Edward Snowden extradition attempts 'could take years'

[yota691]

Edward Snowden extradition attempts 'could take years'

Hong Kong legal experts say US could face lengthy diplomatic and legal process to try NSA whistleblower in American court

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• Conal Urquhart and agencies
• guardian.co.uk,  Saturday 22 June 2013 05.22 EDT

Edward Snowden's face on the cover of news magazines in Hong Kong. Photograph: Kin Cheung/AP

Any attempt by the US to extradite the NSA whistle blower Edward Snowden from Hong Kong for espionage could take years and be blocked by China, legal experts have said.

The warning comes after it emerged on Friday that the US has charged Snowden with theft of government property, unauthorized communication of national defense information and willful communication of classified communications intelligence to an unauthorized person. The latter two charges are part of the US Espionage Act.

Legislators in Hong Kong responded by calling for mainland China to intervene in the case. Snowden, 29, who is reportedly in hiding in Hong Kong, was last seen on 10 June. He is understood to have made contact with human rights lawyers in anticipation of a legal action from the US.

The US and Hong Kong have had an extradition treaty since 1998, a year after Hong Kong was transferred from British to Chinese rule. Scores of Americans have been sent back for trial under the treaty.

While espionage and theft of state secrets are not cited specifically in the treaty, equivalent charges could be pressed against Snowden under Hong Kong's official secrets ordinance, legal experts said.

The time frame for such proceedings remains unclear, but Hectar Pun, a barrister with human rights expertise, said such an extradition could take three to five years.

If Hong Kong authorities did not charge Snowden with an equivalent crime, authorities could not extradite him, lawyers said. In the absence of charges, Snowden was also theoretically free to leave the city, one legal expert said.

Simon Young, a law professor at the University of Hong Kong, said that while the first charge involving theft might readily find equivalence in Hong Kong, the latter two spying offences will likely attract "litigation and dispute" in the courts.

Under Hong Kong's extradition system, a request first goes through diplomatic channels to the government, who decides whether to issue an "authority to proceed". If granted, a magistrate issues a formal warrant for the arrest of Snowden.

Once brought before the court, the judge would decide whether there was sufficient evidence to commit Snowden to trial or dismiss the case, though any decision could be appealed in a higher court.

Snowden could claim political asylum in Hong Kong, arguing he would face torture back home. Article six of the treaty states extradition should be refused for "an offence of a political character".

"The unfairness of his trial at home and his likely treatment in custody" were important factors to consider when assessing Snowden's chances of claiming political immunity from extradition, said Young.

Should a Hong Kong court eventually call for Snowden's extradition, Hong Kong's leader and China could still veto the decision on national security or defense grounds.

Snowden has admitted leaking secrets about classified US surveillance program mes, which he said he did in the public interest. Supporters say he is a whistle blower, while critics call him a criminal and perhaps even a traitor.

Edited June 22, 2013 by yota691

[SgtFuryUSCZ]

***///

 

"torture back home".... "unfairness of his trial at home and his likely treatment in custody"....

 

look who's talking!  wow.

 

do they have any idea what the American Taxpayer shells out annually for those here in custody?

 

do they actually think we're going to put him in a bamboo cage, torture him, and starve him...?

 

oy vay.... sheesh......

[jonjon]

For someone to be considered a traitor they should have done something that would be considered threatening or harmful to the citizen of this country. 

 

Being an information source of the government practice’s that are infringing the rights of the citizens makes him a “Hero”!

[yota691]

I'm just  curious what the difference...

Obama And Biden Indicted By Florida Grand Jury

OCTOBER 31, 2012 BY BREAKING NEWS 88 COMMENTS

 

 

 

(Ocala, Florida, October 30, 2012). Larry Klayman, the founder and chairman of Freedom Watch today announced that President Barack Obama and Vice President Joseph Biden have been criminally indicted for having willfully released classified national security information concerning the raid on Osama bin Laden’s compound, U.S. and Israeli war plans concerning Iran and their cyber-attack on Iran’s nuclear facilities. The release of this information, among other harm to U.S. national security, resulted in the killing of members of Seal Team Six by terrorists and the arrest and imprisonment of American covert agents by Pakistan, such as the doctor who aided the CIA with regard to the bin Laden assassination. U.S.-Israeli war plans with Iran have also been compromised.

A true bill of indictment was issued by a Citizens’ Grand Jury in Ocala, Florida, who reviewed evidence and voted unanimously to indict Obama and Biden at 6:02 pm on October 29, 2012.

