NDE

[EagleEye]

With all the threads questioning the very existence of GOD, along with the “science vs GOD” debates complete with the ensuing verbal gymnastics I wanted to toss the NDE* hat in the ring so to speak.

My own “exposure” with the subject matter : Near Death Experiences* comes from my long time friend and co-author Gary Habermas, PHD(expert scholar in extra-Biblical evidence for the resurrection; author Beyond Death); my dear friend the late Dr. Richard Eby (Obstetrician-Founder of Park Hospital) (author: Caught Up Into Paradise, Tell Them, Tell Them, Tell Them & Didn’t You Read My Book) and a number of other books that I have read on the subject by many authors; among them Moody, Ring, Kubler-Ross and Piper to name only a few.

I have heard the testimony of a heart surgeon who started his search for God following a startling negative NDE by a patient who he brought back on the operating table several times during a rough open heart surgical procedure. The patient said repeatedly,” Doc don’t let me die ! I’m in hell !!” As well as a logger pulled from a river in Seattle at least 45 minutes after a "fatal" accident, with a crushed skull and no water in his lungs. He too was in hell, right up to the moment he saw Jesus walking across a huge gap....and cried out to Him for mercy.

Dr Eby on the other hand had a powerful and vivid positive experience which he shared everywhere until the time of his second passing. His story carried more weight IMO because he himself was an MD. His main thrust was the clear understanding he was sent back to “ Tell Them….” (the title of his second book concerning his NDE)

One DISCLAIMER: the purpose of this post is food for thought…I have no plans to get drawn into a knock-down drag-out verbal battle on this subject. IMO NDE’s are a scientific fact…and the interpretation of why they are, what they mean, what causes them are the stuff of way too much “private interpretation” as it is.

That being said, I present strictly for your “pondering” the following: a) How Jesus of Nazareth described the story of one Lazarus- a beggar in Lk 16: 19- 31 the definitions of the two recorded types of NDE and c) the desire of God for mankind as found in 2Pe_3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Recently I was amazed listening to the story of Colton Burpo on morning television tell of his own NDE at the ripe old age of 4 ! (Heaven Is For Real !)….perhaps the most convincing detail of all was his mention of a baby sister who was in heaven (miscarriage he could not have know about)…and relatives who he never met who had pre-deceased him as well. This was not Christian TV either. This was on the Today Show….

Enjoy !

Luk 16:19 There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day:

Luk 16:20 And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores,

Luk 16:21 And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores.

Luk 16:22 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;

Luk 16:23 And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.

Luk 16:24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.

Luk 16:25 But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.

Luk 16:26 And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.

Luk 16:27 Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house:

Luk 16:28 For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.

Luk 16:29 Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.

Luk 16:30 And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.

Luk 16:31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead. **

The NDE transcends gender, age, class, and religious affiliation. As well as those subjects who take part in research studies, many famous people have lived to tell of their Near Death Experience. Mikhail Gorbachev, Roseanne Barr, George Lucas, Debra Winger and Donald Sutherland have experienced NDEs. The once fiery Louis Farrakhan attributes his kinder, gentler message of unity and peace to an NDE. Singer Della Reese, star of the TV series Touched by an Angel and an ordained minister, believes that she encountered angels in a brush with death that occurred due to a burst brain aneurysm.

While the details of Near Death Experiences may differ, many share a common thread. Yet, there are two distinct types of NDE—positive and negative. Researchers estimate that one in ten people have some sort of NDE after surviving a life-threatening event.5

The Negative Near Death Experience

To those who have experienced a negative NDE, the process of dying is, indeed, hellish. People visit dark places, encounter demonic beings, and experience feelings of grief, depression, and fear.1 P.M.H. Atwater, a longtime NDE researcher reports that about 15 percent of adults and 3 percent of children enter "a threatening void or stark limbo or hellish purgatory," sometimes including "hauntings" from the past.7

One of the most vivid portrayals of such a hellish death is in the movie Ghost, where the earth literally opens a passage for the minions of hell to assail the evildoer and pull him into the bowels of the earth. Joyce Harvey, a 75-year-old retired CID officer from Essex experienced such a negative NDE.

