Guest views are now limited to 12 pages. If you get an "Error" message, just sign in! If you need to create an account, click here.

Jump to content
  • CRYPTO REWARDS!

    Full endorsement on this opportunity - but it's limited, so get in while you can!

Fiscal Cliff Negotiations: Republicans Ought to Simply Walk Away


WallyWeaver
 Share

Recommended Posts

So let me get this straight: Obama's proposal is to increase taxes by $1.6 trillion; give another stimulus of $50 billion; he wants Congress to hand over the ability to raise the debt ceiling solely to the White House, without the approval of Congress; he also includes increasing Federal spending in other unspecified areas..... and he doesn't offer ANY spending cuts? Is this guy for real?

I guess, at this point, all I can say is expect a pretty choppy next few months in the markets. It is now my belief that Krauthammer is right, the Republicans should simply walk away and let America go off the cliff. Their problem is going to be, however, the media will side with Obama that it's the Republican's fault. So Boehner and McConnell are going to need to get in front of a camera on a daily basis and, in as clear of language as possible, they need to explain why they are doing what they are doing. Boehner and McConnell have to do everything in their power to win the PR battle.....

Again, don't expect the markets to react favorably to this. I'm tempted to close out my margin now until this all blows over...... To all: expect smaller paychecks starting in January.

WW.

Krauthammer on Fiscal Cliff Negotiations: "Republicans Ought to Simply Walk Away"

Posted on November 29, 2012

CHARLES KRAUTHAMMER: It's not just a bad deal, this is really an insulting deal. What Geithner offered, what you showed on the screen, Robert E. Lee was offered easier terms at Appomattox, and he lost the Civil War. The Democrats won by 3% of the vote and they did not hold the House, Republicans won the house. So this is not exactly unconditional surrender, but that is what the administration is asking of the Republicans.

This idea -- there are not only no cuts in this, there's an increase in spending with a new stimulus. I mean, this is almost unheard of. What do they expect? They obviously expect the Republicans will cave on everything. I think the Republicans ought to simply walk away. The president is the president. He's the leader. They are demanding that the Republicans explain all the cuts that they want to make.

We had that movie a year-and-a-half ago where Paul Ryan presented a budget, a serious real budget with real cuts. Obama was supposed to gave speech where he would respond with a counter offer. And what did he do? He gave a speech where he had Ryan sitting in the front row. He called the Ryan proposal un-American, insulted him, offered nothing, and ran on Mediscare in the next 18 months.

And they expect the Republicans are going to do this again? The Republicans are going to walk on this. And I think they have leverage. Yes, for Congressional Democrats it will help them in the future if Republicans absorb the blame because we will have a recession. But Obama is not running again unlike the Congressional Democrats. He's going to have a recession, 9% unemployment, 2 million more unemployed, and a second term that's going to be a ruin. That is not a good proposition if you are Barack Obama.

Link: http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2012/11/29/krauthammer_on_fiscal_cliff_negotiations_republicans_ought_to_simply_walk_away.html

  • Upvote 2
  • Downvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Oh, how I DEEPLY hope and pray the Republicans do walk away. It'll be just another "nail in the coffin" for the Grand Old White Man's Party. That would be such a stupidly self-defeating thing to do politically. But. hey. when they think of rape as "gifts from God", what would you expect? The ego mind, what an interesting thing to observe!

  • Upvote 3
  • Downvote 18
Link to comment
Share on other sites

How I wish they were to grow some brass ones and simply stand on the principles we thought the "Conservatives" vauled, like:

1) SMALL government.

2) It is MY MONEY, and YOU HAVE NO BUSINESS TO THINK YOU OWN IT!

3) RESPONSIBILITY, SELF GOVERNANCE, MORAL PRINCIPLE.

4) GOVERNMENT is a TAKER, offering NO value for the threat (at the point of a gun) of imprisonment for the "benefit" of HANDING OVER MY HARD EARNED MONEY to an ENTITY that has NO inherint compunction to use thrift in the disbursement of the funds that were STOLEN from me, that has NO COMPETITION (i.e., the "Marketplace") and THEREFORE the government ends up being "STUPID" ALWAYS (Note, I did not say the people in the government are stupid, though no doubt some are, but the INSTITUTION, not having competition IS STUPID! CANNOT go out of business because it offers a BAD PRODUCT!

