Why The Sharp Dissension

[TrinityeXchange]

I first want to disclaim that I am not for a LOP in the slightest. However, I do not comprehend the intense and sharp dissension between the two mindsets on the forum (LOP vs RV’er). Here is why. Let’s say there is a LOP and the 25k note becomes equal to 25 note. So our dinar gets exchanged to the lower denominations. Have we lost anything yet on our investment? Not in the slightest. This is not a loss or gain but simply a transitional phase of the investment. We always have to keep in mind that this investment is considered a long term investment so transitions should be expected. After the transition, we KNOW that the currency is highly undervalued and will begin increasing in value. The increase might be sudden or it might be gradually or it might be a bit of both. We trust though that our hopes in our investment will be realized as our dinars gain value.

So, why the big deal? If we go direct or indirect at the end of the day our goal will be realized right? Please help me understand what I am missing here, I sincerely want to know. There seems to be an enormous amount of energy between members despising one another at how we get to grandmother’s house but does it matter whether we go over the river or through the woods? Wont we still get to grandmother’s house?

Like I said though, I don’t believe it would LOP first before value is added and here is ONE reason why. The world knows that Iraq’s currency is undervalued and not just because of natural resources. All nations see the attention that the global community is concentrating toward developing nations, Iraq being key. The word attention should be translated to mean commercial benefit….this is the way of the world for all intents in purposes because EVERYTHING is about commercial value. (I don’t have time to expound on that but it is what it is from the local courts to international aide….all things come back to commercial value; period) So what the international community is telling us is that their intent is for commercial value to come to Iraq. Investors & speculators everywhere are primed and ready. The minute the currency LOPs and the socio/economic situation stabilizes, the undervalued currency of Iraq will instantly become red piping hot! Demand will be to the roof and I believe it might even become overvalued for a time before it settles down after all the hype. In my estimation it makes sense for the INITIAL infusion of value to take place before all of this happens.

Even if it doesn’t happen in the order I propose, so what?! I whole heartedly believe value is coming to the currency. What I am saying in a nutshell is that WE ALL WIN! Thanks for taking time to consider my humble 2c worth of an opinion.

Be blessed my friends.

[Tripphood]

I'll tell you my view point as far as the dissension goes, the loppsters come off as so matter of fact and high and mighty. They act is if we " the believers in a RV" are just a stupid bunch of dreamers. It seems they just want to dash our hopes and PROVE that there is no chance of a RV,

Like they thoughrly enjoy being dream crushers.

One jerk on here, who's name I won't mention was SO rude, I just decided I WILL NOT get drawn into even responding to them the LOPPERS, anymore. My reaction to him was this.... the way I see it, I will win no matter what happens. In the event of a LOP I will simply cash out and purchase the new denoms and wait until they rise in value.

There are dreamers and there are dream crushers. I am a dreamer, and I will continue to be dreamer in SPITE of the dream crushers.

GO RV B) B)

[TonyDownTheShore]

I'll tell you how I solved that problem, I put all the lopsters on my ignore list, and I don't see what they posted and life's good, I'm also a dreamer.

[Adam Montana]

Some people simply aren't happy with themselves and spend all their time trying to drag others down.

Others don't have the need to do that and spend time lifting others up.

Trinity, I think you are absolutely correct - of course there's a chance that we could break eve, a slight chance we might lose a little, but I think there's a much GREATER chance that we will come out ahead... so what exactly do the lopsters want, and why are they here?

They hate to see others happy.

I feel bad for them, it must suck to wake up in the morning and think "GOD I'm miserable... how can I ruin someone's day today?"

[SWFloridaGuy]

I first want to disclaim that I am not for a LOP in the slightest. However, I do not comprehend the intense and sharp dissension between the two mindsets on the forum (LOP vs RV’er). Here is why. Let’s say there is a LOP and the 25k note becomes equal to 25 note. So our dinar gets exchanged to the lower denominations. Have we lost anything yet on our investment? Not in the slightest. This is not a loss or gain but simply a transitional phase of the investment. We always have to keep in mind that this investment is considered a long term investment so transitions should be expected. After the transition, we KNOW that the currency is highly undervalued and will begin increasing in value. The increase might be sudden or it might be gradually or it might be a bit of both. We trust though that our hopes in our investment will be realized as our dinars gain value.

So, why the big deal? If we go direct or indirect at the end of the day our goal will be realized right? Please help me understand what I am missing here, I sincerely want to know. There seems to be an enormous amount of energy between members despising one another at how we get to grandmother’s house but does it matter whether we go over the river or through the woods? Wont we still get to grandmother’s house?