While recovering from a chest infection, Ms. Harvey began having breathing problems. Suddenly she was paralyzed by cold. "I started going down and down in a life, with someone pulling my legs which were really hot," she said. "There were terrible noises, discordant notes, and screaming. I could see thousands of faces without bodies beneath me; they were trying to pull me down further and further. I was terrified."4

The Positive Near Death Experience

Often a positive near death experience begins when the person feels his or her consciousness separate and rise from the physical body. During this "out of body" experience (OBE), the subject is totally aware of the activity in the room below. Journalist Neil Marr remembered "watching over the shoulders of doctors and nurses as they hovered" around his bed as he lay with no heartbeat after undergoing a series of five heart attacks.7

Often, the second stage of a positive NDE finds the subject traveling through a tunnel towards a bright light. However, the type of tunnel varies from report to report with descriptions such as a tunnel of tiny stars, spirals of light, the inside of a sewer pipe, or an underground cave.7 Some people meet a deceased friend or relative who either takes them through the tunnel or meets them at the tunnel's end while others give their guides a celestial presence describing them as guardian angels or beings of light. Some people "return to their bodies" never seeing a tunnel, some are pulled back to "life" while journeying through the tunnel, and some are "sent back" by their guide.

Those who pass through the tunnel may go on to other experiences. Many report a sensation of being enveloped by love, peace, and joy. Some subjects undergo a "life review" where they experience both the joy and the mental anguish generated by their earthly actions. Some are "judged" by one or more religious figures while others experience self-judgment as they absorb a feeling of infinite understanding and heightened intellectual abilities.

Hmmm the very Words of Jesus of Nazareth fulfilled in a generation of unbelief **…..IMO GOD loves mankind….gave His only Son to restore fellowship with His creation and such experiences have touched many lives.

[Tripphood]

Amen! I believe.

[Markinsa]

Thanks for the Post EE.

The reference to the movie ghost, reminds me of my oldest brother's testimony. He was lying on a mattress in someone's backyard house, it only had concrete floors, a refrigerator, and a picknick table. I had told him he could no longer stay with me in my apartment because I found needles hidden under the counter of the bathroom sink. He ended up there, and hit bottom with his drug use. He told me about how he wanted to kill himself by od'ing, and how the demon's (He described them as dark shadows like the ones in ghost), were egging him on to kill himself, telling him no one loves him, and just do it. (This always made me wonder, if drug users somehow are able to see into the spirit world.)

Anyhow while he was laying on that mattress at his lowest point, he called out to Jesus to save him, and Jesus did. He's been clean ever since. Praise God!

-

[EagleEye]

Thanks for the Post EE.

The reference to the movie ghost, reminds me of my oldest brother's testimony. He was lying on a mattress in someone's backyard house, it only had concrete floors, a refrigerator, and a picknick table. I had told him he could no longer stay with me in my apartment because I found needles hidden under the counter of the bathroom sink. He ended up there, and hit bottom with his drug use. He told me about how he wanted to kill himself by od'ing, and how the demon's (He described them as dark shadows like the ones in ghost), were egging him on to kill himself, telling him no one loves him, and just do it. (This always made me wonder, if drug users somehow are able to see into the spirit world.)

Anyhow while he was laying on that mattress at his lowest point, he called out to Jesus to save him, and Jesus did. He's been clean ever since. Praise God!

-

wow that is awesome Mark !! I believe you are right about the spirit realm also...just think about the greek word Pharmakeia as used in Scripture and the whole concept of "tripping" in the drug sub-culture....

thanks for sharing

[Heavyduty053]

With all the threads questioning the very existence of GOD, along with the “science vs GOD” debates complete with the ensuing verbal gymnastics I wanted to toss the NDE* hat in the ring so to speak.

My own “exposure” with the subject matter : Near Death Experiences* comes from my long time friend and co-author Gary Habermas, PHD(expert scholar in extra-Biblical evidence for the resurrection; author Beyond Death); my dear friend the late Dr. Richard Eby (Obstetrician-Founder of Park Hospital) (author: Caught Up Into Paradise, Tell Them, Tell Them, Tell Them & Didn’t You Read My Book) and a number of other books that I have read on the subject by many authors; among them Moody, Ring, Kubler-Ross and Piper to name only a few.

