I don't think Iraq is out of Chapter 7

[blitzer]

OK, I know you are all going to come after me.    This is my first post.  I have only been in this investment for a bit over 2 years, so I certainly do NOT claim to know it all.  But I offer these two links to the UN and the UNSC.  Please read them before you try to kill the messenger.  OK?  Thank you for double checking my opinion and thoughts, all of you!! 

 

 http://www.un.org/News/Press/docs/2013/sc11050.doc.htm

 

 http://www.un.org/apps/news/story.asp?NewsID=45287&Cr=Iraq&Cr1=Kuwait#.UdB6BlOd7zf

 

Please note, that the very first words in the press release from the text of the UNSC on last Thursday clearly state that they are removing Iraq from Chapter 7 in regards to missing persons and property ONLY.  And that the title of the news release on the second link, from the UN itself, uses the word "eases" not released.  In my book, eases does not equal released.  Also, in the UNSC text, while they do mention the compensation to Kuwait as having been set up or approved, kind of like a payment plan or whatever.  It is not actually paid off yet, and no where in that text does it say that the resolution is being moved to chapter 6.

 

Zebari says that Iraq is out of chapter 7.  But I have yet to hear the UN or anyone from the UN say that Iraq is out of Chapter 7.  All I can find is what I have listed in the two links above.

 

In the time I have been in this investment, Iraq has "said" it was soveriegn more than once, lol, at it was wrong.  I THINK it is wrong again.  Please.  Those of you who have been here longer than I, show me that I am wrong.  I WANT to be wrong.  But I think I am right.  Please just read the two documents I have provided, and then, educate me if I am wrong.

 

Thank you everyone.

[dontlop]

some thing are removed  from ch7 .. the rest are transferred to ch6 ..they are out of ch7 .

[RONIN II]

Saw the live video feed myself...Zebari gave a 20 minute speech, they took a quick break, came back to the table and voted 15-0 to lift the chapter 7 sanctions and move the outstanding issues to chapter6.

[aliciadogz]

Okie Dokie you have a right to your opinion but we all seen them vote out of chapter 7.

Edited June 30, 2013 by mydogz

[coolbeans]

You better call the UN because according to them the are 100% out of Chapter 7.

[stealthwarrior]

Iraq is out of chapter 7,period

[dontlop]

right under the picture  on your second link it says this >>  Security Council unanimously adopts resolution, removing Iraq from its obligations under Chapter VII of the UN Charter. UN Photo/Rick Bajornas

 

i cant find anything on either of your links that says iraq is under chapter 7 .. maybe you can point it out ..  your link ..>>> 

 

we have all seen it ..

 

Security Council unanimously adopts resolution, removing Iraq from its obligations under Chapter VII of the UN Charter. UN Photo/Rick Bajornas

27

 

Print

27 June 2013 – Welcoming progress on resolving pending issues from Iraq’s 1990 invasion of its smaller neighbour Kuwait, including finding Kuwaiti or third-country nationals, the United Nations Security Council today eased some of its sanctions against Iraq.

Unanimously adopting a new resolution, the Council called on the Iraqi Government to continue searching for Kuwaiti nationals and property missing since Saddam Hussein’s 1990 invasion, but terminated provisions in earlier texts that allowed the military enforcement of the measures under Charter VII of the UN Charter.

Recognizing that the situation that now exists in Iraq is significantly different from that which existed at the time of the invasion, the Council decided that the issues of missing people and property will now be handled under Chapter VI of the Charter, which calls for a peaceful resolution of disputes.

Another key provision of the new resolution is the Council’s decision to transfer the mandate formerly assigned to the High-Level Coordinator for Iraq-Kuwait Missing Persons and Property to the UN Assistance Mission in Iraq (UNAMI).

Paragraph 14 of resolution 1284 (1999) requested the appointment of a High-Level Coordinator to report to the Security Council regularly on “compliance by Iraq with its obligations regarding the repatriation or return of all Kuwaiti and third country nationals or their remains” and “the return of all Kuwaiti property, including archives, seized by Iraq.”

The new resolution terminates that measure and in turn calls on the head of UNAMI to “promote, support and facilitate efforts regarding the repatriation or return of all Kuwaiti and third country nationals or their remains, and the return of Kuwaiti property, including the national archives, seized by Iraq.”

Further, the resolution also requests that Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon consider designating the deputy chief of UNAMI covering political affairs “with the responsibility for overseeing these issues and ensuring appropriate resources for this purpose.”

 show where it says iraq is still under ch7

Edited June 30, 2013 by dontlop

[respectron]

Thanks everyone! I really needed to keep having this Chapter 7 release beat into my head over and over and now I am since a long time have some excitement coming over me.

