Whats the hold up?

[dinarck]

ya right ,,they cant lop either .. they cant because of inflation .. ..

you change your entire structure of buying and salarys .. the same way whether you lop or rv .. no inflation.. thats for dummies .... you dont charge 90 thousand dollars for a barrel of oil ..like dinark says you will .

iraq doesnt have a fiat currency right now .. they have a currency backed by reserves ..

what iraq is doing as we speak is creating a fiat currency system for their country . ..

all those trillions of dinars in the cbi .. will be in the incinerator .. and what will be left is the reserves .. they will use digital banking and finance a rv for outstandiing dinars as well as financing the new dinars ,, ,, we .. everyone but dinark are going to be rich ,, dinark is going to be laying down in a grocery store isle .. crying and kicking his feet .. like a 2 year old .. you cant do that !!!!!.. you cant do that!!!! .. wah!///wah!!!!

and please no questions from you lopsters .. if you cant figure it out ask each other ,, try it .. talk to each other .. your smart .. you got alot in common.. i want to see you lopsters .. chatting away .. in agreement on something,, all you do is argue with people .. trying to get info .. like somene is going to come along and feed you intel if you are on the attack .. i dont think anyone actually wants to help you .. they just take swipes at you when their bored ...freekin lopsters . ill be back next month to punch around some more .. in the mean time .. you lopsters should talk to each other ... or is it too hard to have a conversation with yourself .. fake high fives . dont count .. anyone can do that .. .anyone can go sign up a new name .. and have two log on names or three ,, and open up two or three applications of dv .. and have all three names in a room at the same time ,,on one computer at their home .. pretending like your three different people ,, and gang up on individuals.. heck this lopster link sat for 3 weeks .. no lopsters . then all the sudden all three of you are back .. did you all go on vacation together .. ?/ you would think at least one of you would of been here , but nope its either all three of you lopsters or none ..are in this room ..or on stand bye at the tip of your fingers ready to log on .. your characters for bullying individuals ,, because on your own ,, you cannot handle it .. you must pretend like you have a small army of lopsters ready to attack any time .. ..

i would say if you kept the same currency and your fiat system was already in place ,, you really cannot change it after that .. your stuck with what you got ..but right now iraq .. has nothing to worry about with this bremmer dinar .. its disposable :moon-from-car:/>

the united states is trying to stop our money growth .. . once it gets to a certain point .. it cannot be stopped ... iraq may just have the most modern money system ever developed when they impliment it .. maybe something sustainable ...

oh wait

im sorry

what

dinark said no

no you they cannot too..

yes they do not :salute:/>

silly lopsters .. they all go to bed at the same time . they get up together .. they battle together . only thing they dont do is talk to each other

So they are going to destroy tens of trillions of dinar and then RV the rest? Do you even hear yourself?

The rest of your rant is conspiracy garbage typical of delusioned RV believers.

[dontlop]

So they are going to destroy tens of trillions of dinar and then RV the rest? Do you even hear yourself?

The rest of your rant is conspiracy garbage typical of delusioned RV believers.

its funny .. how if one went to foums page and hold your mouse curser over a members name .. it tells you what time they logged in ..

today as sual all three lopsters logged in with 5 minutes of each other .. do you dinark .. make cents .. and fib .. work together in some kind of shrill employment and start work at the same time ?

or do you live together .. or call each other up so you can all log on at the same time each day .... one logged in at 9:01 a.m. ...one at 9.03a.m. //./.and one at 9:07a.m. .. its amazing how you guys co ordinate your log in times and all head straighgt to the lopster room for battle .. lol your not that smart ..are ya ?

[dinarck]

Pros & Cons help when the rate fluctuates. That is just how it works.

For example, when the dollar gains value, we see cheaper prices when we fill up our vehicles and cheaper prices of imported goods. With that mentality, a strong valued currency is a good thing. When the value drops against foreign currencies, foreign goods become more expensive, i.e., higher gas bills, higher food bills, and imported goods cost more.

So if the IQD rises, imported items become more appealing. Just because the average citizen has the ability to purchase items that are imported, doesn't mean that a supply/demand factor will play into it and once things are gone the prices themselves simply shoot up.. No, they'll simply supply more goods (imports) to fulfill the need desired by those with higher buying powers.

Which sort of brings me back to where I spoke about the Private sector... It can be a catch-22 situation, a private sector may need a solid amount of imports to thrive, yet the need/desire for imports may need a private sector to create the demand. Chicken & the egg argument..... Which needs to come first?

If the country itself becomes too dependent on imports, a private sector may never grow because the demand is met by foreign supply (meaning no internal creation). Why farm if your importing food? Why create your own goods if your simply importing them? However, at the same time, a business may need to import the necessities to get up and running... (I.e., a restaurant may need to order ovens, silverware, computers, registers, etc or a retail store may need to import goods to put on the shelves..)

Why so much talk about imports?They play a vital role on exchange rates... Banks, countries, and businesses don't just exchange currencies for the fun of it, they do so to meet needs, and the exchange rates help allow exchanges.

Sure a higher valued currency makes imports more appealing. Does that mean Iraq can have a RV of 1000s of percent to acquire cheaper imports? Absolutely not. If so they would have done it years ago. So would every country with a hyperinflated currency.

Don't forget about their hyperinflated M2. 72 trillion leaves no room really for anything other than a RD. Your opinion is that they can reduce that M2 by a significant enough amount to somehow RV by a significant enough amount to make a difference on imports. My opinion is that you are correct. They can RD and be on par with the dollar any time they are ready. That makes 72 trillion 72 billion. I would say that is pretty significant.

its funny .. how if one went to foums page and hold your mouse curser over a members name .. it tells you what time they logged in ..

today as sual all three lopsters logged in with 5 minutes of each other .. do you dinark .. make cents .. and fib .. work together in some kind of shrill employment and start work at the same time ?

or do you live together .. or call each other up so you can all log on at the same time each day .... one logged in at 9:01 a.m. ...one at 9.03a.m. //./.and one at 9:07a.m. .. its amazing how you guys co ordinate your log in times and all head straighgt to the lopster room for battle .. lol your not that smart ..are ya ? :ph34r:/>

More conspiracy ignorance. Yawn

[makecents]

ya right ,,they cant lop either .. they cant because of inflation .. ..

you change your entire structure of buying and salarys .. the same way whether you lop or rv .. no inflation.. thats for dummies ....