I have heard the testimony of a heart surgeon who started his search for God following a startling negative NDE by a patient who he brought back on the operating table several times during a rough open heart surgical procedure. The patient said repeatedly,” Doc don’t let me die ! I’m in hell !!” As well as a logger pulled from a river in Seattle at least 45 minutes after a "fatal" accident, with a crushed skull and no water in his lungs. He too was in hell, right up to the moment he saw Jesus walking across a huge gap....and cried out to Him for mercy.

Dr Eby on the other hand had a powerful and vivid positive experience which he shared everywhere until the time of his second passing. His story carried more weight IMO because he himself was an MD. His main thrust was the clear understanding he was sent back to “ Tell Them….” (the title of his second book concerning his NDE)

One DISCLAIMER: the purpose of this post is food for thought…I have no plans to get drawn into a knock-down drag-out verbal battle on this subject. IMO NDE’s are a scientific fact…and the interpretation of why they are, what they mean, what causes them are the stuff of way too much “private interpretation” as it is.

That being said, I present strictly for your “pondering” the following: a) How Jesus of Nazareth described the story of one Lazarus- a beggar in Lk 16: 19- 31 the definitions of the two recorded types of NDE and c) the desire of God for mankind as found in 2Pe_3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Recently I was amazed listening to the story of Colton Burpo on morning television tell of his own NDE at the ripe old age of 4 ! (Heaven Is For Real !)….perhaps the most convincing detail of all was his mention of a baby sister who was in heaven (miscarriage he could not have know about)…and relatives who he never met who had pre-deceased him as well. This was not Christian TV either. This was on the Today Show….

Enjoy !

Luk 16:19 There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day:

Luk 16:20 And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores,

Luk 16:21 And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores.

Luk 16:22 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;

Luk 16:23 And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.

Luk 16:24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.

Luk 16:25 But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.

Luk 16:26 And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.

Luk 16:27 Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house:

Luk 16:28 For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.

Luk 16:29 Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.

Luk 16:30 And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.

Luk 16:31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead. **

The NDE transcends gender, age, class, and religious affiliation. As well as those subjects who take part in research studies, many famous people have lived to tell of their Near Death Experience. Mikhail Gorbachev, Roseanne Barr, George Lucas, Debra Winger and Donald Sutherland have experienced NDEs. The once fiery Louis Farrakhan attributes his kinder, gentler message of unity and peace to an NDE. Singer Della Reese, star of the TV series Touched by an Angel and an ordained minister, believes that she encountered angels in a brush with death that occurred due to a burst brain aneurysm.

While the details of Near Death Experiences may differ, many share a common thread. Yet, there are two distinct types of NDE—positive and negative. Researchers estimate that one in ten people have some sort of NDE after surviving a life-threatening event.5

The Negative Near Death Experience

To those who have experienced a negative NDE, the process of dying is, indeed, hellish. People visit dark places, encounter demonic beings, and experience feelings of grief, depression, and fear.1 P.M.H. Atwater, a longtime NDE researcher reports that about 15 percent of adults and 3 percent of children enter "a threatening void or stark limbo or hellish purgatory," sometimes including "hauntings" from the past.7

One of the most vivid portrayals of such a hellish death is in the movie Ghost, where the earth literally opens a passage for the minions of hell to assail the evildoer and pull him into the bowels of the earth. Joyce Harvey, a 75-year-old retired CID officer from Essex experienced such a negative NDE.

While recovering from a chest infection, Ms. Harvey began having breathing problems. Suddenly she was paralyzed by cold. "I started going down and down in a life, with someone pulling my legs which were really hot," she said. "There were terrible noises, discordant notes, and screaming. I could see thousands of faces without bodies beneath me; they were trying to pull me down further and further. I was terrified."4

The Positive Near Death Experience

Often a positive near death experience begins when the person feels his or her consciousness separate and rise from the physical body. During this "out of body" experience (OBE), the subject is totally aware of the activity in the room below. Journalist Neil Marr remembered "watching over the shoulders of doctors and nurses as they hovered" around his bed as he lay with no heartbeat after undergoing a series of five heart attacks.7

Often, the second stage of a positive NDE finds the subject traveling through a tunnel towards a bright light. However, the type of tunnel varies from report to report with descriptions such as a tunnel of tiny stars, spirals of light, the inside of a sewer pipe, or an underground cave.7 Some people meet a deceased friend or relative who either takes them through the tunnel or meets them at the tunnel's end while others give their guides a celestial presence describing them as guardian angels or beings of light. Some people "return to their bodies" never seeing a tunnel, some are pulled back to "life" while journeying through the tunnel, and some are "sent back" by their guide.