5) PRIVATE PROPERTY IS SACRED!

6) LIBERTY was so SACRED to our Forefathers, that the shed their lives, their honor, their wealth and their BLOOD FOR THE THOUGHT OF LIBERTY!

I could go on, but my eyeballs just exploded from the frustration of OBUMMER in a second term and the further erosion of everything I hold dear.

  • Upvote 7
Link to comment
Share on other sites

How I wish they were to grow some brass ones and simply stand on the principles we thought the "Conservatives" vauled, like:

I could go on, but my eyeballs just exploded from the frustration of OBUMMER in a second term and the further erosion of everything I hold dear.

Nice post, hardmoney1, thanks for your contribution.

Judging by your response I think you would agree that Republicans should just walk away. As you say, it would really require them to "grow a pair," though, because the fury of the MSM will be unleashed on them like they have not seen yet once we go off the cliff.

It is imperative that the Republicans hold their ground this time....

WW.

  • Upvote 5
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Oh, how I DEEPLY hope and pray the Republicans do walk away. It'll be just another "nail in the coffin" for the Grand Old White Man's Party. That would be such a stupidly self-defeating thing to do politically. But. hey. when they think of rape as "gifts from God", what would you expect? The ego mind, what an interesting thing to observe!

How UNINFORMED you are.

Your "GRAND OLD WHITE MAN's Party" is THE PARTY that proclaimed the emancipation proclamation, AGAINST EVERY DEMOCRATS BLOOD-CURDLING cries of PROTEST, that proclaimed (the DEMOCRATS proclaimed) that GOD made the ***** less than the white man.

DEMOCRATS!!! DEMOCRATS!!! They were against the black man's liberty, and HATED the thought HE might VOTE, as much as they hated the idea that WOMEN would vote!

Your party is so idealogically non-sensical and BASE, VAPID with no regard for the DIGNITY of the HUMAN being.

If you are not a black person, then I misread your presentation. However, whatever your skin color, you are IGNORANT of the history of this nation and Specifically of THE DEMOCRATS - Against freedom for the black man/woman, AGAINST the civil rights of the black man, AGAINST voting rights for WOMEN, Against voting rights for blacks, the ORIGINATOR of the KKK,and least you forget ROBERT BYRD, a member of the KKK (AS A DEMOCRAT) in the US SENATE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • Upvote 8
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Oh, how I DEEPLY hope and pray the Republicans do walk away. It'll be just another "nail in the coffin" for the Grand Old White Man's Party. That would be such a stupidly self-defeating thing to do politically. But. hey. when they think of rape as "gifts from God", what would you expect? The ego mind, what an interesting thing to observe!

You my friend have the same right to post you opinions, as do I.

Although they differ somewhat.

This comment: The ego mind, what an interesting thing to observe!

Must cause you great disdain, I'm sure you are referring to obama and his ego of the most un-ept president we have ever had.

He is nothing more than a empty chair.

He has no plan, but to divide this country from those who want from those that have.

He is nothing more than a powerful man that has been handed this power from more powerful people than you or I could ever begin to understand why..

I don't have much, but he cannot take my dignity, nor will you.

I do not know you nor do you know me.

But I know of the mind set of those that do support this empty chair some call our president.

He has not once had ONE buck stop with him, although he always says "the buck stops with me".

But not one time has he taken blame, any blame for anything.

Even a child takes blame for spilling the milk.

I would encourge the republicans to walk away and stand up and say, ya damn right we are walking away because we will not let you distroy this country anymore.

Your driving this car right off this cliff, your driving, sitting in the backseat are the republicans.. WHY? cause thats where you told us to go.

You, Mr president told the american people to not let the republicans have the keyes to the car, "by your vote you are telling the republicans to get in the backseat"

So buckle up OBAMA is driving.