A redenomination does not change the value of anything nor of peopl's buying power its just an accounting convenience, so no inflation. A huge RV gives vastly greater buying power chasing (at least initially) the same amount of products, so anything that is at all in demand will shoot up in (relative) price (i.e. inflation) as now people have plenty of money to pay extra to get whatever supply is available. This effect will reduce for somethings where the supply can be increased, but not for others where it is more difficult. i.e. If bread is 5,000 IQD per loaf now, after a $0.10 RV the vendor will quickly lower it to 40 IQD, but now buyers have 120 times their "bread budget", so if its in short supply they can easily pay double the RV-ized amount, say 80 (RV'ed) IQD. That's inflation in action. The harder and slower things are to import so the supply is low, the higher the prices will go.

A couple of posts back you asserted that things I said about 10T IQD in cash (its really 28T so I was wrong, but not in the way I think you meant) and 125B in debt were false and I should offer docs to support my claims. I did so. But no reply? Will you admit you were wrong?

And "cash in the CBI will be in the incinerator" is moot. Cash in the CBI (in the CBI's own accounts not in accounts of member banks) is irrelevant as they can print all they want. Its 28T in cash OUTSIDE of banks (including the CBI) that counts, as well as the additional 34T in on demand deposits and additional 10T in non-demand deposits (i.e. M1 of 62T and M2 of 72T)

its funny .. how if one went to foums page and hold your mouse curser over a members name .. it tells you what time they logged in ..

I don't know what you mean, I get no such effect. In any case what the profile shows is time last active. I leave my account logged in all the time, its just easier.

Why not elevate the conversation and stop hurling slurs against others and remain on topic?

[Captjohn]

Iraq's current currency situation is paralleled by few if any other nations historically. The dinar was artificially lowered by the US, IMF, and UN in response to the invasion of Kuwait. Reinstating it to its previous level through an RV would be just that; not a huge artificial increase in value, but a reinstatement to its previous level. That's the only logical reason many of us are in this investment. If you want huge gains without the benefit of historical perspective, take your money to Vegas and put it on red.

[RVPleaseToday]

Captjohn, you can't reinstate a currency that no longer exists. The Dinar we hold has never been worth much.

Edited January 16, 2013 by RVPleaseToday

[dinarck]

Iraq's current currency situation is paralleled by few if any other nations historically. The dinar was artificially lowered by the US, IMF, and UN in response to the invasion of Kuwait. Reinstating it to its previous level through an RV would be just that; not a huge artificial increase in value, but a reinstatement to its previous level. That's the only logical reason many of us are in this investment. If you want huge gains without the benefit of historical perspective, take your money to Vegas and put it on red.

Common misconception. The dinar was devalued due to Saddam spending all of his reserves and then going on a printing spree in an attempt to fund the Iraq Iran war.

[dontlop]

A redenomination does not change the value of anything nor of peopl's buying power its just an accounting convenience, so no inflation. A huge RV gives vastly greater buying power chasing (at least initially) the same amount of products, so anything that is at all in demand will shoot up in (relative) price (i.e. inflation) as now people have plenty of money to pay extra to get whatever supply is available. This effect will reduce for somethings where the supply can be increased, but not for others where it is more difficult. i.e. If bread is 5,000 IQD per loaf now, after a $0.10 RV the vendor will quickly lower it to 40 IQD, but now buyers have 120 times their "bread budget", so if its in short supply they can easily pay double the RV-ized amount, say 80 (RV'ed) IQD. That's inflation in action. The harder and slower things are to import so the supply is low, the higher the prices will go.

A couple of posts back you asserted that things I said about 10T IQD in cash (its really 28T so I was wrong, but not in the way I think you meant) and 125B in debt were false and I should offer docs to support my claims. I did so. But no reply? Will you admit you were wrong?

And "cash in the CBI will be in the incinerator" is moot. Cash in the CBI (in the CBI's own accounts not in accounts of member banks) is irrelevant as they can print all they want. Its 28T in cash OUTSIDE of banks (including the CBI) that counts, as well as the additional 34T in on demand deposits and additional 10T in non-demand deposits (i.e. M1 of 62T and M2 of 72T)

I don't know what you mean, I get no such effect. In any case what the profile shows is time last active. I leave my account logged in all the time, its just easier.

Why not elevate the conversation and stop hurling slurs against others and remain on topic?

nope i clicked on all three profile pages .. ya all left last night ,, ya all returned today .. at around 9 oclock .. your last posts were last nigt.. your next posts . were after you logged in. at 9 0clock .. ya i smell a conspiracy all right .. lol .. i thought you guys live off conflict ..after all .. athiests dont go to church . they dont believe in god .. you come here but you dont believe in this ..you must be here for conflict

[hame55]

Iraq's current currency situation is paralleled by few if any other nations historically. The dinar was artificially lowered by the US, IMF, and UN in response to the invasion of Kuwait. Reinstating it to its previous level through an RV would be just that; not a huge artificial increase in value, but a reinstatement to its previous level. That's the only logical reason many of us are in this investment. If you want huge gains without the benefit of historical perspective, take your money to Vegas and put it on red.

Exactly.

And why is this so hard to grasp? It's a simple idea - the money was lowered in value by intl. banks and invading powers (same thing?) and when the dust settles 10 years later....

VOILA! It gets reinstated. I just don't think they counted on so much internet sales in the intervening years since 2003 where so many peons such as US make money too.

Fleas on the money dog...I say.

Common? misconception. The dinar was devalued due to Saddam spending all of his reserves and then going on a printing spree in an attempt to fund the Iraq Iran war.

So, if this is true - devalue due to war - then the new IQD Bremer dinars were exchanged 1 to 1 with the old, trillions overprinted Saddam dinar?

Just wanted to get this straight.

Because it doesn't seem logical to start a new currency - but transfer the same hyperinflation problem to the new currency.