Those who pass through the tunnel may go on to other experiences. Many report a sensation of being enveloped by love, peace, and joy. Some subjects undergo a "life review" where they experience both the joy and the mental anguish generated by their earthly actions. Some are "judged" by one or more religious figures while others experience self-judgment as they absorb a feeling of infinite understanding and heightened intellectual abilities.

Hmmm the very Words of Jesus of Nazareth fulfilled in a generation of unbelief **…..IMO GOD loves mankind….gave His only Son to restore fellowship with His creation and such experiences have touched many lives.

Amen EagleEye, people in this day and time cannot justify their actions as to why they choose to live without the lord. The Bible says that to be absent from the body is to be in the presence of the lord. How many wants to go to eternal torment, no one would say yes and yet they keep refusing Jesus and his saving power over and over everyday. By this they are sealing their fate if they was to die somehow instantly. Jesus said he will come knocking on our hearts door only so many times then he will back away and leave us to our own desires therefore eternal torment for our actions on judgement day. I believe that people in Hell will be able to see Jesus and everyone going with him to heaven so they can see what they gave up.

Edited July 12, 2012 by Heavyduty053

[kcw]

Eagle Eye thank you

Markinsa thank you for sharing

Heavyduty thank you for your continued uplifting posts

[EagleEye]

Yes HD....the logger's story was a real eye-opener because the "gulf" mentioned in Luke was clearly seen by him...and he saw Jesus across the gulf.... it turned out his Christian neighbor had been praying for his salvation for years and was called to identify the body....he came back to his body as she knelt praying for him...

YW KCW....thank you for all you do here and most of all for always lifting my spirits

[brbrlocke]

Thank you both for sharing....

[Butifldrm]

I believe God will save us through our Children.

I don't mind sharing my son's experience because it was so beautiful and provided such a sense of peace. I lost my Dad in July of 2005 to occular melanoma, six months later I lost my mother in law to uterine cancer. At the same time my husband was undergoing extensive chemo for stage IV melanoma. Since he has passed. He had been diagnosed a few month earlier with 8 tumors in his lungs. It was a time in our lives, that illness and death was consuming our family. My husband was the most amazing man. He was a true warrior when it came to his fight against that dreaded disease. When he was first diagnosed, the melanoma was already stage IV and the doctors only gave him a 20% chance to live 2 months. He lived eight years. He passed away, January 2010. My husband was an engineer and traveled nationally and internationally mostly building and working on cooling systems for refineries. One night while he was out of town, my son, Stanton, asked if he could sleep with me. Of course, I said "yes". When I was just about to doze off, He said, " Mom! Did I ever tell you I dreamed about going to Heaven? I said no. He said " Mom, I went to heaven. I could look down and see all of you sleeping in you beds and I was up in Heaven. When I got up there, Grandpa (my dad) was there Mawma (my mother in-law) was there, Grandma Nan and Grandma Nan's husband." Grandma Nan and my Grandfather raised me until I was 10 years old. My Grandfather died when I was 10 and his loss was like losing my Father. I can't remember talking to Stanton, about my Grandfather. Grandma Nan died when he was 4. I asked him if he talked to my Grandfather and he said yes. He said, " he told me to tell you that he loves you very much." I asked him "what did he look like?" He replied, "he looks a lot like Grandpa (my dad), just older." Then he said, " do you know all of the street are gold and the river s are gold?" " Grandpa and I went fishing on this big golden pond and Grandpa caught a huge silver fish, and all grandpa and uncle George do is play golf and go fishing every day" He went on to ask me, " Do you know when you hurt yourself in Heaven, your skin heals it self, just like that! He said, that he and my neighbors son ( who had died at the age of 17 of a horrible accident) had gone skating on a golden pond. Taylor, my neighbor's son had fallen down and hurt his arm and it healed just like that! He described a few other things like our dog Ziggy was in heaven and a few of my friends who had passed away. I also asked what did it smell like up there? He said "Cake". I aked him what kind of music do they have up there? He said, "wedding music".