Read more: http://dinarvets.com/forums/index.php?/topic/135316-fiscal-cliff-negotiations-republicans-ought-to-simply-walk-away/#ixzz2DfOBZN4L

  • Upvote 8
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Republicans should just go ahead and de-fund Obamacare, 100%. DO IT NOW before this fraud goes on vacation!

Every republican should stand in front of every camera everyday and explain to those that do not know the real Obama.

Every republican should call out Reid Pelosi and Durbin and keep saying they (dems) dont have a plan. they need to drive this point home.

Tell the media everyday the dems will not come to the table just like the wisconsin democrats left town to avoid voting.

Drive this point EXPLAIN dem will not even discuss any kind of spending cuts.

We will not raise taxes until we see spending cuts.

We sit at the table waiting for the Democrats to come sit at the table but they THEY refuse to even come to the table.

They need to drive this point every minute on tv every day.

sorry got a little caught up..

Edited by kid4dinar
  • Upvote 9
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I hope they walk away to , if nothing else just to expose the left for who they REALLY are and what there morals and values are. AMERICA is going to hell in a handbasket folks.

God Bless

Exactly right chara55, and thanks for your contribution.

Obama got a majority of the under 30 vote. Those under 30 have never really seen economic hardship on a national level yet so they have every reason to believe all of the lies they were taught in the public school system.

Maybe the Republican's stepping back and allowing America to go off the cliff for awhile (9%+ unemployment, less take home pay, etc.) will be the wake up call we've been waiting for.

WW.

  • Upvote 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

How I wish they were to grow some brass ones and simply stand on the principles we thought the "Conservatives" vauled, like:

1) SMALL government.

2) It is MY MONEY, and YOU HAVE NO BUSINESS TO THINK YOU OWN IT!

3) RESPONSIBILITY, SELF GOVERNANCE, MORAL PRINCIPLE.

4) GOVERNMENT is a TAKER, offering NO value for the threat (at the point of a gun) of imprisonment for the "benefit" of HANDING OVER MY HARD EARNED MONEY to an ENTITY that has NO inherint compunction to use thrift in the disbursement of the funds that were STOLEN from me, that has NO COMPETITION (i.e., the "Marketplace") and THEREFORE the government ends up being "STUPID" ALWAYS (Note, I did not say the people in the government are stupid, though no doubt some are, but the INSTITUTION, not having competition IS STUPID! CANNOT go out of business because it offers a BAD PRODUCT!

5) PRIVATE PROPERTY IS SACRED!

6) LIBERTY was so SACRED to our Forefathers, that the shed their lives, their honor, their wealth and their BLOOD FOR THE THOUGHT OF LIBERTY!

I could go on, but my eyeballs just exploded from the frustration of OBUMMER in a second term and the further erosion of everything I hold dear.

Okay WalleyWeaver, I couldn't sit this one out. cough, cough :( This is an opportunity for the Republicans to make some stride, they better take advantage of this opportunity.

This message is approved by Pattyangel. Great post hardmoney1 1000 +'s if I could give. :)

  • Upvote 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I would encourge the republicans to walk away

So buckle up OBAMA is driving.

I think our best step, other than to pray, is to make sure we encourage the Republicans to take a stand and not falter. There are many of us out here who will support their position and they need to hear from us.

Thanks for your contribution.

WW.

Republicans should just go ahead and de-fund Obamacare, 100%. DO IT NOW before this fraud goes on vacation!

They should definitely feel some sense of boldness, afterall, they did retain the House. Boehner should take that as his mandate to make a stand.

My read of the this situation is Obama is putting out more than he thinks he can get so that he will end up getting the things he really wants. Boehner should answer with just as bold of conditions that Obama has laid down.

Thanks for your comment.

WW.

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Drive this point EXPLAIN dem will not even discuss any kind of spending cuts.

We will not raise taxes until we see spending cuts.

We sit at the table waiting for the Democrats to come sit at the table but they THEY refuse to even come to the table.

Wow, excellent post.