The authority for a Citizens’ Grand Jury can be found at www.citizensgrandjury.com.

The criminal defendants, Obama and Biden, will now be given notice of their indictment, arraigned and then tried for their alleged crimes.

[Shabibilicious]

For someone to be considered a traitor they should have done something that would be considered threatening or harmful to the citizen of this country. 

 

Being an information source of the government practice’s that are infringing the rights of the citizens makes him a “Hero”!

 

Russia agrees with you completely and they are more than willing to hear everything he has to say.......they might even take notes.    

 

GO RV, then BV

[dog53]

For someone to be considered a traitor they should have done something that would be considered threatening or harmful to the citizen of this country. 

 

Being an information source of the government practice’s that are infringing the rights of the citizens makes him a “Hero”!

 

Wow Jon Jon I know you hate this administration as do I but you are just so wrong on this one. 

He`s no hero yeah he dropped a dime on this administration on his way out the door to give top secrets to the enemy .

This man needs no praise what he needs is for one of our spooks to put a bullet through his brain before he can do more damage.

Hero my a$$

[Shabibilicious]

Wow Jon Jon I know you hate this administration as do I but you are just so wrong on this one. 

He`s no hero yeah he dropped a dime on this administration on his way out the door to give top secrets to the enemy .

This man needs no praise what he needs is for one of our spooks to put a bullet through his brain before he can do more damage.

Hero my a$$

 

Yep.    

 

To be fair to jonjon though.......he did author his post before Snowden bolted for Russia

 

GO RV, then BV

Edited June 25, 2013 by Shabibilicious

[jonjon]

Wow Jon Jon I know you hate this administration as do I but you are just so wrong on this one. 

He`s no hero yeah he dropped a dime on this administration on his way out the door to give top secrets to the enemy .

This man needs no praise what he needs is for one of our spooks to put a bullet through his brain before he can do more damage.

Hero my a$$

The only secrets this hero is sharing with China or Russia is there is no way they will ever be able to encroach on or infringe the freedoms of Americans to the extent our own government is. 

[thegente]

The only secrets this hero is sharing with China or Russia is there is no way they will ever be able to encroach on or infringe the freedoms of Americans to the extent our own government is. 

Agree with ya 100% JonJon...

Wow Jon Jon I know you hate this administration as do I but you are just so wrong on this one. 

He`s no hero yeah he dropped a dime on this administration on his way out the door to give top secrets to the enemy .

This man needs no praise what he needs is for one of our spooks to put a bullet through his brain before he can do more damage.

Hero my a$$

If you think Snowden is a traitor, then what would you call what the NSA is doing, spying on American citizens without just cause or due process? Heroic? 

[sandyf]

From Recaps.

 

We were initially advised to watch for this release to take place Sunday Night/Monday Morning on FOREX, with a 24-hour delay before the currencies became tradable. 

Obviously we saw nothing. We expected that the delay might have been pushed to Tuesday in order to comply with normal international banking policies, and in fact were told that might be the case.

All of you have heard about the NSA leaker issue in the news, the fact that he fled to China, and that both China and Russia have cooperated in hiding him or preventing the US from finding the young man's whereabouts. 

Not in our wildest thinking did anyone consider that this event might have a bearing or interfere in any way with the release of these currencies.

Turns out that because of the administration's demands on China for the return of this individual, they decided to throw a temper tantrum and provide a short delay in the release process by fussing over the revaluation of the Vietnamese Dong. 

[yota691]

 

From Recaps.

 

We were initially advised to watch for this release to take place Sunday Night/Monday Morning on FOREX, with a 24-hour delay before the currencies became tradable. 

Obviously we saw nothing. We expected that the delay might have been pushed to Tuesday in order to comply with normal international banking policies, and in fact were told that might be the case.

All of you have heard about the NSA leaker issue in the news, the fact that he fled to China, and that both China and Russia have cooperated in hiding him or preventing the US from finding the young man's whereabouts. 

Not in our wildest thinking did anyone consider that this event might have a bearing or interfere in any way with the release of these currencies.

Turns out that because of the administration's demands on China for the return of this individual, they decided to throw a temper tantrum and provide a short delay in the release process by fussing over the revaluation of the Vietnamese Dong. 

 

[dog53]

Agree with ya 100% JonJon...

If you think Snowden is a traitor, then what would you call what the NSA is doing, spying on American citizens without just cause or due process? Heroic? 