Like I said though, I don’t believe it would LOP first before value is added and here is ONE reason why. The world knows that Iraq’s currency is undervalued and not just because of natural resources. All nations see the attention that the global community is concentrating toward developing nations, Iraq being key. The word attention should be translated to mean commercial benefit….this is the way of the world for all intents in purposes because EVERYTHING is about commercial value. (I don’t have time to expound on that but it is what it is from the local courts to international aide….all things come back to commercial value; period) So what the international community is telling us is that their intent is for commercial value to come to Iraq. Investors & speculators everywhere are primed and ready. The minute the currency LOPs and the socio/economic situation stabilizes, the undervalued currency of Iraq will instantly become red piping hot! Demand will be to the roof and I believe it might even become overvalued for a time before it settles down after all the hype. In my estimation it makes sense for the INITIAL infusion of value to take place before all of this happens.

Even if it doesn’t happen in the order I propose, so what?! I whole heartedly believe value is coming to the currency. What I am saying in a nutshell is that WE ALL WIN! Thanks for taking time to consider my humble 2c worth of an opinion.

Be blessed my friends.

Thanks for the post.

[caz1104]

I'll tell you my view point as far as the dissension goes, the loppsters come off as so matter of fact and high and mighty. They act is if we " the believers in a RV" are just a stupid bunch of dreamers. It seems they just want to dash our hopes and PROVE that there is no chance of a RV,

Like they thoughrly enjoy being dream crushers.

One jerk on here, who's name I won't mention was SO rude, I just decided I WILL NOT get drawn into even responding to them the LOPPERS, anymore. My reaction to him was this.... the way I see it, I will win no matter what happens. In the event of a LOP I will simply cash out and purchase the new denoms and wait until they rise in value.

There are dreamers and there are dream crushers. I am a dreamer, and I will continue to be dreamer in SPITE of the dream crushers.

GO RV

Some people simply aren't happy with themselves and spend all their time trying to drag others down.

Others don't have the need to do that and spend time lifting others up.

Trinity, I think you are absolutely correct - of course there's a chance that we could break eve, a slight chance we might lose a little, but I think there's a much GREATER chance that we will come out ahead... so what exactly do the lopsters want, and why are they here?

They hate to see others happy.

I feel bad for them, it must suck to wake up in the morning and think "GOD I'm miserable... how can I ruin someone's day today?"

[gatoraces]

so is a lopster someone who wants it to lop, or someone who believes it is the most likely scenario? cause i think it is the highest probable event, but i don't hate my life or try to bring anyone down. i am not terribly concerned if it lopped or not.

if a huge rv happens, great, i make a ton of money. the minimal investment is worth the gamble to me.

[easyrider]

so is a lopster someone who wants it to lop, or someone who believes it is the most likely scenario? cause i think it is the highest probable event, but i don't hate my life or try to bring anyone down. i am not terribly concerned if it lopped or not.

if a huge rv happens, great, i make a ton of money. the minimal investment is worth the gamble to me.

its their approach and the ones basically saying no way it will happen and the ones that believe we are all a bunch of idiots. I can name one person but im sure you all know who im referring to that has some type of god complex that hangs out in the lop section. Like Adam mentioned there wil always be those who will try to crush your dreams but you have got to keep moving.

Edited July 20, 2012 by easyrider

[EagleEye]

Some people simply aren't happy with themselves and spend all their time trying to drag others down.

Others don't have the need to do that and spend time lifting others up.

Trinity, I think you are absolutely correct - of course there's a chance that we could break eve, a slight chance we might lose a little, but I think there's a much GREATER chance that we will come out ahead... so what exactly do the lopsters want, and why are they here?

They hate to see others happy.

I feel bad for them, it must suck to wake up in the morning and think "GOD I'm miserable... how can I ruin someone's day today?"

absolutely Adam ...

when I was younger the old folks used to "call them crabs in the bucket"....as any crab fisherman can tell you if you have only one crab in the bucket you "must" have a lid ....with two or more there is no need because if one crab is escaping another will reach up an pull him back down....

I guess the metaphor works for lopsters too... :lol:

[caz1104]

so is a lopster someone who wants it to lop, or someone who believes it is the most likely scenario? cause i think it is the highest probable event, but i don't hate my life or try to bring anyone down. i am not terribly concerned if it lopped or not.

if a huge rv happens, great, i make a ton of money. the minimal investment is worth the gamble to me.

Imo there are some that DO want it to LOP for its all about ego now. They dispise the "Guru's"(i can see there eye's twitch everytime the word is mentioned) for their own self inflicted blind faith when they 1st invested. They need to let the hate go and realize they are'nt the only ones with intelligence. Two phrases that usually get them going is GO RV & Have a Nice Day!

[storm1]

[Jaxinjersey]

This is a repost from me, from another thread addressing this issue...