And you are exactly right..... the Republicans need to take a stand and they must do all in their power to win the PR battle. This is a reason why Reagan was so effective: he was especially good at communicating to the American people what the situation really was and how he was going to lead us out of it. Boehner and McConnell need to the same.

WW.

  • Upvote 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Okay WalleyWeaver, I couldn't sit this one out. cough, cough sad.gif This is an opportunity for the Republicans to make some stride, they better take advantage of this opportunity.

This message is approved by Pattyangel. Great post hardmoney1 1000 +'s if I could give. smile.gif

Hey Patty, sorry about your illness but glad you poked your head in here a little.

I'm glad to know your message is officially approved..... too funny.

Take care.

WW.

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Every republican should stand in front of every camera everyday and explain to those that do not know the real Obama.

Every republican should call out Reid Pelosi and Durbin and keep saying they (dems) dont have a plan. they need to drive this point home.

Tell the media everyday the dems will not come to the table just like the wisconsin democrats left town to avoid voting.

Drive this point EXPLAIN dem will not even discuss any kind of spending cuts.

We will not raise taxes until we see spending cuts.

We sit at the table waiting for the Democrats to come sit at the table but they THEY refuse to even come to the table.

They need to drive this point every minute on tv every day.

sorry got a little caught up..

Give them some help

Do not sit on the side lines people. Get involved

We need every one on deck in full battle dress and at general quarters or the GOP will cave

You profess you want change. Change will not happen unless we get involved

Become a PITA ( Pain In The A** ) Order Your Representative to stand their ground.

Do not wait and complain after the fact. Let your voice be heard NOW.

We already know the liberals are calling anyone who disagrees with them sexist and racist

This is a distraction designed to make you stop and defend and not attack

You cannot defend something that does not exists so don,t try

Just keep pressing the attack

We can make Obama's 2nd term ineffective if We The People Get Involved

Bombard your Representatives and the media with your opinion.

Rock the boat people rock the boat so hard they know you are ready to dump them all into the water.

God,Corps and Country

No Surrender No Retreat and No Compromise

  • Upvote 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Another article/ blog, same perspective from our friend at Redstate, Eric Ericson. Especially pertinent is his advice at the end: "The GOP should pass what they want and promptly go home. Let the Democrats stay and sort things out."

Well said, Eric.

forward-e13524846255091-620x395.jpg

Cliff Diving

By: Erick Erickson (Diary) | November 30th, 2012 at 04:30 AM

Only a fool would think that the same Congress that got us in this mess can get us out of this mess.

The fiscal cliff is the byproduct of multiple congressional compromises to kick several different cans down the road. Now they’ve all landed in the same spot. Both sides are trying to kick multiple cans at one time and are kicking each other instead.

What’s really going on in Washington right now is Republicans are in theater trying to look like the reasonable party. They want back in the good graces of the American public and want to at least save some face when polling says they’ll probably get blamed and their position is unpopular.

They might as well give it up. They’re going to get the blame no matter what happens. They are disjointed with bad spokesmen. One is orange and the other . . . well . . . .

They might as well dive.

Their position improves on the other side as does the baseline from which they are arguing.

From 1982 to 2012, the federal government has had seventeen debt and deficit commissions. The national debt has gone from 1.14 trillion to $16 trillion. Each time, the tax code has grown more complicated and spending has never really been cut.

Today, they tell us we need a balanced approach of tax increases and spending cuts. The so-called fiscal cliff does just that. It is exactly what they’ve always said we needed and now they don’t want it. The truth is they don’t want to cut spending. Neither side really does. They structured their last deal to fail so they could scare the American people.

That’s what they are trying now as they all shuffle around to sound reasonable as fear mongers. Meanwhile, the President is offering nothing substantive and has walked back from his claims of 3 to 1 spending cuts to tax increases. He just wants the tax increases and nothing else. Again, spending cuts won’t happen if the GOP takes the deal. Nothing good can come of negotiating further. The GOP should pass what they want and promptly go home. Let the Democrats stay and sort things out.

Dive.

