Hungary looks to enhance military, cultural, economic ties with Kurdistan

[The Englishman]

 

Interview

Hungary looks to enhance military, cultural, economic ties with Kurdistan

By Majeed Gly 29 minutes ago

Péter Szijjártó, Hungarian Minister of Foreign Affairs and Trade. Photo: Rudaw

Final defeat of ISIS is a global responsibility, Péter Szijjártó, Hungarian Minister of Foreign Affairs and Trade, told Rudaw’s Majeed Gly in New York. As part of their efforts as a member of the global anti-ISIS coalition, Hungary is extending its military commitment in Erbil to 2019. 

Hungary is also looking to expand cultural, education, and economic cooperation with the Kurdistan Region and Iraq, because economic progress reduces the instability that leads to insecurity, Szijjártó explained. 

As for Kurdish independence aspirations, Szijjártó declined to express an opinion but argued that a “one size fits all” political solution does not work. Rather, differences in culture and heritage must be taken into account when finding a solution to Middle Eastern problems. He hopes that the US and Russia can work together, as relations between the two global superpowers bear heavy influence on regional and international issues. 


Rudaw: Thank you very much Mr. Foreign Minister for being with us for this opportunity. I know you have a very hectic schedule so we appreciate your time.

Péter Szijjártó: It’s my pleasure. Thank you very much.

I want to start with the war against ISIS. Your country is obviously contributing, helping the Kurdish fighters and the Iraqi fighters to counter ISIS that started over two years ago. How’s that military assistance going so far and will you continue after the liberation and after the taking back of the city of Mosul from ISIS?

Well we have been committed members and contributors of the anti-ISIS global coalition almost since the founding of the establishment and we consider ISIS as the most dangerous threat on the civilized world. When Donald Trump said that apparently a non-state actor is the most dangerous enemy of the world, he was right. ISIS is threatening the civilized nations of the world, so we contribute to the fight among those 27 countries that send real troops to this real fight. 

So far we’ve had 150 soldiers serving in Erbil as a force protection unit and as trainers and the mandate of them will expire at the end of this year. So we’ve already initiated by the parliament to prolong that mandate until 2019 and increase the number of troops from 150 to 200 and to widen their functions from force protection and training to advise and assist as well. So we’d like to increase our contribution. You know we have delivered guns to the Peshmerga. We have delivered ammunition. We have received the Peshmerga fighters in our military hospital to carry out rehabilitation and we will definitely continue this contribution because it’s not only the job of the Kurds and the Iraqis to fight against ISIS. This is a global responsibility and we have to work on these challenges as soon as possible.

About extending the mandate of your troops until 2019, that’s a long commitment. Does that mean that Hungary and other European countries perhaps think that the war will be extended as far as 2019 or you think you need to have those troops just in case?

Well, hopefully, it’s going to be concluded much earlier than that, but we’d really like to be a long term predictable partner in this fight. That’s why we chose this date. It’s an additional two years in order to stay after the liberation as well we have stayed in Afghanistan. So when the Afghanistan mission was over, it was changed to resolute support mission. We have been staying there with 107 troops 

 

  We are absolutely ready to enhance our economic cooperation as well  

currently. But we will stay definitely and we have another struggle there which is helping the Christian communities. You know we are a Christian country so really we feel a responsibility for helping those communities and we try to assist them to go back to those territories from where they were forced to leave. I think it’s not only in the interest of the Christian communities to return, but it is in the interest of the countries from where they had to leave. 

And about the weapons that you have already sent to Peshmerga, have you sent the weapons directly to Peshmerga or through Baghdad?

Of course in any case we come to an agreement with the Iraqi central government because we don’t want to cause troubles to ourselves and we don’t want to cause troubles to you. So we understand that it’s a sensitive situation but we do hope that there will be an agreement between Baghdad and Erbil to continue in a peaceful manner on mutual benefit of both parties so we really cross fingers for the success of that, let’s say, peaceful coexistence.

Your prime minister famously a couple of years ago announced his support for the right of the Kurdish people for independence. Does Hungary still have the same position?