Get my drift? So what really happened there? This knowledge is critical to the investment (unless you believe auctions have been taking in dinar to the CBI for years)

Edited January 16, 2013 by hame55

[makecents]

nope i clicked on all three profile pages .. ya all left last night ,, ya all returned today .. at around 9 oclock .. your last posts were last nigt.. your next posts . were after you logged in. at 9 0clock .. ya i smell a conspiracy all right .. lol :lol:/> .. i thought you guys live off conflict ..after all .. athiests dont go to church . they dont believe in god .. you come here but you dont believe in this ..you must be here for conflict

I don't know where you get this. The profile page shows "last active" not when you are logged in. I've left my account logged in for several days.

But why don't you respond on topic? Because you can not of course.

So, if this is true - devalue due to war - then the new IQD Bremer dinars were exchanged 1 to 1 with the old, trillions overprinted Saddam dinar?

Just wanted to get this straight.

Because it doesn't seem logical to start a new currency - but transfer the same hyperinflation problem to the new currency.

Get my drift? So what really happened there? This knowledge is critical to the investment (unless you believe auctions have been taking in dinar to the CBI for years)

Yes this is what they did. Why? I can't say for sure but I'd guess just to make it easy. Starting up an economy is a difficult task and likely would have caused upset with the Iraqi's if they tired to do an RD at that time (i.e. giving 1 new IQD for 1000 old ones, and the new ones being exchanged at a much higher value). They didn't have time to educate the population about it. The auctions do take dinars out of circulation (at least when its dollars that are sold, they sell both at times I believe), in exact proportion to the decrease in reserves (so it doesn't help the exchange rate directly), but they just circulate around. If you add up all the auction amounts its far more than the money supply, so some path putting the dinars back into circulation clearly exists or they would have run the money supply down to zero years ago. Instead the money supply keeps growing (and so do reserves so the exchange rate remains stable).

[Darin]

Sure a higher valued currency makes imports more appealing. Does that mean Iraq can have a RV of 1000s of percent to acquire cheaper imports? Absolutely not. If so they would have done it years ago. So would every country with a hyperinflated currency.

Don't forget about their hyperinflated M2. 72 trillion leaves no room really for anything other than a RD. Your opinion is that they can reduce that M2 by a significant enough amount to somehow RV by a significant enough amount to make a difference on imports. My opinion is that you are correct. They can RD and be on par with the dollar any time they are ready. That makes 72 trillion 72 billion. I would say that is pretty significant.

More conspiracy ignorance. Yawn

You keep stating that if it can be done, everyone would do it. The problem is right in front of everyone's eyes and simply just needs to be addressed. Reduce the M2, strengthen the value, and raise the rate.

Yes, they could R/D, and it is a very possible threat to speculators. But, how many speculators are out there? They increase every day and they become a strong threat to the reserves of the CBI. What do you think members on this board will do once a R/D is official? They'll exchange back to USD and forget about IQD. And that could be a rather huge hit to the reserves. I wonder how many other countries that were about to R/D were highly speculated to raise their currency prior to the R/D and had a great amount of speculation going against them?

[makecents]

You keep stating that if it can be done, everyone would do it. The problem is right in front of everyone's eyes and simply just needs to be addressed. Reduce the M2, strengthen the value, and raise the rate.

Yes, they could R/D, and it is a very possible threat to speculators. But, how many speculators are out there? They increase every day and they become a strong threat to the reserves of the CBI. What do you think members on this board will do once a R/D is official? They'll exchange back to USD and forget about IQD. And that could be a rather huge hit to the reserves. I wonder how many other countries that were about to R/D were highly speculated to raise their currency prior to the R/D and had a great amount of speculation going against them?

Even if speculators had a huge amount compared to M2 it would not matter. I doubt there is more then 1T in the hands of speculators, but no matter how much there is, doing an exchange after an RD is no more a threat to the CBIs reserves as exchanging now. The IQD (or IQN) that come in are exactly matched by the dollars that go out. An RV on the other hand is a huge problem exactly due to not maintaining that balance. The $68B or so USD in the CBIs reserves exactly machines the 75T or so IQD at the current exchange rate. If that rate is increased (even by 2x let alone 1000x) there simply is insufficient reserves to back their money supply.

There is lots of (silly, as I see it) talk about how for speculators the dinars will be held by the Fed (at least for the US), but even if such schemes were true (which I find wildly unlikely) they won't help exchanges from inside Iraq when they want to buy stuff from other countries with their newly RV'd wealth. The CBI would be shown to be insolvent in seconds after such an event. Which is why there never will be such an event.

[Darin]

Even if speculators had a huge amount compared to M2 it would not matter. I doubt there is more then 1T in the hands of speculators, but no matter how much there is, doing an exchange after an RD is no more a threat to the CBIs reserves as exchanging now. The IQD (or IQN) that come in are exactly matched by the dollars that go out. An RV on the other hand is a huge problem exactly due to not maintaining that balance. The $68B or so USD in the CBIs reserves exactly machines the 75T or so IQD at the current exchange rate. If that rate is increased (even by 2x let alone 1000x) there simply is insufficient reserves to back their money supply.

There is lots of (silly, as I see it) talk about how for speculators the dinars will be held by the Fed (at least for the US), but even if such schemes were true (which I find wildly unlikely) they won't help exchanges from inside Iraq when they want to buy stuff from other countries with their newly RV'd wealth. The CBI would be shown to be insolvent in seconds after such an event. Which is why there never will be such an event.

Your right, every IQD out there is backed 100% by liquid reserves... But, on a global scale I think speculators do make up a very large portion of IQD outside of banks. And the CBI values how much their reserves have risen over the years that a R/D would give that reserve a significant cut.

With a high level of poverty, a preference of USD over IQD within the market place, and likely a majority of the surrounding countries holding IQD to assist in goods/services exchanges I am sure a lot of the currency may be out of the control of the CBI.

[makecents]

Your right, every IQD out there is backed 100% by liquid reserves... But, on a global scale I think speculators do make up a very large portion of IQD outside of banks. And the CBI values how much their reserves have risen over the years that a R/D would give that reserve a significant cut.

So among the biggest sellers is DinarBanker and they reported a while back that they had done 1B IQD. So 1T would be 1,000 times that amount which seems like a lot to me. There is 28T outside of banks, so that would be 3.5% or so of physical cash. But even if its higher how does an RD threaten the reserves? The important aspect is the ratio of IQD to reserves and that won't change with 1T or even a few T come in after the RD. Also the CBI backs ALL IQD, not just physical cash but the full M2 of 75T or so. So on that score even if speculators have 3T its only 4%.