Link: http://www.redstate....0/cliff-diving/

  • Upvote 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Apparently Mr. Limbaugh is on board as well...... walking away is really the only adult play the Republicans have. As Eric suggested above, the Republican controlled House should pass a bill with what they want to do, maybe they could run Paul Ryan's budget proposal through again, but in the spirit of what Obama is doing they should double the cuts Ryan asked for the first time. And then they should go home for Christmas break and let the Democrats sort it out.....

Just Walk Away, Republicans

November 29, 2012

RUSH: I'm having trouble coming up with a term for this. But the conventional wisdom, the groupthink, I mean, folks, I don't care where you go, and this is not a criticism. I'm actually looking at this in wonderment. I don't care where you go. It could be a left-wing blog or right-wing blog, a left-wing magazine, a right-wing magazine, a left-wing newspaper, right-wing newspaper, they're all analyzing these negotiations in the same way: Can Obama prevail over the Republicans? Do the Republicans have any leverage? Are the Republicans going to get entitlement reform? Will there be any serious tax reform? Will there be any serious spending cuts?

RushGOPWalkAWAY.jpgAll of that is just bunk. It's not real. That's not what's happening. In the leverage that the Republicans have? "That's right, Mr. Limbaugh, the Republicans have leverage that they don't even know they have, because Obama doesn't want that second term recession. They need to call his bluff. They don't dare cave on this because Obama does not want to be saddled with a second term recession." I don't think he cared about the first term recession. And besides, an Obama recession is never gonna be called a recession. The people who write the history are Obama's friends. Whatever happens economically: 399,000 unemployment claims is good news, and 7.9, 8.2% unemployment, not a problem.

Would somebody explain to me how the people who elected Obama, who support Obama, who love Obama in the media, in the universities, who write the history, are going to write anything critical of the guy no matter what happens? Even if there is a second term recession, you're gonna need a telescope to find it reported, just like you need a telescope to find Oprah's network now. It won't be reported as a recession. So what is the leverage that the Republicans have? To my mind the only leverage they've got is to walk away from this, to stop playing, to stop talking, to stop playing this game.

The Republicans lost. Now, they still control the House of Representatives. Boehner still runs the show there. But the only leverage that I can see that they've got is to back out of this and make sure that whatever happens, they don't have any fingerprints on it. I know what you're saying, and you'd be right. You're saying, "But, Rush, but, Rush, no matter what the Republicans do, they're gonna get blamed for it." Yes, totally true. No matter what happens. If there is a reported recession, in fact, it will be said to be the Republicans in the House fault. No matter what happens, that's going to be said, and no matter what happens, as we sit here now, the American people, the majority of whom, are gonna believe that.

Link: http://www.rushlimba...way_republicans

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I wish it was possible to send a 'vote of no confidence' to our Government. I wish they would all shut up and do their jobs. Now Obama is out spending even MORE money as he is traveling around promoting his spending cuts and plan. They do not listen. I wonder if any of them really listen to the people or act on what they believe. Start cutting their huge salaries. They act like anyone making over $250,000.00 per year is evil. If you have a good small business you could show that as an income really easy but that does not mean it is YOUR income. If Congress was really serious they would start cutting at home. Cut their expense accounts. Cut their benefits. Cut their salaries. Cut their travel expense. If you are making over 150,000.00 per year you can afford to pay for your own travel. Stop demonizing each other. SHUT UP AND DO YOUR JOB!

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

as he is traveling around promoting his spending cuts and plan.

Well said, almost.

Obama is not actually proposing any spending cuts. He is proposing:

1. $1.6 trillion in increased taxes

2. Congress should pass a bill allowing the White House to increase the Federal debt limit without the approval of Congress

3. Congress shold pass another $50 billion in stimulus that the President will promptly sign

4. Increased government spending, not cuts, in other as of yet unspecified areas.

No where in Obama's plan, to this point, are there ANY spending cuts.....

The rest of your post was good though; thanks for the comment.