Well, you know we always try to avoid interfering in internal issues of other countries. We try to avoid all types of statements which could destabilize the region and cause any type of difficulties. We’ll leave it for you, for the Kurdish and Iraqis to continue agreement. We don’t like anyone else interfering in our domestic issues either you know, so we respect your rights, we respect your history, we respect your culture a lot and we do hope that those issues which are not very pressing and challenging will be overcome. 

I know it’s very hard to predict the future, especially in international politics, but you said to leave it for you to decide, but the Kurds are now taking steps towards making a referendum. We want to announce independence at some point. On that point, what do you think the international community’s reaction will be?

Well, you know, one think I’ve learned was that sentences starting with “if” do not make sense neither in politics nor in sports, especially football, (laughing). So I’d rather avoid to make predictions about such kind of situation. Let’s revert the situation that’s evolving. What I know from both sides is, and this is encouraging, talking to the Foreign Minister of Iraq and talking to the Foreign Minister of yours, whom I’m going to meet as well and we are in a very, very good personal contact, that both of you want peace and I think that is the most important and stable position from which you can negotiate with each other. 

And you visited KRG and Erbil. Can you tell me more about the relationship, other than the military, with the Kurdistan Regional Government?

Well, first of all, we respect your culture very much and that’s why we try to encourage very much more and more cultural exchange. 

 

  We are very happy that the Trump administration takes fighting against terror very seriously  

We try more and more to encourage student exchange as well as we offer scholarships not only for the central government in Baghdad but for Kurdish students as well. We would love to have them at the Hungarian universities to study in English language. We are absolutely ready to enhance our economic cooperation as well because what I understood as well from the last years is that if you have a good economic cooperation, if you have a good trade cooperation, if there’s economic progress, then there’s less and less place for instability and war and such kind of challenges. 

Well, Hungary, I know it’s a smaller country than other members of the international coalition against ISIS, but it has a unique voice in Europe, let’s just say that. When it comes to the war against ISIS, there are some voices right now among the US administration that we need at least a permanent, long term military presence in Iraq to avoid having yet another, let’s say, ISIS in the region. What do you think about proposals like that?

Well, first of all I have to say that we are very happy that the Trump administration takes fighting against terror very seriously. That’s something which is for the benefit of the entire world I think. Well, I really do agree with the position that we do not only have to eliminate ISIS but we have to make sure that no such of an organization would be established in the future. You know having foreign troops on the soil of other countries is always a sensitive issue so we always have to come into agreement with the given country where the troops are present but I think that a balanced and forward looking cooperation between the Middle East countries, US, Russia and the anti-ISIS global coalition can end up for a presence for the future as well to avoid establishment of ISIS-like organizations. So, I think, we have to look into the details and we shouldn’t do anything against the will of the countries in the region. 

Definitely, this seems to be, when you say ISIS is the outcome, or one of the factors that led to the creation of ISIS in Iraq and the expansion of the so called caliphate is the withdrawal of US forces in 2011. And it seems to be that the international community deserves some assurances after all we saw in Iraq and Syria, which is still going on. ISIS is still a threat. 

You know, there were some terrible decisions on an international level in the last years or decades which led to the very unstable situation in North Africa and in the Middle East region. I think we need to understand that “one size fits all” is not only a lie when it is written in baseball caps but it is a lie when it comes to global politics. We have to understand that there are different cultures, different 

 

  Without a US-Russia agreement, many of these international conflicts... will not be solved 

heritage, different religions, different traditions so one size dos not fit all obviously. So whenever we’ve made decisions regarding international politics, we have to be aware of the outcome. So sending troops somewhere is relatively easy, but creating peace in the long term and ensuring a sustainability and progress of a country is another issue. So I have some doubts and question marks about the American foreign policy under the democratic administration definitely and I really do believe that the Obama administration made some terrible mistakes when it comes to North Africa or the Middle East. 

Can you give us some examples of some of the terrible mistakes or the Obama administration? Would you say that one of them is Syria? It’s very interesting when it comes to that. I mean, it became such an issue right now. It’s a global issue almost.