With a high level of poverty, a preference of USD over IQD within the market place, and likely a majority of the surrounding countries holding IQD to assist in goods/services exchanges I am sure a lot of the currency may be out of the control of the CBI.

I don't know what you mean by "control of the CBI'. The 28T in cash outside of banks is all outside of the control of the CBI (actually by now its likely more like 30 or 32T since the 28T was the Dec 2011 figure). Edited January 16, 2013 by makecents

[dontlop]

You keep stating that if it can be done, everyone would do it. The problem is right in front of everyone's eyes and simply just needs to be addressed. Reduce the M2, strengthen the value, and raise the rate.

Yes, they could R/D, and it is a very possible threat to speculators. But, how many speculators are out there? They increase every day and they become a strong threat to the reserves of the CBI. What do you think members on this board will do once a R/D is official? They'll exchange back to USD and forget about IQD. And that could be a rather huge hit to the reserves. I wonder how many other countries that were about to R/D were highly speculated to raise their currency prior to the R/D and had a great amount of speculation going against them?

iraq is starting over with an entirely new economic system and redenominationof their currency ..and it has around 20 trillion dollars worth of just proven oil reserves sitting in shallow under ground pockets ..its not like its necessary to extract all their oil commodities and put it in a bank for storage .. like you would gold commodities in fort knox .. they have all the contractors they will ever need to pump as much oil as they need to back up and pay for any debt iraq aquires.. but they think everyone should be able to do what iraq does .. well they would have to show us their proven oil reserves if they want treated the same way iraq is treated . iraq isnt every other country . their are some thick skulls out their i wouldnt waste too much time . just verbally punch em a couple times and sit back and watch em respond .. its comical .

[Darin]

So among the biggest sellers is DinarBanker and they reported a while back that they had done 1B IQD. So 1T would be 1,000 times that amount which seems like a lot to me. There is 28T outside of banks, so its 5% or so of cash. But even if its higher how does an RD threaten the reserves? The important aspect is the ratio of IQD to reserves and that won't change with 1T or even a few T come in after the RD. Also the CBI backs ALL IQD, not just physical cash but the full M2 of 75T or so. So on that score even if speculators have 3T its only 4%.

I don't know what you mean by "control of the CBI'. The 28T in cash outside of banks is all outside of the control of the CBI (actually by now its likely more like 30 or 32T since the 28T was the Dec 2011 figure).

Your stating figures from one dealer alone. Keep in mind the following, you've stated that it was some time ago and they had reportedly sold about 1 billion IQD to that point. Lets not forget other dealers, such as DinarTrade and also banks themselves. Than we have to consider those that have went the digital accounting way and created Warka accounts. But even with a high speculation, I would still argue that a lot of the IQD could simply be held by neighboring countries to help provide the services to those that use IQD. (I.e., merchants, businesses, and banks)

So for every speculated dinar that is cashed out, the reserves have the appropriate funds to pay for them. The dinar in itself is a liability to the CBI, as it is like an IOU note, so to speak or credits.Lets say that a value of 25 trillion is held by speculators in some form or fashion (now this # is arguable high, but I am using it for a simple reference #). Also, to keep the numbers more simple, we'll assume that 1,000 IQD = $1.

Now out of that 25 Trillion that is converted to USD (Or other forms of liquid payment, i.e. gold, euros, etc). some of this will be cash, some of this will be cashed out bank accounts, and so forth.

That 25 Trillion dinar is roughly 25 Billion US in value. The CBI reserves are reduced by 25 Billion US, but the ratio their M2 is reduced is affected equally. Their M2 goes down 25 Trillion as well. Pretty even exchange, but the problem still remains of reduced reserves.

Reserves play a pretty vital role in itself.. They show a country's ability to repay debt and provide a security wall to defend their currency. Their reserves also play a factor in the country's credit rating...

So, if a R/D were to result in 25T dinars being exchanged for USD or equivalent, would that be a wise thing to do? In the end the remaining dinar will still be able to be backed by the same rate for the most part, but the reserves are reduced significantly while the supply of dinar was reduced significantly.

Also, the longer it takes them to R/D, the more people who may buy in based upon speculation... So now we see a LOP dillema... The longer they put it off, the more damage it could cause. So why not just do it? Maybe they've realized this is an issue and are looking for alternatives.

[dontlop]

the united states issues themselves credit .. yet they only have 46 billion in their reserves , but they have issued themselves over 6 trillion in credit over the past 5 years .. .

fiat currencys are not what people think they are ,,

japan just released they will issue 50 trillion yen .. to themselves .. it was posted today .. 50 trillion yen .. to themselves ..

iraq will join the crowd son .. their sick of being broke .. they wnt released from the un .. ch 7 ..

[makecents]

Your stating figures from one dealer alone. Keep in mind the following, you've stated that it was some time ago and they had reportedly sold about 1 billion IQD to that point. Lets not forget other dealers, such as DinarTrade and also banks themselves. Than we have to consider those that have went the digital accounting way and created Warka accounts. But even with a high speculation, I would still argue that a lot of the IQD could simply be held by neighboring countries to help provide the services to those that use IQD. (I.e., merchants, businesses, and banks)

So for every speculated dinar that is cashed out, the reserves have the appropriate funds to pay for them. The dinar in itself is a liability to the CBI, as it is like an IOU note, so to speak or credits.Lets say that a value of 25 trillion is held by speculators in some form or fashion (now this # is arguable high, but I am using it for a simple reference #). Also, to keep the numbers more simple, we'll assume that 1,000 IQD = $1.

Now out of that 25 Trillion that is converted to USD (Or other forms of liquid payment, i.e. gold, euros, etc). some of this will be cash, some of this will be cashed out bank accounts, and so forth.

That 25 Trillion dinar is roughly 25 Billion US in value. The CBI reserves are reduced by 25 Billion US, but the ratio their M2 is reduced is affected equally. Their M2 goes down 25 Trillion as well. Pretty even exchange, but the problem still remains of reduced reserves.