You are absolutely right Umbertino... it's just, really, how many times do they need to state their position?!! They have every right to, but it's the incessant same noise.... makes no sense... therefore, it's really more ego driven. Seriously, express it once or twice... but everyday? There is nothing for them to react to, other than RVer's faith and optimism... so, what's their agenda, besides wanting to tell everyone they're "right", you're "wrong". Quite inconsiderate, at the very least. Every bit of news they react to on their side is the same... and they even state that! "Look... they're saying RD again... what's wrong with you people?! There is NO NEW news for them, or to them.

At least RVers, because of faith and optimism (a BIG part of the fun, by the way... and not "life-altering/destroying" for 99% of us) have news and "indicators" to react to... hence this site. The lopsters simply wait for those reactions, and pounce! There's no revelation, or courage in that... and I truly wonder how they have the time to be so incessant and repetitive. I mean, can't they simply be at peace with thier viewpoint... it only takes a minute, once they have their revelation! We heard you the first time! Then simply check in here once in a while... to see if those "elements" have changed? No? Why? Ego. Period. It really is quite transparent by now... hence, the annoyance.

This is no reflection on you Umbertino, as I know you are a defender of rights and a diplomat... I'm just making my own observation. Jax

Read more:

[Sanssouci]

This is a repost from me, from another thread addressing this issue...

You are absolutely right Umbertino... it's just, really, how many times do they need to state their position?!! They have every right to, but it's the incessant same noise.... makes no sense... therefore, it's really more ego driven. Seriously, express it once or twice... but everyday? There is nothing for them to react to, other than RVer's faith and optimism... so, what's their agenda, besides wanting to tell everyone they're "right", you're "wrong". Quite inconsiderate, at the very least. Every bit of news they react to on their side is the same... and they even state that! "Look... they're saying RD again... what's wrong with you people?! There is NO NEW news for them, or to them.

At least RVers, because of faith and optimism (a BIG part of the fun, by the way... and not "life-altering/destroying" for 99% of us) have news and "indicators" to react to... hence this site. The lopsters simply wait for those reactions, and pounce! There's no revelation, or courage in that... and I truly wonder how they have the time to be so incessant and repetitive. I mean, can't they simply be at peace with thier viewpoint... it only takes a minute, once they have their revelation! We heard you the first time! Then simply check in here once in a while... to see if those "elements" have changed? No? Why? Ego. Period. It really is quite transparent by now... hence, the annoyance.

This is no reflection on you Umbertino, as I know you are a defender of rights and a diplomat... I'm just making my own observation. Jax

Read more:

Well put, Jax. I am of the considered opinion that some of the LOPsters are paid agents of disinformation. You will find them in every forum of any size or importance.

Edited July 22, 2012 by Sanssouci

[Jaxinjersey]

Well put, Jax. I am of the considered opinion that some of the LOPsters are paid agents of disinformation. You will find them in every forum of any size or importance.

I have followed your thoughts, Sans.... makes sense to me. Otherwise they would realize their efforts are simply an exercise in futility... as smart as they claim to be.

[R Veyron]

I don't think that all lopsters have personal issues and low self esteem but there may be more than one who does take pleasure in burting other bubbles. I do see , however, that a good reality check is healthy. That there is no certainty of anyone benefiting from any increase in the exchange rate of the dinar. None what so ever but I do as well feel that it is indeed a possibility. Just because someone says lop or indicates that a particular article appears to be regarding such does not mean they are out to ruin someone elses day. Maybe some would but not all . We, as dinar investors have to accept this cold hard possibility and should not live in a bubble. If it just so happens that we profit from this investment we will be better off but if we do not you can't say that we were not at least warned .

[Francie26]

I am not a whiner, but my situation is a bit difficult at times these days, and envisioning an RV keeps my hope alive and allows me to go through my days with much more grace and peace than I could do otherwise. I think there are many people like me to a greater or lesser degree, people who are living through tough times right now, and the RV is a real promise of hope for them in their difficult, frightening days, a situation they face often through no fault of their own. So our dreams serve a greater purpose than merely being unrealisic. We already face a difficult realism every single day, and no matter how unrealistic we seem to be to lopsters, we are merely confronting a greater realism because we are encouraged and sustained by our hopes of an RV. Some people who really can't understand what we are enduring think we are merely whistling in the dark, and that their own realism would be better for us than what they perceive as just our imaginings. Lopsters may not realize it, but through their determination and bluster, they often add to the angst and despair many people are already enduring. If this dinar is a dud, then there will be time ahead to confront that reality. Why should we suffer needlessly, prior to even knowing whether or not it is necessary, if there is a better way to deal with this?