 

What the NSA is doing has absolutely nothing to do with Snowden being a traitor. Were not talking about the NSA we are talking about a american citizen who is about to sell out to the highest bidder. Wake up dude im on your side.  Ill meet ya half way lets do all of them there all traitors 

[thegente]

I'm wide awake Dog..think about it for a minute. If all he wanted to do was sell our secrets to the highest bidder (as MSM and the Govt claims) all he would have had to do was load everything he wanted to sell onto a flash drive, set a meeting and get paid, and could probably have done so for years before being caught/exposed. Did he? NO. He elected to go public and expose the abuses that the US govt visits daily upon Americans. He went public without knowing where he would end up, whether he would be dead or alive if he did so. Do those sound like the actions of a coward or traitor? Not to me...with the knowledge of and how our country treats whislteblowers that report govt waste and abuses, I believe he was acting prudently for his own safety by fleeing the country. Again, if all he wanted was money, he could have done that long ago. The govt got caught with it's pants down, hence the reason for all the "traitor" talk...they're trying to deflect off the NSA problem, and focus on Snowden, it's completely obvious if you look at the big picture and aren't easily distracted. This man just came forward and told you your own govt spies on you, a law-abiding citizen, with out due cause, and your 1st reaction is to want to put a bullet in his head? Oh and for the record, I am on your side as well brother, much respect, and have a great day Dog!

[pattyangel]

I'm wide awake Dog..think about it for a minute. If all he wanted to do was sell our secrets to the highest bidder (as MSM and the Govt claims) all he would have had to do was load everything he wanted to sell onto a flash drive, set a meeting and get paid, and could probably have done so for years before being caught/exposed. Did he? NO. He elected to go public and expose the abuses that the US govt visits daily upon Americans. He went public without knowing where he would end up, whether he would be dead or alive if he did so. Do those sound like the actions of a coward or traitor? Not to me...with the knowledge of and how our country treats whislteblowers that report govt waste and abuses, I believe he was acting prudently for his own safety by fleeing the country. Again, if all he wanted was money, he could have done that long ago. The govt got caught with it's pants down, hence the reason for all the "traitor" talk...they're trying to deflect off the NSA problem, and focus on Snowden, it's completely obvious if you look at the big picture and aren't easily distracted. This man just came forward and told you your own govt spies on you, a law-abiding citizen, with out due cause, and your 1st reaction is to want to put a bullet in his head? Oh and for the record, I am on your side as well brother, much respect, and have a great day Dog!

 

Thegente, I agree with you on your statement above.  Not only a distraction from the NSA, but all the newly issues that have risen with this administration.  I believe we all know this.  Stay focused not on one issue at a time, on all issues.  This is how the power that be works.  Its clearly a deception.

[yota691]

Snowden 'stuck' in Russia .. Moscow rejects Washington's threats

Moscow: Sami Amara 
said Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov said yesterday that Edward Snowden required for the United States on charges of espionage still exists in the transit area Airport in Moscow, pointing out that the man «did not violate the laws did not cross our borders, but also exists in the transit area at the airport, and has the right to go where he wants. He also wrote the Chairman of the Foreign Affairs Committee of the State Duma Alexey بوشكوف the threats to the United States to Russia and China, on the background of the issue Snowden, will not have any effect, but on the contrary will only increase convergence Russian - Chinese.

In the meantime, the Russian public television focused on the arrival of diplomatic vehicles to airport Hirimtievo, while Ecuador did not announce that its ambassador met Snowden upon his arrival Sunday, its decision to grant him political asylum.

   

And Pat Snowden, in terms of shape, contrary to Russian immigration laws that do not allow to remain in the transit area for more than 24 hours, as well as it does not carry a valid passport after the authorities canceled American passport. But nonetheless, Moscow announced that it will not take any action on the young American, especially after he recommended that Russian President Vladimir Putin not to touch it until a solution to the problem.