I asked him "did you see God"? and he replied, "yes". I asked him did God talk to you? He said "yes" I asked what did he say to you? " He told me, " Stanton, your a lucky little boy, be worthy!" Now, I can't tell you how this affected me. I had recently suffered such great loss, and my son’s experience brought great peace into my heart. I truly believe my son went to heaven. There is no way at the age of six he could know all of these things. I have always prayed to and believed in God, but never beat the doors down to get to Church. I have 5 Children ages 34, 31, 24, 21 and 11. They all have different personalities and they all are good kids, but Stanton has such a sweet loving nature about him. I call him my little Angel. There is not a mean bone in his body and I thank God every day for him. (please forgive any typo's)

[EagleEye]

Thank you Butifldrmr !! What an awesome story to share. God bless you and your precious amazing son.

[precious1]

What a beautiful testimony,butifldrm! Thank you for sharing

[Nelg]

Hi EagleEye. I appreciate your post and what you are seeking to accomplish: get us to think beyond the physical here and now and to view our conception of the reality of death.

I am writing a book on the subject of death, and what happens after death, strictly from a biblical standpoint. Several people have ask me to include a chapter on NDE because of their experiences or their relatives experience, so the topic caught my eye.

I would like to ask a question concerning your title. After I read your post, I did not find a prophecy that is being fulfilled. Is there one that you just didn't include? Or am I missing something?

[EagleEye]

Hi EagleEye. I appreciate your post and what you are seeking to accomplish: get us to think beyond the physical here and now and to view our conception of the reality of death.

I am writing a book on the subject of death, and what happens after death, strictly from a biblical standpoint. Several people have ask me to include a chapter on NDE because of their experiences or their relatives experience, so the topic caught my eye.

I would like to ask a question concerning your title. After I read your post, I did not find a prophecy that is being fulfilled. Is there one that you just didn't include? Or am I missing something?

Thanks Nelg for your comments and your question. To clarify what I meant, according to Rev 19:10b worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy. Therefore as He IS the living Word, His every Word contains the spirit of prophecy. With that in mind, the Luke 16:19-31 passage can be seen as prophetic. With the many books and testimonies of those who have been beyond and returned to tell about both heaven and hell , it can still be said that "many" do not believe even when someone returns from the dead. I have often read non-believers theorize for example that oxygen deprivation etc causes the "visions". But I have NEVER read of an aviator, diver, drowning victim or firefighter who has been deprived of oxygen and seen heaven or hell. I hope that explains my intent. Send me a PM if you would like info on the death of our Lord.

[learning all i can]

Wow, I find this subject extremely interesting and exciting to read.

I am still at a place in my life that I really don't have a solid belief or unbelif on this subject. What's true or untrue? When I read about NDE, I am always left with, "wonderings"

I think we as humans all cry out for answers about the afterlife and what happens when this comes in the final seconds of ones life. (Altho the Bible gives us a pretty clear picture) We grasp at straws sometimes to fill our curiosity and satisfy this hunger for the unknown. Perhaps we let our finite minds get the best of us. I also feel that there are some accounts of NDE that seem to be authentic but there are some that are not Bibical and seem to be misleading...What to believe?

The 1st door that stays open for me to believe is that: God truely does love us that much, to give us every opportunity to receive His free gift and eternal life and of course as you quoted EE, 2Peter 3:9

The 2nd door I have to keep open is what Paul tells us, Test all things; hold fast what is good." 1Thessalonian 5:21. I just don't find Bibical evidence to lead me to completely believe

The Lord has not lead me one way or another...Of course, I have not ask for understanding and knowlegde on this subject. If and when He has me stand firm on this I know He will bring it into my heart.

EE, this subject certainly makes one think about life and death, heaven and hell and truely gives one reason to search his own heart.

Thankyou for bringing this......barb

[precious1]

I don't think this counts as a NDE but when my mother was in the last stages of lung cancer and this last hospital stay, she was in and out of consciousness. She awoke this one time and whispered something. My sister and I were on each side of her bed and leaned down close to her lips to hear her. She raised her arm and pointed to the upper corner of the room. She was smiling saying..Angels, do you see the angels? We of course looked and could not see anything there except the silent television

She closed her eyes but her face was smooth and peaceful. She went to our Lord two days later.