I understand that you were just using 25T as a overstated example, but I see no way that speculators have bought anything close to $25B USD wroth of dinars. Lets say DinarBanker has done another 1.5B IQD since that statement a year or so ago. Do they represent only 1 percent of 1 percent of the IQD business? That would mean that the overall IQD trade for speculators is 10,000 times bigger than what DinarBanker has sold. That seems very very unlikely to me.

25T IQD would indeed be a call on about 30% of the CBI's reserves and 80+% of all IQD in cash. And as you say the reserves are important in their own right in addition to backing the currency. As for neighboring countries keeping IQD to service import/export businesses I think its mostly the other way around as Iraq exports very little. You pay for imports in the currency of origin, except for oil. In any case whatever is used for import/export will just keep going as is after an RD. It will be conducted in the new currency eventually but it won't be cashed out so to speak unless the import/export businesses it was servicing go away which also seems very unlikely.

Reserves play a pretty vital role in itself.. They show a country's ability to repay debt and provide a security wall to defend their currency. Their reserves also play a factor in the country's credit rating...

So, if a R/D were to result in 25T dinars being exchanged for USD or equivalent, would that be a wise thing to do? In the end the remaining dinar will still be able to be backed by the same rate for the most part, but the reserves are reduced significantly while the supply of dinar was reduced significantly.

Also, the longer it takes them to R/D, the more people who may buy in based upon speculation... So now we see a LOP dillema... The longer they put it off, the more damage it could cause. So why not just do it? Maybe they've realized this is an issue and are looking for alternatives.

However big of a problem this would be for an RD, its X times that problem for an RV that multiples the exchange rate by X. They don't have to RD of course, other countries have been very successful while having an exchange rate similar to Iraq's (e.g. South Korea). The good thing about an RD would be that it would put an end to the RV speculation and maybe save some folks from losing yet more money to the IQD seller-pumper-scammers (e.g. DinarBanker).

the united states issues themselves credit .. yet they only have 46 billion in their reserves , but they have issued themselves over 6 trillion in credit over the past 5 years .. .

fiat currencys are not what people think they are

They certainly are not what you think they are. The Yen and the USD float, so their value is set by the market, not by whatever the Fed (or Japanese central bank) say. As long as the IQD is pegged, it is the CBI that must back it. If they let it float it will fall in value not go up. Even if huge RV's existed for pegged currencies (which they don't of course), they clearly do not exist for floating currencies.

And are you ever going to reply to previous posts, or should I just take it you concede on all points?

[dontlop]

In a late-2012 announcement, outgoing Bank of Japan leader Masaaki Shirakawa indicated an aggressive easing program that would total 50 trillion yen over the next year or so.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/100377532

i guess they cant do that .. the united states cant print up 2.5 trillion new dollars in the last 4 years either ..or the us cant just print 40 billion dollars every month out of thin air till further notice either . with no interest ,, hmm ..they borrowed the money from themselves .. so i guess they can tell themselves .. they are going to pay themselves either .. maybe they will give themselves all the ripped up worn out dollars as they are returned to the treasury .. after they grind them up .. oops they cant grind up their own curency and still keep the rest of the currency ..

Edited January 16, 2013 by dontlop

[makecents]

In a late-2012 announcement, outgoing Bank of Japan leader Masaaki Shirakawa indicated an aggressive easing program that would total 50 trillion yen over the next year or so.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/100377532

i guess they cant do that .. the united states cant print up 2.5 trillion new dollars in the last 4 years either ..or the us cant just print 40 billion dollars every month out of thin air till further notice either . with no interest ,, hmm ..they borrowed the money from themselves .. so i guess they can tell themselves .. they are going to pay themselves either .. maybe they will give themselves all the ripped up worn out dollars as they are returned to the treasury .. after they grind them up .. oops they cant grind up their own curency and still keep the rest of the currency ..

What? Quantitative Easing is not setting an exchange rate. Its an attempt (not a very successful one these days) to impact interest rates by adding cash to the system. If you let your currency float, then the only way to try and exert influence is to add or subtract money into the system. The only way to set your exchange rate is if you peg and hence back it, not let it float. Indeed printing all the money the US has in the last years has caused our exchange rate to go down some, but everyone else is doing the same so the impact is not that great.

Why not surprise us all and actually respond on topic? Or do you want to just admit that your arguments are too weak to allow that?

[jpdinar]

they are waiting for you to throw in the towel, then they will RV.

[dontlop]

program rates are for minitoring purposes only .. after the monitoring takes place for a set time period .. those poor countrys are determined their currencys worth .. most didnt have any worth to speak of and the exchange rates dropped off or stayed the same ..

in the case of iraq .. its late in the game and they are making good progress to show what they have to offer to the world as far as steady income ..

its all the stolen money and illegal activities that are laundering their dinars on the streets that are holding back a revualation .. the drug trade .. gun runnning .. illegal trade based on smuggling .. they get paid billions of dinars .. do ya think they will go put those dinars into the bank .. or are they laundered ../

if a al kieda group robbed a hundred million dinars ,, they would sell them on the street for less .. just like mafia used to launder money in the us ..80 cents on the dollar and invest in legit purposes ..

as long as the cbi keeps selling at the program rate .. it stablizes the dinar rate .. the launderers willl continue losing money .. .. the alkieda thieves may sell a hundred million dinars for 8o grand ...in us dollars .. then use those dollars to support illegal activities . including terrorism..

eventually alll the illegal activities will be cut back to a sustainable level .. laundering will go down ..the dinar will stablize .. then they can rv ,, if they rv now with billions in the hands of corrupt people .. corruption will become richer and grow ..

they had to grow law enforcement first ..

i think iraq is doing better this year than last year .. and last year was better than the year before .. its all being monitored ..but in the end iraq will beat the bad guys .. .. their dinars will become more valuable ..al kieda will move on to another war torn country and exploit its vulnerabbilities , steal everything it can .... ..its already started to happen .. theres way more corruption in egypt .. syria ,, libya .. than in iraq now days .. it wasnt like that 5 years ago ..iraq is breaking free ..that is americas goal to set up a prospering thriving democratic country in the midst of the middle east .. its slowly methodically being accomplished ..

when they feel they can handle the over load . they will rv ..

ok

whats key here ....and iraq knows it ..is

to get as much of its currency outside of its borders as it can .. that way when it rvs ,,no one will complain ..

