taxes

[ronnie s]

501-c3 church ===no taxes

[Islandgirl7]

Watch yourself..."God will not be mocked"...just sayin'

[imdamanz]

A 501c(3) is a statutory exception for not-for-profits. So what you are saying is that you are going to dump all of your gains from the currency exchange into a church. And, if this goes well, you are not going to show a profit, how? Once you show a profit, you violate the tenants of the IRC that govern, and you lose your exception. Or you manage to spend everything setting up this church, and then have nothing left? You are permitted to have reserves, but they are regulated also. Then if they decide that you did it to evade taxes, you pay penalty, interest, and fines, as well as face criminal prosecution. All of this is being done in an effort to not pay your taxes. I wish you well in your attempt, but an intern at the IRS could figure out what is going on and prepare a case against you, let alone a seasoned examiner who has seen it all a 1000 times. The bottom line is that you are going to pay taxes on the gain at ordinary income rates, and if you use the net, there are ways to legally shelter future gains, or at least defer then to future distribution. I would strongly suggest that you seek expert advise from an attorney, accountant, or financial planner (You will need all of these afterwards, anyhow) before you make any decisions that could have serious consequences.

Starting a church, or other not-for-profit such as a foundation, is very noble. You can help a lot of people. I hope that the reason that you would even consider doing this are pure for the Kingdom of the Father, and not for some kind of selfish avoidance of income taxes.

[ronnie s]

I WAS JUST MAKING A COMMENT THAT IF A 501-C3 CHURCH PURCHESTED OR WAS GIFTED DINARS THEY HAVE NO CAPITOL GAIN

I HAVE NO PLAN TO OPEN A CHURCH

[1234]

no rv no taxes

[Mr Dunar]

I WAS JUST MAKING A COMMENT THAT IF A 501-C3 CHURCH PURCHESTED OR WAS GIFTED DINARS THEY HAVE NO CAPITOL GAIN

I HAVE NO PLAN TO OPEN A CHURCH

Then why bring it up?

[Islandgirl7]

Then why bring it up?

RIGHT!!

[imdamanz]

There will not be any capital gains for any of us...this is treated as ordinary income.

The church still has to spend the money or use it to fill their reserve capacity. I am a degreed accountant who is also the chairman of my church's finance committee. There is such a thing as having too much money for a church or other not for profit. Discuss it with the church leadership. See if they have any plans for a capital project that needs to be funded or financed. See if there are any missions that they have been wanting to support, or bring your own mission idea to them. I think that it is awesome that your heart is to support your church(es).

[BUSHMAN]

great post IMDAMANZ keep it up

[tevye02]

Just a quick thought. When (and if ) this thing RV's gift to charities can be made afterwards and up to 50% of your income can be deducted. In other words if you get $1,000,000 and gift $500,000 then you will be effectively taxed on only $500,000. My plan post RV includes large gifts (if I have large income) to control tax hickey that I'll take and provide maximum benefit to those I want to help. If you are keeping at least half, the gifts do not have to be made pre-RV but they need to be made in the same tax year. I'll be using a communiy foundation in my area that can set up a donor advised fund for me so I can take my time deciding where gifts go while making sure the deductible contribution is in the same tax year as the gain.

This is of course very simplistic and you should consult with your own tax advisor on these issues. Just my 23.4 Dinar

[SaRSam]

Watch yourself..."God will not be mocked"...just sayin'

Then he needs to do a sweep of his churches because now a days their flooded with hypocrisy.

[Drunken Irish]

A lot of churches are run by scam artists and they never go to jail. example Kenneth Copeland, Benny Hinn, Peter Popoff, Jesse Duplantis, Robb Thompson the list is never ending

[taxman]

There is a concept of unrelated business income that applies to not for profit entities and in certain cases income from an RV could be taxable to the entity.

[Doctor Smith]

There will not be any capital gains for any of us...this is treated as ordinary income.

Read more: http://dinarvets.com/forums/index.php?/topic/58285-taxes/#ixzz1GUzR0dtu

Not that is matters unless it RV's. Income tax is the income you receive from your employer. This is not income from your job. This is a gain or loss on an investment. Common sense says it is capital gains.

I've heard lawyers on both sides of this argue both ways.

[imdamanz]

Not that is matters unless it RV's. Income tax is the income you receive from your employer. This is not income from your job. This is a gain or loss on an investment. Common sense says it is capital gains.

I've heard lawyers on both sides of this argue both ways.

