing I follow is the U.S. Constitution. I set my own rules and uphold them with my assault weapons that I would die for with no hesitation. This mess in this country will be dealt with eventually by the people. Look at past history. There has always been a breaking point in societies worldwide including here. Any real American no matter what color you are should stand together and fight. If you are a true American you will when the time comes. Otherwise you a will be considered a coward that stands for nothing.

[Jaxinjersey]

Great thread... and in-depth insight!  Thanks all!

 

This also brings me to another important issue I have... privacy and security, especially financial and property rights.

 

I have no trust in financial transactions, merchant purchases, and banks in general.  We are entering the phase of "forced participation" in the way we do these things... from automated/self check-out for purchases to banking deposits/withdrawals.  "They" do not want us to deal with cash anymore.  Even just yesterday, as I was attempting to make a cash deposit at the bank (inside), I was confounded to find any deposit slips (or any other transaction forms) and had to ask the teller.  She handed me one... and at the same time asked whether I had an ATM card, that I could make my deposit (cash or check) at the ATM... and if I didn't know how... she would show me!  LOL  I told her, "yes I have an ATM card, and yes, I know how... I just prefer your personal service!" LOL

 

This also leads me to the issue we all face in identity theft.  Other than my own BASIC responsible actions to secure my identity and property...  I am adamant about not being responsible for a criminal's activity, should I be the victim of such... AND the subsequent time, energy and expense of remedying it!   This is another potential consequence of a forced participation in the electronic environment.

 

I would love to be able to sign and present a "Non-Liable Waiver Statement" to my bank(s)... making them solely responsible for remedying a potential financial theft/crime against me... including all costs of remedy.  I have enough to do on a daily basis than to be a "banking/financial/accounting/criminal investigator" expert.  I'd simply prefer to say... "I understand it happens.... please just fix it.  Thank you."

 

I know... will never happen!  Somehow... it'll be MY fault... and my expense.

[Thaiexpat]

The only thing I follow is the U.S. Constitution. I set my own rules and uphold them with my assault weapons that I would die for with no hesitation. This mess in this country will be dealt with eventually by the people. Look at past history. There has always been a breaking point in societies worldwide including here. Any real American no matter what color you are should stand together and fight. If you are a true American you will when the time comes. Otherwise you a will be considered a coward that stands for nothing.

Really? You signed on this document? I would have you consider really reading the 14th Amendment to this document. Do you fall under its scope? I dont. I am NOT a 14th Amendment citizen. This is why I see no reason that the Constitution even applies to me. I never signed. Hell. I have never seen it for real. 

As for any statue/regulation, any law that contravenes the Constitution is  VOID. You need not follow it. Again, this goes back to the original post of "for the collective good we do this" and everybody jumps on that bandwagon. If, you, have the individual thought of "Hey! Wait a minute...." You will be consider a kook, one-of-those people, nut bag.." How sad it has become that someone who follows Natural Law above all is consider a wacko. 

For those who dont know it goes like this:

natural law: just because we are alive, we have certain rights/abilities

Constitutional law: an affirmation of our natural laws LIMITING government and ensuring our natural law rights are truly protected

and down the list it goes.

The Constitution is to AFFIRM our Natural Rights as human being. It doesnt give anything we dont have already. No matter where you are and where you are from, you have rights as a living being. No government can limit those rights (speech, religion, gathering, protecting against government violation of your rights, etc) and no government can make you a SLAVE (14th Amendment) without your consent.

Finally, as for using the Straw man argument in Court: I ask if you have ever seen a lawyer use the same? I havent. I have never seen it work. In fact, I personally know a fellow who used this tactic and the city just went back and changed all the spellings to show proper English grammar usage. BLOW, JOE was changed to Blow, Joe. Well, so much for his position. 

Cheers and to LIBERTY-She needs our help today

[Jim1cor13]

 

Cheers and to LIBERTY-She needs our help today

 

 

She sure does Doc, thanks again for your perspectives. Always good

to see and read your posts, you think outside the box, and that is appreciated.

[FlyHi]

 This is a great thread. 

As an outsider looking in it seems that the people are like a frog put in a pot of cold water and slowly brought to the boil. It appears you have all been complacent in letting your rights slip through your hands and be taken away by government/banksters and other corrupt people. This is so sad to watch a once great nation being stripped apart by stealth, little by little until you are left powerless and defenceless.

Wake up America!

[Thaiexpat]

Roger that, HiFly

Slowly, surely, the rights have been replaced with privileges. The most basic questions that one must always consider is: "Is it my right (by being alive) to do......?" Can you travel freely? Can you speak your mind (even if it offends others)? Can you openly hate a group of people/persons if that is what is in your heart? Can you put into your body whatever you want to, so-long-as, doing so hurts no one only the self? Can you pray/meditation in a manner that suits you in any location you wish to that is considered a public space? What has happened, America? Why do you need permission to stage a protest or gather to complain? How is it that government can make you write something on a cake that is against your morality? WHERE did it get such authority over you?

Some sites I follow for information/updates/good laughs (because of the utter stupidity of gubbermint)

Lewrockwell's

Karl Denniger's Market ticker

Marc Steven's no state project

Having lived in 2 communist countries, I have personally seen the decay in morality, ethics and good ol' common sense. Nothing makes sense in those places. What is right today, might be wrong tomorrow and the people learn to follow the lead of the biggest criminal gang-the State. The State is GOD. Obey or be destroyed. No property rights. No rights without permission. Bow before the all powerful State and be blessed for your total loyalty. You have nothing to hide, so don't fear the State. Besides its for the....children! hahahaha. This sickness has spread throughout the country. The collective "good" is all that matters. SO be reasonable and think of your neighbors first. Come on. If we all work together, we will all feel better. All boats float with the in-coming tide, right? So what's your problem, individualist? Your freedoms are yours, so-long-as, they don't interfere with the collectives goals.

And this message is pumped into the society at large. On and on it goes. Look at the other topics posted here and see the responses of some members. Still fighting amongst themselves. Still distracted from what is really happening. Seeing how we argue makes TPTB's happy, happy, happy. Keep it up! Nothing to see here-your freedom is done gone already. We'll offer a new "leader" to make the 50% happy, so 50% will continue to argue with them. total DISTRACTION, folks.

Cheers and a tear for the liberties lost......

[Thaiexpat]

I wanted to add, to those who actually believe in the election process/voting, 2 quotes

1. George Carlin: "If you vote you cant complain. You voted for the SH--. You voted for the problem we have now...."

2. Adolf Hitler: "It is easier for a camel to pass thru the eye of a needle, then a "good man" to be found by an election.." (Even a madman can have a moment of clarity)

Cheers and refuse to consent....