do ya think that if iraq rvs to 3 dollars .. and theres 1 trillion dinars in the united states,,, worth 3 trillion dollars .. and it ends up in our treasury . do ya think the united states will be opposing the rate..?

or do ya think the us would be working out a deal in the wto .. to exchange it in little by little for oil or what ever products we bought from iraq..

so without going all out and advertising a huge rv ,, where all the rich guys would buy up all avaliable dinar .. they spread the wealth around by putting out bits and peices to make it only a speculative investment ..and do it covertly in a way that no rich greedy person would risk their money on speculation .. they tend to invest in solid secure investments .. they couldnt bbear ever losing their wealth and living as a commoner once they are rich ...

so say iraq has a goal to get 5% of its currency spread across the globe .. then rv ..whats that about 3.5 trillion dinars .. 5%

so they rv at a dime at the same time eliminating 90% of their dinars electronically ,, ..350 billion dollars worth at the rate of a dime each ..... sell off the oil for say 2 years to regain the majority of the dinars valued at a dime . and then rv again to 3 bucks .... paying all their costs for the rv and profiting to the tune of a couple trillion dollars .. all of which would be sitting in the cbi of course .. as reserves ..

or do ya think they think .. that they should have all the dinars in their own hands and try to get an rv accepted globally ..

i think they are better off spreading it around before they rv ,

..

with chinas billion population,, thats around 10,000 per capita gdp .. iraq is going to surpass that per capita gdp .. if not this year ,, next year ..chinas gdp is diluted amongest a billion people .. they arent that rich .. in china

heres you dinark >>> Iraq has no manufacturing. No factories. No skilled work force. No infrastructure. They are still shooting and blowing each other up.

Read more:

i especially like that .. it proves you dont know what words definitions are .. its a simple word .. two letters .. no .. whats so hard about it .. your like clinton with his ..is ... thing ..

here this proves you wrong .. study for a second .. its just one example for ya dinark .. you should do alittle reasearch

The company originated during the Ottoman Empire in

1910 by the trading business of Haj Mahmood Jassim Al Bunnia. >> http://www.al-bunnia.com/HMBS.pdf <<< theres lots of pictures so you wont get confused

,,

i know .. im not good at bringing fourth every detail to cover every question that could arise form every scenario possible to every situation .. thats eternal in speculating .. but what i think a possibility is .. they dont just delete them .. they convert them to the new dinar with the same value at 1000 to one ..just for their electronic dinars they they hold in the cbi .. that would mean they lose not a penny on their transaction.. .. im sorry if you were offended ..

i will post things that some how would make people think of possibilities .. and open up a discussion .. only problem is on this thread in the lopster bin .. you just get attacked for posting theoretical speculatory observations and posibilities .

if they are going to rv like some people say . it would have to be in some ..unorthadox fashion .. it could not happen by using everyday banking procedures ....its called creative financing

if they had 72 billion dollars worth of dinars when they started . and 60 billion were electronic in the cbi .. they could exchange those for 60 billion in new dinars . and still rv thae other ten billion dollars worth or 10 trillion dinars .. at 10 cents ..at a cost of 1 trillion dollars of debt .. or pay 1 cent at a cost of 100 billion in debt ..most countrys that use fiat currencys carry debts .. ..

this is not something i read .. its just an analogy of something unorthadox .. but to try to post simple analogys . i cant write a book every time i post something .. just so i can avoid attacks .. sometimes people need to just use their own brains .. im sure after this response ill be asked even more questions .. then more questions after i respond to them .. eventually i just turn away from the questioners .. i post my theorys .. and if people dont agree .. thats fine .. who cares .. ..but if there was a link .. or something in print .. i would go directly to the news area and post that news .. all the other areas .. i spout out openly .. but as you can see some people think thats illegal . and they want to take a person down for speculative theorizations .. i just laugh it off .. i cant help it if they dont have any imagination .... if you want news ....seriuosly.... try the news section .. this section is for lopsters .. they have no crediility either .. unless you think that this world is non corrupt ...and everything is on the up and up and always has been ..especially in iraq ..i hope they do something wrong over there and try to scam the world and i get in on it ..and make millions too,, at least ill get back some of the costs for the us for what we spent liberating iraq .. i think they owe us a few bucks at least ..if they do .. im getting some of it .. and will bring it back home..

everyone knows everything these lopsters know about iraq.. everything ..

we are looking at other posibilities . especially at how much debt iraq will take on to make their country prosper ..that debt will back their dinar .. fiat currencys are not backed by anything but credit and dept .. your ability to pay your debts ... over a set time frame .. in govt those time frames could be a hundred years to pay down debts ..some people think if they take out debts they got to pay them back in a year .. or 5 years . .. nope... the debt they hold can be forever ..they sell bonds .. they pay interest . iraq pays 2 dollars a barrel for their oil to be pumped out of the ground .. they sell it for 93 dollars a barrel ..they have a heftty profit margin.. they are also growing their other bases like manufacturing .. agriculture .. which cuts down on import costs .. each year iraq frees up more and more of their debt...

im wondering will they take on 1 trillion in debt to finance a revaluation of their currency ..will it be 3,5 trillion .. who knows what its going to take to run iraq efficiently .. to run a military .. a education dept a banking sector .. a transportation dept .. / .. id say alot more than the state of california .. which has a one trillion dollars gdp.. but their major depts are covered by our federal govt. .. they dont have to provide a navy ,, air force ... ect. / .. id say iraq would do well with a 3.5 trillion dollar financial system ..and i think they could finance that ..

dont forget the united states and britan has been setting this up ..they dont think small.

the truth is i dont have a clue what iraq is going to do .. we will find out when the new currency hits the streets .. then and only then will anyone know for sure ..what the exchange rates will be for the bremmer dinar note we hold ... only the lopsters claim they know what is going to happen in iraq .. and we all know they dont know either ..

its all in financing ,, not in what they have right now.. they dont have much debt right now ....this we do know

.. new to this site to be a lopster .. lol .. so nothing will work .. theres no such thing as taking on debt to finance a higher valued dinar ,, thats what a fiat currency is .. they are not using a commodity based currency in iraq ..its not a gold standard .. which every note is backed by something .. its backed by credit .. just like my credit cards are .. i have nothing but i can have something for it .. even though its not backed up .. i back my debts (currency).. promisary notes .. what ever you want to call it .. fiat currency .. i back mine with work .. most of the time thats all thats require ,, to have a job,,then you get a loan .. also it helps to have a good credit history ,, thats what iraq has been doing for the last 10 years . paying debts .. they have oil to back their dinars .. just like i have work to back my credit cards.. i havent worked yet ,,, but i promise i will .. its a promisary note .. issued by the federal reserve ,, its a debt ,, thats what fiat currencys are

.