You can report it as capital gains if you choose. Don't be surprised when you receive a bill in the mail for the amount that was shorted plus interest and penalty. Currency transactions are not a short or long term asset. They are cash. Any gain or loss on the exchange of currency gets posted to either a revenue or and expense, depending on the position. This goes to net income, which goes to taxable income...at ordinary income rates. How do I know this, I was the cash and credit line analyst for a milti-billion dollar, multi-national corporation. The approved method that we used was the average of the exchange rate at the 1st business day of the month and the last business day of the month. Then you take your total US dollars exchanged with that currency and multiply it by the average. Whatever the difference between the actual paid and the average gets booked as revenue or expense. It goes to the income statement, not held as an asset on the balance sheet. If you hear otherwise, that person has not thouroghly completed their research. There are provisions for holding coins, jewlery etc...that are considered to be assets held for investment. An examaple id the Krugerrand. It is not a coin used in normal daily use, and it's value changes with fluxuation in the commodities market - ie. it is tied to the price of gold. If you know anyone who owns, or works in finance for a company with international business, you can ask them how it is treated. They will absolutely confirm exactly what I am saying. I am not trying to show how smart I am or begin a drawn out arguement. I just do not want to see or hear about a lot people who have a limited understanding of accounting or taxes getting hurt because they did not follow the IRS rules. I promise they will be looking for returns that have this transaction on it and will go over them with a fine toothed comb. I know that you have an area of expertise where you could teach me a thing or two about it, this is just my contribution to the conversation.

[best president ever]

stop trying to evade paying taxes God say pay your taxes and you are right don't mock God.

[ckh]

You can report it as capital gains if you choose. Don't be surprised when you receive a bill in the mail for the amount that was shorted plus interest and penalty. Currency transactions are not a short or long term asset. They are cash. Any gain or loss on the exchange of currency gets posted to either a revenue or and expense, depending on the position. This goes to net income, which goes to taxable income...at ordinary income rates. How do I know this, I was the cash and credit line analyst for a milti-billion dollar, multi-national corporation. The approved method that we used was the average of the exchange rate at the 1st business day of the month and the last business day of the month. Then you take your total US dollars exchanged with that currency and multiply it by the average. Whatever the difference between the actual paid and the average gets booked as revenue or expense. It goes to the income statement, not held as an asset on the balance sheet. If you hear otherwise, that person has not thouroghly completed their research. There are provisions for holding coins, jewlery etc...that are considered to be assets held for investment. An examaple id the Krugerrand. It is not a coin used in normal daily use, and it's value changes with fluxuation in the commodities market - ie. it is tied to the price of gold. If you know anyone who owns, or works in finance for a company with international business, you can ask them how it is treated. They will absolutely confirm exactly what I am saying. I am not trying to show how smart I am or begin a drawn out arguement. I just do not want to see or hear about a lot people who have a limited understanding of accounting or taxes getting hurt because they did not follow the IRS rules. I promise they will be looking for returns that have this transaction on it and will go over them with a fine toothed comb. I know that you have an area of expertise where you could teach me a thing or two about it, this is just my contribution to the conversation.

Great post, thanks! I have a question tho... would you use the actual exchange rate received rather than the average if that info is available for each transaction? (receipts)

Do you see a windfall tax materializing for this situation too, with the clarification of the FINcen104 that has already been released?

[cw2]

I WAS JUST MAKING A COMMENT THAT IF A 501-C3 CHURCH PURCHESTED OR WAS GIFTED DINARS THEY HAVE NO CAPITOL GAIN

I HAVE NO PLAN TO OPEN A CHURCH

I had wondered if I should just give my church a $25,000 dinar note and let then cash it in since, since they are a 501-c3 and would not pay taxes on it. I plan on paying my taxes just didn't want to pay more than I needed. Please advise.

Edited March 13, 2011 by cw2

[Markinsa]

stop trying to evade paying taxes God say pay your taxes and you are right don't mock God.

Which is better?

Spending $100 on clothes on a tax free weekend, which allows you to get two or three extra things that you wouldn't normally get because of taxes?

Spending $100 on clothes and taxes on a regular weekend?

We are not trying to evade taxes, just minimize the amount we pay.

[ronnie s]

I HAVE FREIND THAT HAS 20000000.00 DINARS WITH NO TAX PROBLEMS HES A CIT. OF THE BAHAMAS

[Islandgirl7]

Then he needs to do a sweep of his churches because now a days their flooded with hypocrisy.

Couldn't agree with you more!!!

[Markinsa]

Couldn't agree with you more!!!

Churches have always been filled with hypocrits. Why do you think they're there???? If they were perfect they wouldn't need to be in Church.

[imdamanz]

Great post, thanks! I have a question tho... would you use the actual exchange rate received rather than the average if that info is available for each transaction? (receipts)

Do you see a windfall tax materializing for this situation too, with the clarification of the FINcen104 that has already been released?

One would think that that is the way to go. However, when I would call the bank, I would get a quote based on that days exchange rate. Sometimes it took 2 to 3 days for the wire or ACH to go through, or we mailed a check and it took even longer. We would have to go back for each and every transaction and adjust the estimated rate that we to the actual. When you are talking about hundreds or even thousands of transactions, it would take forever and reconciliations would never get done. That is why we used one of the approved average methods.

[sheepdog]

imdamanz,thank you for your explanation on gains.??

EX: If you made 1 mil in profit from an RV in 2011, would your taxes on that profit be computed on current income tax tables for the year 2011? if you were in the 5% tax bracket for 2010,would the income tax be based on 5% from 2010 or a higher percent for the income made off the dinar in the year 2011?

[Islandgirl7]

Churches have always been filled with hypocrits. Why do you think they're there???? If they were perfect they wouldn't need to be in Church.

Actually if we were perfect we wouldn't need Jesus