Yeah and I think we should concentrate on the solution. The solution will only come if there is an agreement between the US and Russia. I think it’s very simple in this way. You know we are really crossing fingers for the American and the Russian presidents to be able to build up a more pragmatic relationship, a more successful or a more friendly, if you wish, relationship between Russia and the United States. You know, when you speak like this in Europe currently, or in international media, you’re going to be attacked and accused immediately of being pro-Russian, being a spy of Putin, all these kind of terrible things. No, we are not taking sides. We are only just having the compass of our national interests, and the interest of Hungary is a central European interest that we don’t want to have a hostile relationship between Russia and the US because history has taught us that whenever there was a conflict between east and west, Soviet Union, Russia, NATO, US, central Europe was always a loser and we don’t want to be losers anymore so that’s why we are crossing fingers for a much better, a much more pragmatic relationship between US and Russia because without a US-Russia agreement, many of these international conflicts we have touched upon will not be solved for sure.

The point that you made about the US and Russia, how bad is the relationship right now and how concerned are you about the outcome?

Well I think that everyone sees, whoever watches television or reads newspapers, that currently the relationship is not the best ever for sure. If you look back at the recent period of time, then you can see that whenever there were serious international issues, solution was much easier or much more realistic whenever the Russians or the Americans were able to work together on the solution. Look back to Iran, the nuclear deal. As you can see from the picture, the Russian and the American foreign ministers were sitting on the same side of the table. And actually before negotiations had started, no one really gave a bet on the success of those negotiations. But then, those negotiations were successful because US and Russia were able to work together. 

Or when it comes to anti-terror fight, counter terror fight, we think that it’s vital to have involvement and engagement of both parties. So we hope for the best in this regard because, for central Europe, because that would be much more relaxing to have a balanced relationship between the two of them. 

Well, certainly this view that you mentioned is not popular between members of the European Union…

No.

And I believe that just today they passed a law in the parliament and they proposed that Hungary change its policy regarding immigration and certain other issues. What is your comment about that, that position, from your opinion?

You know we always rejected any attempts to interfere in our domestic issues. There are certain authorities that are the competence of the European Union and there are many authorities which are the competence of the member states and migration policy is the core 

 

  We laid the security of Europe into the hands of the Turkish president and the Turkish government  

competence of the member states. And they’ve made it very clear regardless of any kind of international pressure that we will not let any single person enter the territory of ours illegally. There are legal ways of how people can enter the territory of our country. Everyone is welcome who comes legally, who comes to respect our laws and regulations. But we never let anyone violate our border and we never let anyone enter the territory of ours illegally. This position is pretty much un-liked in the European Union, pretty much un-liked by the European institutions because they are pushing for a regulatory relocation system of the migrants. But we will never accept that because it’s against European regulations, it’s against the will of the people in Hungary, it’s un-implementable, and it’s against common sense. 

But there are threats from some European Union members of taking away your voting rights at the moment. Aren’t you concerned about that?

You know taking away a voting right of a member state must be based on consensus, and I believe that some member states would never support such type of decision, as Poland was frightened by such a decision as well. But we made it very clear in the first moment that Hungary would never vote in favor of such kind of a decision against Poland. 

With this migration crisis and refugee crisis, whatever you name it, there’s a consensus that the war in Syria and the ISIS war created this mess. Basically the instability created that. And now there are suggestions, actually a proposal in agreement between Turkey, Iran, Russia in Astana to create safety zones in Syria. How do you view the creation of safe zones inside Syria basically as a measure to prevent further refugees flowing over to Turkey, then to Europe?

Well, you know I have to tell you we are too small of a country to have important positions in this issue, so I don’t think anyone would care about our position. But what I can tell you is that we welcome all types of initiatives which bring us closer to peace in Syria, which bring us closer to more people living under safe conditions. If it is safe zones, then let’s call them safe zones. I think that here it is a very favorable development that somehow the Americans are putting into consideration the Astana format. We are happy that the Turks and the Russians could manage their issues and their challenges on the bilateral stuff. So, well creating safety at least in parts of Syria is at least a positive development.