WW.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hey WW,

What I am seeing is the making of a dictator in the works. He circumvents congress with EO's. The proposal by Obama/Geitner is scary, let me increase taxes, spending along with the debt ceiling and regulations without the checks and balances in place. NDAA has been passed on his watch and there is a bill in the senate to allow the govt to dip into our IRA's and 401's, they're just waiting to get a democratic congress to ram that bill through. Our country is going the way of Europe and we all see how that's working out. We have a president that is out of control along with the puppet dems. :twocents:

  • Upvote 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

willy1der....that is exactly why I keep screaming, and probably making enemies, about the comparisons between Obama and Hitler. Look at history. Look at the events that Hitler took and that transpired. Look at the way the wealthy are being demonized. Look at the way that Christian principles and rights are being tossed away for political correctness not to offend muslims. Look at the political events and social actions established by the government. PEOPLE WE ARE IN TROUBLE.

  • Upvote 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hey WW,

What I am seeing is the making of a dictator in the works. He circumvents congress with EO's. The proposal by Obama/Geitner is scary, let me increase taxes, spending along with the debt ceiling and regulations without the checks and balances in place. NDAA has been passed on his watch and there is a bill in the senate to allow the govt to dip into our IRA's and 401's, they're just waiting to get a democratic congress to ram that bill through. Our country is going the way of Europe and we all see how that's working out. We have a president that is out of control along with the puppet dems. TwoCents.gif

Did you ever think you would live to see the day, Willy? I mean, having lived through the Reagan years and having grown up learning and reading many books about the Founders I didn't think it was possible that we could turn this far left this fast..... And just think, the man hasn't even been sworn in for his second term yet!

Dictator is well said, thanks for your input Willy.

WW.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

willy1der....that is exactly why I keep screaming, and probably making enemies, about the comparisons between Obama and Hitler. Look at history. Look at the events that Hitler took and that transpired. Look at the way the wealthy are being demonized. Look at the way that Christian principles and rights are being tossed away for political correctness not to offend muslims. Look at the political events and social actions established by the government. PEOPLE WE ARE IN TROUBLE.

I agree with what you're saying desimo, one of the biggest problems facing America is the number of people receiving "gifts" from the govt. There are those who need it and those who abuse it. Unfortunately we have a population with a growing number of folks abusing the system. I see it every day in my neck of the woods. We've also had to deal with ACORN here. I can't tell you the number of people that started businesses, received their ACORN money and close the doors, we helped to fund that nonsense. Now that ACORN has been exposed they give the money to SEIU and SEIU in turns hands it over to ACORN. And we can thank the man in the whitehouse for this. I'm in Louisiana, worked in Chicago when Obama was running for president and listened to my co-workers talk about how disgusted they were with him and ACORN. Our founding fathers set up the three branches for checks and balances and now this administration is circumventing that system all they can. To propose to congress to give me a blank check is a disgrace. If that were to happen there would no longer be a need for congress, hey, we can save some money there huh. I hope the republican party stands firm against the president. We have a man in the whitehouse that is more concerned with taking us over the edge than he is in resolving the problems. Look at his actions, still campaigning.

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Did you ever think you would live to see the day, Willy? I mean, having lived through the Reagan years and having grown up learning and reading many books about the Founders I didn't think it was possible that we could turn this far left this fast..... And just think, the man hasn't even been sworn in for his second term yet!

Dictator is well said, thanks for your input Willy.

WW.

WW, I thought Americans had more pride than this. We have 3 to 4 generations that have grown up on welfare and are perfectly content with living in bondage with welfare. Now they're screaming for higher taxes on the rich because they want a raise, imagine that. So to answer your question WW, no I didn't think I'd live to see this. The man basically ran against capitalism and won, so we go the way of Greece! I will move to Honduras, preach the gospel and enjoy life until Jesus returns. For those of you that believe Jesus was a socialist I'll point you to read the parable of the talents.

It's one thing to give folks a hand up and another to give them false hope with hand outs.

I really do want to see the photo op of the situation room while they watched the murder of four Americans in Benghazi, do you think we'll see that photo op?

Blessings to you WW, keep up the good work.

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.


  • Testing the Rocker Badge!

  • Live Exchange Rate

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.