[cris]

I believe absolutely in an Afterlife, after my own NDE.

At age 7, on a closed school playground, Where I wasnt supposed to be,

I fell from the top of a slide, and was found by school staff.

At the Nellis AFB where my Father was stationed, and where we

lived in base housing, the Military was quick to react.

Without saying a word to my parents, I was ambulanced to the Base

Hospital....They evidently thought my case was severe enough (concussion)

that I should be sent to another, better facility, in California.

I was put on a military jet, and with a Doctor and 2 nurses, flown to the

facility in Cali. During the flight, I evidently died, at least for a few minutes.

I found myself hovering over my body while the Doctor and Nurses were trying

to revive me.

The inside of the small jet, the bed, my gown, and the staff were all in white.

A wierd little detail of this, Some of you may know, a body evacuates the bowels

after passing, which is what mine did. I remember looking down and being so

embarrassed that I had done that, a 7 year old isnt supposed to do that! At

least thats what I was thinking at the time

I was in a coma for 7 days and woke in a Hospital bed, with no idea of

how I got there.

I only know the particulars because at age 15, in 1976, asking questions,

my Mother filled me in on the details.

I had started seeing interesting books on the NDE experience, and some TV

documentaries on the subject, and thought Wow, thats what happened to me!

Having had recurring memories of the flight, and having the out of body experience.

It was 8 years after the flight, that the Phenomenon started to become popular media.

So, at age 7, I could have no frame of reference, or any exposure

to the idea.

I believe it was a real experience, and therefore to me, must absolutely mean that a

life after death and the soul exists....Its only my little proof just for me, but it

is comforting

[learning all i can]

Hi EagleEye. I appreciate your post and what you are seeking to accomplish: get us to think beyond the physical here and now and to view our conception of the reality of death.

I am writing a book on the subject of death, and what happens after death, strictly from a biblical standpoint. Several people have ask me to include a chapter on NDE because of their experiences or their relatives experience, so the topic caught my eye.

I would like to ask a question concerning your title. After I read your post, I did not find a prophecy that is being fulfilled. Is there one that you just didn't include? Or am I missing something?

Hi Nelg, Randy Alcorn's book "HEAVEN" is a book about heaven and what to expect in our hereafter/eternity. It is scripture based and simply beautiful....492 pages of complete joy and every page makes you smile and think of how awesome our God truely is..

You indicated that your book will also be from a Bibical standpoint...I want to read it when you have finished it..Please let us know when that time comes, as I will be one of the 1st in line...I just love it when God makes us smiles..

[bamagirl]

Thanks for starting this topic EE... I am like Learning All I Can on this, no solid belief either way. I have just recieved and started a book that pertains to this subject (thanks Nadita) and it's gonna be real interesting to watch this thread!

[EagleEye]

Thanks for starting this topic EE... I am like Learning All I Can on this, no solid belief either way. I have just recieved and started a book that pertains to this subject (thanks Nadita) and it's gonna be real interesting to watch this thread!

You're welcome...as I said I wanted it to provoke thought...

[pattyangel]

Here's my experience EagleEye. My father who I hold dear to my heart had a NDE back in March of this year. We rushed him into the ER, he was suffering from rapid heart beats, along with irregular heart beats. He said he felt he was running a marathon. They hooked him to all the necessary equipments and to know avail they couldn't control either one, rapid or irregular. They then injected him with medication. About 10 minutes later we lost him. And the room went wild with all medical personal working on him. As I watched along with my mother. They were able to bring him back. We lost him for 7 seconds, just 7 seconds. Well he recovered and came home with a pacemaker.

This is his experience. He said he felt himself leaving his body and immediately going through a tunnel like room. He saw stars, sparkles that looked very much like puzzle pieces. He did say that the puzzle pieces may have been about his life. (not quiet sure on that part). He felt peace, joy, calmness, he felt someone was with him guiding him toward a light, he couldn't say who. Then he returned back to us. All this happen in 7 seconds.

I was hesitant about believing in NDE, but now that I have someone very close to me that have experienced it, I dare not believe. God allowed my dad to come back to us to tell of his experience and I feel blessed knowing this.