Do you think that Turkey is doing enough to prevent refugee flows into Europe?

Well, currently I do, definitely. We made it very clear at the beginning that we can come to an agreement with Turkey, but this is not, let’s say, the final solution.  The best solution should be to enable Europe, to enable European Union, to be able to protect itself. Currently, we laid the security of Europe into the hands of the Turkish president and the Turkish government. We respect them a lot so we enjoy a very good bilateral relationship with Turkey. But in the meantime, Europe is not ready and not able to protect itself. This is the problem. We should have taken advantage of this period when there were no migrants coming because of the agreement with Turkey and we should have enabled ourselves to be able to protect ourselves. Currently if refugees or migrants leave Turkey, then the first place that they are stopped is the southern border of Hungary. Macedonia has done a very, very good job recently before the deal was made. But currently they are undergoing an unstable internal political situation unfortunately. 

I was a former refugee. I’m a former refugee as are many Kurds. Most of them, they don’t have a choice. The camps in Turkey are overcrowded, the situation is not perfect and they are desperate. Basically, building a wall on a European border is not, as many would say, is not a humanitarian situation.

Here we have two principals. Number one is that we have to bring help where it is needed. So our understanding is that we have to help people to stay as close to their homes as it is possible in order to be able to return after a situation is solved, after the challenge is 

 

  We liked [Trump's] approach regarding safety and security  

solved. How we should do it? We have to give very heavy financial support, not only to Turkey, but to Jordan, to Iraq, to the Kurdish region, to Lebanon to be able to host those people who had to leave their homes in order to keep them as close to their homes as possible. 

The second issue is in the international law. International law doesn’t say you have a right to pick a country where you would like to live in and order to get there, to violate borders. Our issue is the violation of the border. I mean how it comes that hundreds of thousands just violated our border and marched through our country and then to Germany and Austria and Sweden and afterwards, the Swedish, the Germans, and the Austrians would like to send them back to us saying that we were the first EU member state where they stepped into the territory into an EU member country. 

So, this is a very complex situation. Our position is that we have to bring help to the people where they are. Number two, we have to stick European funding to conditionality, meaning that European Union funds very heavily deferred countries. We should stick this funding to conditionality. Look, we give you the money, but you have to carry out reforms, political or economic that doesn’t matter, which would not force your people to leave their homes. And we have to overcome the war, the crisis as well because the ideal situation is that no one had to leave his or her home, right? And we should encourage anyone to do so.

Basically what you’re suggesting is to find a solution to the crisis in the Middle East but still there are people in the US and Europe that are reluctant about this. They are saying we have to be careful, not about just funding.  I’m talking about in general. But the Trump administration, the new administration in Washington, it seems that they don’t have that reluctance. How are you rating Trump’s foreign policy so far?

You know what, we liked his approach which was against this “one size fits all” principal. We liked his approach regarding safety and security. We like his approach saying that America is first, but what would the American president say, if not, that America is first or who would say America is first if not the American president. For us, Hungary is first. For us the security and safety of the Hungarian people and the country and the investments in the country are first. So, I have to tell you that we look at his policy with great sympathy. We hope that he is going to be successful. We see media being very hostile to him. Nothing new for us, we had the same experience with the international media being very hostile to Hungary. I see some international television channels being very frustrated of the fact that it was not them to appoint the president of the US but the American people to make the decision. So we really cross fingers for his success, because having a successful United States is an interest to the whole world. 

With that we’ll end this interview. Thank you very much for this interview and this opportunity and I wish you all the best with your trip here in New York and the US.

[ChuckFinley]

Seems like everyone wants to deal with the Kurds.  The Kurds have done a lot to draw business to their region.  Good for them. 

[tigergorzow]

Englishman Thanks,  CF Agree, DV,  Every country is smelling the money all the way from Baghdad & Kurdistan.   This is the only reason they are all jumping on board to invest because Babylon is about to rise from the ashes in a BIG WAY and they want some of the wealth from all of those natural resources, etc.

 

GO RV / RI