[dog53]

I'm wide awake Dog..think about it for a minute. If all he wanted to do was sell our secrets to the highest bidder (as MSM and the Govt claims) all he would have had to do was load everything he wanted to sell onto a flash drive, set a meeting and get paid, and could probably have done so for years before being caught/exposed. Did he? NO. He elected to go public and expose the abuses that the US govt visits daily upon Americans. He went public without knowing where he would end up, whether he would be dead or alive if he did so. Do those sound like the actions of a coward or traitor? Not to me...with the knowledge of and how our country treats whislteblowers that report govt waste and abuses, I believe he was acting prudently for his own safety by fleeing the country. Again, if all he wanted was money, he could have done that long ago. The govt got caught with it's pants down, hence the reason for all the "traitor" talk...they're trying to deflect off the NSA problem, and focus on Snowden, it's completely obvious if you look at the big picture and aren't easily distracted. This man just came forward and told you your own govt spies on you, a law-abiding citizen, with out due cause, and your 1st reaction is to want to put a bullet in his head? Oh and for the record, I am on your side as well brother, much respect, and have a great day Dog!

 

Your being naive . This is what your thinking in your head. "You believe" Yes and I respect that . I plainly see that you are a patriot. But do not be deceived . Look at it from all the angles  rather then the one your heart wants it to be. Be open minded and think any thing is possible. It may save your life in the coming days.  If this man for what EVER   Reason  has given info to the enemy . Info that could possibly hurt the security of MY family . then he is a traitor . Yes he gave valuable intel to "WE THE PEOPLE"

BUT What else is he willing to give up. You talk like he was your brother or something. You dont know this man. You may be right I might be right.  We will see.

 

Wasn't my first reaction it was my 3rd or 4th now I can definitly say they need to shut this guy up. Period.

Just my opinion   With respect 

 

 I hope your right

Edited June 27, 2013 by dog53

[10 YEARS LATER]

A white boy gets his own back on an Uncle Tom. Boy am I gonna heat on this. Satire folks, just satire. I won't hide behind it, it is what it is.

[thegente]

Dog, I may be many things but naive simply isnNt one of them. I'm 45, grew up on the streets since I was 14 (in very rough neighborhoods), and have seen the better part of the world my friend. My reason for forming the opinion I have is simple deduction...had Snowden wanted to majorly profit and hurt the US and it's citizens, he could have done so in a variety of different ways that would have not involved exposing himself as he had. To me a person motivated by greed and hatred of his country would have done so in secrecy, and made sure he had an exit already prepared and his defection to another country set up and waiting. I may be wrong, but I'm a pretty good judge of character, something that's saved my life more than once. I will admit, I could be 180 degrees off on this, only time will tell. Hopefully I am right for all our sakes bud...

[jonjon]

Its no accident that the press is focused on the flight and the pursuit of Edward Snowden, while the pervasiveness and legality of the NSA spying programs gets little widespread attention. This is by design - there is a concerted effort to magnify the "damage done" by Snowden's disclosures, and minimize any scrutiny given to whether the NSA has egregiously stretched the law's boundaries far beyond what was intended and authorized by the FISA and Patriot Act. The administration and security establishment have vigorously worked to discredit Snowden, to minimize the impact of the disclosures, which, whether truly damaging in any major way, are certainly an embarrassment to admit. The illusion of safety promoted by politicians and the security/military/industrial complex behind the scenes, all of whom benefit greatly by keeping Americans in fear of "the terrorists" while keeping Americans uninformed about just how deep the erosion of individual civil rights in the name of security has been. So long as this "safety of the public" scaremongering continues, both political parties benefit by keeping Americans clueless about how deeply penetrated their "private" communications and "private" economic choices have been by the government, without choice, informed consent, or recourse... there will be no relief from our elected representatives, as Democrats and Republicans close ranks to prevent reductions in the massive spending for the "safety of the nation." Meanwhile, millions are aborted, thousands die of medical malpractice,  thousands die by violence each year, thousands die at the hands of drunk drivers, tobacco and alcohol kill tens of thousands... yet no massive government effort exists to "protect the American public's safety" from these hazards. Its purely political expediency, a sellout of the Bill of Rights for selfish spying power by all involved. Who Watches the Watchers?

 

[Thaiexpat]

I think some people need to look-up the definition of: traitor and espionage. If Snowden was a spy for someone else, why didn't he go to those people FIRST. Whom did he tell-THE AMERICAN PEOPLE. Therefore, if we use those definitions, WE, the people, are the enemy to the State apparatus! Does that sound right? Doesn't to me. In my eyes, he is a HERO. He told us what is going on-which is illegal (to some degree). Now, I am not against spying on those OUTSIDE the states-we've done that for decades, but I do have a major problem with warrantless, domestic spying w/o a cause upon US citizens. If it is all legal, a warrant would be easy to issue and the FISA courts would approve of such actions. Dunno, just saying....Peace  

[jonjon]