[Black Swan]

Well...I certainly don't want to be a party pooper, as I can see some of my absolute favorite posters have provided comment. So I will only add this personal testimony, a few years ago my grandfather, a WWII Marine Vet, committed suicide, he overdosed on Tylenol. You see he had been suffering from Alzheimer’s and in one of his more lucid moments, he decided to end his life so that he could leave this world in a dignified fashion and also not to present a continued hardship to my grandmother.

My grandmother found him on the kitchen floor and thought he had had a stroke and called the ambulance. They got him to the hospital, examined him and determined that he had OD, so they immediately pumped his stomach. He was subsequently moved to intensive care. Meanwhile, my father called me, and I immediately jumped a plane..as I was attending college in Canada. My grandfather and I were very close and I wanted to be with him more than anything at his passing.

He actually survived the initial bout, but the specialist said that it was only a matter of hours before his liver would shut down. I was with him the entire time, holding his hand and telling him how much I loved him...and I remember how calm and peaceful he was...and then near the very end, he began to talk to his parent, my great grandparents...as if they were there in the room with us. To say that it sent chills down my spine is an understatement.

While I do not personally believe in this, I know he did, and it brought him comfort at the end. And I was very very grateful that he slipped away wrapped in a blanket of love and anticipation on meeting his loved ones on the other side.

And so, as Forest would say "That's all I got to say about that".

Peace,

Tiff

[EagleEye]

Thank you Tiff for sharing this....Peace to you and yours...

Chris and PattyAngel likewise thank you for sharing these personal accounts....

I am so grateful that these posts have remained thought provoking thus far.

[Nelg]

Thanks Nelg for your comments and your question. To clarify what I meant, according to Rev 19:10b worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy. Therefore as He IS the living Word, His every Word contains the spirit of prophecy. With that in mind, the Luke 16:19-31 passage can be seen as prophetic. With the many books and testimonies of those who have been beyond and returned to tell about both heaven and hell , it can still be said that "many" do not believe even when someone returns from the dead. I have often read non-believers theorize for example that oxygen deprivation etc causes the "visions". But I have NEVER read of an aviator, diver, drowning victim or firefighter who has been deprived of oxygen and seen heaven or hell. I hope that explains my intent. Send me a PM if you would like info on the death of our Lord.

Thanks for the explanation and I appreciate the offer of information on the Lord's death. I may contact you.

Hi Nelg, Randy Alcorn's book "HEAVEN" is a book about heaven and what to expect in our hereafter/eternity. It is scripture based and simply beautiful....492 pages of complete joy and every page makes you smile and think of how awesome our God truely is..

You indicated that your book will also be from a Bibical standpoint...I want to read it when you have finished it..Please let us know when that time comes, as I will be one of the 1st in line...I just love it when God makes us smiles..

Thanks, I saw the book on line and read some reviews. I have so many books now that I am "book poor." But I am always reading, especially well researched books. Thanks.

[wc41]

[You know what EE this is beautiful !! My closest reference to this topic is thru a close friend of mine I've known for 30+ years. He had his own NDE about a year to year and half before we knew each other. He was on the operating table after a drug overdose and they lost him. He watched them try to revive him. It has been a while since I've heard his story but he was given a clear message he wouldn't have another chance after this one. He was being sent back as they managed to revive him. He entered rehab after and had God touch his life after he developed a hunger and thirst to draw closer to God.

That point is my reason for posting now and my prayer for each one pondering what this all means. Just ask God ( or if your not sure hes even real you can say if you are real) create in me a hunger and thirst to draw closer to you. You may not still be confidently able to say its G O D but evidence of a new craving for peace, understanding and all the things that a foundation in a Christians life will be your proof....God is real!! Keeping that desire as priority in your life assures He'll guide you where to worship/serve and continue to grow!!

EE thanks for sharing and look forward to a blessing from the books/material that are being shared about here.

[Goldeelox]

Steve Jobs was one of the most creative and intelligent people that ever lived on this Earth. According to the eulogy that his sister gave at his memorial, his dying words were, "OH WOW! OH WOW! OH WOW! .....it must have been too glorious for even the most imaginative mind to describe....

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/steve-jobs-eulogy-reactions-new-york-times-255114

Edited July 13, 2012 by Goldeelox