[doctor robbins]

I first want to disclaim that I am not for a LOP in the slightest. However, I do not comprehend the intense and sharp dissension between the two mindsets on the forum (LOP vs RV’er). Here is why. Let’s say there is a LOP and the 25k note becomes equal to 25 note. So our dinar gets exchanged to the lower denominations. Have we lost anything yet on our investment? Not in the slightest. This is not a loss or gain but simply a transitional phase of the investment. We always have to keep in mind that this investment is considered a long term investment so transitions should be expected. After the transition, we KNOW that the currency is highly undervalued and will begin increasing in value. The increase might be sudden or it might be gradually or it might be a bit of both. We trust though that our hopes in our investment will be realized as our dinars gain value.

When you buy a million dinar worth $860 for $1020 you have incurred an 18% spread. To exchange your dinar for the new dinar you would incur an additional spread so you would in effect have invested $1180 for $860 worth of dinar. You would now need for the new dinar to increase in value by 36% just to break even. Seeing as how that is more than the largest revaluation on record the odds of making a profit based on a revaluation seem slim, and it isn't likely for the new dinar to appreciate on the open market since it's a pegged currency.

If the lop occurs and the dealers can't get into Iraq for some reason to convert the old dinar for the new they will likely disappear. The banks have quit dealing in dinar and nobody on ebay will be buying so your only option at that point is to fly to the middle east and look for a place to exchange, and you can imagine how costly that would be. So I think you can see here how a lop could very well leave you with a substantial loss.

The assumption that the dinar is undervalued is based on its low valuation and nothing else. Considering the inflated money supply I would say that's presumptuous. If there is a lop and you are able to exchange your dinar for the new dinar you could very well be holding on to a currency that will never increase in value enough for you to break even, let alone provide you with any profits.

Edited September 5, 2012 by doctor robbins

[amhvl]

In short, I believe (some) lopsters are being paid to discourage people into selling their dinar (reverse pumping). I had this very conversaton with Stryker today and his intel suggests that sellers are out pacing the buyers 3-1. If you noticed the many recent articles suggesting nothing will happen until 2013-2018, it all makes sense. The CBI reads our forums and continually strategizes on ways to decrease their liability and improve their position. Guru's come in many forms...

[magawatt]

I suspect loppers are frustrated hall monitors.

[automag]

Ok Doc...............Now what? What would you have me do now? You've made Your point and now I am convinced that we will not profit. Now what is it you want me to do? Should I stay or should I go. I already have my money tied up and to sell now will guarantee a no win scenario so now that I believe your message what should I do?I have seen you post your opinion many times and now that you won my support tell me Boss !! What should we all do???

Not being mean or sarcastic or hostile. But you tell me. Now what?

[puckster_guy]

The CBI reads our forums and continually strategizes on ways to decrease their liability and improve their position. Guru's come in many forms...

i often wonder if indeed they do read our posts and throw off contradictory articles just to piss us off and read and chuckle at the responses...just a thought lol

Edited September 6, 2012 by puckster_guy

[WorkerBee]

In short, I believe (some) lopsters are being paid to discourage people into selling their dinar (reverse pumping). I had this very conversaton with Stryker today and his intel suggests that sellers are out pacing the buyers 3-1. If you noticed the many recent articles suggesting nothing will happen until 2013-2018, it all makes sense. The CBI reads our forums and continually strategizes on ways to decrease their liability and improve their position. Guru's come in many forms...

Once upon a time the dealers actually admitted how much they were selling. Haven't seen any reports lately. It seems to me that once Iraq stops making money,( US Dollars), on the sale of their currency they will make a move. In the mean time, the dealers are profiting off the sells/buys that are taking place. Unless, from what I've read, they are still printing money, allowing it to escape their borders and bringing in our dollars so maybe Iraq is profiting also? So I ask all the good people here, what will be the catalyst that makes Iraq act?

[doctor robbins]

Ok Doc...............Now what? What would you have me do now? You've made Your point and now I am convinced that we will not profit. Now what is it you want me to do? Should I stay or should I go. I already have my money tied up and to sell now will guarantee a no win scenario so now that I believe your message what should I do?I have seen you post your opinion many times and now that you won my support tell me Boss !! What should we all do???

Not being mean or sarcastic or hostile. But you tell me. Now what?

Sorry, I don't give advice. I just deal in facts.

[automag]

Sorry, I don't give advice. I just deal in facts.

[/quote

Ok..Well..........You do own dinar I assume. I mean you are posting on a site dedicated to discussion of the dinar's alledged Revaluation. If you own dinar and now realize the mistake we made then what do you plan on doing with your dinar. Maybe not advise but a little insight from your perspective would be enlighting I'm sure. Thanks.