Dollarization

Types

Dollarization can occur in a number of situations. The most popular type of dollarization is unofficial dollarization or de facto dollarization. Unofficial dollarization happens when residents of a country choose to hold a significant share of their financial assets denominated in foreign currency although the foreign currency lacks the legal tender.[7] They hold deposits in the foreign currency because of a bad track record of the local currency, or as a hedge against inflation of the domestic currency.

Official dollarization or full dollarization happens when a country adopts a foreign currency as its sole legal tender, and ceases to issue the domestic currency. Another effect of a country adopting a foreign currency as its own is that the country gives up all power to vary its exchange rate. There is a small number of countries adopting a foreign currency as legal tender. For example, Panama underwent a process of full dollarization by adopting the U.S. dollar as legal tender in 1904. This type of dollarization is also known as de jure dollarization.

Dollarization can be used semiofficially (or officially bimonetary systems), where the foreign currency is legal tender alongside the domestic currency.[8]

In literature, there is a set of related definitions of dollarization such as external liability dollarization, domestic liability dollarization, banking sector's liability dollarization or namely deposit dollarization and credit dollarlization. The external liability dollarization measures total external debt (private and public) denominated in foreign currencies of the economy.[8][9] Deposit dollarization can be measured as the share of dollar deposit in total deposit of the banking system while credit dollarization can be measured as the share of dollar credit in total credit of the banking system.[10]

Effects

On trade and investment

One of the main advantages of adopting of a strong foreign currency as sole legal tender is to reduce the transaction costs of trade among countries using the same currency.[11] There are at least two ways to infer this impact from data. The first one is a significantly negative effect of exchange rate volatility on trade in most cases, and the second is an association between transaction costs and the need to operate with multiple currencies.[12] Economic integration with the rest of the world becomes easier as a result of lowered transaction costs and stabler prices in dollar terms.[13] Rose (2000) applied the gravity model of trade and provided empirical evidence that countries sharing a common currency engage in significantly increased trade among them, and that the benefits of dollarization for trade may be large.[14]

Dollarized economies can invoke greater confidence among international investors, inducing increased investments and growth. The elimination of the currency crisis risk due to full dollarization leads to a reduction of country risk premiums and then to lower interest rates.[13] These effects result in a higher level of investment. However, there is a positive association between dollarization and interest rates in a dual-currency economy.[15]

On monetary and exchange rate policies

Official dollarization helps to promote fiscal and monetary discipline and thus greater macroeconomic stability and lower inflation rates, to lower real exchange rate volatility, and possibly to deepen the financial system.[12] Firstly, dollarization helps developing countries, providing a firm commitment to stable monetary and exchange rate policies by forcing a passive monetary. Adopting a strong foreign currency as legal tender will help to "eliminate the inflation-bias problem of discretionary monetary policy".[16] Secondly, official dollarization imposes stronger financial constraint on the government by eliminating deficit financing by issuing money.[17] An empirical finding suggests that inflation has been significantly lower in dollarized nations than in non-dollarized ones.[18] The expected benefit of dollarization is the elimination of the risk of exchange rate fluctuations and a possible reduction in the country's international exposure. Though dollarization cannot eliminate the risk of an external crisis, it provides steadier markets as a result of eliminating fluctuations in exchange rates.[13]

On the other hand, dollarization leads to the loss of seigniorage revenue, the loss of monetary policy autonomy, and the loss of the exchange rate instruments. Seigniorage revenues are the profits generated when monetary authorities issue currency. When adopting a foreign currency as legal tender, a monetary authority needs to withdraw the domestic currency and give up future seigniorage revenue. The country loses the rights to its autonomous monetary and exchange rate policies, even in times of financial emergency;[13][19] former chairman of the Federal Reserve Alan Greenspan, for example, has stated that the central bank only considers the effects of its decisions on the US economy.[20] In a full dollarized economy, exchange rates are indeterminate and monetary authorities cannot devalue.[21] In a highly dollarized economy, devaluation policy is less effective in changing the real exchange rate because of significant pass-through effects to domestic prices.[13] However, the cost of losing an independent monetary policy exists when domestic monetary authorities can commit an effective counter-cyclical monetary policy, stabilizing the business cycle. This cost depends adversely on the correlation between the business cycle of the client country (the dollarized economy) and the business cycle of the anchor country.[11] In addition, monetary authorities in dollarized economies diminish the liquidity assurance to their banking system.[13][22]

[edit] On banking systems

In a fully dollarized economy, monetary authorities cannot act as lender of last resort to commercial banks by printing money. The alternatives to lending to the bank system may include taxation and issuing government debt.[23] The loss of the lender of last resort is considered a cost of full dollarization. This cost depends on the initial level of unofficial dollarization before moving to a full dollarized economy. This relation is negative because in a heavily dollarized economy, the central bank already fears difficulties in providing liquidity assurance to the banking system.[24] However, literature points out the existence of alternative mechanisms to provide liquidity insurance to banks, such as a scheme by which the international financial community charges an insurance fee in exchange for a commitment to lend to a domestic bank.[25]

Commercial banks in countries where saving accounts and loans in foreign currency are allowed may face two types of risks:

1.Currency mismatch risk: Assets and liabilities on the balance sheets may be in different denominations. This may arise if the bank converts foreign currency deposits into local currency and lends in local currency, or vice versa.