 

[dontlop]

the first link they read that all off and voted to remove iraq from ch7 to ch6 .. ch7 is when the un can use force  .. under ch 6 theres no un force

[zigmeister]

*sigh*  

[blitzer]

OK, well thank you for at least some of you trying to at least actually read the links.  I also watched the video.  However, what was said, and by WHOM, and what was actually VOTED on is the question.

 

In reply to a couple of the questions however:

 

UNANIMOUSLY ADOPTING RESOLUTION 2107 (2013), SECURITY COUNCIL REMOVES IRAQ

FROM CHAPTER VII OBLIGATIONS OVER RETURN OF KUWAITI NATIONALS

 

The above section in red, is a copy and paste from the first link, and it clearly states, to me at least, that there was a unanimous vote, adopting the resolution, to remove Iraw from Chapter 7 in regards to the missing Kuwaiti's.  It does NOT refer to any of the other remaining sanctions.  Just that one.

 

The Security Council today decided to remove Iraq from its obligations under Chapter VII of the United Nations Charter concerning the return of Kuwaiti and third-State nationals or their remains and their property seized by Iraq’s former regime during its 1990 invasion of Kuwait.

 

This very first line of text, from the same document, then states what they are removing from Chapter 7. 

 

Following the adoption, Hoshyar Zebar, Iraq’s Foreign Minister, said the text marked a turning point in Iraq’s relationship with the international community and a significant step in Iraq’s and Kuwait’s joint efforts to mend bilateral ties.  Further, it illustrated that Iraq had fulfilled all its obligations under Chapter VII of the Charter.

 

And here is WHY I was politely asking for some second opinions, from you all.  This section says that Iraq has fulfilled its obligations, BUT, fulfilled and released are not the same thing, usually.  And I think we can all safely agree that as an example, since they have not ACTUALLY finished paying off the final compensation, and they have not actually finished doing the border marking; they have not yet COMPLETED their obligations.  They have fulfilled them by taking the proper steps to comply, but until the bill is paid, and until the markers are set, they are not yet done.  Does anyone have a problem with the definition or the logic of that statement?

 

“3.   Decides, under Chapter VII of the Charter of the United Nations, to terminate the measures in paragraphs 2 ©, 2 (d) and 3 © of resolution 686 (1991), paragraph 30 of resolution 687 (1991) and the arrangements set forth in paragraph 14 of resolution 1284 (1999), and reaffirmed in subsequent relevant resolutions;

 

OK, still the same document, this is still the UNSC text of the Thursday meeting.  In this section, they are moving 3 resolutions from Chapter 7 into Chapter 6; specifically: 686, 687, & 1284.  They are NOT however moving resolution 833 from Chapter 7 into Chapter 6.  And 833 is the one that deals with the compensation.  At no point in this meeting or document does the UNSC EVER state that that 833 is out of Chapter 7.

 

Now as to the second set of questions or denials of my thougts/opinions/questions.  The second link, if anyone had chose to actually look at it, clearly states, from the UN, in their own press release, that they are EASING sanctions.  They did not say they were removing Iraw from Chapter 7.  I would think that if they were removing a country fully from such a status, that this would be a big enough event, that they woud say so.  They did not.

 

I say again.  Zebari said they were out of 7.  I did not hear the Brit say that Iraq was out of 7.  He said that the Council was voting to adopt the resolution, and THAT resolution ONLY moved the affected resolutions in regards to missing Kuwaiti's, their property and archives, and some third parites.

 

Thank you again.

 

 

[blitzer]

Well, my last reply has not been cleared by the hard working mods yet, but I did find something more to add.  Since it was requested by one of you to show where it said Iraq was still under Chapter 7, I went and found yet another place where it states just that.  Beyond what I already found on the first two links that most of you have not yet taken the time to actually read. 

 

Here is the link to the article / website, but I have included the relevant paragraph for you.  Also please note that while the article headline states one thing for hype and ratings, the bottom pargraph does in fact state the opposite, and backs up what I have been saying.

 

Here is the link:

 

http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2013/06/27/311111/unsc-removes-iraq-from-chapter-7/

 

Here is the paragraph:

 

UN diplomatic sources say the only issues regarding Iraq's invasion of Kuwait which remain under Chapter 7 are an arms ban and the country’s payment of USD 52 billion in compensation to Kuwait.

Iraq still owes USD 11 billion to Kuwait. It hopes to settle it by 2015.

 

And to the person who so pithily told me to contact the UN, thank you!!  That was a most excellent idea, and I have now sent an email to them requesting clarification on this.  And when I get a reply, next week or whenever, I will post that as well.  After all, always ask the the front end of the horse, not the back end......

 

Thanks again everyone.