2.Default risk: Arises if the bank uses the foreign currency deposits to lend in foreign currency.[26]

However, dollarization eliminates the probability of a currency crisis that impacts negatively on the banking system through the balance sheet channel. Dollarization may reduce the possibility of systematic liquidity shortages and the optimal reserves in the banking system.[27] Research has shown that official dollarization has played a significant role in improving bank liquidity and asset quality in Ecuador and El Salvador.[28]

The dynamics of the flight from domestic money

High and unanticipated inflation rates decrease the demand for domestic money and raise the demand for alternative assets, including foreign currency and assets dominated by foreign currency. This phenomenon is called the "flight from domestic money". It results in a rapid and sizable process of dollarization.[29] In countries with high inflation rates, the domestic currency tends to be gradually displaced by a stable currency, such as the U.S. dollar. At the beginning of this process, the store-of-value function of the domestic currency is replaced by the foreign currency. Then, the unit-of-account function of the domestic currency is displaced when many prices are quoted in a foreign currency. A prolonged period of high inflation will induce the domestic currency to lose its function as medium of exchange when the public carries out many transactions in foreign currency.[30]

Ize and Levy-Yeyati (1998) examine the determinants of deposit and credit dollarization, concluding that dollarization is driven by the volatility of inflation and the real exchange rate. Dollarization increases with inflation volatility and decreases with the volatility of the real exchange rate.[31]

[edit] Institutional factors

The flight from domestic money depends on a country's institutional factors. The first factor is the level of development of the domestic financial market. An economy with a well-developed financial market can offer a set of alternative financial instruments dominated in domestic currency, reducing the role of foreign currency as an inflation hedge. The pattern of the dollarization process also varies across countries with different foreign exchange and capital controls. In a country with strict foreign exchange regulations, the demand for foreign currency will be satisfied in the holding of foreign currency assets abroad and outside the domestic banking system. This demand often puts pressure on the parallel market of foreign currency and on the country's international reserves.[29] Evidence for this pattern is given in the absence of dollarization during the pre-reform period in most transition economies, because of constricted controls on foreign exchange and the banking system.[32] In contrary, by facilitating the domestic holding of foreign currency, a country might mitigate the shift of assets abroad and strengthen its external reserves in exchange for a dollarization process. However, the effect of this regulation on the pattern of dollarization depends on the public's expectations of macroeconomic stability and the sustainability of the foreign exchange regime.[29]

.

if iraq has a 100 trillion dinar note .. and they use it to loan out promisary note to their citizens .. as long as each transaction is accounted for .. its all legitimate .. each citizen takes out a loan and agrees to pay it back with interest , they log every transaction ,, their books show all the increases in numbers being generated through interest payments

now iraq cant go around the world buying things with 100 trilliondinar notes .. but domestically they can do anything they choose ..they can use cans of beans for currency if they choose ... what we hold is iraq local currency that got away .. maybe purposly . for repayment to the world for its freedom .. who knows .. they know its out .. they know we have it .. they know they cant delete hard cash ,, but they know how much is out here .. whether it be 3% .. 7% .. what ever .. and they do have the knowledge of how to get it back legally ..im waiting to see their offer ..

iraq can run deficits just like everyone else does .. there no different

.

they dont have an international currency at this point they can do what ever they want with their currency .... they can use cans of dog food for their local currency and feed it to their dogs if they choose ..and when its all gone they can shoot the dogs and use their fur for currency .. the iraqi dinar has nothing to do with international anything .. if they do go international with their new currency then that currency would have to comply with international standards .. ..if they choose to delete half their dinars and double their value they dont have to ask permission .. they just do it .. they just keep the books up to date so the international community knows what they are doing when they do go international with their new currency ...the 1166 rate was set up with the imf for monitoring purposes only .. .. i think they should use barrels of oil for currency .. try carrying those around in your pocket .. money is no different than a coupon. the dinar is an iraqi coupon ..they only have to honor those dinars that are not in the cbi.. those at the cbi could all become one dinar worth 50 billion dollars if they want to .. that would be a huge rv .. but they could put a different value on those remaining dinars .... the other 10 trilion .. those dinars belong to iraq ... not the imf or the world bank ..

.

im positive the federal reserve will be ready for any such transaction and have all its banks loaded with a sufficient amount of cash for the transaction .. the fed stands to make a pretty penny here .. iraq wont blind side the world with a blast of heavily valued currency for exchange ,, this is well planned out and bilateral agreements should be set up and ready to go on rv day .. :lol:/>/>/>

.there now you can cherry pick lines out of context and twist them around ..have fun

Edited January 16, 2013 by dontlop

[dinarck]

You keep stating that if it can be done, everyone would do it. The problem is right in front of everyone's eyes and simply just needs to be addressed. Reduce the M2, strengthen the value, and raise the rate.

Yes, they could R/D, and it is a very possible threat to speculators. But, how many speculators are out there? They increase every day and they become a strong threat to the reserves of the CBI. What do you think members on this board will do once a R/D is official? They'll exchange back to USD and forget about IQD. And that could be a rather huge hit to the reserves. I wonder how many other countries that were about to R/D were highly speculated to raise their currency prior to the R/D and had a great amount of speculation going against them?

Darin....reducing M2 and raising the rate 100s or 1000s of percent does not exist in economics. That whole notion was contrived on dinar forums. Look anywhere throughout history and you will see developing nations (almost always pegged) increase M2 while either keeping a stable value or losing value. That's just they way it works. We can argue till our fingers bleed from typing but please just show me when the economic practices you are describing have ever been implemented. Iraq will not be the first because it wouldn't work. For them to reduce their M2 all that means is they basically by back their own currency for the current rate and then RV it to a higher rate. Pretty good deal I would say. So good you will never see it happen.

[VIZIOIRAQI]

Yeah. Iraq's 30 million people are going to surpass China's 11 trillion a year GDP. Never gonna happen. Iraq has no manufacturing. No factories. No skilled work force. No infrastructure. They are still shooting and blowing each other up.

Nothing is brewing over there but death and corruption. I mean we have the "PM" dictator over there threatening to dissolve parliament and somehow Iraq is some huge economic player? Don't think so.

Mr Rich you better take another look and do some homework Everything you just said is all Wrong ! If you don't bother to study Iraq and know whats really going on your Assuming will just well you know and Yes I know who you Really Are !!!

[dinarck]

Mr Rich you better take another look and do some homework Everything you just said is all Wrong ! If you don't bother to study Iraq and know whats really going on your Assuming will just well you know and Yes I know who you Really Are !!!

Really? And who told you that? Frank or Jokie?

Maybe you have missed the methodical assassinations of Iraqi leaders going on over there. But don't worry.....Kraperoni says everything is ok and we are still on schedule for the "RV". Haha